Tamba Hali

[Mecca]

Originally Posted by dirk digler

I hate to make comparisons but DT used to get run on alot.

And I am no way saying Hali = DT

When a guy gets sacks like that it's a little more acceptable than a guy who gets 8.

Even with his bad coverage skills you can scheme around that even in a 3-4 having a rush backer and a sam backer where one guy is rarely asked to drop but Hali isn't good enough at either to really take advantage of that.

[-King-]

Originally Posted by Mecca

When a guy gets sacks like that it's a little more acceptable than a guy who gets 8.

Even with his bad coverage skills you can scheme around that even in a 3-4 having a rush backer and a sam backer where one guy is rarely asked to drop but Hali isn't good enough at either to really take advantage of that.

Hali doesn't have near what DT had around him.
Posted via Mobile Device

[DeezNutz]

Originally Posted by KcChiefsKing

Hali doesn't have near what DT had around him.
Posted via Mobile Device

And Hali cannot finish like DT.

Look, I'll be the first to admit that Tamba was better than I was expecting. Again, he can have a role in a successful defense. But if you're expecting him to be your primary pass rusher in a top 5 D, which should be the goal, I think you're pissing into the wind.

[TheGuardian]

Originally Posted by Mecca

When a guy gets sacks like that it's a little more acceptable than a guy who gets 8.

Even with his bad coverage skills you can scheme around that even in a 3-4 having a rush backer and a sam backer where one guy is rarely asked to drop but Hali isn't good enough at either to really take advantage of that.

You were one of the guys that claimed Hali would be a complete failure at his new position. Still having trouble admitting you were wrong on this one huh?

Derrick Thomas also had guys like Dan Saleaumua and Joe Phillips to collapse the interior line. Let's be real, Derrick never played on a defense this devoid of talent. Ever. He was always surrounded by good/great players. What other guy helped Hali out this year in the front 7 getting to the passer?

[dirk digler]

Originally Posted by Mecca

When a guy gets sacks like that it's a little more acceptable than a guy who gets 8.

Even with his bad coverage skills you can scheme around that even in a 3-4 having a rush backer and a sam backer where one guy is rarely asked to drop but Hali isn't good enough at either to really take advantage of that.

Tamba is putting up decent numbers considering who he is playing with.

[TheGuardian]

Originally Posted by Mecca

Hali has been getting run on since the day he came in the league, it's part of who he is.

He also always gets a ton of pressures that line has been used since his rookie year also yet it never really shows on his sack total, he doesn't finish.

He's alright, that's about it, he's not a franchise pass rusher, he's an alright player who happens to stand out because he can get some sacks surrounded by a sea of shit.

And if you put a true nose on this line and give him a guy that can also collect a few sacks here and there Hali would be a 10+ sack guy.

The fact is Tamba Hali is one of the last guys to be bitching about on this defense/team. It's reeruned for people to be doing it.

[milkman]

Originally Posted by TheGuardian

And if you put a true nose on this line and give him a guy that can also collect a few sacks here and there Hali would be a 10+ sack guy.

The fact is Tamba Hali is one of the last guys to be bitching about on this defense/team. It's reeruned for people to be doing it.

While I think you overrate Hali, I agree with what you are saying here.

I doubt he'll ever be a consistent double digit sack guy, but he is one of teh last guys we should be bitching about.

[TheGuardian]

Originally Posted by milkman

While I think you overrate Hali, I agree with what you are saying here.

I doubt he'll ever be a consistent double digit sack guy, but he is one of teh last guys we should be bitching about.

I don't overrated him. My stance has always been that he's a solid player. Not pro-bowl quality, but a very solid starter. He just gets UNDERRATED by too many here.

Re Vrabel: It's not your money Dane and he's not breaking the bank so why so much ****ing bitching and moaning about it? 5 million anymore is chump change in the NFL.

If Hali beat his man with a speed rush, the qb could step up in the pocket every time to escape. If Hali used his above average balance to beat his man to inside leverage, the QB rolled to Vrabels side to escape every time. From there, all he had to do was throw away from Flowers and he was out of trouble and onto a career day.

THIS is what I watched all season. Hali CONSISTENTLY beat his man, only to have the QB step up into the pocket where there was ZERO PRESSURE, or he rolled to the other side where there was zero pressure. AS good as Derrick was, he had great players around him to help him as well. Hali is in fact best suited as an outside backer in this kind of scheme. However until we find a nose tackle that can collapse the pocket and/or someone who can bring pressure from the other side he'll never be able to "finish" because QB's simply move to that giant area where the center is and no Chief can be found. IT's that simple.

[DaneMcCloud]

Originally Posted by TheGuardian

I don't overrated him. My stance has always been that he's a solid player. Not pro-bowl quality, but a very solid starter. He just gets UNDERRATED by too many here.

What the ****?

Where did I EVER state that he was anything other than a solid player that would play hard each and every down?

Your story is changing.

Originally Posted by TheGuardian

Re Vrabel: It's not your money Dane and he's not breaking the bank so why so much ****ing bitching and moaning about it? 5 million anymore is chump change in the NFL.

So, you equate stating a fact as bitching and moaning? What the **** is wrong with you?

Furthermore, Vrabel wastes a roster spot and likely will play before a younger player. Studebaker may never be a Pro Bowler either, but each and every time he's been the starter, he's been a playmaker.

Finally, re-signing Vrabel does nothing for the youth of this team, nor does it make it more talented.

I'm really beginning to question your views.

[BossChief]

I think these are solid takes that are turning up roses. There is A LOT of fail in this thread

Originally Posted by BossChief

Hali gets to the qb, too bad that guys like Vrabel, Edwards, Mike Brown and Jon McGraw let him get away and complete the pass anyway.

Give us upgrades to those guys and Hali is perceived as one of the leagues better pass rushers.

JMO, but I think its spot on.

Originally Posted by BossChief

If Hali beat his man with a speed rush, the qb could step up in the pocket every time to escape. If Hali used his above average balance to beat his man to inside leverage, the QB rolled to Vrabels side to escape every time. From there, all he had to do was throw away from Flowers and he was out of trouble and onto a career day.

Is Hali slow? YES

Are his combine times in the quickness/balance drills on par with about any good pass rusher in the NFL? YES, eerily similar to the elite ones to be more accurate.

Does Hali have short arms that cause missed opertunities? ABSOLUTELY

Do I think the defenses lacking talent is more to do with his just above average production than his physical limitations? ABSO****INGLUTELY

JMO

Originally Posted by BossChief

I think its funny that some people can claim that he has reached his peak when he has always played on defenses that have no push up the middle and only a short time period with a good pass rusher across from him (and FTR he had more sacks than Jared his first year)

I dont know how many times Hali has missed a sack and flushed a qb out of the pocket only to see the qb throw for a big gainer because of lacking talent on this defense.

FACT he has been a top five at his position player at pressures on the quarterback about every year he has played in the NFL and IMHO if we get a solid push up the middle and a pass rush presence other than him on this team, qbs wont be able to escape as much and it will start to make passers throw rushed and a lot of those pressures will turn to sacks (for him or the other defenders)

I think Hali could consistently get 12+ sacks if the other factors are lined up.

[Mecca]

Tamba Hali got what, 10 sacks coming off the right side with Jared Allen on the team...

I think we have far to many debates about guys like Tamba Hali, do other teams fans do this?

The truth on him is somewhere in the middle and if he was as good as some would have you believe pass rusher wouldn't always be at the top of this teams needs list.

[Titty Meat]

Originally Posted by Mecca

Tamba Hali got what, 10 sacks coming off the right side with Jared Allen on the team...

I think we have far to many debates about guys like Tamba Hali, do other teams fans do this?

The truth on him is somewhere in the middle and if he was as good as some would have you believe pass rusher wouldn't always be at the top of this teams needs list.

Uhh the fact that the executive of the decade hasn't replaced him is proof Hali is a really good player.

[Mecca]

Originally Posted by billay

Uhh the fact that the executive of the decade hasn't replaced him is proof Hali is a really good player.

You know what makes Hali look really good?

Mike Vrabel that dude is awful yet he got a new contract.

[Titty Meat]

Originally Posted by Mecca

You know what makes Hali look really good?

Mike Vrabel that dude is awful yet he got a new contract.

Nah man Pioli is just filling the back end of the roster.

[aturnis]

Originally Posted by billay

Nah man Pioli is just filling the back end of the roster.

You are a ****ing reerun. There is no doubt that Vrabel will be the starter unless we draft someone to man the left side, or Studie steps up and takes it. That would not be considered improving the back end of the roster, that would be filling the holes. You know, that thing you do with experienced veterans.