I've got a question for the Raiders fans.

[WebGem]

What is your view on the Raiders offseason so far? Honestly, I think I'd be pissed. That is my honest opinion.

[Wallcrawler]

Im not a Raider fan, but if I were, id definately be pissed.

Sure, they snagged Randy Moss, but look what it cost them. They were cutting players left and right to fit his salary in, and they may lose even more players.


Their defense was bad to begin with, but now its horrendous. They traded MLB Napoleon Harris in the Moss trade, along with the 7th overall pick that would have helped in the defense department.

Then they cut S Ray Buchanan in the secondary, and John Parella on the D-line.

Charles Woodson counts for 10m against the cap, and talks are that he might be traded.


G Frank Middleton is cut from an O-line that needed help, so thats not good news for Kerry Collins.


The only good cuts I saw them make were TE Roland Williams who didnt even catch a pass all season, and Cutting Tyrone Wheatley because they are bringing in Lamont Jordan.


So they have a shaky o-line, a statue QB who fumbles if he gets ripped on the blind side, but can throw a great deep ball when and if he gets the time.

Lamont Jordan comes in to try to help the rushing game, but the O-line he is playing behind doesnt even compare to the one he ran behind with the Jets, so who knows how well he will do.


Basicly, you have Randy Moss and Jerry Porter, and they can only be effective if Collins has time to get them the ball.

Then that defense comes out onto the field, and will most likely have just about as rough a time stopping teams from scoring as the KC defense does. If you can imagine such a thing.

Yeah, Id be pretty pissed off if I was a Raider fan.

[TheNextStep]

I'd like to go ahead and respond to some of Stinger's points...

Originally Posted by The Stinger

Sure, they snagged Randy Moss, but look what it cost them. They were cutting players left and right to fit his salary in, and they may lose even more players.

They cut three players to fit his salary. They cut two more to accomodate LaMont Jordan.

Their defense was bad to begin with, but now its horrendous. They traded MLB Napoleon Harris in the Moss trade, along with the 7th overall pick that would have helped in the defense department.

First, Napoleon Harris was outperformed last year by Danny Clark, who had 120 tackles to Harris' 61. Secondly, Napoleon Harris didn't make a single damned play last year that stood out. Guys that get 61 tackles and no big plays DO, in fact, grow on trees.

Secondly, there is not a player in this draft that would be available at #7 who is a better impact player than Randy Moss.

Then they cut S Ray Buchanan in the secondary, and John Parella on the D-line.

True of false: Ray Buchanan sucked.
The answer, of course, it "true." No matter what the Raiders did this off-season, I wanted Buchanan gone. Why? Because his play warranted it. So, seriously, don't point to Buchanan as an example of the Raiders "having to cut" somebody for Moss. He was a guy who is an example of the Raiders "having to cut" somebody for playing like shit on Sundays. No more, no less.

John Parrella is about to be 36 years old, wasn't effective as a nose tackle, and expressed an unwillingness to move to DE in the 3-4 defense. As a result, he was down to #3 on the DT depth chart.

Charles Woodson counts for 10m against the cap, and talks are that he might be traded.

And if he is traded, there's nearly 11 million freed up to hit the free agent market. There's also talk that the Raiders are still trying to work out a long term deal. There's also talk that the Raiders are actively shopping for a cornerback in free agency (Andre Dyson and Ty Law are the ones mentioned most but it was also reported that they were one of the teams who contacted the Dolphins about Pat Surtain). There's also talk that they'll let Woodson play the year on the franchise tender again.

I wouldn't like to lose Woodson, don't get me wrong.

G Frank Middleton is cut from an O-line that needed help, so thats not good news for Kerry Collins.

Frank Middleton has been on Injured Reserve for two years... and adding a running game will certainly help the offensive line in Oakland. Robert Gallery is a year older, as are Jake Grove and Langston Walker. Barry Sims restructured and Brad Badger has played very good ball for us while Middleton was on IR.

I like Middleton and always have. I'm hoping that they bring him back somehow (as they did when they cut him and brought him back two years ago)... but when a guy sits on IR for two years, it is hard to criticize a team for cutting bait on him...

[TheNextStep]

I'm absolutely thrilled with it.

Re-signing Jerry Porter. I love this move because I still think this guy is going to get better. It took a while for he and Collins to get onto the same page but once they did... damn.

Trading for Randy Moss. Yes, you can say, "this really wasn't a need position" but I maintain that any time you add the #1 player at his respective position, that's a good thing. Denver doesn't NEED a running back, but would them somehow getting LaDanian Tomlinson be a BAD thing? Indy doesn't NEED a tight end... but if you guys sent Tony Gonzalez to them, would that hurt the Colts? Personally, I love the move... despite the fact that Randy is not exactly my favorite guy.

LaMont Jordan. My favorite move of all. Last year, Amos Zereuoe led the Raiders in rushing with something around 458 yards or so. That is the lowest yardage total for a leading Raider runner IN THE HISTORY OF THE FRANCHISE.

Yes, you can say "but they didn't get any defense" but I'd say two things to that:

1. You guys didn't watch all the games that I did so you really don't know how many f***ing times we went 3 and out on offense and left our defense on the field for seriously extended periods of time. Having an offense that should be able to sustain a drive will help the defense.

2. The Raiders aren't done. It has only been day one of free agency. Rumors are already out there that the Raiders are bringing in Ed Jasper (DT, Falcons) on Monday and have their sights set on Andre Dyson (CB, Tennessee) and Morlon Greenwood (OLB, Dolphins). I'm confident that there will be more looks than just that, too, including more after June 1st, when perhaps a 3-4 linebacker like Sam Cowart stands a good possibility of being cut.

As for the salary cap, it isn't really that much of an issue. People always tell me "Ha ha, the Raiders don't have any cap room" and the simple fact of the matter is that they always end up being wrong. John Clayton has literally run a "Raiders against the cap and it is time to panic" article every year for the past 6 years. Literally, for the past 6 years. He has yet to be right.

If free agency ended tomorrow and these were the ONLY moves that we'd made, I would obviously have serious concerns about our defense... but there's a whole lot of off-season ahead of us to address that. As for how they started? Man, I couldn't be happier.

[BigMeatballDave]

Originally Posted by TheNextStep

I'm absolutely thrilled with it.

Are you ? Your D went from horrible to worse...

[whoman69]

Originally Posted by TheNextStep

I'm absolutely thrilled with it.
Yes, you can say "but they didn't get any defense" but I'd say two things to that:
1. You guys didn't watch all the games that I did so you really don't know how many f***ing times we went 3 and out on offense and left our defense on the field for seriously extended periods of time. Having an offense that should be able to sustain a drive will help the defense.
2. The Raiders aren't done. It has only been day one of free agency. Rumors are already out there that the Raiders are bringing in Ed Jasper (DT, Falcons) on Monday and have their sights set on Andre Dyson (CB, Tennessee) and Morlon Greenwood (OLB, Dolphins). I'm confident that there will be more looks than just that, too, including more after June 1st, when perhaps a 3-4 linebacker like Sam Cowart stands a good possibility of being cut.
As for the salary cap, it isn't really that much of an issue. People always tell me "Ha ha, the Raiders don't have any cap room" and the simple fact of the matter is that they always end up being wrong. John Clayton has literally run a "Raiders against the cap and it is time to panic" article every year for the past 6 years. Literally, for the past 6 years. He has yet to be right.
If free agency ended tomorrow and these were the ONLY moves that we'd made, I would obviously have serious concerns about our defense... but there's a whole lot of off-season ahead of us to address that. As for how they started? Man, I couldn't be happier.

I thought that as well a few years ago about the time on the field for the defense. A couple years ago the Chiefs seemingly tried to score a TD everytime they had the ball. Just the same as a three and out if you score too quick. But the Chiefs can pound the ball as well and cut down on three and outs and the defense still sucked. At some point you just have to look at the players. The Raiders got too old and had noone in the wings.
The salary cap will be an issue because Moss and Woodson take up so much room. Sure you can get a guy like Gannon to take a cut because he lost his starting job and is near the end of his career. But are you going to have luck getting other guys to stick their necks out for a 5 win team? The good players on the team are not going to want to take one for the team if they think the team is going nowhere. Davis will threaten to cut them, but with the losing situation right now, that might be an empty threat. They can't afford to cut what little talent they have, so the threat is useless.

[easymobee]

I'm not a Raider fan ( Or a Chief fan ) But i think the Raiders have had a great offseason so far.

Randy Moss + Porter resigning + Jordan all but done ... whats the Problem?

[tommykat]

Originally Posted by easymobee

I'm not a Raider fan ( Or a Chief fan ) But i think the Raiders have had a great offseason so far.

Randy Moss + Porter resigning + Jordan all but done ... whats the Problem?

IF YOU ARE NOT A CHIEF FAN.........then wtfreak are you doing here???

[easymobee]

Originally Posted by tommykat

IF YOU ARE NOT A CHIEF FAN.........then wtfreak are you doing here???

Keep your friends close .... Keep your enemies even closer.

I'm a Broncos * ( * Won back to back SB's for the cost of a Gallon of Crisco and a 3rd rounder according to you guys) fan.

[WebGem]

Originally Posted by easymobee

Randy Moss + Porter resigning + Jordan all but done ... whats the Problem?

What was the problem with the Chiefs the last 3 seasons?

[easymobee]

Originally Posted by ChiefsFan5840

What was the problem with the Chiefs the last 3 seasons?

And did you guys ever complain about how things were done BEFORE it was obvious that it was not the best route?

So why should Joe Raderfan be pissed about the offseason so far?

The only D player that the Raiders have lost so far is Nap Harris .....

Thats akin to you guys losing Fujita from your D and adding in a Randy Moss to push Morton off the starting lineup last year ....

Is a Fujita or a Harris really that hard to replace?

Is a Moss really that easy to obtain?

Its also safe to say that the Moss addition is gonna cost the Chargers and Chiefs an extra 5 Million each in potential signing bonus to find a good enough CB to chase him around for 60 minutes.

So the Raiders kinda screw their rivals with the same move.

A. Henry got 2/3rds of the Signing Bonus that Champ got last year, imagine what a guy like Rolle is gonna want tommorow as opposed to yesterday.

A. Henry was 5th or so on most peoples CB lists .... Widely considered the last one on the list that could be counted on to be a probable starter.

[Katie]

[QUOTE=easymobee]And did you guys ever complain about how things were done BEFORE it was obvious that it was not the best route?

You are relatively new here, so I'll fill you in...This board has been inundated with threads bashing the Chiefs front office for poor player acquisitions for the last four years, maybe longer.

I watched the Vikings quite a bit last year and the guy takes as many plays off as he makes. Vikings fans are GLAD to see this guy leave...how are the Raiders fans going to feel when this guy walks off the field before the game ends?

[tiptap]

[QUOTE=Chief Kwayzee]

Originally Posted by easymobee

And did you guys ever complain about how things were done BEFORE it was obvious that it was not the best route?

You are relatively new here, so I'll fill you in...This board has been inundated with threads bashing the Chiefs front office for poor player acquisitions for the last four years, maybe longer.

I watched the Vikings quite a bit last year and the guy takes as many plays off as he makes. Vikings fans are GLAD to see this guy leave...how are the Raiders fans going to feel when this guy walks off the field before the game ends?

The Raiders got better. The Raiders have always accepted that professional football is entertainment and that Moss' antics will add entertainment value as well as someone who can be a difference maker and make others better. And I want them somewhat better so that at the end of the season there are more W's in AFC-W against the AFC-E. I am waiting on the schedules but there needs to be big clashes between the two divisions. Entertainment you know.

[SBK]

Shouldn't this thread be titled:

ATTENTION INMATES

[CosmicPal]

Originally Posted by shortbuskid

Shouldn't this thread be titled:

ATTENTION INMATES