MIZZOU ST

[joeball]

Hey about those MISSOURI STATE Bears!!! The ESPN men's basketball front page has them as "Mizzou ST". Man, bet you mizzou fans hate to see that. Seriously, they have a very good team this year. It IS a shame that little mizzou won't play the BEARS unless they are forced too. Well while da Bears are cuttin some net in the Big Dance maybe, just maybe little mizzou can grope for an nit bid.
HA ole mizzou had it coming, fighting the name change and doing everything it can to avoid playing little ole sw missouri state in the day!!!!!

[tk13]

Originally Posted by BSPimpDude

More like youre an idiot if you dont agree with that.

I don't agree with that. I don't think any Mo. Valley team would win the Big 12, but they'd be more than competitive.

[CoMoChief]

Originally Posted by tk13

By all means, you'll get no disagreement from me. KU has a talented group of players. Far more McDonalds All-Americans. But fans, and analysts, get too caught up in that sometimes. Sometimes there's more to it than just running and jumping and flying around like KU can.

Northern Iowa is a good basketball team. They beat Iowa, who leads maybe the most competitive conference in the country in the Big 10. They went into LSU and beat an athletic LSU team, that is 10-2 in the SEC, which is always a feat. They just took out that same Bucknell team that beat Kansas. They can play. As can some of these other Mo. Val teams.

This is where people get stupid about these one year wonders. Every once in a while youll have a team come out of nowhere and play like they are on another planet while a marquee team plays mediocre at best and the top team falls, like KU did last year against Bucknell. I would bet all of my bank account on the fact that KU and other big time schools would beat these smaller schools 49/50 times.

[CoMoChief]

Originally Posted by tk13

I don't agree with that. I don't think any Mo. Valley team would win the Big 12, but they'd be more than competitive.

More than who, Baylor??? Come on, no one really thinks Baylor's in the Big12 anyway, except for baseball. Maybe Southern Illinois and possibly Crieghton would be a bottom 3-4 team in the Big12 but thats about it.

[duncan_idaho]

BS

Think you misunderstood me... I was saying my evaluation of kU as a national title dark horse had nothing to do with the name on the jersey and everything to do with what I had seen on the hardwood.

I'm definitely with you on the state school/small school thing... Missouri—when it's not being run by a cokehead who seems more interested in schtupping his star player's girlfriend—can attract a level of player schools like SMS can only dream of.

tk,
UNI has a solid shot at the Sweet 16/Elite 8... but I doubt you'd find anyone who would consider them a dark horse national title contender. That's the difference in having mediocre talent and superior coaching and execution (UNI) and having superior talent with good coaching and improving execution (kU).

A 'great' season for a basketball power in the MVC is a run to the Sweet 16 or Elite 8. A 'great' season for a basketball power in the Big 12, Big 10, Pac 10, Big East, SEC or ACC is a Final Four/National title appearance.

That's the key difference...

[tk13]

Originally Posted by BSPimpDude

This is where people get stupid about these one year wonders. Every once in a while youll have a team come out of nowhere and play like they are on another planet while a marquee team plays mediocre at best and the top team falls, like KU did last year against Bucknell. I would bet all of my bank account on the fact that KU and other big time schools would beat these smaller schools 49/50 times.

Every once in a while? It happens every year, multiple times. Just in the Mo. Valley alone this year:

-Northern Iowa beat both Iowa and LSU, 1st place teams of two of the best conferences in America, as well as a very good ranked Bucknell team.
-Wichita State lost a 1 point heartbreaker to Illinois
-Creighton beat Nebraska (who is tied for 5th in the Big 12) by 26 POINTS
-Drake, who is 5-11 in the conference, lost @ Iowa and @ Boston College by a combined 8 points
-Indiana State beat an Indiana team early in the season that was up near the top 10-15 at the time before the whole coaching controversy started tearing the team down.
-Evansville beat Purdue, at Purdue
-Illinois State had Cincinnati within 6 points in the 2nd half before Cincy pulled away.

I mean those last few are just the bottom feeder teams, and they've been more than competitive if not beaten "major" teams. There's a reason their RPI is so high, it's not just an accident.

[Pitt Gorilla]

Originally Posted by BigRedChief

name calling is the first resort of a lame argument.

I think that if two teams meet on the basketball court and the Bears beat NI that means that the Bears are better than NI.

Uh, UNI also beat SMS. It's called a "split" I believe. Of course, KSU beat KU on the court. Are they better than KU? MU also split with KU, which by your strange definition, means they are also "better than" KU. Interesting.

[Pitt Gorilla]

Originally Posted by tk13

By all means, you'll get no disagreement from me. KU has a talented group of players. Far more McDonalds All-Americans. But fans, and analysts, get too caught up in that sometimes. Sometimes there's more to it than just running and jumping and flying around like KU can.

Northern Iowa is a good basketball team. They beat Iowa, who leads maybe the most competitive conference in the country in the Big 10. They went into LSU and beat an athletic LSU team, that is 10-2 in the SEC, which is always a feat. They just took out that same Bucknell team that beat Kansas. They can play. As can some of these other Mo. Val teams.

Exactly. UNI will not "out talent" very many teams. They will, however, beat teams like KU. They simply play better basketball. If Funk was healthy for Creighton, I'd pick them in the top of a league like the Big 12.

[tk13]

Originally Posted by Pitt Gorilla

Exactly. UNI will not "out talent" very many teams. They will, however, beat teams like KU. They simply play better basketball. If Funk was healthy for Creighton, I'd pick them in the top of a league like the Big 12.

Yeah, my point never was that the MVC is consistently as good as the Big 12. This year they're probably closer than a lot of people would like to admit though. And I think that happens every year, there's a conference or two that legitimately is pretty talented that gets shafted for some .500ish teams from a conference like the Big 12. If a team like a Nebraska gets in over someone like Southern Illinois it would be pretty disgusting, regardless of what the Big XII homers here say. Sometimes the reason there aren't as many of those upset stories is because a "smaller" conference only gets a team or two in the tournament. The MVC is usually pretty good anyway but this year has been a pretty special year for them, I hope they get rewarded. The MAC had a year like this a few years back and only got one team in, Kent State, and they almost made it to the Final Four.

[alnorth]

Originally Posted by tk13

Yeah, my point never was that the MVC is consistently as good as the Big 12. This year they're probably closer than a lot of people would like to admit though. And I think that happens every year, there's a conference or two that legitimately is pretty talented that gets shafted for some .500ish teams from a conference like the Big 12. If a team like a Nebraska gets in over someone like Southern Illinois it would be pretty disgusting, regardless of what the Big XII homers here say. Sometimes the reason there aren't as many of those upset stories is because a "smaller" conference only gets a team or two in the tournament. The MVC is usually pretty good anyway but this year has been a pretty special year for them, I hope they get rewarded. The MAC had a year like this a few years back and only got one team in, Kent State, and they almost made it to the Final Four.

Your being a bit overly paranoid this year. The power conferences as a whole are way down. There are plenty of bids available for both the Big XII *AND* the MVC to get at least 4 teams in. Most years the power conferences have so many strong teams that opportunities become hard to find, but this year the MVC is actually better than the PAC 10 top-to-bottom, and better than the Big XII as a whole after giving Texas, KU, and OU a nod.

The bracketologists at ESPN are spookily accurate, and they have declared that the MVC has a 3-team lock, a 4th team almost at a lock, and 2 more teams in the hunt. A 5th bid is not out of the question for MVC. It definitely is out of the question for the Big XII, barring a shock in the conference Tourney.

[tk13]

Originally Posted by alnorth

Your being a bit overly paranoid this year. The power conferences as a whole are way down. There are plenty of bids available for both the Big XII *AND* the MVC to get at least 4 teams in. Most years the power conferences have so many strong teams that opportunities become hard to find, but this year the MVC is actually better than the PAC 10 top-to-bottom, and better than the Big XII as a whole after giving Texas, KU, and OU a nod.

The bracketologists at ESPN are spookily accurate, and they have declared that the MVC has a 3-team lock, a 4th team almost at a lock, and 2 more teams in the hunt. A 5th bid is not out of the question for MVC. It definitely is out of the question for the Big XII, barring a shock in the conference Tourney.

I agree with you. But we'll see, I don't trust the selection committee. Honestly though, the Big East and Big Ten should just get half the at-large bids...

[alnorth]

Originally Posted by tk13

I agree with you. But we'll see, I don't trust the selection committee. Honestly though, the Big East and Big Ten should just get half the at-large bids...

I wouldnt trust the selection committee of old during the 1990's. Recently, the selection committee has proven themselves many times over to be fair in recent years.

We are going to have to see a monumental collapse from the MVC for them to have only 3 bids, never mind 1 or 2.

[|Zach|]

When is selection day?

[Skip Towne]

I remember 35-40 years ago the MVC was not to be toyed with. Their top teams were as good as the Big 8 top teams. WSU and Bradley in particular. It's not quite back there yet but it is eerily similar. I hope KU doesn't draw an MVC team in the first round. I think KU would pound them into submission with sheer size and depth but maybe not. We have 5 guys 6'8" or taller and 3 of them are 235# or more. And I saw a stat that showed KU's defense is among the best ever in limiting the other teams FG %age. I know I'm a homer but I do realize some of these "lesser" teams can beat us on a given day. I've seen it happen several times.

[CoMoChief]

Originally Posted by alnorth

Your being a bit overly paranoid this year. The power conferences as a whole are way down. There are plenty of bids available for both the Big XII *AND* the MVC to get at least 4 teams in. Most years the power conferences have so many strong teams that opportunities become hard to find, but this year the MVC is actually better than the PAC 10 top-to-bottom, and better than the Big XII as a whole after giving Texas, KU, and OU a nod.

The bracketologists at ESPN are spookily accurate, and they have declared that the MVC has a 3-team lock, a 4th team almost at a lock, and 2 more teams in the hunt. A 5th bid is not out of the question for MVC. It definitely is out of the question for the Big XII, barring a shock in the conference Tourney.

Personally I would love to have 5 teams from the MVC in the NCAA tourney. Just makes the pathway easier for KU.

[CoMoChief]

Originally Posted by ZachKC

When is selection day?

Its usually the night of the conference tournaments' championship games. I dont feel like looking it up though sorry.