Football The ground can't cause a fumble - Page 3

Beef Supreme · 08-17-2013, 08:33 AM

This used to be a clear cut rule. No subjective bullshit involved. Now it seems like yet another way for the refs to influence the outcome of a game. Discuss.

**DaFace** · 08-17-2013, 12:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jd1020

No use talking to you anymore because you don't know anything on the subject.

I accept your concession.

jd1020 · 08-17-2013, 12:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaFace

I accept your concession.

Rule 7 Section 4 Article 1 (a): How to give yourself up

An official shall declare dead ball and the down ended:

(a) when a runner is out of bounds or declares himself down by falling to the ground and makes no effort to advance.

There you go dipshit.

Now **** off.

**kysirsoze** · 08-17-2013, 12:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jd1020

... The rules of the game say a player can give himself up.

Nice try?

In case anyone wants to know what the actual rules are... (Sorry for a few missing letters, the pdf wouldn't copy correctly.)

http://static.nfl.com/static/content...ule%20Book.pdf

Quote:

Note: Defenders are required to treat a sliding runner as they would a runner who is down by contact.
(1)
A defender must pull up when a runner begins a feet
-
first slide. This does not mean that all contact by a defender is
illegal. If a defender has already committed himself, and the contact is unavoidable, it is not a foul unless the defender
commits some other act, such as helmet
-
to
-
helmet contact or by driving his forearm or shoulder into the head or ne
ck
area of the run
ner.
(2)
A runner who desires to take advantage of this protection is responsible for starting his slide before contact by a
defensive player is imminent; if he does not, and waits until the last moment to begin his slide, he puts himself in
jeopardy of b
eing contacted.
(e)
when a runner is out of bounds, or declares himself down by falling to the ground, or kneeling, and making no effort to
advance; or
(f)
when an opponent takes a ball that is in the possession of a runner who is on the ground; or

Basically you have to fall to the ground and make no effort to advance. Dex injured himself trying to stay up. His fall was not intentional (He did not "declare himself down by falling". Sure he made no attempt to advance, but that was after he had already fumbled. You would have an argument if he intentionally went down, but he didn't.

**kysirsoze** · 08-17-2013, 12:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jd1020

Rule 7 Section 4 Article 1 (a): How to give yourself up

An official shall declare dead ball and the down ended:

(a) when a runner is out of bounds or declares himself down by falling to the ground and makes no effort to advance.

There you go dipshit.

Now **** off.

Like I said, he didn't "declare himself down by falling". He fell and in the process of falling lost control of the ball. Way to lose your shit over a play from a play from a year ago, though.

**DaFace** · 08-17-2013, 12:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jd1020

Rule 7 Section 4 Article 1 (a): How to give yourself up
ray in arlington : 10/2/2011 7:56 pm
An official shall declare dead ball and the down ended:

(a) when a runner is out of bounds or declares himself down by falling to the ground and makes no effort to advance.

There you go dipshit.

Now **** off.

Again, there's no mention of an injury in there whatsoever. Therefore, the injury is irrelevant to the discussion.

So, if you watched that play and had no clue there was an injury, are you honestly suggesting that he "fell to the ground and made no effort to advance" in the 0.2 seconds that passed between the time his arm hit and the time the ball came out?

If that's the way you're interpreting that rule, then I can't help you.

jd1020 · 08-17-2013, 12:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kysirsoze

Like I said, he didn't "declare himself down by falling". He fell and in the process of falling lost control of the ball. Way to lose your shit over a play from a play from a year ago, though.

He didn't lose control of the ball. He had control the whole time until he intentionally let go of the ball.

And I'm not losing my shit over the call made a year ago on a 2-14 team. I'm losing my shit over someone who clearly knows nothing on the subject acting like I'm making stuff up.

**DaFace** · 08-17-2013, 12:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jd1020

He didn't lose control of the ball. He had control the whole time until he intentionally let go of the ball.

And I'm not losing my shit over the call made a year ago on a 2-14 team. I'm losing my shit over someone who clearly knows nothing on the subject acting like I'm making stuff up.

(peruses rules looking for something about a play stopping due to a player intentionally letting go of the ball)

**BigMeatballDave** · 08-17-2013, 12:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jd1020

He didn't lose control of the ball. He had control the whole time until he intentionally let go of the ball.
.

Still a fumble.

Chiefless · 08-17-2013, 12:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jd1020

He didn't lose control of the ball. He had control the whole time until he intentionally let go of the ball.

And I'm not losing my shit over the call made a year ago on a 2-14 team. I'm losing my shit over someone who clearly knows nothing on the subject acting like I'm making stuff up.

Apparently you are the only member of the board who understands this rule correctly, since EVERYONE else thinks that was a fumble.

jd1020 · 08-17-2013, 01:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chiefless

Apparently you are the only member of the board who understands this rule correctly, since EVERYONE else thinks that was a fumble.

Clearly.

Even the person who posted the clip thought it was a fumble...

Idiot.

**kysirsoze** · 08-17-2013, 01:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jd1020

He didn't lose control of the ball. He had control the whole time until he intentionally let go of the ball.

And I'm not losing my shit over the call made a year ago on a 2-14 team. I'm losing my shit over someone who clearly knows nothing on the subject acting like I'm making stuff up.

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaFace

(peruses rules looking for something about a play stopping due to a player intentionally letting go of the ball)

So where's that rule? I missed it.

**BigMeatballDave** · 08-17-2013, 01:21 PM

You're free to have the opinion that it is not a fumble, but you're still wrong.

jd1020 · 08-17-2013, 01:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TrueFanDave

You're free to have the opinion that it is not a fumble, but you're still wrong.

Not really.

The rule states that if a player falls to the ground and makes no effort to advance the ball the play is dead.

McCluster fell to the ground and made no effort to advance the ball. Play dead.

It's either an incomplete pass or a catch and down by virtue of that rule.

Chiefless · 08-17-2013, 01:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jd1020

Clearly.

Even the person who posted the clip thought it was a fumble...

Idiot.

You don't mean this Guy do you?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scorp

True that, but he was down by butt hurt. Ought to be a law!

It almost sounds like thee posts later he thought it was a fumble too.

it's really ok to be wrong on ocassion.

**BigMeatballDave** · 08-17-2013, 01:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jd1020

Not really.

The rule states that if a player falls to the ground and makes no effort to advance the ball the play is dead.

McCluster fell to the ground and made no effort to advance the ball. Play dead.

It's either an incomplete pass or a catch and down by virtue of that rule.

Just admit you are wrong and move on.

08-17-2013, 08:33 AM
Beef Supreme MVP Join Date: Oct 2010 Casino cash: $10019560	The ground can't cause a fumble This used to be a clear cut rule. No subjective bullshit involved. Now it seems like yet another way for the refs to influence the outcome of a game. Discuss.
Posts: 11,000

08-17-2013, 01:21 PM	#42
BigMeatballDave GBM 8-12-15 Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Dayton, Oh. Casino cash: $10052154	You're free to have the opinion that it is not a fumble, but you're still wrong.
Posts: 59,997