PDA

View Full Version : Chiefs Can this team improve next year and be competitive in TWO? YES.


dallaschiefsfan
10-20-2008, 10:05 AM
I say this with the caveat that it's unlikely (based on recent comments at face value) that Clark has the courage to do this...but hey, I can dream. The Chiefs CAN make progress next year and be extremely competitive in 2 years. It happens all the time, but needs some key things to happen in this order:

1. Immediately announce the firing of Carl Peterson and conduct a search for young, talented front office people (a team Pres AND a separate GM). The GM is most important and must be someone that has been intimately involved with the player personnel side of a consistently winning organization. Why this move first? This will a.) get a head start on putting a plan in motion for next year and b.) Communicate to the fans that ownership has the courage to make bold moves and cut bait when it's not working.

2. Announce the retention of Germ Edwards for the remainder of the season. At this point, I want the ineptness that is Germ to finish the season so as to seal his fate as an NFL fraud of a head coach. I don't simply want him to be let go mid-season with excuses for his horrendous coaching...I want him humiliated...untouchable by every NFL organization except for the Faiders and Al Davis.

3. Once the season is over, announce the firing of Germ Edwards 30 minutes after his final post-game presser. Waste no time. Let the new GM get his guy. Don't care who...because at this point, if they hire a good GM, the choice will be well-thought out. A good HC and coaching staff that excludes Dick Curl will do wonders for the 2008 draft pics. The one area Germ has succeeded (CB's Carr and Flowers) must be built upon. Whoever the coach is, they need to be someone that sells out to bleed Chiefs red and be the greatest advocate for stoking the fire of the "12th man". Marty was excellent at this...and I'm convinced this was as key as anything in rebuilding the franchise in the 90's.

4. Obtain a solid vet QB in free agency that will be a one year transition guy. If our goal is to draft and go with a young QB early, I believe the best chance of getting him up to speed fast is by having a vet run the offense for a year while transitioning our newly drafted guy into the mix. Manning is an exception...most guys do better behind a vet for the first year. Warner and Garcia seem to be the most likely candidates. They would IMMEDIATELY give your offense an opportunity to move forward while simultaneously giving your new rookie QB time to learn NFL speed and the new offensive system.

5. Sign the best available UFA kicker. I am absolutely stunned that Herm "I prefer field goals" Edwards hasn't put a full court press on getting a competent kicker in his 3 years.

6. Sign the best UFA line backer/s available. This is an area we are really, really weak. We have to spend money AND draft to get improvement. This can't be fixed by better coaching...but I believe our D-line and Safeties can get better with competent coaching. We have a LARGE amount of money under the cap and need to spend some on this area. I don't like Ray Lewis...and don't advocate bringing him in, necessarily...but let's be honest, he wouldn't put up with this sh!t.

7. Sign either an UFA center or guard that has played competently at the NFL level. Jones is a weak link and Nicewonger is probably out of position. The better option is probably center...and move Nicewonger to right guard. At that point, Herb Taylor at RT and with better coaching and a decent mid-round G or T draft pick and you might be ok.

8. Draft an F'ing QB in the first round and draft another in the mid rounds. Always be developing QB's. Draft a value QB every year. When Jimmy Johnson took the Cowboy job, he was very smart to draft Aikman AND Walsh. Walsh didn't work out, but he gave them added competition in landing their QBOTF. Keep competition alive at this position and always have someone in the shoot. After transitioning to the QBOTF, never have a vet backup again. Develop guys for the "just in case" scenarios.

9. Continue building the team through the draft. I agree with this...but you can't go cold turkey and expect to develop winning as a cultural reality. Young guys like Neil Smith, Okoye and Dino Hackett and vets like Cherry, Lewis, Ross etc. did NOT become winners until Marty brought in some veteran band-aids to stop the bleeding. I'm convinced that none of those players would have reached their full potential exclusively surrounded by other rookies. Winning is cultural...and so is fundamental NFL professionalism. This team needs competent NFL vets along the way to successfully build from the draft. Herm does NOT seem to GET THIS.

There's no reason that a team couldn't be competitive in two years under this scenario...but the GM and coaching piece is easily the most important part of the whole equation. This is a poorly managed organization with a poorly coached team on the field. Once those two items are addressed, we might be surprised how many players are salvageable for future use toward competitiveness.

|Zach|
10-20-2008, 10:05 AM
I agree, not because the Chiefs are that great or anything but just because of the nature of the NFL.

Deberg_1990
10-20-2008, 10:07 AM
The Rams turned around their season with a HC change in two weeks.

So yes, progress can be made immediatly, but once your an employee of the Chiefs its "4 Life" it seems.

ChiefGator
10-20-2008, 10:07 AM
Absolutely agree with this 100%.

Not much point in cutting Herm if we don't have anyone we can replace him with, and I look around and don't see anyone decent, even as an interim.

Chiefnj2
10-20-2008, 10:09 AM
Why would someone want to take over GM duties at this point in the season? You can't do anything and you have a lame duck staff. It's pointless.

dallaschiefsfan
10-20-2008, 10:12 AM
Why would someone want to take over GM duties at this point in the season? You can't do anything and you have a lame duck staff. It's pointless.

I disagree. You basically let the season carry on while making evaluations of player personnel so as to make your plan of attack for the off-season. Player evaluations are the greatest asset of coming in mid-season. Decide who is a bust and who's simply coached poorly. This isn't brain surgery...of course a GM would benefit by being here for the rest of the season.

Deberg_1990
10-20-2008, 10:14 AM
Didnt Parcells go into Miami during the middle of last season?

Brock
10-20-2008, 10:16 AM
Didnt Parcells go into Miami during the middle of last season?

No.

triple
10-20-2008, 10:17 AM
two years is not enough time to replace the entire front office, the entire coaching staff, and all but 5-10 players

dallaschiefsfan
10-20-2008, 10:25 AM
two years is not enough time to replace the entire front office, the entire coaching staff, and all but 5-10 players

Absolutely it is. Culture is huge. Your 5-10 players is ridiculous number. You can't throw all these players under the bus when they've been coached by this coaching staff. At some point, you simply don't know how many of these guys are salvageable until you change the organization culture and coaching staff. That takes ONE off-season. Bill Parcells is proving that...

SDChief
10-20-2008, 10:28 AM
Possible, but it's got to be the right guy. You can't just change for change sake to some other guy that doesn't have a clue and expect it to get better. Clark has to start looking at some choices right now. there is no reason to have a lame duck gm and staff next year. It will accomplish nothing.

Chiefnj2
10-20-2008, 10:35 AM
I disagree. You basically let the season carry on while making evaluations of player personnel so as to make your plan of attack for the off-season. Player evaluations are the greatest asset of coming in mid-season. Decide who is a bust and who's simply coached poorly. This isn't brain surgery...of course a GM would benefit by being here for the rest of the season.

You can do that on film. Quite frankly it really doesn't matter because every coach wants to bring in his own players anyway.

dallaschiefsfan
10-20-2008, 11:31 AM
You can do that on film. Quite frankly it really doesn't matter because every coach wants to bring in his own players anyway.

Film later vs. watching the players now? Doesn't make sense to me when you can start working a plan now vs. doing it in a shortened period of the off-season. A new GM should have a plan in place the minute Free Agency period begins. I doubt they'd be able to review enough film from the end of the season until the free agency period.

And while coaches might want to bring in some of their own players, it's silly to believe that they would do this with no discretion for the players already under contract. Marty walked in when Neil Smith was being touted as a possible bust. He saw a guy that just hadn't been developed fully...made the right call and the rest is history.

Shag
10-20-2008, 11:37 AM
Assuming your GM is going to come from some other team, trying to hire that position mid-season would be difficult, I would think. The available talent pool would likely be significantly larger in the offseason...

dallaschiefsfan
10-20-2008, 11:41 AM
Assuming your GM is going to come from some other team, trying to hire that position mid-season would be difficult, I would think. The available talent pool would likely be significantly larger in the offseason...

Not really. Most teams will give permission if an asst. GM or similar has an opportunity to be full GM. Now...if you want a GM that is about to get fired at the end of the season, you're correct. However, I fail to see how the talent pool is diminished otherwise. Besides, why would you want another team's cast-off?

Chiefnj2
10-20-2008, 11:45 AM
Marty walked in when Neil Smith was being touted as a possible bust. He saw a guy that just hadn't been developed fully...made the right call and the rest is history.

Where is this myth coming from that Smith was a bust? Wasn't he drafted in 1988, one year before Marty came to KC?

Brock
10-20-2008, 11:48 AM
Where is this myth coming from that Smith was a bust? Wasn't he drafted in 1988, one year before Marty came to KC?

Yeah, it's a bunch of crap.

dallaschiefsfan
10-20-2008, 11:49 AM
Where is this myth coming from that Smith was a bust? Wasn't he drafted in 1988, one year before Marty came to KC?

Not a myth. Smith was a disappointment his first year and people were talking about Smith the same way they spoke about Dorsey until recently. I don't recall it being as bad as the Simms-bust talk...but I distinctly remember people questioning Smith's NFL chops. I can't cite articles/papers or radio commentary because I simply don't keep an archive of random information. Perhaps others who were tuned into the Chiefs during that era can verify.

Anyway...

Shag
10-20-2008, 11:51 AM
Not really. Most teams will give permission if an asst. GM or similar has an opportunity to be full GM. Now...if you want a GM that is about to get fired at the end of the season, you're correct. However, I fail to see how the talent pool is diminished otherwise. Besides, why would you want another team's cast-off?

I was questioning another team's FO staff being made available for interviews mid-season. I assumed that would be an issue with many teams, especially those in contention for post-season. Perhaps that's not the case...

Brock
10-20-2008, 11:51 AM
Not a myth. Smith was a disappointment his first year and people were talking about Smith the same way they spoke about Dorsey until recently. I don't recall it being as bad as the Simms-bust talk...but I distinctly remember people questioning Smith's NFL chops. I can't cite articles/papers or radio commentary because I simply don't keep an archive of random information. Perhaps others who were tuned into the Chiefs during that era can verify.

Anyway...

Anyone who calls a player a bust after one season is a fucking moron.

dallaschiefsfan
10-20-2008, 11:53 AM
Anyone who calls a player a bust after one season is a ****ing moron.

Enter the media...

dallaschiefsfan
10-20-2008, 11:56 AM
I was questioning another team's FO staff being made available for interviews mid-season. I assumed that would be an issue with many teams, especially those in contention for post-season. Perhaps that's not the case...

I suppose that is possible...but I doubt most asst. GM's and equivalent are really that important to their team's post-season run...especially if they're going to be headed to another team in the off-season anyway. Seems to make more sense to let him interview in the interest of good relations and then leave it up to the interviewee as to whether he'd like to serve out the rest of his contract with his current team as a part of the deal (a-la Dayton Moore).

BIG_DADDY
10-20-2008, 12:49 PM
With Herm and Carl, no.

ferrarispider95
10-20-2008, 01:00 PM
I agree with taking a couple qbs and plenty of offensive lineman. Always be developing and creating competition between the qbs until we find our franchise player.

Micjones
10-20-2008, 01:02 PM
I'd like to see us draft a QB in Round 1 and find another young guy in Free Agency.
We have so many needs we really need to make the best of our draft choices.

Mecca
10-20-2008, 01:03 PM
It's not about getting a bunch of QB's it's about getting THE QB, do you think the Redskins made out ok because they brought in Heath Shuler and Gus Frerotte in the same draft?

Chiefnj2
10-20-2008, 01:11 PM
It's not about getting a bunch of QB's it's about getting THE QB, do you think the Redskins made out ok because they brought in Heath Shuler and Gus Frerotte in the same draft?

The more you bring in the better the chance of finding THE Qb.

Demonpenz
10-20-2008, 01:15 PM
I wouldn't mind the change coming mid season. Just so I knew A change was made. I am deathly afraid we got herm and carl for one more year

Mecca
10-20-2008, 01:16 PM
The more you bring in the better the chance of finding THE Qb.

I'm not a fan of that strategy, I don't think the throwing a bunch at the wall and hoping 1 sticks is a good strategy for filling the most important position on the team.

Chiefnj2
10-20-2008, 01:23 PM
I'm not a fan of that strategy, I don't think the throwing a bunch at the wall and hoping 1 sticks is a good strategy for filling the most important position on the team.

It's worked for Green Bay.

whoman69
10-20-2008, 01:25 PM
What is the point of holding onto Herm if you are going to fire him at the end of the year?

Mecca
10-20-2008, 01:26 PM
It's worked for Green Bay.

How do you figure? Their QB is the guy who they picked in the 1st round.

Chiefnj2
10-20-2008, 01:28 PM
How do you figure? Their QB is the guy who they picked in the 1st round.

They draft and bring in QB's all the time.

TrickyNicky
10-20-2008, 01:51 PM
So you think our DE's are fine and can be coached up?

I know the philosophy is BPA in the draft, but we have to draft for need at QB, MLB, and DE. And you could make a case for WR and Oline.

dallaschiefsfan
10-20-2008, 02:06 PM
I'm not a fan of that strategy, I don't think the throwing a bunch at the wall and hoping 1 sticks is a good strategy for filling the most important position on the team.

I'm not a fan of doing nothing...or simply freezing up. Even if you pick "the guy", he could blow his knee or any number of things could happen. Drafting multiple guys when you have ZERO future QB's on the roster sounds like a great strategy.

teedubya
10-20-2008, 02:18 PM
I think that dallaschiefsfan is ACTUALLY CLARK HUNT!! and he is going to do something, and this thread is a gauge for action!

Yes!

StcChief
10-20-2008, 02:26 PM
I think that dallaschiefsfan is ACTUALLY CLARK HUNT!! and he is going to do something, and this thread is a gauge for action!

Yes!I doubt it.... but Clark will do something if they don't win some games and show improvement.

out best shot to win 12/21 home against Mia (pray of sloppy field)
at Cincy 12/28.(same sloppy field)

dallaschiefsfan
10-20-2008, 02:39 PM
So you think our DE's are fine and can be coached up?

Actually, I do. Of course, Hali needs to be moved back to his position on the other side. To account for the loss of Allen, we either have to get a good pass rushing DE OR go the speed linebacker option in addressing our LB situation. In my mind, I feel our line COULD be solid against the run if coached better and decent to much better against the pass if we had a speed LB (my preference). In my above scenario, I've chosen to upgrade our LB situation both via free agency and the draft and stay put with our line...unless something unbelievable falls in our lap. Great DE's rarely show up the way Jared Allen did...most are high first round pics...which we will need for a QB.

dallaschiefsfan
10-20-2008, 02:40 PM
I think that dallaschiefsfan is ACTUALLY CLARK HUNT!! and he is going to do something, and this thread is a gauge for action!

Yes!

I wish it were so...but no...Clark and me only have one thing in common...and that's the town we live in.

SAUTO
10-20-2008, 04:42 PM
How do you figure? Their QB is the guy who they picked in the 1st round.

brunell, hasselback, aaron brooks, JT o sullivan,ty detmer, steve bono,to name a few don't know if all were drafted by GB but they were signed and backed up farve, this year alone they drafted matt flynn, AND brian brohm

dallaschiefsfan
10-20-2008, 04:49 PM
brunell, hasselback, aaron brooks, JT o sullivan,ty detmer, steve bono,to name a few don't know if all were drafted by GB but they were signed and backed up farve, this year alone they drafted matt flynn, AND brian brohm

Yes...and because the QB position is so coveted, one of these guys will shine when Rogers goes down (something Favre refused to do) and they could receive better value than their original draft round. Plus...if a Packers coach asst. coach goes elsewhere, he will talk up their backup to his next team and that's how guys get moved. Hasselback never played in Green Bay, but Holmgren knew he was a good QB looking for an opportunity. Always stock up on skill players...and QB and RB are the most coveted. This is just smart drafting by the Packers.

MahiMike
10-20-2008, 05:10 PM
Great post. I agree 98%. Only difference I woulda fired both Carl and Herm at halftime. Who cares who's coaching this year? Hell Let Huard coach. Definitely need to get a new GM months before April so he can see who he wants to dump and work some deals prior to the draft. I sure as hell hope Carl gets NO say in who gets drafted next year. As for Herm, let him wash jocks.