Murder or Castle Doctrine?

[Rain Man]

A case not too far from my hometown.

http://www.therolladailynews.com/app...8&refresh=true

Slaying case may hinge on property rights


STEELVILLE, Mo. — James Crocker had grown weary of the partying canoeists and rafters who encroached on his neatly kept property along Missouri's Meramec River. When he caught a man about to relieve himself on a gravel bar by his yard last month, a nasty confrontation ensued that ended with one person dead and Crocker accused of killing him.

The case against Crocker is the latest to put a spotlight on "castle doctrine" laws, which allow the use of deadly force to protect property. Missouri is among at least 30 states that have enacted the statutes, which supporters say protect gun rights but others insist promote vigilantism.

Crocker's attorney, Michael Bert of St. Louis, said that Crocker was defending himself and his property.

"Here's a man in fear for his life and fearful he might suffer bodily injury," Bert said.

Prosecutors see it differently. Witnesses who testified at a hearing this month said Crocker was angry and raging, shooting into the crowd of people, narrowly missing two others before killing 48-year-old Paul Dart Jr. of Robertsville, Mo. Crocker has been charged with second degree murder.
Even some supporters of the doctrine say the violence seemed avoidable.

"The smart thing is to back away, and nobody seemed to be willing to do that," said Kevin Jamison, an attorney who lobbied for Missouri's castle doctrine bill as a member of the Western Missouri Shooters Alliance.

Crocker, a 59-year-old plastics plant worker with long hair and a thick goatee, lives in a small white frame home on a shaded gravel road about eight miles west of Steelville, the self-proclaimed floating capital of the world. Tens of thousands of people come to the region every year to raft, canoe or kayak down the Meramec and nearby rivers.

Drinking is sometimes part of the outings, resulting in bawdy behavior that doesn't sit well with owners of land that touches the river. Many have complained for years about loud parties, trash left behind and crude behavior.

Herb Smelser, 77, who lives three houses down from Crocker, said it isn't uncommon to find people using his yard as a restroom. The problem was so bad, he said, that he let his grass grow high to discourage trespassers.
Crocker, though, kept his yard trim and tidy — "like a park," Smelser said. To keep out the unwanted, Crocker posted "No Trespassing" and "Private Property" signs along the hill that slopes down to a gravel area along the meandering river.

On July 20, Dart, a carpenter, and around four dozen other members of an extended family gathered at a campground for their annual float trip along the Meramec. A few hours into the trip, Robert and Regina Burgess stopped their canoe on a gravel bar. Robert, who had drunk about three beers, decided to relieve himself, he testified at the preliminary hearing.

Crocker confronted Burgess and other members of the party. When happened then is in dispute, and will be a crucial part of the case.

Burgess and his wife testified that Crocker was immediately agitated and aggressive, firing two shots in their direction — Robert said one hit the ground near his feet. Another bullet hit Dart in the face.

Burgess said it was only after Dart was shot that members of the party picked up rocks to defend themselves against Crocker, who was armed with a 9mm semi-automatic pistol.

"I'm standing there unarmed and the guy's got a gun," Burgess said.
Crocker didn't testify at the hearing, but his attorney gave a different account.

In an interview with The Associated Press, Bert said Crocker politely asked the float trip party to leave. "The response he got was angry and profane," Bert said.

Crocker and those in the float trip party argued over whether the gravel bar was public land or Crocker's. Eventually, the men picked up "softball-sized" rocks and began pelting Crocker, Bert said. He said Crocker suffered head injuries, then fired his gun to defend himself.

"When people say is this a case of the castle doctrine I say, 'yes, kind of,' but more importantly these people were armed with what I would consider weapons," Bert said.

Missouri State Highway Patrol trooper Joseph Peart testified that he saw no evidence that Crocker was injured.

Police said Crocker told them, "I just shot the one closest to me."

Whether or not the floaters were on Crocker's property may be an issue in the case since Missouri law isn't clear on where private property along a waterway begins. Some experts say it starts at the vegetation line; others say property rights extend to the center of a river or stream.

"That may be a critical question," said Jamison, of Kansas City, Mo. "If (Crocker) reasonably believed the man was on his property and he wasn't, I'm not sure that's enough."

Missouri's castle doctrine statute, enacted in 2007, gives residents a legal right to defend themselves and their property against intruders. Supporters of such laws cite a number of cases in which homeowners were able to fend off burglars or other criminals without fear of prosecution. But Florida's law gained notoriety after a neighborhood watch activist, George Zimmerman, fatally shot teen Trayvon Martin, and was acquitted of criminal charges.

A 2012 Texas A&M University study found that homicides ruled justifiable rose by 8 percent in states with "stand-your-ground laws.

In the Missouri case, Crawford County detective Zachary Driskill said he asked Crocker if he could have called police instead of taking matters into his own hands.

"I guess I could have, but it's my property and I was going to protect it," Crocker responded, according to case documents.

[DJ's left nut]

Originally Posted by scott free

Dude was only on his third beer during a canoe trip? that's a lie.

Back to reading...

Yup. As has already been noted, it's the same as the "only a couple" answer on DUI checkpoints. As a public service - the answer is never "only a couple". That's exactly the answer the officer is looking for. The answer is always 'none'. I don't care if you throw up on the guy first, the answer is still none.

Originally Posted by scott free

I've been down the Current twice and no doubt there are a LOT of idiots, and also, if the victim was with two dozen others, you can damn near bet he was being a jackoff, i've seen it myself down there... the bigger the group, the bigger the assholes they're capable of being.

Absolutely. And the author knew it.

"Dart and about 4 dozen of his extended family" sounds a lot better than "50 !@#$ing people" because anyone that's ever been on a float knows how those work out.

Based on what we have here, I just don't see how you can convict this guy of 2nd degree murder.

[Dayze]

Originally Posted by Radar Chief

Ground rule double.

"Quick! Someone help me pull her into the raft"!!


onlookers "...why is that guy pulling her out with her knees around his shoulders"?

[cosmo20002]

Originally Posted by Radar Chief

I was once shot at while float fishing on the Neosho river for this very reason. When I complained to police I was told that I should stay away from that guys section of the river in the future.

Maybe you looked like you had to pee and he didn't want you to get any ideas.

[Easy 6]

Originally Posted by DJ's left nut

Yup. As has already been noted, it's the same as the "only a couple" answer on DUI checkpoints. As a public service - the answer is never "only a couple". That's exactly the answer the officer is looking for. The answer is always 'none'. I don't care if you throw up on the guy first, the answer is still none.



Absolutely. And the author knew it.

"Dart and about 4 dozen of his extended family" sounds a lot better than "50 !@#$ing people" because anyone that's ever been on a float knows how those work out.

Based on what we have here, I just don't see how you can convict this guy of 2nd degree murder.

Yep, he'll get off with something much less than second.

[Radar Chief]

Originally Posted by cosmo20002

Maybe you looked like you had to pee and he didn't want you to get any ideas.

No, he’s just an old asshole.
I worked with his grandson and even he agreed the old **** is an asshole. When I told him my story he said, “Yup, he’ll do that.”

[cosmo20002]

Originally Posted by Rain Man

A case not too far from my hometown.

STEELVILLE, Mo. — James Crocker had grown weary of the partying canoeists and rafters who encroached on his neatly kept property along Missouri's Meramec River. When he caught a man about to relieve himself on a gravel bar by his yard last month, a nasty confrontation ensued that ended with one person dead and Crocker accused of killing him.

That's not where they filmed Deliverance is it?
You can't just be floating down rivers in Missouri and expect not to be shot at sometimes, or, requested to squeal like a pig on occasion.

[seclark]

Originally Posted by Dayze

"Quick! Someone help me pull her into the raft"!!


onlookers "...why is that guy pulling her out with her knees around his shoulders"?

when my old man was a ranger at a park on the Meramac, some lady drove her car right down a boat ramp, committing suicide. he got there and went in the water to try to get her out...reached into the car window and grabbed her by the hair and it came off in his hand. she was wearing a wig. he was already pretty tense, but that freaked him out.
sec

[vailpass]

Originally Posted by seclark

when my old man was a ranger at a park on the Meramac, some lady drove her car right down a boat ramp, committing suicide. he got there and went in the water to try to get her out...reached into the car window and grabbed her by the hair and it came off in his hand. she was wearing a wig. he was already pretty tense, but that freaked him out.
sec

Wow. **** that.

[WhawhaWhat]

I hope this guy gets life in prison. He's an asshole.

[cosmo20002]

Originally Posted by seclark

when my old man was a ranger at a park on the Meramac, some lady drove her car right down a boat ramp, committing suicide. he got there and went in the water to try to get her out...reached into the car window and grabbed her by the hair and it came off in his hand. she was wearing a wig. he was already pretty tense, but that freaked him out.
sec

I think that's actually better though. The whole scalp would have been kinda gross.

[patteeu]

Originally Posted by Pawnmower

I call bullshit. A dude gets blasted with a 9mm and you pick up a rock and chuck it at the crazy motherfcucker with the gun? YOU RUN LIKE **** and take cover.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHHAHAHAAHAHAHAH

Sorry pal, the rocks were thrown 1st, just admit it.

That was the first thing I thought too.

[R8RFAN]

This is 2nd degree murder in NC

[WhawhaWhat]

Originally Posted by patteeu

That was the first thing I thought too.

Have you ever been down one of these rivers? You can't run and hide anywhere. If you have to go to the bathroom, you pull the canoe or raft onto the side of the river on a sand/gravel bank, find some trees to go behind and do your business.

Some of these responses make it seem like some of you think these rivers flow down the middle of a street with port-a-potties on every corner and this guy just got out and peed in his lawn.

[patteeu]

Originally Posted by WhawhaWhat

Have you ever been down one of these rivers? You can't run and hide anywhere. If you have to go to the bathroom, you pull the canoe or raft onto the side of the river on a sand/gravel bank, find some trees to go behind and do your business.

Some of these responses make it seem like some of you think these rivers flow down the middle of a street with port-a-potties on every corner and this guy just got out and peed in his lawn.

Yes, I have. And there's plenty of opportunity to run for cover.

[Easy 6]

Originally Posted by WhawhaWhat

Have you ever been down one of these rivers? You can't run and hide anywhere. If you have to go to the bathroom, you pull the canoe or raft onto the side of the river on a sand/gravel bank, find some trees to go behind and do your business.

Some of these responses make it seem like some of you think these rivers flow down the middle of a street with port-a-potties on every corner and this guy just got out and peed in his lawn.

The property owner may have been overzealous, but my money says this big group got cocky with the rocks, their drunken leader, egged on, started approaching and got popped.

Lesson is, don't get drunk and stupid... you usually never know who you're messing with.