NFBT - Don't kill convicted murders - Page 2

dollar1 · 09-10-2001, 02:03 PM

Sorry about the polical topic. There was a post on another thread about how can Bush sleep at night know that an "innocent" convicted murder might be subject to capital punishment.

THIS REALLY CHAPS MY BUTT!!

It never ceases to amaze me...You can't kill a convicted murder for the off chance that he was innocent. Probability of innocence: 5 in 100. The killing is a form of punishment and deterence. The murder had a choice and took a life.

Yet, it is prefectly sane to kill perfectly innocent kids. Probability of innocence: 100 in 100. The killing is for convience. The kid had no choice so his/her life was taken.

Talk about backward logic. 100 years ago, imagine anyone allowing babys to be killed, yet rallying for criminals??

Sad

Anyone that is FOR abortion has not borne any children. If they do have kids and still believe in abortion...they have to have a heart of stone.

Lightning Rod · 09-10-2001, 03:37 PM

I did a bit of looking and found many site claiming X number of people have been executed and later found innocent. Strangely I could not find specific examples. I would think it would take a strange combination of circumstances for a dead man to be later exonerated. This in my opinion on this subject.
In civil matters one must only prove their case by a preponderance of the evidence. Criminal matters have must be proven beyond a reasonable doubt. If we are to continue to execute people I think there should be an even higher standard applied to those cases. The judicial system is a branch of our government. Our government is by its very nature Incompetent. I am not comfortable with the government making life and death decisions. Just MHO

MrBlond · 09-10-2001, 03:39 PM

[QUOTE]I said somone who is wealthy not moderate to middle class[/QUOTE]

According to Democrats don't the wealthiest deserve to be punished? I would think the death penalty coupled with the estate tax laws would be a perfect form of wealth redistribution. All we have to do is figure out a way to make the Bill Gates's of the world kill and rape more people.

MrBlond · 09-10-2001, 03:41 PM

Punkin.

Again, if more wealthy white men were executed would you support the death penalty?

htismaqe · 09-10-2001, 03:43 PM

The economics line is bull****! People who commit murder are executed because they committed murder, not because they are poor. If a rich man is convicted of murder( there are 100's of examples) he can't buy his way out of it. Some might argue he could buy his way out of being convicted, but the death penaly implies conviction...

The simple fact is that poor people are more likely to commit murder while in the act of committing another crime (ie. robbery)...

The death penalty is a RESULT and therefore cannot be judged along socio-economic lines. If you want to help the poor, find out why they are more likely to COMMIT CRIMES, not more likely to be executed.

By the way, I happen to believe that both abortion and the death penalty are wrong...

PunkinDrublic · 09-10-2001, 03:45 PM

Look if somone is a serial killer and is on the loose that's an extreme case. For every one of these serial killers that is put death there are literally hundreds of underclass people on death row who were misrepresented and didn't get a fair trial. Until everyone gets a truly fair trial there will always be a flawed system.

htismaqe · 09-10-2001, 03:47 PM

Those "underpriveleged" as you call them are often defended by public defenders, trained by and working in the same system as the public prosecutors...seems like a fair fight to me...

If you truly want equity, give all accused 1st degree murderers a public defender, regardless of income...

PunkinDrublic · 09-10-2001, 03:49 PM

I'm not talking about race Mr. Blond I'm talking about the fact that the poor are more often misrepresented. Your Bill gates theory holds know weight.

PunkinDrublic · 09-10-2001, 03:53 PM

This has turned out to be a very good discussion and I hope all of you will considered what I said. By the way Mr. Blond I'm not a democrat.

MrBlond · 09-10-2001, 03:53 PM

So if wealthy people regardless of race were executed in greater numbers you would support it? Are you against the death penalty as immoral and wrong? Or do you just want more rich people included?

MrBlond · 09-10-2001, 03:55 PM

I am guessing by your tag line you are not rank and file GOP.

dollar1 · 09-10-2001, 03:55 PM

Iowian, agreed having this in march. But it did come up and inflames me.

Public Drunk...

As expected...

My sister was raped. She took a spermacide later. My wife, when younger, used abortion as birth control. I felt like you before...rape/incest/hurt the mom/defective baby...all as reason enough for an abortion.

I will assume that you don't have kids?? THEN YOU DON'T HAVE A CLUE!!!!!!!

From all of the above "reasons", what's wrong with ADOPTATION? There are a ton of folks who would love to have a baby.

To me it is clear cut.

BTW I'm not for killing anybody. I do whoever think that the death penalty has some limited use. We need more deterence. I don't feel we should have to pay $36000 a year to house a convicted murderer. If everyone that was a CONVICTED, to include DNA investigation, MURDERER swung. I think we would have less of a crime problem.

I'm done, I got what I wanted from PD except if he had kids??

PunkinDrublic · 09-10-2001, 03:56 PM

What I'm saying is that wealth and social status shouldn't give anyone the right to be above the law. I've got to go but everyone should seriously consider my point.

MrBlond · 09-10-2001, 03:57 PM

By the way punkin, I am not a democrate either.

htismaqe · 09-10-2001, 03:57 PM

The economic argument doesn't support the death penalty...

It costs more for the appeals and such to condemn someone to death than it does to confine them for 99 years...

**ExtremeChief** · 09-10-2001, 03:57 PM

Punkin,

Maybe the poor don't always get the best representation, but they still get a jury of their peers. That's 12 everyday people that live with taking another life on their concience. I don't believe you could find 12 people that take that responsibility lightly.

As far as the original topic, which has been argued over and over and over again... what representation do the unborn get???

understanding there will never be agreement on this topic...

09-10-2001, 02:03 PM
dollar1 Starter Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Hiawatha, KS Casino cash: $10004900	NFBT - Don't kill convicted murders Sorry about the polical topic. There was a post on another thread about how can Bush sleep at night know that an "innocent" convicted murder might be subject to capital punishment. THIS REALLY CHAPS MY BUTT!! It never ceases to amaze me...You can't kill a convicted murder for the off chance that he was innocent. Probability of innocence: 5 in 100. The killing is a form of punishment and deterence. The murder had a choice and took a life. Yet, it is prefectly sane to kill perfectly innocent kids. Probability of innocence: 100 in 100. The killing is for convience. The kid had no choice so his/her life was taken. Talk about backward logic. 100 years ago, imagine anyone allowing babys to be killed, yet rallying for criminals?? Sad Anyone that is FOR abortion has not borne any children. If they do have kids and still believe in abortion...they have to have a heart of stone.
Posts: 277

09-10-2001, 03:37 PM	#16
Lightning Rod Need a new title Join Date: Sep 2000 Location: Prairie Village Casino cash: $10004900	Government Bad fire good I did a bit of looking and found many site claiming X number of people have been executed and later found innocent. Strangely I could not find specific examples. I would think it would take a strange combination of circumstances for a dead man to be later exonerated. This in my opinion on this subject. In civil matters one must only prove their case by a preponderance of the evidence. Criminal matters have must be proven beyond a reasonable doubt. If we are to continue to execute people I think there should be an even higher standard applied to those cases. The judicial system is a branch of our government. Our government is by its very nature Incompetent. I am not comfortable with the government making life and death decisions. Just MHO __________________ Who was the first person to say, "See that chicken over there ... I'm gonna eat the first thing that comes out if its butt"?
Posts: 1,151

09-10-2001, 03:39 PM	#17
MrBlond Lets Rock. Join Date: Sep 2000 Location: South of the border. Casino cash: $10004900	[QUOTE]I said somone who is wealthy not moderate to middle class[/QUOTE] According to Democrats don't the wealthiest deserve to be punished? I would think the death penalty coupled with the estate tax laws would be a perfect form of wealth redistribution. All we have to do is figure out a way to make the Bill Gates's of the world kill and rape more people. __________________ "I can handle things, I'm smart, not like everybody says, like dumb, I'm smart, and I want respect!"
Posts: 12,747

09-10-2001, 03:41 PM	#18
MrBlond Lets Rock. Join Date: Sep 2000 Location: South of the border. Casino cash: $10004900	Punkin. Again, if more wealthy white men were executed would you support the death penalty? __________________ "I can handle things, I'm smart, not like everybody says, like dumb, I'm smart, and I want respect!"
Posts: 12,747

09-10-2001, 03:43 PM	#19
htismaqe 'Tis my eye! Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Chiefsplanet Casino cash: $8089900	The economics line is bull****! People who commit murder are executed because they committed murder, not because they are poor. If a rich man is convicted of murder( there are 100's of examples) he can't buy his way out of it. Some might argue he could buy his way out of being convicted, but the death penaly implies conviction... The simple fact is that poor people are more likely to commit murder while in the act of committing another crime (ie. robbery)... The death penalty is a RESULT and therefore cannot be judged along socio-economic lines. If you want to help the poor, find out why they are more likely to COMMIT CRIMES, not more likely to be executed. By the way, I happen to believe that both abortion and the death penalty are wrong...
Posts: 104,433

09-10-2001, 03:45 PM	#20
PunkinDrublic Stay down bitch! Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: Plano, TX Casino cash: $4320670	Look if somone is a serial killer and is on the loose that's an extreme case. For every one of these serial killers that is put death there are literally hundreds of underclass people on death row who were misrepresented and didn't get a fair trial. Until everyone gets a truly fair trial there will always be a flawed system. __________________ Disappointing my parents since 1976
Posts: 9,557

09-10-2001, 03:47 PM	#21
htismaqe 'Tis my eye! Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Chiefsplanet Casino cash: $8089900	Those "underpriveleged" as you call them are often defended by public defenders, trained by and working in the same system as the public prosecutors...seems like a fair fight to me... If you truly want equity, give all accused 1st degree murderers a public defender, regardless of income...
Posts: 104,433

09-10-2001, 03:49 PM	#22
PunkinDrublic Stay down bitch! Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: Plano, TX Casino cash: $4320670	I'm not talking about race Mr. Blond I'm talking about the fact that the poor are more often misrepresented. Your Bill gates theory holds know weight. __________________ Disappointing my parents since 1976
Posts: 9,557

09-10-2001, 03:53 PM	#23
PunkinDrublic Stay down bitch! Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: Plano, TX Casino cash: $4320670	This has turned out to be a very good discussion and I hope all of you will considered what I said. By the way Mr. Blond I'm not a democrat. __________________ Disappointing my parents since 1976
Posts: 9,557

09-10-2001, 03:55 PM	#25
MrBlond Lets Rock. Join Date: Sep 2000 Location: South of the border. Casino cash: $10004900	I am guessing by your tag line you are not rank and file GOP. __________________ "I can handle things, I'm smart, not like everybody says, like dumb, I'm smart, and I want respect!"
Posts: 12,747

09-10-2001, 03:56 PM	#27
PunkinDrublic Stay down bitch! Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: Plano, TX Casino cash: $4320670	What I'm saying is that wealth and social status shouldn't give anyone the right to be above the law. I've got to go but everyone should seriously consider my point. __________________ Disappointing my parents since 1976
Posts: 9,557

09-10-2001, 03:57 PM	#28
MrBlond Lets Rock. Join Date: Sep 2000 Location: South of the border. Casino cash: $10004900	By the way punkin, I am not a democrate either. __________________ "I can handle things, I'm smart, not like everybody says, like dumb, I'm smart, and I want respect!"
Posts: 12,747

09-10-2001, 03:57 PM	#30
ExtremeChief Poser Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: BFE, MO Casino cash: $9991344	Punkin, Maybe the poor don't always get the best representation, but they still get a jury of their peers. That's 12 everyday people that live with taking another life on their concience. I don't believe you could find 12 people that take that responsibility lightly. As far as the original topic, which has been argued over and over and over again... what representation do the unborn get??? understanding there will never be agreement on this topic... __________________ When you wish upon a falling star, your dreams can come true. Unless it's really a meteorite hurtling to the Earth which will destroy all life. Then you're pretty much hosed no matter what you wish for. Unless it's death by meteor.
Posts: 2,354