Football Your assessment of Brandon Staley - Page 9

Deberg_1990 · 12-17-2021, 07:27 AM

Says he’s sticking with his 4th down approach……..good for him.

Chargers coach Brandon Staley isn't changing his ways: He says he will continue to go for it on fourth down, even after three out of Los Angeles' five attempts Thursday night failed in a 34-28 overtime defeat to the Kansas City Chiefs.

"I felt really comfortable with all those decisions," Staley said after the loss, which dropped the Chargers two games behind the Chiefs in the AFC West standings with three to play. "That's the way we're going to play around here. That's the way we're going to play. When we have a quarterback like ours, and we have an offense like ours, that's the way we're going to play because that's how you need to play against Kansas City, for sure. That's how we're going to become the team that we're ultimately capable of being, by playing that way."

The Chargers entered the game 13 for 21 on fourth downs this season, giving them the fourth-most conversions in the league. Their conversion percentage (61.9) was tied for eighth best in the NFL.

Two of Los Angeles' failed attempts to convert came inside the Kansas City 5, and another was on the edge of field goal range. The Chargers became the first team to fail twice on fourth-and-goal in a first half since the 1984 Chargers did the same -- also against the Chiefs -- 37 years ago to the day (Dec. 16, 1984).

Quarterback Justin Herbert said he stands by his coach and his decisions on fourth down.

"It's always tough and you'd love to be able to convert those," Herbert said. "I think we need to be better on third downs so that we're not in those situations, but we believe in each other. We believe in the guys in that locker room and that huddle, and we believe in the defense. I think that's a statement of trusting everyone on the field and off the field, as well. We love to be put in those situations. Unfortunately, we didn't convert as many as we would've liked to have today, but we're going to ride with each other and we're going to be right back."

With Patrick Mahomes and Tyreek Hill on the other sideline, Staley and his coaching staff realized no lead would be safe until the clock ran out. That's why they never stopped trying to score in all situations: Only the very last of the Chargers' 10 drives ended in a punt.

"It's life in the NFL, in decision-making like that. ... I know that the quickest way to win a game like that is to score touchdowns, not field goals, especially considering who's on the other side," Staley said. "When you don't feel like it's a gamble, when you feel like this is an advantage for you, then that's going to be our mindset. And I don't think that any decision that we made tonight, that I made tonight, was a gamble. We felt like it was an advantage situation for us, and that's why we did it.''

Herbert and his teammates came agonizingly close to proving Staley correct.

Donald Parham seriously injured himself while coming down just out of bounds with a catch in the back of the end zone on the Chargers' failed fourth down from the Kansas City 5 on the game's opening drive.

Four drives later on the final snap of the first half, Herbert was in the shotgun on fourth down from the Kansas City 1 -- but Daniel Sorensen got his hand on a quick out to Keenan Allen, wiping out a potential TD pass and leaving the Chargers' halftime lead at only 14-10 despite 208 yards of offense on five solid drives.

The Chargers' only drive of the third quarter ended at the Kansas City 28 when Herbert and Jared Cook couldn't connect on a fourth-and-2 pass. Cook also dropped a probable touchdown pass on second down during that final drive before halftime.

After Thursday's game, the Chargers have now gone for it on fourth down 29.9% of the time this season. That's the highest rate for any team since the 2007 Jacksonville Jaguars (30.0%).

"We felt like it was an advantage situation for us," Staley explained. "That's why we did it. If we didn't feel like that was the case, then we would have kicked a field goal or we would have punted. That's the way that we're going to do things around here. I know that our team embraces that mindset. We're going to continue to do it every game we play moving forward."

https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/...way-going-play

"The quickest way to win a game like that is to score touchdowns not field goals, especially considering who's on the other side."

Chargers coach Brandon Staley on being aggressive on 4th down against the Chiefs. pic.twitter.com/4mskizFo2J
— CBS Sports HQ (@CBSSportsHQ) December 17, 2021

Wisconsin_Chief · 12-17-2021, 07:38 PM

Honestly think he could be a defensive minded version of Adam Gase. He seems detached and aloof. He’s lucky he has Joe Lombardi working with Herbert or he wouldn’t know what to do with him.

He doesn’t worry me.

T-post Tom · 12-17-2021, 07:43 PM

My assessment is that he should die in an aids fire. He’s a mother****ing dolt.

**jjchieffan** · 12-17-2021, 10:12 PM

I came across an interesting nugget concerning the failed fourth down attempts

Via ESPN Stats and Information, and the Elias Sports Bureau, the Chargers are the first team to fail twice on fourth-and-goal tries in the first half of a game since the Chargers themselves did the exact same thing against the exact same opponent, the Chiefs, on the exact same day, Dec. 16, in 1984.

Halfcan · 12-17-2021, 10:17 PM

He looks like he is 16 years old. Andy schooled him.

suzzer99 · 12-17-2021, 10:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jjchieffan

I came across an interesting nugget concerning the failed fourth down attempts

Via ESPN Stats and Information, and the Elias Sports Bureau, the Chargers are the first team to fail twice on fourth-and-goal tries in the first half of a game since the Chargers themselves did the exact same thing against the exact same opponent, the Chiefs, on the exact same day, Dec. 16, in 1984.

They were way behind early in that game.

Sorce · 12-17-2021, 11:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wallcrawler

What?

The dolts were 2-5 on fourth downs.

3 pure fails. All easy fgs. 9 points left out there.

Yes but to say let's keep the two touchdowns but give them credit for the field goals isn't fair. My point is 5 FGs are 15 points, I took away the two touchdowns they got as a result of the 4ths which is 14 points.

4th and Long · 12-17-2021, 11:17 PM

I am completely fine with Brandon Staley's decision making processes. May he continue to make these same decisions for the Chargers for many years to come.

Megatron96 · 12-17-2021, 11:25 PM

Staley made a mistake that a young coach in 2021 is almost bound to make: he relied too much on analytics because he didn't have enough experience to lean on.

He's going to be a very good coach in a few years once he's had some tempering. But recognize that we're looking at a defensive-minded HC that is maybe the most aggressive HC in the NFL right now. That's not normal, at all. He made a mistake last night. I'll bet he learns a lot from it.

**Bearcat** · 12-24-2021, 08:12 AM

We covered this pretty well, but Brett Kollmann's take on the analytics behind the 4th down decisions.

mililo4cpa · 12-24-2021, 08:19 AM

my impression is that, seeing the Chargers are going to finish in second place behind the Chiefs again, he's no different than any of the other Chargers coaches!

Chris Meck · 12-24-2021, 08:25 AM

It's a brutal, physical, exhausting game. Analytics don't factor in the emotion and mental focus aspects of football that are plain to observe in real time. A good coach knows where his guys are at in the flow of the game and has learned to manage the lows, steady the ship, and keep his guys focused.

All those 4th down tries absolutely deflated his team's momentum. It had to be depressing for his defense, they had to operate with zero room for error all game long... It created a desperation in his offense. It was not good people management.

These are things you can't learn from just looking at statistics on a piece of paper or computer screen.

It's not just about 15 points vs. 14 points. It's about the flow of the game and how everything affects everything else and managing emotion and focus of 53 guys giving max effort for 3 hours straight.

**jjchieffan** · 12-24-2021, 08:45 AM

We should cheer him on. Let's go Brandon!

Danguardace · 12-24-2021, 08:54 AM

His face is extremely punchable!

RedinTexas · 12-24-2021, 09:04 AM

The whole thing about how the "analytics" said to go for it on fourth down bothered me. It reminded me of when the NFL adopted the two-point conversion. Coaches had cheat sheets to tell them when they should and shouldn't go for 2. What the sheets didn't do was take into account static analysis vs a dynamic analysis. Game conditions like how much time remains and how quickly teams are scoring should be big factors in such analysis, but they weren't taken into account in those "cheat sheets," so coaches often made mistakes because they didn't take into account the actual conditions of the game. Coaches relying on their "analytics" are making very similar mistakes just like Staley did.

**DaFace** · 12-24-2021, 09:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RedinTexas

The whole thing about how the "analytics" said to go for it on fourth down bothered me. It reminded me of when the NFL adopted the two-point conversion. Coaches had cheat sheets to tell them when they should and shouldn't go for 2. What the sheets didn't do was take into account static analysis vs a dynamic analysis. Game conditions like how much time remains and how quickly teams are scoring should be big factors in such analysis, but they weren't taken into account in those "cheat sheets," so coaches often made mistakes because they didn't take into account the actual conditions of the game. Coaches relying on their "analytics" are making very similar mistakes just like Staley did.

The models absolutely take into account game situations.

12-17-2021, 07:27 AM
Deberg_1990 In Search of a Life Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: San Antonio Tx. Casino cash: $294454	Your assessment of Brandon Staley Says he’s sticking with his 4th down approach……..good for him. Chargers coach Brandon Staley isn't changing his ways: He says he will continue to go for it on fourth down, even after three out of Los Angeles' five attempts Thursday night failed in a 34-28 overtime defeat to the Kansas City Chiefs. "I felt really comfortable with all those decisions," Staley said after the loss, which dropped the Chargers two games behind the Chiefs in the AFC West standings with three to play. "That's the way we're going to play around here. That's the way we're going to play. When we have a quarterback like ours, and we have an offense like ours, that's the way we're going to play because that's how you need to play against Kansas City, for sure. That's how we're going to become the team that we're ultimately capable of being, by playing that way." The Chargers entered the game 13 for 21 on fourth downs this season, giving them the fourth-most conversions in the league. Their conversion percentage (61.9) was tied for eighth best in the NFL. Two of Los Angeles' failed attempts to convert came inside the Kansas City 5, and another was on the edge of field goal range. The Chargers became the first team to fail twice on fourth-and-goal in a first half since the 1984 Chargers did the same -- also against the Chiefs -- 37 years ago to the day (Dec. 16, 1984). Quarterback Justin Herbert said he stands by his coach and his decisions on fourth down. "It's always tough and you'd love to be able to convert those," Herbert said. "I think we need to be better on third downs so that we're not in those situations, but we believe in each other. We believe in the guys in that locker room and that huddle, and we believe in the defense. I think that's a statement of trusting everyone on the field and off the field, as well. We love to be put in those situations. Unfortunately, we didn't convert as many as we would've liked to have today, but we're going to ride with each other and we're going to be right back." With Patrick Mahomes and Tyreek Hill on the other sideline, Staley and his coaching staff realized no lead would be safe until the clock ran out. That's why they never stopped trying to score in all situations: Only the very last of the Chargers' 10 drives ended in a punt. "It's life in the NFL, in decision-making like that. ... I know that the quickest way to win a game like that is to score touchdowns, not field goals, especially considering who's on the other side," Staley said. "When you don't feel like it's a gamble, when you feel like this is an advantage for you, then that's going to be our mindset. And I don't think that any decision that we made tonight, that I made tonight, was a gamble. We felt like it was an advantage situation for us, and that's why we did it.'' Herbert and his teammates came agonizingly close to proving Staley correct. Donald Parham seriously injured himself while coming down just out of bounds with a catch in the back of the end zone on the Chargers' failed fourth down from the Kansas City 5 on the game's opening drive. Four drives later on the final snap of the first half, Herbert was in the shotgun on fourth down from the Kansas City 1 -- but Daniel Sorensen got his hand on a quick out to Keenan Allen, wiping out a potential TD pass and leaving the Chargers' halftime lead at only 14-10 despite 208 yards of offense on five solid drives. The Chargers' only drive of the third quarter ended at the Kansas City 28 when Herbert and Jared Cook couldn't connect on a fourth-and-2 pass. Cook also dropped a probable touchdown pass on second down during that final drive before halftime. After Thursday's game, the Chargers have now gone for it on fourth down 29.9% of the time this season. That's the highest rate for any team since the 2007 Jacksonville Jaguars (30.0%). "We felt like it was an advantage situation for us," Staley explained. "That's why we did it. If we didn't feel like that was the case, then we would have kicked a field goal or we would have punted. That's the way that we're going to do things around here. I know that our team embraces that mindset. We're going to continue to do it every game we play moving forward." https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/...way-going-play "The quickest way to win a game like that is to score touchdowns not field goals, especially considering who's on the other side." Chargers coach Brandon Staley on being aggressive on 4th down against the Chiefs. pic.twitter.com/4mskizFo2J — CBS Sports HQ (@CBSSportsHQ) December 17, 2021
Posts: 68,445

12-17-2021, 07:38 PM	#121
Wisconsin_Chief MVP Join Date: Aug 2019 Casino cash: $-909600	Honestly think he could be a defensive minded version of Adam Gase. He seems detached and aloof. He’s lucky he has Joe Lombardi working with Herbert or he wouldn’t know what to do with him. He doesn’t worry me.
Posts: 9,731

12-17-2021, 07:43 PM	#122
T-post Tom Busy in a Kohl's restroom Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Milk/Honey/Gazland Casino cash: $1887293	My assessment is that he should die in an aids fire. He’s a mother****ing dolt. __________________ You seem nice!
Posts: 22,290

12-17-2021, 10:12 PM	#123
jjchieffan Supporter Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Highlandville, MO Casino cash: $62248	I came across an interesting nugget concerning the failed fourth down attempts Via ESPN Stats and Information, and the Elias Sports Bureau, the Chargers are the first team to fail twice on fourth-and-goal tries in the first half of a game since the Chargers themselves did the exact same thing against the exact same opponent, the Chiefs, on the exact same day, Dec. 16, in 1984. __________________ Genesis 1:1 In the beginning, God created the Heavens and the Earth. Following the historical accounts and the genealogy from that point on, the age of the Earth is approximately 6000-7000 years old. The Big Bullshit Theory is a lie. It and the evolution theory go against real science. Satan has used our public school system to brainwash everyone into believing these lies. Be not decieved.
Posts: 13,325

12-17-2021, 10:17 PM	#124
Halfcan In Search of a Life Join Date: Aug 2005 Casino cash: $7327995	He looks like he is 16 years old. Andy schooled him.
Posts: 43,200

12-17-2021, 11:17 PM	#127
4th and Long Sad Patrick Is Sad. :( Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: In a house Casino cash: $6514925	I am completely fine with Brandon Staley's decision making processes. May he continue to make these same decisions for the Chargers for many years to come. __________________
Posts: 21,568	3 0

12-17-2021, 11:25 PM	#128
Megatron96 Suupraa Geniuuusss Join Date: Jan 2019 Location: North Phoenix, AZ Casino cash: $-1769600	Staley made a mistake that a young coach in 2021 is almost bound to make: he relied too much on analytics because he didn't have enough experience to lean on. He's going to be a very good coach in a few years once he's had some tempering. But recognize that we're looking at a defensive-minded HC that is maybe the most aggressive HC in the NFL right now. That's not normal, at all. He made a mistake last night. I'll bet he learns a lot from it. __________________ *“Some ideas are so stupid only intellectuals believe them.”*- George Orwell Steven "Spags" Spagnuolo is my Adopt-A-Chief!!!
Posts: 34,909

12-24-2021, 08:12 AM	#129
Bearcat Would an idiot do that? Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Arizona Casino cash: $-885069	We covered this pretty well, but Brett Kollmann's take on the analytics behind the 4th down decisions.
Posts: 59,474	1 0

12-24-2021, 08:19 AM	#130
mililo4cpa Veteran Join Date: Jan 2017 Location: Orlando, FL Casino cash: $-149600	my impression is that, seeing the Chargers are going to finish in second place behind the Chiefs again, he's no different than any of the other Chargers coaches!
Posts: 3,239

12-24-2021, 08:25 AM	#131
Chris Meck MVP Join Date: May 2001 Location: midtown KC Casino cash: $-1185090	It's a brutal, physical, exhausting game. Analytics don't factor in the emotion and mental focus aspects of football that are plain to observe in real time. A good coach knows where his guys are at in the flow of the game and has learned to manage the lows, steady the ship, and keep his guys focused. All those 4th down tries absolutely deflated his team's momentum. It had to be depressing for his defense, they had to operate with zero room for error all game long... It created a desperation in his offense. It was not good people management. These are things you can't learn from just looking at statistics on a piece of paper or computer screen. It's not just about 15 points vs. 14 points. It's about the flow of the game and how everything affects everything else and managing emotion and focus of 53 guys giving max effort for 3 hours straight.
Posts: 19,421	1 0

12-24-2021, 08:45 AM	#132
jjchieffan Supporter Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Highlandville, MO Casino cash: $62248	We should cheer him on. Let's go Brandon! __________________ Genesis 1:1 In the beginning, God created the Heavens and the Earth. Following the historical accounts and the genealogy from that point on, the age of the Earth is approximately 6000-7000 years old. The Big Bullshit Theory is a lie. It and the evolution theory go against real science. Satan has used our public school system to brainwash everyone into believing these lies. Be not decieved.
Posts: 13,325	3 1

12-24-2021, 08:54 AM	#133
Danguardace Veteran Join Date: Oct 2012 Location: Shrewsbury England Casino cash: $-864410	His face is extremely punchable!
Posts: 2,630

12-24-2021, 09:04 AM	#134
RedinTexas Veteran Join Date: Nov 2020 Location: Texas Casino cash: $-260000	The whole thing about how the "analytics" said to go for it on fourth down bothered me. It reminded me of when the NFL adopted the two-point conversion. Coaches had cheat sheets to tell them when they should and shouldn't go for 2. What the sheets didn't do was take into account static analysis vs a dynamic analysis. Game conditions like how much time remains and how quickly teams are scoring should be big factors in such analysis, but they weren't taken into account in those "cheat sheets," so coaches often made mistakes because they didn't take into account the actual conditions of the game. Coaches relying on their "analytics" are making very similar mistakes just like Staley did.
Posts: 2,903	1 0

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