QBs: Dickhead vs. Douchebag

'Hamas' Jenkins · 02-25-2010, 10:07 AM

I've been thinking about the Clausen debate a good deal recently. I'm not totally sold on Clausen in light of next year's class, but I'm not sure we'll be in position to take one of those guys either. Obviously, Clausen's personality has rubbed people the wrong way at times. But how so?

Mecca made a point the other day that it wasn't a big deal, because a lot of QBs were douches. That's definitely true, but perhaps taken more literally, how successful have the true douchebags been? I'm talking about me-first, aloof assholes who have a bizarre air of entitlement about them.

Conversely, how has their success compared to that of dickheads? Essentially a dickhead is someone who acts like an ass to a lot of people, is incredibly demanding, but may not have the aloof attitude of the douchebag.

Looking at a lot of QBs across history, I think that you could break them down along the following lines:

Dickheads:

Dan Marino, Peyton Manning, Tom Brady.

All of them bitched out their WRs for very small mistakes, got on their line for blown coverages, or snapped on a back for missing a block. But one could argue that it was due to their insane competitive drive.

Douchebags:

Jeff George, Jay Cutler, Ryan Leaf.

These guys were all (seemingly) despised by both fans and teammates. They didn't always get into it with players, but they never seemed to have a problem mixing it up with either fans or coaches.

Here is the crux. Obviously, the dickheads in the above example are "winners" while the douchebags are "losers". Is the only differentiation between the two the fact that the dickheads won? Or, do the dickheads have something within their dickhead personality that makes them win, something the douchebags never had?

If we are to believe this rather primitive theory, do you think that Clausen's actions are the actions of a dickhead or a douchebag, and how might that affect your view on drafting him?

**Note that I've exempted guys like Drew Brees and Joe Montana, who seem universally loved by their teammates

****Grbac was a douche and Gannon was a dickhead.

**The Franchise** · 02-25-2010, 10:11 AM

Honestly.....I get more upset if my QB doesn't get on his WRs for dropping the ball or he doesn't get on the offensive lineman who misses their assignment.

'Hamas' Jenkins · 02-25-2010, 10:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pestilence

Honestly.....I get more upset if my QB doesn't get on his WRs for dropping the ball or he doesn't get on the offensive lineman who misses their assignment.

Classic hallmark of a dickhead QB.

Douchebag throws his arms up and makes a stupid face while sulking on the sidelines.

**The Franchise** · 02-25-2010, 10:14 AM

Well....a classic douchebag move would be throwing an INT and then smiling and laughing while he walks back to the sidelines.

Fat Elvis · 02-25-2010, 10:15 AM

I also like QBs that don't over-or under-throw their receivers on a regular basis.

'Hamas' Jenkins · 02-25-2010, 10:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pestilence

Well....a classic douchebag move would be throwing an INT and then smiling and laughing while he walks back to the sidelines.

Example?

**The Franchise** · 02-25-2010, 10:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 'Hamas' Jenkins

Example?

Hmmm....first person that comes to mind. Jay Cutler.

keg in kc · 02-25-2010, 10:19 AM

I think it's leadership that makes the difference, although how or why someone is a "leader" isn't so much a tangible thing. George, Cutler and Leaf were/all are basically flakes whose teammates wouldn't piss on them if they were on fire, whereas Marino, Manning and Brady were/are clearly "the man" on their teams. I think it has to do with the ability to drive the people around them to a higher level of play. Maybe they're dickheads for the sake of the team, whereas the other guys were dickheads into themselves? Maybe it's how they try to get their points across? Hell if I know, but I think leadership is the difference.

As for Clausen, I don't really know. He's had some really good individual results in what I consider a less-than-perfect situation, but I don't have a clue how he'll translate to the NFL. Just for me, there's always something that's seemed a little "off" about him, but with Weis on the staff, this is the really rare situation where I would just acceed to the decision of the team. 'cause I think we have a deeper insight than any other franchise into him. Although on the other hand, maybe it would be tunnel vision.

'Hamas' Jenkins · 02-25-2010, 10:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by keg in kc

I think it's leadership that makes the difference, although how or why someone is a "leader" isn't so much a tangible thing. George, Cutler and Leaf were/all are basically flakes whose teammates wouldn't piss on them if they were on fire, whereas Marino, Manning and Brady were/are clearly "the man" on their teams. I think it has to do with the ability to drive the people around them to a higher level of play. Maybe they're dickheads for the sake of the team, whereas the other guys were dickheads into themselves? Maybe it's how they try to get their points across? Hell if I know, but I think leadership is the difference.

As for Clausen, I don't really know. He's had some really good individual results in what I consider a less-than-perfect situation, but I don't have a clue how he'll translate to the NFL. Just for me, there's always something that's seemed a little "off" about him, but with Weis on the staff, this is the really rare situation where I would just acceed to the decision of the team. 'cause I think we have a deeper insight than any other franchise into him. Although on the other hand, maybe it would be tunnel vision.

I agree. People will follow a dickhead. Patton was a consummate dickhead. People will not follow a douchebag.

**The Franchise** · 02-25-2010, 10:23 AM

It is possible for a dickhead not to be a winner.......because like keg said....he has to be a leader as well. You can't yell at your WRs all game and expect them to follow you. You also have to pull them aside when they make the great catch and pat them on the helmet and tell them good job.

Stanley Nickels · 02-25-2010, 10:24 AM

**RealSNR** · 02-25-2010, 11:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pestilence

Well....a classic douchebag move would be throwing an INT and then smiling and laughing while he walks back to the sidelines.

Jamarcus Russell amirite

**Tribal Warfare** · 02-25-2010, 11:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 'Hamas' Jenkins

Douchebag throws his arms up and makes a stupid face while sulking on the sidelines.

That's Matt Cassel.

Chiefnj2 · 02-25-2010, 11:18 AM

"Sports Illustrated labeled Clausen "the kid with the golden arm" when he was a junior in high school. He announced his commitment to Notre Dame by arriving at the College Football Hall of Fame in South Bend, Ind., in a stretch Hummer limousine."

That's a lot more d-bag than dickhead.

Brock · 02-25-2010, 11:45 AM

Refusing to play for the team that drafted you seems like a douchebag move.

02-25-2010, 10:07 AM
'Hamas' Jenkins Now you've pissed me off! Join Date: Jan 2006 Casino cash: $7129572	QBs: Dickhead vs. Douchebag I've been thinking about the Clausen debate a good deal recently. I'm not totally sold on Clausen in light of next year's class, but I'm not sure we'll be in position to take one of those guys either. Obviously, Clausen's personality has rubbed people the wrong way at times. But how so? Mecca made a point the other day that it wasn't a big deal, because a lot of QBs were douches. That's definitely true, but perhaps taken more literally, how successful have the true douchebags been? I'm talking about me-first, aloof assholes who have a bizarre air of entitlement about them. Conversely, how has their success compared to that of dickheads? Essentially a dickhead is someone who acts like an ass to a lot of people, is incredibly demanding, but may not have the aloof attitude of the douchebag. Looking at a lot of QBs across history, I think that you could break them down along the following lines: Dickheads: Dan Marino, Peyton Manning, Tom Brady. All of them bitched out their WRs for very small mistakes, got on their line for blown coverages, or snapped on a back for missing a block. But one could argue that it was due to their insane competitive drive. Douchebags: Jeff George, Jay Cutler, Ryan Leaf. These guys were all (seemingly) despised by both fans and teammates. They didn't always get into it with players, but they never seemed to have a problem mixing it up with either fans or coaches. Here is the crux. Obviously, the dickheads in the above example are "winners" while the douchebags are "losers". Is the only differentiation between the two the fact that the dickheads won? Or, do the dickheads have something within their dickhead personality that makes them win, something the douchebags never had? If we are to believe this rather primitive theory, do you think that Clausen's actions are the actions of a dickhead or a douchebag, and how might that affect your view on drafting him? Note that I've exempted guys like Drew Brees and Joe Montana, who seem universally loved by their teammates **Grbac was a douche and Gannon was a dickhead.
Posts: 75,083

02-25-2010, 10:11 AM	#2
The Franchise Most Valuable Villain Join Date: Dec 2006 Casino cash: $2065047	Honestly.....I get more upset if my QB doesn't get on his WRs for dropping the ball or he doesn't get on the offensive lineman who misses their assignment.
Posts: 92,316

02-25-2010, 10:14 AM	#4
The Franchise Most Valuable Villain Join Date: Dec 2006 Casino cash: $2065047	Well....a classic douchebag move would be throwing an INT and then smiling and laughing while he walks back to the sidelines.
Posts: 92,316

02-25-2010, 10:15 AM	#5
Fat Elvis Sexiest Athlete Join Date: Apr 2001 Casino cash: $-2088075	I also like QBs that don't over-or under-throw their receivers on a regular basis.
Posts: 12,703

02-25-2010, 10:19 AM	#8
keg in kc oxymoron Join Date: Feb 2001 Location: OP/KC/Whatever Casino cash: $9556299	I think it's leadership that makes the difference, although how or why someone is a "leader" isn't so much a tangible thing. George, Cutler and Leaf were/all are basically flakes whose teammates wouldn't piss on them if they were on fire, whereas Marino, Manning and Brady were/are clearly "the man" on their teams. I think it has to do with the ability to drive the people around them to a higher level of play. Maybe they're dickheads for the sake of the team, whereas the other guys were dickheads into themselves? Maybe it's how they try to get their points across? Hell if I know, but I think leadership is the difference. As for Clausen, I don't really know. He's had some really good individual results in what I consider a less-than-perfect situation, but I don't have a clue how he'll translate to the NFL. Just for me, there's always something that's seemed a little "off" about him, but with Weis on the staff, this is the really rare situation where I would just acceed to the decision of the team. 'cause I think we have a deeper insight than any other franchise into him. Although on the other hand, maybe it would be tunnel vision.
Posts: 58,682

02-25-2010, 10:23 AM	#10
The Franchise Most Valuable Villain Join Date: Dec 2006 Casino cash: $2065047	It is possible for a dickhead not to be a winner.......because like keg said....he has to be a leader as well. You can't yell at your WRs all game and expect them to follow you. You also have to pull them aside when they make the great catch and pat them on the helmet and tell them good job.
Posts: 92,316

02-25-2010, 10:24 AM	#11
Stanley Nickels [null] Join Date: Sep 2008 Casino cash: $1632893	__________________ Bacon-wrapped shrimp: My first-favorite food wrapped around my third-favorite food. I'd go to a banquet in honor of those Somali pirates if they served bacon-wrapped shrimp.
Posts: 6,657

02-25-2010, 11:18 AM	#14
Chiefnj2 In Search of a Life Join Date: Mar 2007 Casino cash: $6654388	"Sports Illustrated labeled Clausen "the kid with the golden arm" when he was a junior in high school. He announced his commitment to Notre Dame by arriving at the College Football Hall of Fame in South Bend, Ind., in a stretch Hummer limousine." That's a lot more d-bag than dickhead. __________________ Mismanaging the clock.
Posts: 22,541

02-25-2010, 11:45 AM	#15
Brock Say hello to my little friend Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Larryville Casino cash: $9598422	Refusing to play for the team that drafted you seems like a douchebag move.
Posts: 47,314