WTF Mike Silver says we are the 28th best team in the NFL

[DJ's left nut]

Originally Posted by Direckshun

Built the deepest team on both sides of the ball that we've seen in a really, really long time.

Developed talent that was un- and under-developed under Herm.

Has had two good drafts ('10 and '11) to one bad one ('09). Even including the 2009 draft, arguably no team in the NFL has drafted better in that three year span. And has signed relatively strong value guys in the offseasons.

All his coaching hires after 2009 have been rock solid, with the possible exception of Daboll.

Pioli was out there doing hand-drills with Johnson?

Bowe is the exact same player now he was 3 years ago. Flowers, Carr and Hali just needed experience. Give me a break with that crap - Pioli gets zero credit for 'developing' a bunch of rookies and 2nd year players. They all showed flashes and simply matured and gained experience.

2010 was not a good draft. At best it was average. I've had this discussion with you before, but the bottom line is that he wasted the 2nd round, traded up to get the 4th best TE in the draft (and an injury prone one at that) and apart from his no-brainer in Berry and a nice guard in Asomoah (the same position so many have cried is so easy to fin), added very little reliable talent to this roster in 2010.

His hires have been rock solid? Well apart from Haley being a ****ing lunatic - sure. Mostly he just kept a bunch of guys in the organization that was already here and hired Crennel. That's it. His only 'rock solid' hire was Romeo.

[Direckshun]

Originally Posted by DJ's left nut

Pioli was out there doing hand-drills with Johnson?

Bowe is the exact same player now he was 3 years ago. Flowers, Carr and Hali just needed experience. Give me a break with that crap - Pioli gets zero credit for 'developing' a bunch of rookies and 2nd year players. They all showed flashes and simply matured and gained experience.

You can't blame Pioli when prospects don't turn out -- then refuse to credit him when they do.

His coaches, his successes and failures.

Originally Posted by DJ's left nut

2010 was not a good draft. At best it was average. I've had this discussion with you before, but the bottom line is that he wasted the 2nd round, traded up to get the 4th best TE in the draft (and an injury prone one at that) and apart from his no-brainer in Berry and a nice guard in Asomoah (the same position so many have cried is so easy to fin), added very little reliable talent to this roster in 2010.

You're wrong, bud.

Berry, McCluster, Arenas, Asamoah, Moeaki, Lewis?

You can quibble about the values each was taken at, and I'm on record agreeing with you. But we got solid starters at RG and FS and NCB, added a potential Pro Bowler in Moeaki, an All Pro in Berry, and McCluster, whom nobody really has any idea what to do with him.

I understand the hate on the value of some of the players, as well as McCluster. But we got a haul from that draft, which is better than something like 95% of the teams do in every draft.

[DJ's left nut]

Originally Posted by Direckshun

You can't blame Pioli when prospects don't turn out -- then refuse to credit him when they do.

His coaches, his successes and failures.



You're wrong, bud.

Berry, McCluster, Arenas, Asamoah, Moeaki, Lewis?

You can quibble about the values each was taken at, and I'm on record agreeing with you. But we got solid starters at RG and FS and NCB, added a potential Pro Bowler in Moeaki, an All Pro in Berry, and McCluster, whom nobody really has any idea what to do with him.

I understand the hate on the value of some of the players, as well as McCluster. But we got a haul from that draft, which is better than something like 95% of the teams do in every draft.

McCluster, Arenas and Moeaki are not good picks. Nickle backs and kick returners are not, under any circumstances, worth 2nd rounders. And Moeaki was an injury risk that's already missed half-his career and has been less productive than multiple TEs taken after him.

Berry was simply too damn simple for me to give him credit for.

I'll concede I forgot Lewis. Lewis was a good pick. But it's still no more than an average draft considering the position we sat in each of those rounds (at the very top) as well as the fact that we had an extra 2nd rounder.

[OnTheWarpath15]

Originally Posted by Direckshun

You can't blame Pioli when prospects don't turn out -- then refuse to credit him when they do.

His coaches, his successes and failures.



You're wrong, bud.

Berry, McCluster, Arenas, Asamoah, Moeaki, Lewis?

You can quibble about the values each was taken at, and I'm on record agreeing with you. But we got solid starters at RG and FS and NCB, added a potential Pro Bowler in Moeaki, an All Pro in Berry, and McCluster, whom nobody really has any idea what to do with him.

I understand the hate on the value of some of the players, as well as McCluster. But we got a haul from that draft, which is better than something like 95% of the teams do in every draft.

Potential Pro Bowler in Moeaki...

Holy shit, that's rich.

I guess it's possible there's a year in which Gronkowski, Hernandez, Gates and Keller all die...

And Moeaki actually stays healthy.

[htismaqe]

Originally Posted by OnTheWarpath58

Potential Pro Bowler in Moeaki...

Holy shit, that's rich.

I guess it's possible there's a year in which Gradkowski, Hernandez, Gates and Keller all die...

And Moeaki actually stays healthy.

Bruce Gradkowski is NOT going to make the Pro Bowl.

[OnTheWarpath15]

Originally Posted by htismaqe

Bruce Gradkowski is NOT going to make the Pro Bowl.

Well played, sir.

[Direckshun]

Originally Posted by OnTheWarpath58

Potential Pro Bowler in Moeaki...

Holy shit, that's rich.

I guess it's possible there's a year in which Gradkowski, Hernandez, Gates and Keller all die...

And Moeaki actually stays healthy.

When you want to dive back into discussion, rather than fire off drive-bys, we've got a thread here you can use.

Moeaki has Pro Bowl upside, with a really good quarterback a 70-80 catch season isn't terribly unlikely.

[OnTheWarpath15]

Originally Posted by Direckshun

When you want to dive back into discussion, rather than fire off drive-bys, we've got a thread here you can use.

Moeaki has Pro Bowl upside, with a really good quarterback a 70-80 catch season isn't terribly unlikely.

Say stupid shit, get called on it.

He's the 4th best TE in his draft class, much less the league.

When he's actually playing, that is.

[Direckshun]

Originally Posted by OnTheWarpath58

What he said.

I believe you meant to say PURE HATE

[OnTheWarpath15]

Originally Posted by Direckshun

I believe you meant to say PURE HATE

Snappy comeack.

[DJ's left nut]

Originally Posted by Direckshun

When you want to dive back into discussion, rather than fire off drive-bys, we've got a thread here you can use.

Moeaki has Pro Bowl upside, with a really good quarterback a 70-80 catch season isn't terribly unlikely.

You can't keep saying "possible" while ignoring the fact that the only reason anyone worried about that pick was his injury risk.

He's injury prone - period. He was injury prone in college and now he's straining his body even harder to compete with larger, faster men then ever before. He's being hit by guys that hit harder than ever. He's not going to suddenly escape the injury issues.

He's always going to be an injury risk. Even if he gives you a healthy season, can you truly count on him for the following season? Can you ever truly build an offense with him identified as a critical contributor?

I just don't see it. He's an injury risk that's been injured as a professional. He has the potential to do great things in this league...just as he did going into the draft. But alas, the dude can't stay on the field and if you can't rely on the guy, what good is he?

[OnTheWarpath15]

Originally Posted by DJ's left nut

You can't keep saying "possible" while ignoring the fact that the only reason anyone worried about that pick was his injury risk.

He's injury prone - period. He was injury prone in college and now he's straining his body even harder to compete with larger, faster men then ever before. He's being hit by guys that hit harder than ever. He's not going to suddenly escape the injury issues.

He's always going to be an injury risk. Even if he gives you a healthy season, can you truly count on him for the following season? Can you ever truly build an offense with him identified as a critical contributor?

I just don't see it. He's an injury risk that's been injured as a professional. He has the potential to do great things in this league...just as he did going into the draft. But alas, the dude can't stay on the field and if you can't rely on the guy, what good is he?

What he said.

[Direckshun]

Originally Posted by DJ's left nut

You can't keep saying "possible" while ignoring the fact that the only reason anyone worried about that pick was his injury risk.

He's injury prone - period. He was injury prone in college and now he's straining his body even harder to compete with larger, faster men then ever before. He's being hit by guys that hit harder than ever. He's not going to suddenly escape the injury issues.

He's always going to be an injury risk. Even if he gives you a healthy season, can you truly count on him for the following season? Can you ever truly build an offense with him identified as a critical contributor?

I just don't see it. He's an injury risk that's been injured as a professional. He has the potential to do great things in this league...just as he did going into the draft. But alas, the dude can't stay on the field and if you can't rely on the guy, what good is he?

That's fair.

[Hammock Parties]

Originally Posted by Direckshun

McCluster, whom nobody really has any idea what to do with him.

Pioli has a good idea: draft players to replace him.