Chiefs Whitlock: Why should the Chiefs bring Haley back? - Page 5

**Tribal Warfare** · 12-20-2009, 11:17 PM

Why should the Chiefs bring Haley back?
By JASON WHITLOCK
The Kansas City Star

I’m not arguing that Todd Haley should be fired. I’m wondering what’s the justification for bringing him back.

Loyalty? Fairness?

You throw them overboard with the waiting list for season-ticket holders. Anyone arguing the Chiefs have made progress this season hasn’t heard about what happened inside Arrowhead Stadium on Sunday when the Cleveland Browns visited.

On a day when Cleveland quarterback Brady Quinn threw for 66 yards and two interceptions, the Browns rumbled for 351 yards on the ground and surpassed the 40-point barrier in a 41-34 victory over Haley’s Chiefs.

Keep in mind, the Browns are in the process of wooing Mike Holmgren to take over their organization and can embattled head coach Eric “Dead Man Coaching” Mangini. The Browns are bad. The Chiefs are worse.

It took a total team effort to give Cleveland a road victory.

“When you allow two returns for touchdowns, that’s generally not going to end up being a good thing,” Haley said, scolding the special-teams unit that allowed Josh Cribbs to find the end zone twice on kickoff returns.

“When you drop nine balls, and we had 39 to 40 by the NFL’s count going into this game — 50-plus by my count — it’s going to be very difficult,” Haley said, scolding his receivers for their inability to catch.

“When you allow a team to run the football the way they were able to run the football, you’re not going to have much of a chance to win,” Haley said, scolding a defensive unit that has surrendered 800-plus rushing yards in its last three games at Arrowhead Stadium.

That’s all three units, folks. Special teams. Offense. And defense.

It’s Christmas, and all three phases of Haley’s team are in disarray.

We’ve spent so much time focusing on the shortcomings within Kansas City’s roster, we’ve failed to mention that it’s likely Haley will overhaul his entire coaching staff, too.

You think Clancy Pendergast is coming back as defensive coordinator after some kid named Jerome Harrison gained 286 yards and finished 10 yards shy of the NFL’s all-time rushing record? We know Haley is a hothead. He booted his most qualified assistant (Chan Gailey) before the season. He’s already demoted a receivers coach. He benches receivers when his mood dictates.

Come on, you know Haley’s instincts will tell him to fire everyone except his wingman, Maurice Carthon. Haley can argue that he got this head-coaching position so late last offseason that he was unable to lure top-flight assistants.

Will top assistants want to come work for Haley this offseason? Let’s don’t even deal with the damage Haley has done to his reputation with his wild-man coaching routine and his handling of Gailey. Why would a top assistant come to KC when Haley is going to enter next season on the hot seat?

You know who would come? A coach with ties to Scott Pioli; a coach who thinks he could be the interim head coach if Haley gets fired six weeks into the season. Charlie Weis. Romeo Crennel.

Yes, more of the Patriots Way. A continuation of the flawed philosophy that you can export a winning culture from one city to another. Winning produces its own unique culture wherever it lands.

Let me get back on topic. I’m not saying Todd Haley should be fired. I’m wondering what’s the justification for bringing him back.

Mike Shanahan appears to be headed to Washington. Mike Holmgren apparently is going to take over Cleveland’s front office. Bill Cowher might rejoin the coaching ranks. The Chiefs are going to stand pat with Haley?

What has he shown us that gives us confidence he’ll hire a competent coaching staff? And if the Chiefs are going to be starting over with a new assistant-coaching staff, why not just start all the way over with a new head coach?

I did not say fire Todd Haley. I’m searching for reasons to bring him back. Right now, loyalty and fairness come to mind.

Scott Pioli stuck Haley with a craptastic roster. The stupidity of playing all season with special-team players masquerading as starting linebackers and safeties has caught up with the Chiefs the last month. And so has playing musical waiver wire at receiver.

Haley’s defenders can argue quite persuasively that he hasn’t been given a fair shot. Haley’s critics could argue that Haley has made a bad situation worse.

I’m not arguing anything. And I’m cool with Haley coming back ... as long as he realizes he has to make a boatload of fundamental changes to his coaching approach.

DJ's left nut · 12-21-2009, 12:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by billay

It's also worth mentioning the team that shit canned their GM and will fire the coach put up records aginst the Chiefs.

Mangini just needs more time!!!!

Kokinis just needed more time!!!!!

Don't you know that, given enough time, even the least able coaches and executives suddenly become great?

'Hamas' Jenkins · 12-21-2009, 12:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DJ's left nut

I asked that question 5 months ago.

And again 3 months ago.

The answer is evidently that I'm not a GM and should therefore

.

It's not difficult to surmise how DJ's left nut feels about killing Scott Pioli, and uh, my own proclivities for killing Pioli are well known and oft-lamented facts of ChiefsPlanet lore.

T-post Tom · 12-21-2009, 12:36 AM

Whitlock is spot on. And I liked the way he wrote it. It conveys his argument in a way that's more novel than the standard fire-the-head-coach.com type of onslaught commonly seen in this type of situation.

**DaneMcCloud** · 12-21-2009, 12:37 AM

Bobby Petrino won three games in Atlanta before bailing.

WITHOUT a RB, WITHOUT a QB, WITHOUT a left tackle and WITHOUT fan support.

Haley needs to go.

Buh-Bye.

Hammock Parties · 12-21-2009, 12:37 AM

I think that's the first time I've seen "craptastic" in print.

**DeezNutz** · 12-21-2009, 12:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 'Hamas' Jenkins

People will do anything to bash Whitlock.

He's making a pretty common rhetorical move. Rather than state your case, have the other side state theirs. What evidence is there that Todd Haley deserves to coach this team next year? What has he done to prove that he's qualified to do anything other than work as a trainer on The Biggest Loser?

I asked a similar question earlier today about Pioli. What has he done in KC to show you that he knows anything about personnel evaluation?

Fine if this were an open debate, but a terrible gesture, generally speaking, for a columnist.

With each column, he needs a more cogent, concise argument. If he had set this up as a type Part I, for example, I'd say ok, but as is, it's poorly written.

Perhaps he could have made the case. Presented the reasons for keeping Haley and developed these reasons a bit more...Something, anything.

bigbucks24 · 12-21-2009, 12:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by billay

Cam Cameron was fired after 1 season and the team did pretty good when he was fired

No. No. No. That was all luck. They played the NFC West. From 1-15 to 11-5 was only because of the easier schedule. It takes 1 full year to evaluate. No one could have turned this team around in 1 year (unless they got to play the NFC East and then it would only be because of luck.) It had nothing to do with a great judge of talent as a President of Football Operations. It had nothing to do with pick Ireland as a GM. Or Sporano as a HC. Or cutting Zach Thomas (one of the all-time favorite Dolphins) because he was tool old to fit the system. It had nothing to do with trading Jason Taylor (one of the all time favorite Dolphins) because he didn't buy into the new system. It had nothing to do with picking up a QB in free agency (cheap) and building a system around him that fits his talent (so he can finish 2nd in MVP). It had nothing to do with drafting a very good LT with the first pick in the draft and having him signed before the draft so he doesn't miss 1 minute of practice. Or nothing to do with implementing a system that covers up the weakness of the offensive line (wildcat). It's such a gimmick that nearly every NFL team runs it. Or drafting OL and DL in their first draft. Nope. It was all luck and don't you ever say otherwise.

Jerm · 12-21-2009, 12:41 AM

Can anyone see Pioli busting the kill shot on Haley and then hiring........Mangini????

Oh Jesus Christ.

'Hamas' Jenkins · 12-21-2009, 12:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeezNutz

Fine if this were an open debate, but a terrible gesture, generally speaking, for a columnist.

With each column, he needs a more cogent, concise argument. If he had set this up as a type Part I, for example, I'd say ok, but as is, it's poorly written.

Perhaps he could have made the case. Presented the reasons for keeping Haley and developed these reasons a bit more...Something, anything.

All he needed was to restate his title and follow it with two words: "They shouldn't."

**DeezNutz** · 12-21-2009, 12:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jerm

Can anyone see Pioli busting the kill shot on Haley and then hiring........Mangini????

Oh Jesus Christ.

I'd go on sabbatical.

Jerm · 12-21-2009, 12:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeezNutz

I'd go on sabbatical.

I'd probably ****ing Cobain myself.

**DeezNutz** · 12-21-2009, 12:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 'Hamas' Jenkins

All he needed was to restate his title and follow it with two words: "They shouldn't."

Then he would have had a thesis, and all would have been well.

But when I read, "I'm not arguing anything" from a columnist, I wonder who the **** was sleeping at the editorial desk.

Hammock Parties · 12-21-2009, 12:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeezNutz

Then he would have had a thesis, and all would have been well.

But when I read, "I'm not arguing anything" from a columnist, I wonder who the **** was sleeping at the editorial desk.

I doubt anyone questions anything Whitlock writes.

DBOSHO · 12-21-2009, 12:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaneMcCloud

Bobby Petrino won three games in Atlanta before bailing.

WITHOUT a RB, WITHOUT a QB, WITHOUT a left tackle and WITHOUT fan support.

Haley needs to go.

Buh-Bye.

Well obviously you cant play football without those positions.

TEX · 12-21-2009, 12:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigbucks24

No. No. No. That was all luck. They played the NFC West. From 1-15 to 11-5 was only because of the easier schedule. It takes 1 full year to evaluate. No one could have turned this team around in 1 year (unless they got to play the NFC East and then it would only be because of luck.) It had nothing to do with a great judge of talent as a President of Football Operations. It had nothing to do with pick Ireland as a GM. Or Sporano as a HC. Or cutting Zach Thomas (one of the all-time favorite Dolphins) because he was tool old to fit the system. It had nothing to do with trading Jason Taylor (one of the all time favorite Dolphins) because he didn't buy into the new system. It had nothing to do with picking up a QB in free agency (cheap) and building a system around him that fits his talent (so he can finish 2nd in MVP). It had nothing to do with drafting a very good LT with the first pick in the draft and having him signed before the draft so he doesn't miss 1 minute of practice. Or nothing to do with implementing a system that covers up the weakness of the offensive line (wildcat). It's such a gimmick that nearly every NFL team runs it. Or drafting OL and DL in their first draft. Nope. It was all luck and don't you ever say otherwise.

I hear ya. Pioli and Haley could have IMPROVED the team in year 1 instead of making it WORSE.

12-20-2009, 11:17 PM
Tribal Warfare Man of Culture Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Far Beyond Comprehension Casino cash: $-2997187	Whitlock: Why should the Chiefs bring Haley back? Why should the Chiefs bring Haley back? By JASON WHITLOCK The Kansas City Star I’m not arguing that Todd Haley should be fired. I’m wondering what’s the justification for bringing him back. Loyalty? Fairness? You throw them overboard with the waiting list for season-ticket holders. Anyone arguing the Chiefs have made progress this season hasn’t heard about what happened inside Arrowhead Stadium on Sunday when the Cleveland Browns visited. On a day when Cleveland quarterback Brady Quinn threw for 66 yards and two interceptions, the Browns rumbled for 351 yards on the ground and surpassed the 40-point barrier in a 41-34 victory over Haley’s Chiefs. Keep in mind, the Browns are in the process of wooing Mike Holmgren to take over their organization and can embattled head coach Eric “Dead Man Coaching” Mangini. The Browns are bad. The Chiefs are worse. It took a total team effort to give Cleveland a road victory. “When you allow two returns for touchdowns, that’s generally not going to end up being a good thing,” Haley said, scolding the special-teams unit that allowed Josh Cribbs to find the end zone twice on kickoff returns. “When you drop nine balls, and we had 39 to 40 by the NFL’s count going into this game — 50-plus by my count — it’s going to be very difficult,” Haley said, scolding his receivers for their inability to catch. “When you allow a team to run the football the way they were able to run the football, you’re not going to have much of a chance to win,” Haley said, scolding a defensive unit that has surrendered 800-plus rushing yards in its last three games at Arrowhead Stadium. That’s all three units, folks. Special teams. Offense. And defense. It’s Christmas, and all three phases of Haley’s team are in disarray. We’ve spent so much time focusing on the shortcomings within Kansas City’s roster, we’ve failed to mention that it’s likely Haley will overhaul his entire coaching staff, too. You think Clancy Pendergast is coming back as defensive coordinator after some kid named Jerome Harrison gained 286 yards and finished 10 yards shy of the NFL’s all-time rushing record? We know Haley is a hothead. He booted his most qualified assistant (Chan Gailey) before the season. He’s already demoted a receivers coach. He benches receivers when his mood dictates. Come on, you know Haley’s instincts will tell him to fire everyone except his wingman, Maurice Carthon. Haley can argue that he got this head-coaching position so late last offseason that he was unable to lure top-flight assistants. Will top assistants want to come work for Haley this offseason? Let’s don’t even deal with the damage Haley has done to his reputation with his wild-man coaching routine and his handling of Gailey. Why would a top assistant come to KC when Haley is going to enter next season on the hot seat? You know who would come? A coach with ties to Scott Pioli; a coach who thinks he could be the interim head coach if Haley gets fired six weeks into the season. Charlie Weis. Romeo Crennel. Yes, more of the Patriots Way. A continuation of the flawed philosophy that you can export a winning culture from one city to another. Winning produces its own unique culture wherever it lands. Let me get back on topic. I’m not saying Todd Haley should be fired. I’m wondering what’s the justification for bringing him back. Mike Shanahan appears to be headed to Washington. Mike Holmgren apparently is going to take over Cleveland’s front office. Bill Cowher might rejoin the coaching ranks. The Chiefs are going to stand pat with Haley? What has he shown us that gives us confidence he’ll hire a competent coaching staff? And if the Chiefs are going to be starting over with a new assistant-coaching staff, why not just start all the way over with a new head coach? I did not say fire Todd Haley. I’m searching for reasons to bring him back. Right now, loyalty and fairness come to mind. Scott Pioli stuck Haley with a craptastic roster. The stupidity of playing all season with special-team players masquerading as starting linebackers and safeties has caught up with the Chiefs the last month. And so has playing musical waiver wire at receiver. Haley’s defenders can argue quite persuasively that he hasn’t been given a fair shot. Haley’s critics could argue that Haley has made a bad situation worse. I’m not arguing anything. And I’m cool with Haley coming back ... as long as he realizes he has to make a boatload of fundamental changes to his coaching approach.
Posts: 43,454

12-21-2009, 12:36 AM	#63
T-post Tom Busy in a Kohl's restroom Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Milk/Honey/Gazland Casino cash: $1747293	Whitlock is spot on. And I liked the way he wrote it. It conveys his argument in a way that's more novel than the standard fire-the-head-coach.com type of onslaught commonly seen in this type of situation. __________________ You seem nice!
Posts: 22,376

12-21-2009, 12:37 AM	#64
DaneMcCloud Supporter Join Date: Sep 2000 Location: Hollywood, CA Casino cash: $10053648	Bobby Petrino won three games in Atlanta before bailing. WITHOUT a RB, WITHOUT a QB, WITHOUT a left tackle and WITHOUT fan support. Haley needs to go. Buh-Bye.
Posts: 88,960

12-21-2009, 12:37 AM	#65
Hammock Parties I'll be back. Join Date: Nov 2002 Casino cash: $800478	I think that's the first time I've seen "craptastic" in print. __________________ Chiefs game films
Posts: 297,443

12-21-2009, 12:41 AM	#68
Jerm Mahomes > God Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Clinton, MO Casino cash: $4418996	Can anyone see Pioli busting the kill shot on Haley and then hiring........Mangini???? Oh Jesus Christ.
Posts: 10,221