Bradford Please

[jAZ]

I don't think he's coming out, but he's my choice in the QB dice-roll.

[eazyb81]

In who's opinion? This ONE scout you reference? There's a combination of 4-5 guys that could end up being the 1st pick, and a lot of mocks reflect that.

Yes. If he's going to bring up the system point, which has been discussed ad nauseum (and mainly incorrectly), then he should bring up the other point that this scout thinks he's a #1 overall pick.

[milkman]

Originally Posted by eazyb81

Seriously?

You don't think more than 50% of the people into the draft on this board exaggerate Bradford's weaknesses? Just go through this thread again if you don't believe me.

I think almost everyone in a debate is going to focus on the strengths of the player they are backing, and the weaknesses of the player they aren't.

[eazyb81]

Originally Posted by OnTheWarpath58

You never go full reerun.

Read THIS thread.

If you're smart enough to be able to sort through the guys that are making comments to get under the skin of the OU fans, and the guys that actually know a few things about football and the draft, you'd see that people ARE giving him props.

But they are also pointing out his shortcomings, just like they have with Stafford (decision making and inconsistency) and Sanchez. (only 1 full year as a starter)

People gloss over the questions about Stafford and Sanchez, and go into full on exaggeration mode when it comes to Bradford.

I'm a member of a few football boards, and the hatred of Bradford on here is unrivaled. What's even funnier is that the haters just can't admit that they're biased.

I thought people would be a bit more humble in their QB analysis this year after most on the board were completely and utterly wrong on Ryan this year, but apparently that's not how the loudest posters on here operate.

[eazyb81]

Originally Posted by milkman

I think almost everyone in a debate is going to focus on the strengths of the player they are backing, and the weaknesses of the player they aren't.

Why is it even a debate? Why is this board seemingly incapable of discussing the players without including biases? It's not impossible.

[kstater]

Originally Posted by eazyb81

People gloss over the questions about Stafford and Sanchez, and go into full on exaggeration mode when it comes to Bradford.

I'm a member of a few football boards, and the hatred of Bradford on here is unrivaled. What's even funnier is that the haters just can't admit that they're biased.

I thought people would be a bit more humble in their QB analysis this year after most on the board were completely and utterly wrong on Ryan this year, but apparently that's not how the loudest posters on here operate.

As opposed to you and your completely unbiased love of Bradford.

[eazyb81]

Originally Posted by kstater

As opposed to you and your completely unbiased love of Bradford.

I have him 3rd in my QB rankings, but yeah.

[milkman]

Originally Posted by eazyb81

People gloss over the questions about Stafford and Sanchez, and go into full on exaggeration mode when it comes to Bradford.

I'm a member of a few football boards, and the hatred of Bradford on here is unrivaled. What's even funnier is that the haters just can't admit that they're biased.

I thought people would be a bit more humble in their QB analysis this year after most on the board were completely and utterly wrong on Ryan this year, but apparently that's not how the loudest posters on here operate.

And the people that don't like Stafford gloss over the questions about Bradford.

Hell we have some dumbass telling us that Stafford doesn't run a pro style offense like Bradford.

[OnTheWarpath15]

Originally Posted by eazyb81

People gloss over the questions about Stafford and Sanchez, and go into full on exaggeration mode when it comes to Bradford.

I'm a member of a few football boards, and the hatred of Bradford on here is unrivaled. What's even funnier is that the haters just can't admit that they're biased.

I thought people would be a bit more humble in their QB analysis this year after most on the board were completely and utterly wrong on Ryan this year, but apparently that's not how the loudest posters on here operate.

Who glosses over Stafford and Sanchez' question marks?

It's been discussed to death around here.

Bradford - lack of experience in pro-style offense, making reads for himself, taking snaps under center, will need to learn 3, 5 and 7 step drops.

Stafford - inconsistent, questionable decision making, seems to play lights out against weak competition, and struggles against top competition.

Sanchez - only has one year of starting experience.

[OnTheWarpath15]

Originally Posted by milkman

Hell we have some dumbass telling us that Stafford doesn't run a pro style offense like Bradford.

This.

Again, if you can't sort through the dumbasses, then that's on you.

[Marcellus]

I don't think any of the big 3 QB's is worthy of the 3rd pick but I am in the minority.

[eazyb81]

Originally Posted by OnTheWarpath58

Who glosses over Stafford and Sanchez' question marks?

It's been discussed to death around here.

Bradford - lack of experience in pro-style offense, making reads for himself, taking snaps under center, will need to learn 3, 5 and 7 step drops.

Stafford - inconsistent, questionable decision making, seems to play lights out against weak competition, and struggles against top competition.

Sanchez - only has one year of starting experience.

The two biggest issues I have are people making a big deal out of Bradford's arm and the system he plays in.

Bradford's arm is good. I think it's getting knocked excessively this year because he's being compared to Stafford, and anyone's arm will look weak when you put them next to Stafford. His arm is right there with what Matt Ryan showed last year. His arm strength improved dramatically this year from last, and once he fills out his arm will improve, just like it did for Manning and Brady. Also, pure arm strength is probably the least important aspect of grading a QB prospect, IMO. Bradford has excellent accuracy in the short/medium range, and great poise and pocket presence.

The system argument works on the surface, but if you look closer the system is more of a pro-style spread that has been used by the Pats, Steelers, etc. the last year or so. The NFL has quietly moved to a hybrid spread offense recently, and this is almost exactly the offense Bradford plays in. It's a balanced spread, not a passy-happy spread or a run-happy spread.

The main arguments that I agree with are that he rarely looks off his first or second read, just because he doesn't have to due to the surrounding talent. Also, he doesn't have experience reading a defense in the game and making changes based on what he sees. However, he's an extremely smart guy and no one knows what he could do in that area if given the opportunity. Finally, the talent on OU's offense probably helped make him look better than he is (just like Sanchez), because he had an extra second or two to throw the ball and great skill players to make things happen and get YAC.

[L.A. Chieffan]

If Detroit was smart theyd grab TEbow before we do

[OnTheWarpath15]

Originally Posted by eazyb81

The two biggest issues I have are people making a big deal out of Bradford's arm and the system he plays in.

Bradford's arm is good. I think it's getting knocked excessively this year because he's being compared to Stafford, and anyone's arm will look weak when you put them next to Stafford. His arm is right there with what Matt Ryan showed last year. His arm strength improved dramatically this year from last, and once he fills out his arm will improve, just like it did for Manning and Brady. Also, pure arm strength is probably the least important aspect of grading a QB prospect, IMO. Bradford has excellent accuracy in the short/medium range, and great poise and pocket presence.

The system argument works on the surface, but if you look closer the system is more of a pro-style spread that has been used by the Pats, Steelers, etc. the last year or so. The NFL has quietly moved to a hybrid spread offense recently, and this is almost exactly the offense Bradford plays in. It's a balanced spread, not a passy-happy spread or a run-happy spread.

The main arguments that I agree with are that he rarely looks off his first or second read, just because he doesn't have to due to the surrounding talent. Also, he doesn't have experience reading a defense in the game and making changes based on what he sees. However, he's an extremely smart guy and no one knows what he could do in that area if given the opportunity. Finally, the talent on OU's offense probably helped make him look better than he is (just like Sanchez), because he had an extra second or two to throw the ball and great skill players to make things happen and get YAC.

-We're in total agreement regarding his arm strength. It will be more than sufficient at the NFL level.

-Being in a balanced spread doesn't help his causes considering few teams operate in a system like that, even occasionally. Again, it comes back to footwork and reads, which you cover in your third point.

I'll go one further on the footwork/drops issue: I don't think people are taking this issue as serious as it really is.

People think that a 3, 5, or 7 step drop is just that - a certain amount of steps.

It's much, much more than that. It has to be precise, the timing has to be consistent. There are college QB's that come out every year, who DO play in a pro-system in college, who struggle with the drops they are expected to take in the NFL, and then deliver the ball on time, and on target.

In Bradford's case, he's going to have to learn that basically from scratch, while also learning to make post-snap reads WHILE making that drop.

I'm not saying he won't be able to do it, he will, IMO.

But as I mentioned earlier in this thread, if I'm a GM, I'm hesitant to give a $60M contract to a kid that isn't going to help your team for 2-3 years. He'll need some good coaching at the next level.

[milkman]

Originally Posted by eazyb81

The two biggest issues I have are people making a big deal out of Bradford's arm and the system he plays in.

Bradford's arm is good. I think it's getting knocked excessively this year because he's being compared to Stafford, and anyone's arm will look weak when you put them next to Stafford. His arm is right there with what Matt Ryan showed last year. His arm strength improved dramatically this year from last, and once he fills out his arm will improve, just like it did for Manning and Brady. Also, pure arm strength is probably the least important aspect of grading a QB prospect, IMO. Bradford has excellent accuracy in the short/medium range, and great poise and pocket presence.

The system argument works on the surface, but if you look closer the system is more of a pro-style spread that has been used by the Pats, Steelers, etc. the last year or so. The NFL has quietly moved to a hybrid spread offense recently, and this is almost exactly the offense Bradford plays in. It's a balanced spread, not a passy-happy spread or a run-happy spread.

The main arguments that I agree with are that he rarely looks off his first or second read, just because he doesn't have to due to the surrounding talent. Also, he doesn't have experience reading a defense in the game and making changes based on what he sees. However, he's an extremely smart guy and no one knows what he could do in that area if given the opportunity. Finally, the talent on OU's offense probably helped make him look better than he is (just like Sanchez), because he had an extra second or two to throw the ball and great skill players to make things happen and get YAC.

I'm not sure how you could argue that he has great poise and pocket presence when he played behind a line that gave him such outstanding protection.

Now he showed something in the game against Florida, but that's not a lot to work with to really make an evaluation.

As for Sanchez, he didn't get the same kind of time that Bradford had, and he did show a lot of poise in the face of pressure all year long.

[OnTheWarpath15]

Originally Posted by milkman

I'm not sure how you could argue that he has great poise and pocket presence when he played behind a line that gave him such outstanding protection.

Now he showed something in the game against Florida, but that's not a lot to work with to really make an evaluation.

As for Sanchez, he didn't get the same kind of time that Bradford had, and he did show a lot of poise in the face of pressure all year long.

I'm guessing very few people watched USC this year, Sanchez was pressured and was hit a lot this year, and more often than not, delivered a strike in the face of that pressure.