Chiefs At the Quarter Mark: Better or Worse? - Page 2

**OnTheWarpath15** · 05:47 PM

After the Haley hire, you couldn't throw a stick through this place without hitting someone that made the following comment:

"We'll be a better team based on coaching alone," or, "we'll win X amount of games due to coaching alone."

Yes, it's only been 4 games, and this is NOT a call for Haley's head - but is deserved criticism of the way he's prepared this team over the first 4 games of the regular season.

Also, IN NO WAY is the following an endorsement of Herman Edwards. What it is, however, is a giant red flag - this team - of which 60% has been handpicked by Pioli and Haley - is actually worse in almost all statistical categories when compared to the 2008 team after 4 games - which many here claimed were the darkest days of last season. We'll call it, B.S. - or, Before Spread.

Offensively (bolded number is 2009 totals):

1st downs: (63) (62)

3rd down conversions: (25/62 - 40%) (9/51 - 18%)

Total yards: (1145) (986)

Rushing yards: (554) (406)

Passing yards: (591) (580)

Sacks Allowed: (12) (13)

Penalties/Yardage: (10/109) 29/230

Scoring: (16.25 PPG) (16 PPG)

Not a single category in which we've improved over 2008, which happened to include going through 3 QB's - playing the 3rd stringer in 2 of the 4.

Defensively:

1st downs allowed: (74) (85)

3rd down conversions against: (25/54 - 46%) (25/58 - 43%)

Total yards allowed: (1517) (1516)

Rushing yards allowed: (706) (514)

Passing yards allowed: (811) (1002)

Sacks: (3) (5)

Points allowed: (24.25 PPG) (28 PPG)

Turnover margin: (+2) (Even)

Yea! 2 more sacks! And nice to see the 192 yard improvement from the rush defense, only to see 191 of it be given back up by the pass defense.

The 2008 team was apparently so bad that management felt the need to purge 30 players, yet is playing worse with a roster that is 60% their handpicked players?

What message are you trying to send, Todd? It seems like it changes on a weekly ****ing basis.

As someone who predicted a 3 win season, the losses aren't surprising me.

The way we are losing, after hearing the phrase, "we're going to be a big, strong, fast, smart, tough, disciplined football team" IS surprising me.

There is no improvement over the "Dark Ages" of last season in ANY of those areas. And there's no excuse for it, especially the lack of discipline. Make 'em run some more, Todd - it seems to be working...

Enough excuses - enough with the "messages" - enough petty bullshit sitting players - time to see some ****ing improvement. Not necessarily wins.

IMPROVEMENT.

**Bane** · 10-05-2009, 01:57 PM

I knew we were gonna be pretty bad but this team so far hasn't come together like I had hoped.Right now I would have to vote for worse,but being this bad has to mean being good is next...I hope....
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KCUnited · 10-05-2009, 02:00 PM

Switch out last years Denver game for this years Giants game and those numbers may even out some. But yeah, we are worse no question.

**Mr. Flopnuts** · 10-05-2009, 02:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GoChiefs

We're appreciably worse but that's to be expected when you're installing new offensive and defensive systems and dumping talent like Tony Gonzalez.

By the way, we are a better team than we were at the beginning of last year when we tried to run the pro set to futility. And I believe we will be a better team by the end of the year than we were at the end of 2008.

We took two steps backwards to get pointed in the right direction. It will pay off.

I almost started this very thread yesterday. OTWP did a better job with stats to back everything up. I found myself pondering whether or not this team was better than it was 1 year ago today. I determined it's not, and mostly for the reasons GoChiefs listed above. We'll see where it goes from here, but so far, not so good.

**DeezNutz** · 10-05-2009, 02:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chiefnj2

Plus, they have no identity yet.

But what about that "message" that Haley sent in Philly? Didn't that help?

**DeezNutz** · 10-05-2009, 02:07 PM

Oh, and OTW, I'm going to be shocked if you didn't just write Whitlock's next column.

Congrats.

.

**OnTheWarpath15** · 10-05-2009, 02:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeezNutz

But what about that "message" that Haley sent in Philly? Didn't that help?

Sunday is "opposite day" in the Haley household.

Run 10 of 11 plays when down 3 scores, throw 5 of 6 plays inside the 2 ****ing yard line.

**OnTheWarpath15** · 10-05-2009, 02:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeezNutz

Oh, and OTW, I'm going to be shocked if you didn't just write Whitlock's next column.

Congrats.

.

Hey, I've always wanted to be published.

**The Franchise** · 10-05-2009, 02:09 PM

That onside kick to open the second half was ****ing reeruned.

KCUnited · 10-05-2009, 02:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pestilence

That onside kick to open the second half was ****ing reeruned.

We are going to keep doing it until we get it right.

Mr_Tomahawk · 10-05-2009, 02:20 PM

It would be interesting to see these numbers during Haley's 3rd year when he has been at the helm.

All these numbers tell me is that Haley has put up near identical numbers with an overhauled team in his first year compared to Herms team which had been 3 years in the making...

SenselessChiefsFan · 10-05-2009, 02:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr_Tomahawk

It would be interesting to see these numbers during Haley's 3rd year when he has been at the helm.

All these numbers tell me is that Haley has put up near identical numbers with an overhauled team in his first year compared to Herms team which had been 3 years in the making...

Give me a break. Herm wasn't allowed to tear down the team and start building until his third year.

I am not calling for Haley's head.... but this has been pathetic.

**Buehler445** · 10-05-2009, 02:40 PM

Good analysis OTW. Third Down futility had a lot to with replacing Gonzo with shit on a ****ing shingle.

I was telling someone yesterday, that I had no idea why Pioli and Haley didn't go get some different starters.
Posted via Mobile Device

Hammock Parties · 10-05-2009, 02:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OnTheWarpath58

Uh, no, we're not.

Did you actually look at the numbers?

And how the **** did we take 2 steps backwards, when all I heard last year is how it can't get any worse?

Look at the games against Carolina and Tennessee last year.

Nothing nearly that bad has happened this year. Philly came close.

And that Oakland game last year was a disaster. This year it was just...disappointing.

Hammock Parties · 10-05-2009, 02:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr_Tomahawk

All these numbers tell me is that Haley has put up near identical numbers with an overhauled team in his first year compared to Herms team which had been 3 years in the making...

Exactly. That is a huge difference.

Shag · 10-05-2009, 02:46 PM

I think some allowance has to be made for a new scheme on both sides of the ball, a late offensive playbook change, and quality of opponents faced. That being said, the team has been disappointing so far, even given very low expectations. The 3rd down efficiency and penalties are the most discouraging stats, IMHO - nearly impossible to win with those numbers.

I think the second half of the season will be the most telling. 8 weeks to get at least somewhat comfortable with the new schemes, and a much more reasonable schedule should give a much better idea of where this team is heading for the future.

10-05-2009, 01:50 PM
OnTheWarpath15 MVP Join Date: Sep 2005 Casino cash: $2031115	At the Quarter Mark: Better or Worse? After the Haley hire, you couldn't throw a stick through this place without hitting someone that made the following comment: "We'll be a better team based on coaching alone," or, "we'll win X amount of games due to coaching alone." Yes, it's only been 4 games, and this is NOT a call for Haley's head - but is deserved criticism of the way he's prepared this team over the first 4 games of the regular season. Also, IN NO WAY is the following an endorsement of Herman Edwards. What it is, however, is a giant red flag - this team - of which 60% has been handpicked by Pioli and Haley - is actually worse in almost all statistical categories when compared to the 2008 team after 4 games - which many here claimed were the darkest days of last season. We'll call it, B.S. - or, Before Spread. Offensively (bolded number is 2009 totals): 1st downs: (63) (62) 3rd down conversions: (25/62 - 40%) (9/51 - 18%) Total yards: (1145) (986) Rushing yards: (554) (406) Passing yards: (591) (580) Sacks Allowed: (12) (13) Penalties/Yardage: (10/109) 29/230 Scoring: (16.25 PPG) (16 PPG) Not a single category in which we've improved over 2008, which happened to include going through 3 QB's - playing the 3rd stringer in 2 of the 4. Defensively: 1st downs allowed: (74) (85) 3rd down conversions against: (25/54 - 46%) (25/58 - 43%) Total yards allowed: (1517) (1516) Rushing yards allowed: (706) (514) Passing yards allowed: (811) (1002) Sacks: (3) (5) Points allowed: (24.25 PPG) (28 PPG) Turnover margin: (+2) (Even) Yea! 2 more sacks! And nice to see the 192 yard improvement from the rush defense, only to see 191 of it be given back up by the pass defense. The 2008 team was apparently so bad that management felt the need to purge 30 players, yet is playing worse with a roster that is 60% their handpicked players? What message are you trying to send, Todd? It seems like it changes on a weekly **ing basis. As someone who predicted a 3 win season, the losses aren't surprising me. The way we are losing, after hearing the phrase, "we're going to be a big, strong, fast, smart, tough, disciplined football team" IS surprising me. There is no improvement over the "Dark Ages" of last season in ANY of those areas. And there's no excuse for it, especially the lack of discipline. Make 'em run some more, Todd - it seems to be working... Enough excuses - enough with the "messages" - enough petty bullshit sitting players - time to see some *ing improvement. Not necessarily wins. IMPROVEMENT. Last edited by OnTheWarpath15; 10-05-2009 at 05:47 PM..*
Posts: 60,758

10-05-2009, 01:57 PM	#16
Bane C.H.I.E.F.S Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: **** your face Casino cash: $10005055	I knew we were gonna be pretty bad but this team so far hasn't come together like I had hoped.Right now I would have to vote for worse,but being this bad has to mean being good is next...I hope.... Posted via Mobile Device
Posts: 12,621

10-05-2009, 02:00 PM	#17
KCUnited Cheat Death Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Land of Drincoln Casino cash: $-1691756	Switch out last years Denver game for this years Giants game and those numbers may even out some. But yeah, we are worse no question.
Posts: 37,042

10-05-2009, 02:09 PM	#23
The Franchise Most Valuable Villain Join Date: Dec 2006 Casino cash: $2055047	That onside kick to open the second half was ****ing reeruned.
Posts: 92,316

10-05-2009, 02:20 PM	#25
Mr_Tomahawk Prestige Worldwide Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Spring Hill, KS Casino cash: $-179474	It would be interesting to see these numbers during Haley's 3rd year when he has been at the helm. All these numbers tell me is that Haley has put up near identical numbers with an overhauled team in his first year compared to Herms team which had been 3 years in the making... __________________ Adopt-A-Chief: John Dorsey
Posts: 18,621

10-05-2009, 02:40 PM	#27
Buehler445 Supporter Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Scott City KS Casino cash: $-1665266	Good analysis OTW. Third Down futility had a lot to with replacing Gonzo with shit on a ***ing shingle. I was telling someone yesterday, that I had no idea why Pioli and Haley didn't go get some different starters. Posted via Mobile Device*
Posts: 60,039

10-05-2009, 02:46 PM	#30
Shag MVP Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: San Diego, CA Casino cash: $-1466658	I think some allowance has to be made for a new scheme on both sides of the ball, a late offensive playbook change, and quality of opponents faced. That being said, the team has been disappointing so far, even given very low expectations. The 3rd down efficiency and penalties are the most discouraging stats, IMHO - nearly impossible to win with those numbers. I think the second half of the season will be the most telling. 8 weeks to get at least somewhat comfortable with the new schemes, and a much more reasonable schedule should give a much better idea of where this team is heading for the future.
Posts: 5,186