Science A wind power stat that may surprise you. - Page 2

**Rain Man** · 08-17-2012, 09:22 AM

At least, it surprised me.

The figure is a little misleading because it was apparently a short-term peak in the wee hours of the morning, but it's nonetheless quite impressive. I had no idea they were anywhere near that level, and I'm perhaps even more impressed that the annual average in Colorado (edit: from this provider, which is Colorado's largest) is 17 percent.

http://money.cnn.com/2012/08/06/news...dex.htm?iid=EL

Wind power hits 57% mark in Colorado
By Steve Hargreaves @CNNMoney August 6, 2012: 5:18 AM ET

NEW YORK (CNNMoney) -- During the early morning hours of April 15, with a steady breeze blowing down Colorado's Front Range, the state's biggest utility set a U.S. record -- nearly 57% of the electricity being generated was coming from wind power.

As dawn came and the 1.4 million customers in Xcel Energy's service district began turning on the lights, toasters and other appliances, the utility's coal and natural gas-fired power plants ramped up production and brought wind's contribution back closer to its 2012 average of 17%.

Utilities have long been wary of placing too much finicky renewable power on the grid.

"A lot of utilities don't want to contract large amounts of wind because it's volatile," said Amy Grace, a wind analyst at Bloomberg New Energy Finance. "Anything over 25%, and utilities get nervous."

Colorado's overnight high-water mark demonstrated that utilities can indeed incorporate cleaner power sources into the mix.

It also provides hope that, under the right conditions and policies, wind will be able to provide a significantly larger share of the nation's power than its current 3% rate.

**Donger** · 08-17-2012, 10:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rain Man

While I realize that the wind turbines are huge, it seems like there should be a way to screen them so that birds bounce off the chicken wire instead of going into the blender.

Reducing efficiency and adding cost, sure.

AndChiefs · 08-17-2012, 10:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bump

Wind Power is really really good. Unless it ruins my view. /democrats

I mean, the nations top priority is keeping the mega rich, rich and getting them richer. how is wind power going to contribute to that?

FYP

**Donger** · 08-17-2012, 10:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Braincase

Not to mention the loss of lives due to "windlung" disease, and the ever present threat of sunmines collapsing, trapping and possibly killing the sunmine workers.

Braincase · 08-17-2012, 10:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Donger

Some things you can't put a $ on, unless you work in the insurance industry.

**Donger** · 08-17-2012, 10:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Braincase

Some things you can't put a $ on, unless you work in the insurance industry.

Sorry, I'm not following your argument (if you have one).

**bevischief** · 08-17-2012, 10:25 AM

They are all over West Texas, North and South Dakota, Nebraska, Iowa and Minnesota. They have a plant that makes them here in Fargo.

Braincase · 08-17-2012, 10:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Donger

Sorry, I'm not following your argument (if you have one).

You were mentioning fossil fuels being less expensive than wind/solar.

**Donger** · 08-17-2012, 10:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Braincase

You were mentioning fossil fuels being less expensive than wind/solar.

And they are.

**Rain Man** · 08-17-2012, 10:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Donger

And they are.

I think braincase's point is that there are downstream costs that may not be attributed to fossil fuels, but which exist and are borne by society more than the industry. There may be for wind as well, but we don't know that yet.

ghak99 · 08-17-2012, 10:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Braincase

You can buy kits to generate your own wind power. If you are connected to the grid, you can generate enough electricity for yourself and others, and sell it back to the power company.

Have you seen the real world ROI and estimated time to break even on these kits?

jiveturkey · 08-17-2012, 10:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ghak99

Have you seen the real world ROI and estimated time to break even on these kits?

I have and it's not good.

Those ROI's don't include resale value but in suburbia it doesn't matter what you do to your house anyway. It's all based on what your neighbors houses sell for.

**Donger** · 08-17-2012, 10:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rain Man

I think braincase's point is that there are downstream costs that may not be attributed to fossil fuels, but which exist and are borne by society more than the industry. There may be for wind as well, but we don't know that yet.

Oh.

I suppose my sarcasm detector needs calibration. I actually thought "WTF is a sunmine?"

**Rain Man** · 08-17-2012, 10:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ghak99

Have you seen the real world ROI and estimated time to break even on these kits?

I bet my neighbors wouldn't like me doing this on my 3,600 sq. ft. lot, but one does wonder how it compares to solar. I have a great hunger to put solar panels on my house and am just trying to win my wife over on it. Our neighbor got solar panels and was told that it would be an eight-year breakeven, so I'm looking forward to hearing how his first year goes.

DJ's left nut · 08-17-2012, 10:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Braincase

You can buy kits to generate your own wind power. If you are connected to the grid, you can generate enough electricity for yourself and others, and sell it back to the power company.

The power company has no obligation to buy from you if you're not a consistent power source.

In order to be considered a consistent power source, you're probably going to be spending close to a million bucks to get a reliable, consistent enough generator put up and running.

You can find rural farmers all throughout central and southern Kansas that thought they were going to build a $50,000 windmill and make millions off it, only to get the bird.

Wind energy just doesn't work right now. Electric cars will continue to push battery technology forward and perhaps someday it will get to where it needs to be to make wind energy worthwhile.

But right now it just isn't.

**cdcox** · 08-17-2012, 10:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Donger

No, wind power (and other renewable sources) are just fine. They just happen to cost twice or more per kWh than does fossil-fuel generation.

Before we make this comparison let's do the following:

1. require all middle eastern armed conflicts to be paid for in real time by a gasoline tax

2. require all "excess" healthcare bills associated with bad air quality be paid for by a coal tax

3. establish the economic impact of other environmental impacts (including climate change) and pay for those by a tax on the appropriate fossil fuel.

08-17-2012, 09:22 AM
Rain Man NFL's #1 Ermines Fan Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: My house Casino cash: $2828491 VARSITY	A wind power stat that may surprise you. At least, it surprised me. The figure is a little misleading because it was apparently a short-term peak in the wee hours of the morning, but it's nonetheless quite impressive. I had no idea they were anywhere near that level, and I'm perhaps even more impressed that the annual average in Colorado (edit: from this provider, which is Colorado's largest) is 17 percent. http://money.cnn.com/2012/08/06/news...dex.htm?iid=EL Wind power hits 57% mark in Colorado By Steve Hargreaves @CNNMoney August 6, 2012: 5:18 AM ET NEW YORK (CNNMoney) -- During the early morning hours of April 15, with a steady breeze blowing down Colorado's Front Range, the state's biggest utility set a U.S. record -- nearly 57% of the electricity being generated was coming from wind power. As dawn came and the 1.4 million customers in Xcel Energy's service district began turning on the lights, toasters and other appliances, the utility's coal and natural gas-fired power plants ramped up production and brought wind's contribution back closer to its 2012 average of 17%. Utilities have long been wary of placing too much finicky renewable power on the grid. "A lot of utilities don't want to contract large amounts of wind because it's volatile," said Amy Grace, a wind analyst at Bloomberg New Energy Finance. "Anything over 25%, and utilities get nervous." Colorado's overnight high-water mark demonstrated that utilities can indeed incorporate cleaner power sources into the mix. It also provides hope that, under the right conditions and policies, wind will be able to provide a significantly larger share of the nation's power than its current 3% rate.
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08-17-2012, 10:25 AM	#21
bevischief .... Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Somewhere Kansas Casino cash: $8659352 VARSITY	They are all over West Texas, North and South Dakota, Nebraska, Iowa and Minnesota. They have a plant that makes them here in Fargo.
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