Defense is better without Jones?

[JakeF]

Denver's offensive line is weak so all of this is wait and see but we definitely seem to have a more structured Defense without Jones. Jones' talent is undeniable but his play has a serious flaw. He abandons the run to attack the QB.

With Jones gone, we have 2 bigger guys in the middle who play the run 1st. They also protect our linebackers who are freed up to read and attack. With the center of our defense now anchored, the outside guys (clark,ogbah, okafor) can be more aggressive. It also keeps the middle of the field clear for our safeties.

That's what seemed to change for our defense against Denver.

Hitchens played his best game and Ragland showed up like he never has before. Frank Clark was better and Matheiu was more aggressive.

Having DT's that protect your LBs is so important. I would rather have Clark,Okafor and Ogbah getting sacks than Jones.

I think Hitchens and Ragland can even start getting some sacks without guards in their face on every play.


:hmmm:

[poolboy]

yes, who would have thunk it?:huh:

[rabblerouser]

Put Jones at end. Clark at LB.

Profit.

[MAHOMO 4 LIFE!]

Also not having Darron Lee on the field helped but definitely Saunders and Nnadi we’re splitting double teams all day long. Sticking to their assignments and letting other players like the linebackers make the plays!! Exactly what Mathieu said we needed to do. Jones literally shoots the wrong hole and allows running lanes that a semi can drive through

[UChieffyBugger]

I'm glad someone started this thread as I was gonna ask this very question :D . Although tbh I think putting Jones at DE opposite Clark could be the way forward and then just rotate Okafor and Ogbah in to keep the D-line fresh and dangerous. Saunders was known for his pass rushing skills in college so it might not be long before we see him getting to the QB as well.

[MAHOMO 4 LIFE!]

I'm glad someone started this thread as I was gonna ask this very question :D . Although tbh I think putting Jones at DE opposite Clark could be the way forward and then just rotate Okafor and Ogbah in to put the D-line fresh and dangerous. Saunders was known for his pass rushing skills in college so it might not be long before we see him getting to the QB as well.

He was rock solid against the run last week. That stuffed failed 2 point conversion happened because of him splitting the double team and Ragland filling his gap

[-King-]

Already? This really is overreaction planet

[Hog's Gone Fishin]

Our Defense didn't all of the sudden get good because Jones is out. Spags put a different plan together because his coaching ass is on the line. Our linebackers never attacked like this before. I just hope this wasn't a fluke!

[Chris Meck]

I like Jones, but I've been as critical as anyone about his freelancing.

He's talented, but if he's not going to play scheme-sound football, then yeah, he'll be a liability, especially on run downs.

Let's hope that watching the game Thursday got him a Jones-sized woody for team play.

[carcosa]

No

[Wallcrawler]

Already? This really is overreaction planet

Jones has always been a pass rush first player. Theres no already about it.

With him out of the middle, and the tackles just doing their job, the run defense was massively improved.

Pass rush is fantastic, but not if it creates a situation in the run game where the offense literally never has to throw.

Put him at end, or get him on board with the scheme in the middle.

[wazu]

Have been wondering about this as well. Will definitely need to see if this new look D is still showing up the next 2 weeks before believing this could be possible.

[dlphg9]

Holy fuck this place is fucking filled with stupid mother fuckers. You realize he was out against the Texans and they shoved our shit in? He was in against the Raiders and we owned them. So somehow you come to this retarded conclusion that we are better with out Jones? Sound logic, idiot.

[wazu]

To those acting like this is a stupid thing to even wonder about, remember that Thursday night, there was one point where there was a very real possibility that the Chiefs were going to break the all-time record for sacks in a game. Without Chris Jones. And yes much of that was on their horrid offense, but they've been able to run the ball against others this year just fine.

[Chris Meck]

Holy **** this place is ****ing filled with stupid mother ****ers. You realize he was out against the Texans and they shoved our shit in? He was in against the Raiders and we owned them. So somehow you come to this retarded conclusion that we are better with out Jones? Sound logic, idiot.


I don't think either of your characterizations are quite accurate.

I don't think anyone is saying we're better without Jones, just that the ONE real dominant performance showed 11 guys all maintaining their responisibilities and so were successful. Jones is known for not doing that a fair amount.

I think we all would prefer if Jones were healthy, in the line-up, and not freelancing.

Big man needs to stay in his lane.

[dlphg9]

Seriously you all realize he didn't play against the Texans and they had the most points, the most total yards, and the 2nd most rushing yards that we have allowed all, season. You can't just pick one game where the D was good and decide "wow, our D must be better without Jones!" especially since the first game he missed was our worst defensive performance. Cuz I can find that he played in that our D performed almost just as well. Maybe it has more to do with the opponent, then it does with Jones being out. Flacco is the absolute worst starter in the NFL, so we stacked the box. That allowed an extra run defender. Seriously how are some of you so dumb?

[WhiteWhale]

Were they better last week?

Shut the fuck up. This board's hatred of Chris Jones is fucking retarded.

[WhiteWhale]

I don't think either of your characterizations are quite accurate.

I don't think anyone is saying we're better without Jones, just that the ONE real dominant performance showed 11 guys all maintaining their responisibilities and so were successful. Jones is known for not doing that a fair amount.

I think we all would prefer if Jones were healthy, in the line-up, and not freelancing.

Big man needs to stay in his lane.

Known by alleged know-it-alls at Chiefsplanet.

Color me skeptical of Chris jones never being double teamed and always running out of his gap. It's horse-shit nonsense and has been since the start. He's not just out there doing whatever he wants. That's ****ing narrative that exists on this site and this site alone because people wanted to scapegoat someone.

Meanwhile this site was sucking Damien Wilson's cock and subbing in Ragland (a figure loathed on the planet) for him made a far bigger impact. Someone who was getting DOWNHILL in the running game instead if sitting back in his gap playing the waiting game.

Stop with the mental gymnastics to support the chosen narrative, and let'st just settle ****ing down after 1 good game from the defense. They're going to have to step up HUGE in the next month.

[Easy 6]

Better against the run?

Maybe

But I’m still not ready to pull the plug on Sacksquatch, hoping he’ll eventually buy in to a less selfish style of play

[wazu]

Seriously you all realize he didn't play against the Texans and they had the most points, the most total yards, and the 2nd most rushing yards that we have allowed all, season. You can't just pick one game where the D was good and decide "wow, our D must be better without Jones!" especially since the first game he missed was our worst defensive performance. Cuz I can find that he played in that our D performed almost just as well. Maybe it has more to do with the opponent, then it does with Jones being out. Flacco is the absolute worst starter in the NFL, so we stacked the box. That allowed an extra run defender. Seriously how are some of you so dumb?

So maybe it took them a game to adjust. Maybe the truth lies somewhere in the middle. We definitely need to see it again against better competition before drawing any real conclusions, but it's definitely something worth tracking.

[wazu]

Were they better last week?

Shut the fuck up. This board's hatred of Chris Jones is fucking retarded.

Chris Jones is one of my favorite players. If Mahomes wasn't on the team I'd probably have a Chris Jones jersey. But this defense looked pretty bad until last night, so it's fair to analyze what things we did differently, including who was playing where.

[Chris Meck]

Known by alleged know-it-alls at Chiefsplanet.

Color me skeptical of Chris jones never being double teamed and always running out of his gap. It's horse-shit nonsense and has been since the start. He's not just out there doing whatever he wants. That's ****ing narrative that exists on this site and this site alone because people wanted to scapegoat someone.

Meanwhile this site was sucking Damien Wilson's cock and subbing in Ragland for him made a far bigger impact.

I don't recall anyone saying ALWAYS anything.

But if you didn't see gaping holes right in Jones' spot several times before he left the line-up, I don't know what to tell you. It was pretty glaring.

Of course, nobody was playing well, and there were gaping holes everywhere.

[dlphg9]

I don't think either of your characterizations are quite accurate.

I don't think anyone is saying we're better without Jones, just that the ONE real dominant performance showed 11 guys all maintaining their responisibilities and so were successful. Jones is known for not doing that a fair amount.

I think we all would prefer if Jones were healthy, in the line-up, and not freelancing.

Big man needs to stay in his lane.

At least half of the initial replies and the OP are saying that the D is better without Jones. Do you not remember the Raiders game?

10 PA, 307 Total Yards, 178 Pass YDs, 129 rush yards, 5 QB hits, 3 Sacks, 2 TOs

I'd consider that pretty dominant. Yeah we had a lot more sacks because Donk line is trash and Joe Flacco takes sacks.


Denver's offensive line is weak so all of this is wait and see but we definitely seem to have a more structured Defense without Jones. Jones' talent is undeniable but his play has a serious flaw. He abandons the run to attack the QB.

With Jones gone, we have 2 bigger guys in the middle who play the run 1st. They also protect our linebackers who are freed up to read and attack. With the center of our defense now anchored, the outside guys (clark,ogbah, okafor) can be more aggressive. It also keeps the middle of the field clear for our safeties.

That's what seemed to change for our defense against Denver.

Hitchens played his best game and Ragland showed up like he never has before. Frank Clark was better and Matheiu was more aggressive.

Having DT's that protect your LBs is so important. I would rather have Clark,Okafor and Ogbah getting sacks than Jones.

I think Hitchens and Ragland can even start getting some sacks without guards in their face on every play.


:hmmm:

yes, who would have thunk it?:huh:

Also not having Darron Lee on the field helped but definitely Saunders and Nnadi we’re splitting double teams all day long. Sticking to their assignments and letting other players like the linebackers make the plays!! Exactly what Mathieu said we needed to do. Jones literally shoots the wrong hole and allows running lanes that a semi can drive through

[Buckweath]

That's kind of a stupid question.

Jones is arguably the Chiefs best defensive player.

The Chiefs defense is obviously better with him.

The guy is an All-Pro. Yeah definitly a stupid question.

I know this a forum but why do people always overreact off of one game.

[dlphg9]

Yep guessing the dumb fucks here forgot all about the Raiders game.

[Chris Meck]

I think at least half of the overreaction is regarding the mischaracterization that people are somehow saying Jones sucks.

That's not what anyone's saying.

[UChieffyBugger]

Seriously you all realize he didn't play against the Texans and they had the most points, the most total yards, and the 2nd most rushing yards that we have allowed all, season. You can't just pick one game where the D was good and decide "wow, our D must be better without Jones!" especially since the first game he missed was our worst defensive performance. Cuz I can find that he played in that our D performed almost just as well. Maybe it has more to do with the opponent, then it does with Jones being out. Flacco is the absolute worst starter in the NFL, so we stacked the box. That allowed an extra run defender. Seriously how are some of you so dumb?

I'm not saying we're better off without Jones. My point is we may be better off without Jones AS A DT IN THE MIDDLE. Because let's be real here, Jones has been a mainstay In the middle of our defense and our run D has been appalling during that time. Saunders was making his first start last week and penalties killed several of the stops the defense made...but this week they looked totally different against the run so we SHOULD all be hopeful that something has changed. IF the run is stopped again next week then imo Jones must be moved to DE.

[JakeF]

Yep guessing the dumb fucks here forgot all about the Raiders game.
You posted the same fucking thing 3 or 4 fucking times. If you don't like the thread then get the fuck out. We already know you don't agree.

[JakeF]

I think at least half of the overreaction is regarding the mischaracterization that people are somehow saying Jones sucks.

That's not what anyone's saying.
I specifically said that Jones was really talented, not that he sucked.

We are talking about whether the defensive system is better without someone going rogue all the time. If the center of your defense breaks down it can create problems everywhere. It allows C/G to get to your LB, it breaks down the entire scheme.

I wonder if Jones wouldn't be better at DE for the Defense as a whole.

If Jones isn't back next week against Packers we'll find out.

[pugsnotdrugs19]

The defense was better because they played physical, aggressive, TEAM defense. Every guy busting their ass to do their job. Flacco and Denver didn’t hurt either...

If Jones comes in and does that as well, the defense will be much better as a whole.

[JakeF]

The defense was better because they played physical, aggressive, TEAM defense. Every guy busting their ass to do their job. Flacco and Denver didn’t hurt either...

If Jones comes in and does that as well, the defense will be much better as a whole.
Very possible

Was it Denver's Oline being shitty?
Was it the Chiefs just deciding to play harder?
Was it better scheme play because Jones wasn't fucking it up?

We'll see.

[Megatron96]

Actually I agree with PnD19 and D-9; there's not enough evidence to say definitively that the run defense is better without Jones. It was only one game, against what appeared to be one of the worst OLs in the NFL. And it was obvious that our defense, particularly our front-7 came out and played at a completely different level of intensity than they have all season.

But saying that our run defense is now a solid unit after just one game isn't clear and obvious. We need to see them play against some better OLs. The games against the Packers and the Vikings will be much more telling, IMO.

If he comes back sometime in the next two weeks, particularly against either the Vikings or the Packers, and the run D is dramatically better or worse will be a lot more telling about his effect. And that's assuming the front-7 plays similarly to how they played Thursday night.

And it's a fact that Jones is the most capable and athletic of our DTs. At the end of the day, we really need him to be playing well for us going forward.

[wazu]

The defense was better because they played physical, aggressive, TEAM defense. Every guy busting their ass to do their job. Flacco and Denver didn’t hurt either...

If Jones comes in and does that as well, the defense will be much better as a whole.

This is my hope. Maybe the system is coming together and team leadership is bringing a different attitude. Jones comes back and takes it up another notch.

[Coogs]

There was a similar conversation a couple of years ago when Peters had his one game suspension. Peters freelanced a bunch and left his teammates hanging out to dry. Peters got his one game suspension. Defense had it's best performance of the season that day.

:shrug: Just sayin'

Jones did say before the season he wasn't sure about this new defense. Paraphrasing of course.

[Chieftain]

Veach should "Dee Ford" the whole Jones contract situation. Franchise tag him and trade him for a 2nd rounder. Get an IML at the draft with that pick.

[Dunerdr]

I love Chris Jones but I recently wondered what Bill Bellicheat would do with Jones. He’s be sidelined for fucking up run plays until they needed him to rush the passer, and probably tagged and traded.

[chiefzilla1501]

Our Defense didn't all of the sudden get good because Jones is out. Spags put a different plan together because his coaching ass is on the line. Our linebackers never attacked like this before. I just hope this wasn't a fluke!

I always hate the theory that a coach saves his best stuff for the end of the season. But I still really wonder if that was the case here. Our D was uncharacteristically vanilla to start the season.

[MAHOMO 4 LIFE!]

Hitchens said they didn’t do anything different. There mentality was different he said

[notorious]

They played against a pile of shit team. Jones is a stud.

No.

[Chris Meck]

The defense was better because they played physical, aggressive, TEAM defense. Every guy busting their ass to do their job. Flacco and Denver didn’t hurt either...

If Jones comes in and does that as well, the defense will be much better as a whole.

I don't think anyone would disagree with that.
:thumb:

[dlphg9]

This stupid ass Jones goes rogue is just some over blown saying that was initially used as an excuse by people to defend Frank Clark. "Chris Jones is only rushing the passer so well because he goes rogue and Frank Clark holds his edge", Its ****ing retarded.

[staylor26]

This stupid ass Jones goes rogue is just some over blown saying that was initially used as an excuse by people to defend Frank Clark. "Chris Jones is only rushing the passer so well because he goes rogue and Frank Clark holds his edge", Its ****ing retarded.

No it actually started before that. CP really does hate Jones. It’s weird as fuck.

[Mama Hip Rockets]

Wasn't Chris Jones out for the previous 1.5 games when they gave up 16,000 rushing yards to Indianapolis and Houston?

The defense was better because they played the horrendous Broncos instead of Indy or Houston.

[PHOG]

Wasn't Chris Jones out for the previous 1.5 games when they gave up 16,000 rushing yards to Indianapolis and Houston?

The defense was better because they played the horrendous Broncos instead of Indy or Houston.
That is a true story

[JD10367]

I love Chris Jones but I recently wondered what Bill Bellicheat would do with Jones. He’s be sidelined for ****ing up run plays until they needed him to rush the passer, and probably tagged and traded.

your and idiot

But, since you bring it up, perhaps your whole "Chris Jones freelances too much and maybe the D is better without him" thing is kind of similar to the Pats and Jamie Collins. When they had him, he was an occasionally great player who freelanced once too often and got sent packing to (at the time) football Siberia (Cleveland). He figured it out and started to become more disciplined and has become a better player this second time around with the Pats.

[Pitt Gorilla]

Hitchens said they didn’t do anything different. There mentality was different he said

But they did. Gap assignment was much better. That’s not just a Chris Jones thing, either.

[ThyKingdomCome15]

I just wonder if this new scheme makes Jones less valuable to the team. I cant see us paying Jones 22 million a year at this point.

[ThyKingdomCome15]

But they did. Gap assignment was much better. That’s not just a Chris Jones thing, either.

Darron Lee out and Ragland in was much better as well. Of course Ragland played the middle and Hitchens slid over in Lee's spot. It was vastly better.

[RunKC]

This stupid ass Jones goes rogue is just some over blown saying that was initially used as an excuse by people to defend Frank Clark. "Chris Jones is only rushing the passer so well because he goes rogue and Frank Clark holds his edge", Its ****ing retarded.

Chris Jones has looked like the DT version of Dee Ford. He’s missing games consistently, he’s not holding his gap against the run and he’s not a complete player.

He’s abandoning his gap vs the run to rush the passer bc he wants to get paid.

It’s looking more and more like Veach did the right thing giving Frank Clark big money and not Chris Jones.

And if Chris Jones wants Frank Clark money, we need to trade his ass.

[farmerchief]

Chris Jones has looked like the DT version of Dee Ford. He’s missing games consistently, he’s not holding his gap against the run and he’s not a complete player.

He’s abandoning his gap vs the run to rush the passer bc he wants to get paid.

It’s looking more and more like Veach did the right thing giving Frank Clark big money and not Chris Jones.

And if Chris Jones wants Frank Clark money, we need to trade his ass.
Kind of reminds me of the game Marcus Paters didn’t play, and our D was much,much,better.

[Buckweath]

Chris Jones has looked like the DT version of Dee Ford. He’s missing games consistently, he’s not holding his gap against the run and he’s not a complete player.

He’s abandoning his gap vs the run to rush the passer bc he wants to get paid.

It’s looking more and more like Veach did the right thing giving Frank Clark big money and not Chris Jones.

And if Chris Jones wants Frank Clark money, we need to trade his ass.
The things you will read on this board..:rolleyes:

Chris Jones has not missed single game in his 4 year career except the last two games. This is the definition of a durable player.

Chris Jones is an All-Pro player and absolutely deserving. He is probably ranked as a top 50 player in the league by most analysts. And 15 sacks by a DT is fucking 15 sacks by a DT. While Jones is not elite against the run, he had 19 tackles for a loss last year as per Pro Football Reference. I repeat, 19 tackles for loss. Those 19 tackles for a loss were not all on pass plays. You get it.

And I was the one to tell some fans on this board that he was/is not the 2nd best DT in the game but Fletcher Cox was/is.

Chris Jones is an elite player and would greatly help any defense in this league.

That's all you need to know.

[dlphg9]

Chris Jones has looked like the DT version of Dee Ford. He’s missing games consistently, he’s not holding his gap against the run and he’s not a complete player.

He’s abandoning his gap vs the run to rush the passer bc he wants to get paid.

It’s looking more and more like Veach did the right thing giving Frank Clark big money and not Chris Jones.

And if Chris Jones wants Frank Clark money, we need to trade his ass.


Ummm what? Missing games consistently? You're trolling. Not even worth it.

Holy shit, so I guess youre not trolling. You are just incredibly stupid. Missing 2 games in his entire career is now missing games consistently? Abandoning his gap consistently? Can I get some proof of him abandoning his gap, cuz after the lies you used to defend Frank Clark it's hard to trust anything you say. You used this as one of your defenses of Clark and all the other excuses you kept spouting off were lies, so I find it hard to believe that this is true.

Lol it's looking more and more like Veach made the right move paying Clark over Jones? You're so full of shit. You're basing this off of one game and ignoring every other game? You keep beating that chest because Frank had 2 sacks against a shit line and the worst QB in the league. Jones deserves more money than Frank should ever see. He has looked completely dominant in multiple games and Clark has looked like shit until the stars aligned.

[dlphg9]

The things you will read on this board..:rolleyes:

Chris Jones has not missed single game in his 4 year career except the last two games. This is the definition of a durable player.

Chris Jones is an All-Pro player and absolutely deserving. He is probably ranked as a top 50 player in the league by most analysts. And 15 sacks by a DT is ****ing 15 sacks by a DT. While Jones is not elite against the run, he had 19 tackles for a loss last year as per Pro Football Reference. I repeat, 19 tackles for loss. Those 19 tackles for a loss were not all on pass plays. You get it.

And I was the one to tell some fans on this board that he was/is not the 2nd best DT in the game but Fletcher Cox was/is.

Chris Jones is an elite player and would greatly help any defense in this league.

That's all you need to know.

He's trolling. I'm pretty sure he's not that big of a fucking retard.

[Buckweath]

He's trolling. I'm pretty sure he's not that big of a ****ing retard.

He was not.

[RunKC]

The things you will read on this board..:rolleyes:

Chris Jones has not missed single game in his 4 year career except the last two games. This is the definition of a durable player.

Chris Jones is an All-Pro player and absolutely deserving. He is probably ranked as a top 50 player in the league by most analysts. And 15 sacks by a DT is ****ing 15 sacks by a DT. While Jones is not elite against the run, he had 19 tackles for a loss last year as per Pro Football Reference. I repeat, 19 tackles for loss. Those 19 tackles for a loss were not all on pass plays. You get it.

And I was the one to tell some fans on this board that he was/is not the 2nd best DT in the game but Fletcher Cox was/is.

Chris Jones is an elite player and would greatly help any defense in this league.

That's all you need to know.

He missed the Titans playoff game with a knee injury (surgery), he was out of the Pats game last year at the end with an injury and now he’s out again.

I like Chris Jones. I want to keep him. But he needs to understand that he’s got 2 sacks this year and he has one great year of play, last year.

He’s worth Fletcher Cox money and I hope he takes that offer. He’s not worth Frank Clark money or Aaron Donald money.

Chiefs need to try to keep him, but at the right price. It’s critical we don’t overpay players when Pat gets paid.

[dlphg9]

He missed the Titans playoff game with a knee injury (surgery), he was out of the Pats game last year at the end with an injury and now he’s out again.

I like Chris Jones. I want to keep him. But he needs to understand that he’s got 2 sacks this year and he has one great year of play, last year.

He’s worth Fletcher Cox money and I hope he takes that offer. He’s not worth Frank Clark money or Aaron Donald money.

Chiefs need to try to keep him, but at the right price. It’s critical we don’t overpay players when Pat gets paid.

He did not miss the Titans playoff game and since you lied about that and pretty much everything else, then I don't believe you that he missed the end of the Pats game.

[Buckweath]

He did not miss the Titans playoff game and since you lied about that and pretty much everything else, then I don't believe you that he missed the end of the Pats game.
I checked. Jones tore his MCL and missed the second half of the Titans game.

[dlphg9]

I checked. Jones tore his MCL and missed the second half of the Titans game.

He still played. Ole LieKC said he missed the game.

[KChiefs1]

Spags will figure it out.

[JakeF]

The things you will read on this board..:rolleyes:

Chris Jones has not missed single game in his 4 year career except the last two games. This is the definition of a durable player.

Chris Jones is an All-Pro player and absolutely deserving. He is probably ranked as a top 50 player in the league by most analysts. And 15 sacks by a DT is fucking 15 sacks by a DT. While Jones is not elite against the run, he had 19 tackles for a loss last year as per Pro Football Reference. I repeat, 19 tackles for loss. Those 19 tackles for a loss were not all on pass plays. You get it.

And I was the one to tell some fans on this board that he was/is not the 2nd best DT in the game but Fletcher Cox was/is.

Chris Jones is an elite player and would greatly help any defense in this league.

That's all you need to know.
fine, then our DC needs to configure his defense scheme around the fact that he will have a gaping hole in the middle of his defensive line on most plays.

[MrCasual]

Yes, Chris Jones is terrible and should be sent to the Patriots for a conditional 7th round pick.

[tyreekthefreak]

I'm on the fence regarding Chris Jones but...…..the 19 tackles for loss could be attributed to him blowing his gap assignments and the run to rush the QB...….gets the tackle by chance!

He does seem to get gassed rather easily, IMO...…

Not worth big money....

[ChiefsFanatic]

Our Defense didn't all of the sudden get good because Jones is out. Spags put a different plan together because his coaching ass is on the line. Our linebackers never attacked like this before. I just hope this wasn't a fluke!I said in another thread that watching all of the all-22 film from our other games, there was a huge change in regards to calling stunts, games, and blitzes. We have rarely blitzed this year, and coming into the game I think we were in the bottom 5 in percentage of blitzes ran.

Hitchens said that the same plays were called and the players just changed their mentality, but he had to be protecting Spags, because the play calls were much more aggressive. Maybe that's just because the plan was to collect 20 holding calls on Bowles, or they identified some specific weakness in Denver's offensive line.

But whatever the case, I think we ran more stunts and games in this game than we had all season combined. Rodgers is much more mobile, and much, much, much more talented than Flacco, so we'll see if we stay aggressive, or go back to calling defensive plays like weeks 1-6.

Sent from my GM1915 using Tapatalk

[Chargem]

I'm pretty sure the "Chris Jones is bad against the run" thing is a myth. He's definitely a better pass rusher than a run defender, but he's perfectly adequate against the run.

He is an elite player, and you regularly see him just stall a drive on his own with one big TFL or sack - which is exactly what was missing in the Texans game.

Worst case, Nnadi and Saunders make a better run stuffing duo in the center of the line and you give CJ a breather on 1st downs and keep him fresh to do what he does best on passing downs.

On whether to extend him or not, well that depends on what you could tag and trade him for. If you get a 1st round pick plus another good pick, you have to consider it.

[ChiefsFanatic]

Very possible



Was it Denver's Oline being shitty?

Was it the Chiefs just deciding to play harder?

Was it better scheme play because Jones wasn't fucking it up?



We'll see.I don't think Jones freelances like people seem to think. My only issue with Jones is that he sometimes just quits on a play way too often. I have seen him stand and watch a play 6 yards down the field like he was watching a play that was 50 yards down the field. Think of how many times we saw Hali and Houston help gang tackle a running back 15 yards down field, because they were hustling their asses off, and then think about how many times you have seen Chris Jones do that.

I think we played better because we had two true defensive tackles, Saunders and Naadi, playing inside at the defensive tackle position instead of a defensive end, Jones, playing out of position.

When we had a dominant defense in the 90s, we had two huge tackles, Dan Saleumua and Joe Phillips, who occupied both offensive guards and the center, allowing Neil Smith and DT to go one-on-one with the tackles.

Imagine taking Saleaumua out, and replacing him with Smith at defensive tackle. I think we would have been a much different defense.

Jones isn't the outside pass rusher that Smith was, but he is closer to that than he is to being the run stopper that Saleaumua or Phillips was.



Sent from my GM1915 using Tapatalk

[RunKC]

This defense has been significantly better against the run without Jones and Williams in the lineup and I think that says a lot.

At this point I’m thinking the smart play is to trade Jones, try to extend Ogbah at a decent price, use the picks and use leftover cash flow to find a LB in FA.

You’d think this defense would be crippled by Jones departure. The inside guys are actually making him expendable.

[Chris Meck]

This defense has been significantly better against the run without Jones and Williams in the lineup and I think that says a lot.

At this point I’m thinking the smart play is to trade Jones, try to extend Ogbah at a decent price, use the picks and use leftover cash flow to find a LB in FA.

You’d think this defense would be crippled by Jones departure. The inside guys are actually making him expendable.

Nnadi and Saunders are both playing well, but neither has the pass rush explosiveness of Jones.

I'm not saying we have to pay him, but I am saying we're better when he's available. Between the 3 of them, that's a real nice rotation inside.

[treeguy27]

Nnadi and Saunders are both playing well, but neither has the pass rush explosiveness of Jones.

I'm not saying we have to pay him, but I am saying we're better when he's available. Between the 3 of them, that's a real nice rotation inside.

Agreed, but our sack totals have been higher since Jones has been out. It is probably a product of scheme change, but it shows we could scheme pressure without breaking the bank to keep Jones.

[Chris Meck]

Agreed, but our sack totals have been higher since Jones has been out. It is probably a product of scheme change, but it shows we could scheme pressure without breaking the bank to keep Jones.

Yeah, and I'm encouraged about the progression of the defense.

We're getting to the QB because we're blitzing like mad. I like it because it's aggressive, but it'd be nice to not have to do it as much and still get there.

Clark and Jones give you that capability.

Nnadi and at this point in his early career Saunders can get you some effort sacks, but neither is what I'd call 'explosive'.

[TomBarndtsTwin]

The last 2 weeks have shown that you can play solid D without Jones in there and get pressure on the QB. Yeah, you're gonna have to blitz more, but wouldn't most people rather see an aggressive game plan? Supposedly that's why everyone wanted Spags (the exotic blitz packages, mixing it up, etc.).

The gameplan used against Rodgers and GB last night would have beaten Brady and Hoodie in the AFC Title Game last year. Spags needs to file that one away and save it for the Patsies.

I am convinced, after watching the last 2 weeks, there is no way the Chiefs pay Jones close to $20 mil. per after this season. He's gone either via tag and trade or FA and a comp. pick.

Nice knowing you, Chris. Thanks for the couple seasons of performance.

[ChiefaRoo]

Put Jones at end. Clark at LB.

Profit.

Jones should play End.

[Rasputin]

Nah i think he will beast when he comes back his dick will come out of his pants and deep throat a quarterback.

[Hammock Parties]

Put Jones at end. Clark at LB.

Profit.

You are criminally stupid. Clark is not a LB. Jones is not a DE, unless it's in an "elephant" package.

[O.city]

You don’t want to have to continually blitz like that though you’ll get eaten alive

Getting a healthy jones back and hopefully Clark will be big

[Kman34]

You don’t want to have to continually blitz like that though you’ll get eaten alive

Getting a healthy jones back and hopefully Clark will be big

Jones with a blitz could be very affective...

[rabblerouser]

You are criminally stupid. Clark is not a LB. Jones is not a DE, unless it's in an "elephant" package.

He's a liability against the run at DT.

you wouldn't know stupid if it punted the ball to Aaron Rodgers with 5 min left in the game.

[Iczer]

I'm beginning to warm up to trading Jones. I really don't want him gone honestly, but with the way KC's cap situation is and having to sign Mahomes. Spags is adjusting his gameplan and getting more exotic with his blitzs, proving we can get to the quarterback.

Linebacker is a serious need

[comochiefsfan]

Is Jones’ one sack a game more valuable than all the rushing yards he gives up? That’s the question we need to ask ourselves here.

Personally, I don’t think so. Spags can dial up blitzes to get to the QB and we badly need an interior run stuffer to help out our subpar linebackers.

Let him walk.

[WhiteWhale]

The packers averaged over 5 YPC and ran all over us for 5 minutes to close the game and you jackasses still think Jones is the problem? I guess that was his fault?

He didn't ****ing play! He didn't play against Houston and they jammed it up our ass!

This "Chis Jones actually sucks and is a liability" narrative is ****ing dumb. I'm ****ing tired of dickheads talking like he's the only problem with our run D when we suck without him and our LB's are a dumpster fire.

If you want to talk about him being worth the money, him being injured too much, fine. There's a lot of arguments. The "He's actually shitty" argument is embarrassing.

[ModSocks]

The packers averaged over 5 YPC and ran all over us for 5 minutes to close the game and you jackasses still think Jones is the problem? I guess that was his fault?

He didn't ****ing play! He didn't play against Houston and they jammed it up our ass!

This "Chis Jones actually sucks and is a liability" narrative is ****ing dumb. I'm ****ing tired of dickheads talking like he's the only problem with our run D when we suck without him and our LB's are a dumpster fire.
.

It's the most bullshit, overblown CP narrative of 2019.

[Iczer]

They got ran over with him and without him, so.... maybe invest in some linebackers that can fill gaps and tackle. That's just my perspective.

[ModSocks]

They got ran over with him and without him, so.... maybe invest in some linebackers that can fill gaps and tackle. That's just my perspective.

It's always been the fucking linebackers. Always. Like ive said many times before it's no coincidence the run D went to shit when DJ was released.

Anthony Hitchens can't run with Aaron Rodgers...i mean c'mon.

[dlphg9]

Reggie Ragland had a play last night in which he played the run like the linebacker should. He met the RB right as he was hitting his hole. It was awesome. I want to see more of that.

[-King-]

This defense has been significantly better against the run without Jones and Williams in the lineup and I think that says a lot.

At this point I’m thinking the smart play is to trade Jones, try to extend Ogbah at a decent price, use the picks and use leftover cash flow to find a LB in FA.

You’d think this defense would be crippled by Jones departure. The inside guys are actually making him expendable.

How are we significantly better? We have up 5 yards per carry yesterday and allowed the Packers to run out the last 5 minutes of the game doing nothing but running the ball.

[-King-]

It's the most bullshit, overblown CP narrative of 2019.

One person said he freelances at times and now some people want to act like that's all he does.

[staylor26]

How are we significantly better? We have up 5 yards per carry yesterday and allowed the Packers to run out the last 5 minutes of the game doing nothing but running the ball.

A lot of that has to do with the DL running out of gas and barely having enough guys for a rotation.

It’s pretty obvious the run defense has been much better the last 2 weeks. That still doesn’t mean we’re better without Jones though.

[suzzer99]

The run D is better because we've been selling out for the run. Rodgers exploited the flaw in doing that.

[dlphg9]

One person said he freelances at times and now some people want to act like that's all he does.

Yep, it is such a stupid fucking assessment and now it's been completely overblown by Clark the sympathizers. They were running out of excuses for FC and in their attempt to white knight him for not getting to the QB as much as Jones, they decided to start saying "well its because Jones just goes out and does whatever he wants and his only focus is rushing the passer, unlike Frank who follows his assignments and just an elite player in every phase of the game". The only thing that motherfucker is elite at is running his mouth and beating up on one of the worst tackles in the league and sacking a guy that didn't even look like he wanted to play.

[Iczer]

It's always been the ****ing linebackers. Always. Like ive said many times before it's no coincidence the run D went to shit when DJ was released.

Anthony Hitchens can't run with Aaron Rodgers...i mean c'mon.

Agreed, I can still picture DJ knifing through blocks and laying guys out behind the LOS.

[RunKC]

One person said he freelances at times and now some people want to act like that's all he does.

He’s ignoring gap assignments against the run bc he wants to collect sacks to get a big contract.

[crispystl]

It's always been the fucking linebackers. Always. Like ive said many times before it's no coincidence the run D went to shit when DJ was released.



Anthony Hitchens can't run with Aaron Rodgers...i mean c'mon.Yup they're the only constant. We've changed every fucking other thing. It's them.

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