Chris Jones threatens to Hold Out

[YayMike]

Originally Posted by Chiefspants

I am equally baffled by the overwhelming amount of twitter commenters saying Jones' performance in the Super Bowl was "overrated" as I am by those saying we have to lock up 200m in our defensive line. I remember we talked about the writing on the wall about this situation being there when we traded for Clark. I love Jones. He brings an atypical skillset to the position and has a mentality on that defensive line that comes up clutch when the lights are brightest.

If Andy and the coaching staff aren't willing to pay him 20m/year (his market price), that should tell us something. I think I've grown a bit more accepting of Jones going elsewhere after watching Kollman's breakdowns of Jones' run defense. Jones run D never stopped being a liability through the end of the season. He was often out of position or missed run assignments and had to be bailed out by other players. He came up huge in the playoffs/Super Bowl, no doubt, but it makes me wonder if that's why the Chiefs are more hesitant to make a deal than previously indicated.

If he ends up going elsewhere, I wish him the best. The dude had a straight up legendary performance in the Super Bowl and we don't win a title without him. He should never have to pay for a meal in KC ever again.

Perfectly stated!

[Demonpenz]

this is why veach is on the hotseat because of shit like this

[FloridaMan88]

Bottom line is Mahomes gives the Chiefs the luxury/buffer of not needing to be great (and pay for top level talent) at every position.

Chris Jones and probably any non-PMIII player is not worth $20 million/year with this new reality.

[Chiefshrink]

Originally Posted by KCChiefsFan88

Bottom line is Mahomes gives the Chiefs the luxury/buffer of not needing to be great (and pay for top level talent) at every position.

Chris Jones and probably any non-PMIII player is not worth $20 million/year with this new reality.

Logic rules.

[Chiefspants]

Sorry for this comparison non-royals fans, but Chris Jones has always felt like the Eric Hosmer of the Chiefs 2019-2020 team.

He brings an uncharacteristic skillset to his position and the team and is just, unbelievably clutch in the biggest moments. I mean three knockdowns in the 4th quarter? Two that prevent sure completions to Kittle - one of which would have extended the Niners drive when we were down 20-17 and conceivably could have ended the game for us. Not only that, the Niners were so worried about Jones on passing plays that they triple teamed him and he still managed a knockdown. I mean holy ****. That is legendary stuff right there, just like Eric Hosmer going 0-3 with 3 lazy groundouts before becoming Babe Ruth in the bottom of the 9th inning down 2 runs.

Like Hosmer, Chris Jones struggles at the fundamentals of the position. There are two schools of thought about this. Keysor, for example, believes Jones more than makes up for it with his pass rushing, and that because of the Chiefs high powered offense, this more than makes up for Jones' struggles on running D. Kollmann, OTOH, disagrees, specifically because Jones is such a liability on running defense that other players have to compensate for Jones' weaknesses. This is especially a problem if the Chiefs have so much money locked up in Jones that they can't afford to lock up talent in other positions on the defense. Similar to Hosmer, some have suggested that Jones' strengths won't age well, and that the moment he loses a step his pass rushing will take a major hit, and that his lack of fundamentals on rushing defense would make him a complete liability on defense. We saw this happen with Hosmer the instant he got his new contract, as once his raw talent lost a step he took major steps back at the plate and on defense.

Now, there's always the chance that Jones will continue to be an absolute pass rushing force, and if that's the case, whoever gives him 5/105 money will be in good shape for a long time - but there's always a chance that the cynics will prove to be right (like they were with Hosmer) and that a contract like that will prove to be an albatross quite quickly. Like Hosmer, I'll forever love Jones and what he did to get us a title, but I think I'm going to be supportive of whatever the Chiefs decide to do in this case. Jones even has that Hosmer like swag on the D, getting in Brady's face was the stuff of champions in Foxboro this year, as was him arising at the best possible moment in the SB (and forcing that early INT off of Jimmy G).

[Dante84]

Originally Posted by Chiefspants

Sorry for this comparison non-royals fans, but Chris Jones has always felt like the Eric Hosmer of the Chiefs 2020 team.

He brings an uncharacteristic skillset to the team and is just, unbelievably clutch in the biggest moments. I mean three knockdowns in the 4th quarter? Two that prevent sure completions to Kittle - one of which would have extended the Niners drive when we were down 20-17 and conceivably could have ended the game for us. Not only that, the Niners were so worried about Jones on passing plays that they triple teamed him and he still managed a knockdown. I mean holy ****. That is legendary stuff right there, just like Eric Hosmer going 0-3 with 3 lazy groundouts before becoming Babe Ruth in the bottom of the 9th inning down 2 runs.

Like Hosmer, Chris Jones struggles at the fundamentals of the position. There are two schools of thought about this. Keysor, for example, believes Jones more than makes up for it with his pass rushing, and that because of the Chiefs high powered offense, this more than makes up for Jones' struggles on running D. Kollmann, OTOH, disagrees, specifically because Jones is such a liability on running defense that other players have to compensate for Jones' weaknesses. This is especially a problem if the Chiefs have so much money locked up in Jones that they can't afford to lock up talent in other positions on the defense. Similar to Hosmer, some have suggested that Jones' strengths won't age well, and that the moment he loses a step his pass rushing will take a major hit, and that his lack of fundamentals on rushing defense would make him a complete liability on defense.

Now, there's always the chance that Jones will continue to be an absolute pass rushing force, and if that's the case, whoever gives him 5/105 money will be in good shape for a long time - but there's always a chance that the cynics will prove to be right (like they were with Hosmer) and that a contract like that will prove to be an albatross quite quickly. Like Hosmer, I'll forever love Jones and what he did to get us a title, but I think I'm going to be supportive of whatever the Chiefs decide to do in this case. Jones even has that Hosmer like swag on the D, getting in Brady's face was the stuff of legends in Foxboro this year, as was him arising at the best possible moment in the SB (and forcing that early INT off of Jimmy G).

Great post. Thanks for that.

The 3 options are:

1. Force him to play on Franchise tag (if he plays), but risk team morale and also have diminished leverage in 2021

2. Trade him while his value will never be higher, but lose a critical star player

3. Sign him to a long-term and deal, but have cap limitations for future years


What's your preference?

[Halfcan]

Originally Posted by Dante84

Great post. Thanks for that.

The 3 options are:

1. Force him to play on Franchise tag (if he plays), but risk team morale and also have diminished leverage in 2021

2. Trade him while his value will never be higher, but lose a critical star player

3. Sign him to a long-term and deal, but have cap limitations for future years


What's your preference?

I think the Chiefs make him play on the tag this year.

[Chiefspants]

Originally Posted by Dante84

Great post. Thanks for that.

The 3 options are:

1. Force him to play on Franchise tag (if he plays), but risk team morale and also have diminished leverage in 2021

2. Trade him while his value will never be higher, but lose a critical star player
What's your preference?

That’s a tough one, for me it all depends on what’s being offered in return. I honestly think the DeForest Buckner trade kneecapped the Chiefs leverage in multiple ways. I'm guessing the Chiefs would have never sent Jones to an ascending AFC competitor like the Colts for obvious reason (which never made the Colts a viable trading partner) But the move also locked in Jones price at 21m/year (which the Chiefs seem against spending) and it also may have ended the Chiefs hopes of other teams getting into a bidding war for Jones’ services. I worry that the compensation for a trade at this point will be in the Marcus Peters range (2nd and a 4th) rather than in the Buckner range.

If the Chiefs DO get a 1st round offer from an NFC team, I wonder if the Chiefs would take it. For one, it prevents Jones from going to an AFC rival and gives Chiefs some control over where he goes, but if the Chiefs are only getting marginal offers for Jones, I think the Chiefs should go with the tag and maybe offer a 1/22 deal as an olive branch to max out his year compensation. This gives them the option to reassess their cap space after locking up Mahomes and if the NFL adds significantly more room after next season. My biggest fear with this scenario is that it could allow Jones to become the 2020's Neil Smith and go straight to the Raiders or another AFC heavy hitter, and with our weaknesses on the IOL that is straight up nightmare fuel to imagine Jones going after Pat 2-3 times a year. Luckily, we now have the star QB on our roster who can over come taking that type of pressure in high stakes situations, but it's still not a scenario that's fun to think about.

But, if the Chiefs surprise everyone with a 5/105 deal, I won’t be against that either. I have complete faith in the Chiefs FO at this point.

[VAGOMO 4 LIFE!]

Dominique Foxworth made a great point. With Jones on the field opposing QBs QBR are 32 which is basically Mason Rudolph. With Jones off the field QBs are 64 which is Carson Wentz. He single handedly changes this defense

[Pasta Little Brioni]

Originally Posted by MAHOMO 4 LIFE!

Dominique Foxworth made a great point. With Jones on the field opposing QBs QBR are 32 which is basically Mason Rudolph. With Jones off the field QBs are 64 which is Carson Wentz. He single handedly changes this defense

Yet I have to read dumbass Hosmer comparisons

[Chiefspants]

Originally Posted by Pasta Giant Meatball

Yet I have to read dumbass Hosmer comparisons

Love you, PGM

[VAGOMO 4 LIFE!]

Originally Posted by Pasta Giant Meatball

Yet I have to read dumbass Hosmer comparisons

It’s ****ing reeruned!! Jones is the most crucial player on this defense

[Chiefspants]

Originally Posted by MAHOMO 4 LIFE!

It’s ****ing reeruned!! Jones is the most crucial player on this defense

I don’t disagree with his importance and have sung his praises this entire thread, homie. Signing Jones will most likely put us in a “stars and scraps” situation (think I borrowed that phrase from Duncan). Jones may be so important to our front office that they make the signing anyway - but maybe not.

As Chiefs fans, I can’t recall the last time we let go of a player as dominant and as young as Jones. Marcus Peters was great, but his trade made sense, especially if his rumored beef with Patrick was legit.

In the past, our decent QB’s made only decent money, allowing the Chiefs to pretty much keep their talent at other positions. Now that we have the best QB in the NFL, we may have to get used to difficult partings with star players every once in a while.

[VAGOMO 4 LIFE!]

Originally Posted by Chiefspants

I don’t disagree with his importance and have sung his praises this entire thread, homie. Signing Jones will most likely put us in a “stars and scraps” situation. Jones may be so important to our front office that they make the signing anyway - but maybe not.

As Chiefs fans, I can’t recall the last time we let go of a player as dominant and as young as Jones. Marcus Peters was great, but his trade made sense, especially if his rumored beef with Patrick was legit.

In the past, our decent QB’s made only decent money, allowing the Chiefs to pretty much keep their talent at other positions. Now that we have the best QB in the NFL, we may have to get used to difficult partings with star players every once in a while.

We could’ve used Watkins money for Jones....

[Dante84]

Is it possible to restructure the contract so that:

- it's the exact same scenario as the tag and retains the ability to retag next year
- but pays him 21-22million this year?

If so, that could be a win-win. He gets more money immediately, can get to his next contract and still cash in within 1-2 years, and we can double-tag him next year, extend him, or trade him.