Math question

[tooge]

Ok, so my 10 year old daughter comes home last night and asks me to help her with her "base 10 blocks" for proofing long division. Huh? so, anyhow, I look it up on line and after being utterly confused, I find a few youtube videos about it, and now I get it. What I don't get, is why these little hieroglyphic looking pictures are used to "proof" something that is super simple. My daughter has no trouble with the long division at all, it's only the "simplified" drawings that are confusing to her. Did any of you use this to learn division?

[Katipan]

Originally Posted by BucEyedPea

I can see that point, only for understanding the underlying concepts—not for real world use. So I like what the "Frustrated Parent" with a BS degree in Electronic Engineering wrote: " In the real world, simplification is valued over complication."

HEY! What she said!

[J Diddy]

Originally Posted by Amnorix

Interesting sidenote -- we suck at math, but we're much, much more entrepreneurial than most of those same countries that kick our ass at math. They are working on trying to encourage more of an entrepreneurial spirit among their students. It's a "technical proficiency" versus "creating thinking" thing, apparently. We're better at creativity, and they're better at technical stuff.

But that means they usually end up working for us. What we want to do is improve our technical proficiency without killing the entrepreneurial capability.

Yes. Everyone has their place. We (as a society, certainly not me) make the money and they count it for us.

[tooge]

Well, whether or not we suck at math in the US, I was always pretty damned good at it, and this base ten block drawing concept is idiotic. It seems like it's teaching down to the lowest common denominator

[Frosty]

Originally Posted by NewChief

That article does a really nice job of showing how we actually, in the real world, do a lot of these tricks anyway. We break complex math problems down into a series of simpler math problems (think of how we figure 15% tips in our heads).

I was just going to post the same comment. I was surprised to find that I used some of the same techniques all the time when doing math in my head.

However, in this example

Cell phones with built-in calculators have made it easy to get the tip ($3.70). But many adults still do it in their heads: Move the decimal point over. OK, that's 10 percent, or $1.85. Now you need to double it. But multiplying a three-digit decimal still isn't easy. So you think about it this way: $1.85 can be broken down into $1.50 plus 35 cents. $1.50 times 2 is $3, and 35 cents times 2 is 70 cents. Tip $3.70.

I probably would have done "10% of 18.50 is $1.85, or almost $2. 2 x $2 is $4, then subtract out the difference (2 x $.15) for $3.70." Pretty much the same idea.

[BucEyedPea]

Originally Posted by NewChief

That article does a really nice job of showing how we actually, in the real world, do a lot of these tricks anyway. We break complex math problems down into a series of simpler math problems (think of how we figure 15% tips in our heads).

I know what you mean. I do that myself. But that's simple mental math. A tip is simple enough. I would think some problems are too complex for that approach like in engineering. Are engineers going to figure all their math out in their heads, especially like that? Like I said, it's fine for some things.

[WhawhaWhat]

Originally Posted by tooge

Well, whether or not we suck at math in the US, I was always pretty damned good at it, and this base ten block drawing concept is idiotic. It seems like it's teaching down to the lowest common denominator

Plot twist: You are the lowest common denominator and they are teaching up.

[Frosty]

Originally Posted by BucEyedPea

I know what you mean. I do that myself. But that's simple mental math. A tip is simple enough. I would think some problems are too complex for that approach like in engineering. Are engineers going to figure all their math out in their heads, especially like that? Like I said, it's fine for some things.

I would be more upset about this if they weren't teaching the standard algorithms along with the CC stuff. It is simply to teach the concepts behind the standard way. I think that is pretty important.

[cosmo20002]

Originally Posted by BucEyedPea

No need to bother trying to make everyone good at both. That's why we have individuals. Everyone has more ability in certain areas and it starts with what an individual's interests are. That's okay. Nothing wrong with it at all. Allow the individual to go where they want and provide the tools for them. Not everyone has to be good a higher level math. That's why we exchange and trade with one another because someone else is better at doing something that we can't do.

I think we should ask the kids whether they want to learn math at all. I mean, if they are not interested, they are individuals who can make a choice.

[BucEyedPea]

Originally Posted by Frosty

I would be more upset about this if they weren't teaching the standard algorithms along with the CC stuff. It is simply to teach the concepts behind the standard way. I think that is pretty important.

Well, that's what I posted. Did you read the thread? But I have to wonder if that is the intent.

[BucEyedPea]

Originally Posted by cosmo20002

I think we should ask the kids whether they want to learn math at all. I mean, if they are not interested, they are individuals who can make a choice.

I didn't say that either. Please read...I said higher level math. You might go back to an earlier grade yourself to learn reading comprehension or phonics, cosmos.
Or logic, since you posted a strawman argument.

[Dave Lane]

This new learning amazes me Sir Bedivere, explain again to me how rams bladders may be employed to prevent earthquakes?

[Dave Lane]

Originally Posted by WhawhaWhat

Plot twist: You are the lowest common denominator and they are teaching up.

No shit and the very lowest.

[Katipan]

Originally Posted by BucEyedPea

I didn't say that either. Please read...I said higher level math. You might go back to an earlier grade yourself to learn reading comprehension or phonics, cosmos.
Or logic, since you posted a strawman argument.

I like cosmo, and he knows I like you. But do you ever feel like he's running around snapping your bra strap?

[morphius]

I think the goal, as I understand it, is interesting. Teach things multiple ways in hopes that something clicks for each of the students. It makes more sense than the old style of one size fits all. I don't know that the execution is there yet, and I know my 8 year olds assignments confuse the piss out of me, but I don't know that it makes it all bad either.

[KC native]

My kid is gifted at math and gets frustrated by the CC stuff (because he wants to rush through it and not show his work), but it's been a good teaching tool for showing him how to step through problems.

He doesn't need to step through them yet (because he gets the concepts), but the way the work makes him go through the steps and disassemble a problem has made him much better at solving other problems that he comes across (like in video games that he plays).

My kid is a 3rd grader.