Do we want DeHop?

[ROYC75]

https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/nfl...9536dcd3&ei=21


Story by Andrew Gould




The Kansas City Chiefs won the Super Bowl without a star wide receiver, but they could reportedly make an elite offense even scarier by acquiring DeAndre Hopkins.

NFL insider Benjamin Albright told PHNX Cardinals that Kansas City is the "primary suitor" for Hopkins. He doesn't know the draft compensation the Cardinals would receive, but he said it's more likely they get a second-round pick than a first.

After the 2022 season, theScore's Jordan Schultz reported that the Cardinals plan to trade Hopkins this offseason.

Arizona hired a new general manager and head coach after a disappointing four-win season, and Hopkins is set to make $19.45 million (with a $30.75 million cap hit) in 2023. The Cardinals could seek a clean slate by moving the three-time All-Pro wideout, who turns 31 in June.

Hopkins began his Cardinals career by tallying 1,407 yards and six touchdowns in 2020. However, multiple lower body injuries limited him to 10 games in 2021, and he served a six-game suspension to start the 2022 season for violating the NFL's PED policy.

Yet he remains an impact player when on the field. Hopkins totaled 474 receiving yards in six full games with quarterback Kyler Murray last season.

Now imagine what he can accomplish when catching passes from Patrick Mahomes.

The Chiefs flourished without a star replacement for Tyreek Hill, but they could still benefit by solidifying the position this offseason. JuJu Smith-Schuster is a free agent after garnering 78 catches for 933 yards on a one-year deal. The depth chart features several talented question marks in Mecole Hardman, Kadarius Toney, and Marquez Valdes-Scantling.

Adding Hopkins could be great news for Kansas City, but terrible for all opposing defenses.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Do we want a high priced prima donna?

[T-post Tom]

Originally Posted by Chris Meck

Not necessarily the Chiefs.

[raybec 4]

Originally Posted by Megatron96

Okay, well in my opinion, it's a 'cheat code' when it happens every once in a while, say every three-four-five games, when it's necessary.

To me, It's a bit of a red flag when it's 5 out of the last 8 games, with a 3-game and 2-game streak, separated by less than a month. Particularly when it happens in the latter half of the season, when the offense is supposed to be in sync, vs. some of the worst defenses in the league. To me, that tells me that something is off.

Just to clarify....scoring more points and gaining more yards is only a good thing if certain position groups do it? I also take your meaning to be if it's not WRs scoring a ton of TDs that something is not functioning properly?

[Megatron96]

Originally Posted by Chris Meck

Something was off. Juju's knee looked like a grapefruit. Hardman missed a chunk of time.

Good lord, man, you have very significant selective memory.

You know, I've been pretty consistent about not making things personal, CM. I've made some arguments and brought facts/stats to bear on the subject, as opposed to just feelings. it' be great if we could keep things in the middle. just saying.

Anyway . . .


Well see, I'm getting some mixed signals about the JJSS/Hardman thing in this thread (not saying you're the originator of this; plenty of posters have been doing this).

On the one hand, they sucked and were completely irrelevant to the offense because "we were the number one offense!" On the other hand, they were significant contributors, and their respective injuries were the cause of the WR group's struggles. I'd like to know which is true someday.


Regardless, the WR room as a whole was pretty anemic over the last 8 weeks, regardless of who played, and not just in yards and TDs. 1st downs, RZ efficiency (except Hardman), etc. Over the entire season Skyy had 11 games where he caught 1 or fewer passes. Justin Watson, who started the season strong, basically disappeared in the second half of 2022.

Point being, it wasn't just JSS' knee.


Now, you may have a point about Hardman. Before injuries effectively ruined his season, he was on the way to possibly his best season, potentially earning more than 700 yds receiving and possibly as many as 12 TDs receiving/rushing, and maybe 35-40 1st downs. For a WR3 that's pretty respectable. But of course we'll never know now.

As it happened, he didn't eclipse 300 yards, and his contributions weren't consistent, though he was the highest scoring WR in 2022 with 6 total, rushing/receiving.

But that's yet another point; our highest scoring WR played in just 8 games, scored 4 receiving TDs total, meanwhile several other WRs (several of whom were supposedly better/more talented WRs) played the entire slate of 17 games and couldn't match Mecole's paltry 4 with twice as many games played? Kind of a red flag there as well.

[saphojunkie]

Originally Posted by BryanBusby

On the flipside, people were begging for Terrace Marshall Jr and were pissed when Veach took Bolton instead.

Given Veach's history I'm assuming that Marshall, Bateman, or Elijah Moore is going to be a Chief in the next two years.

[Megatron96]

Originally Posted by raybec 4

Just to clarify....scoring more points and gaining more yards is only a good thing if certain position groups do it? I also take your meaning to be if it's not WRs scoring a ton of TDs that something is not functioning properly?

Seriously? That's your take away?


Look, pretend it's not the Chiefs. Hell, pretend it's a college team. If I told you that the entire WR room for that team scored just 13 TDs in 17 games, while the top-10 teams' WR rooms scored an average of 22-25 TDs, but your team had the best OC and the best QB in the conference, would that raise an eyebrow?

How about if I told you that going back several years, few if any teams made the playoffs with a WR room that scored less than 18 TDs as a group?


Think about it. Objectively. you can go back and look at any playoff teams for the last dozen years; the tale of the tape is the same: what the Chiefs accomplished in 2022 was in spite of the WR room. Just how likely do you think it is that that can be replicated consistently?

I mean, I really don't get why this is so hard to understand. The WR room struggled last season, and we kind of got lucky in that Travis had a career type season, Mecole scored some timely TDs in the middle part of the season that may have saved a game or two, and McKinnon stepped up when JJSS stepped down.

The fastest, most athletic, and most able pass catchers/scorers (as a unit, let's not quibble about individual players) on the team struggled as a whole for more than two months at the end of the season, when they should've been at their best

That culminated in the Chiefs WRs totaling just 81 yards in the Super Bowl.


I won't go into how they did in the playoffs as a whole, but it wasn't great.




Well, maybe I do get why it's so hard for some of you. "We're the number one offense!" and "We have the number one scoring offense!" That's the issue, isn't it?

Funny how we can understand just how silly season total stats/monikers are when KC is playing "the number one scoring defense!" but when some talking heads staple "KC has the number one scoring offense" to the Chiefs, it suddenly becomes the most important stat in the world.


But I get it, I guess. it's fun to throw that stuff around.

[Chris Meck]

Originally Posted by Megatron96

You know, I've been pretty consistent about not making things personal, CM. I've made some arguments and brought facts/stats to bear on the subject, as opposed to just feelings. it' be great if we could keep things in the middle. just saying.

Anyway . . .


Well see, I'm getting some mixed signals about the JJSS/Hardman thing in this thread (not saying you're the originator of this; plenty of posters have been doing this).

On the one hand, they sucked and were completely irrelevant to the offense because "we were the number one offense!" On the other hand, they were significant contributors, and their respective injuries were the cause of the WR group's struggles. I'd like to know which is true someday.


Regardless, the WR room as a whole was pretty anemic over the last 8 weeks, regardless of who played, and not just in yards and TDs. 1st downs, RZ efficiency (except Hardman), etc. Over the entire season Skyy had 11 games where he caught 1 or fewer passes. Justin Watson, who started the season strong, basically disappeared in the second half of 2022.

Point being, it wasn't just JSS' knee.


Now, you may have a point about Hardman. Before injuries effectively ruined his season, he was on the way to possibly his best season, potentially earning more than 700 yds receiving and possibly as many as 12 TDs receiving/rushing, and maybe 35-40 1st downs. For a WR3 that's pretty respectable. But of course we'll never know now.

As it happened, he didn't eclipse 300 yards, and his contributions weren't consistent, though he was the highest scoring WR in 2022 with 6 total, rushing/receiving.

But that's yet another point; our highest scoring WR played in just 8 games, scored 4 receiving TDs total, meanwhile several other WRs (several of whom were supposedly better/more talented WRs) played the entire slate of 17 games and couldn't match Mecole's paltry 4 with twice as many games played? Kind of a red flag there as well.

I just said you have a selective memory. By CP standards, that's extremely polite. 😁

[saphojunkie]

Originally Posted by Megatron96

Seriously? That's your take away?


Look, pretend it's not the Chiefs. Hell, pretend it's a college team. If I told you that the entire WR room for that team scored just 13 TDs in 17 games, while the top-10 teams' WR rooms scored an average of 22-25 TDs, but your team had the best OC and the best QB in the conference, would that raise an eyebrow?

How about if I told you that going back several years, few if any teams made the playoffs with a WR room that scored less than 18 TDs as a group?


Think about it. Objectively. you can go back and look at any playoff teams for the last dozen years; the tale of the tape is the same: what the Chiefs accomplished in 2022 was in spite of the WR room. Just how likely do you think it is that that can be replicated consistently?

I mean, I really don't get why this is so hard to understand. The WR room struggled last season, and we kind of got lucky in that Travis had a career type season, Mecole scored some timely TDs in the middle part of the season that may have saved a game or two, and McKinnon stepped up when JJSS stepped down.

The fastest, most athletic, and most able pass catchers/scorers (as a unit, let's not quibble about individual players) on the team struggled as a whole for more than two months at the end of the season, when they should've been at their best

That culminated in the Chiefs WRs totaling just 81 yards in the Super Bowl.


I won't go into how they did in the playoffs as a whole, but it wasn't great.




Well, maybe I do get why it's so hard for some of you. "We're the number one offense!" and "We have the number one scoring offense!" That's the issue, isn't it?

Funny how we can understand just how silly season total stats/monikers are when KC is playing "the number one scoring defense!" but when some talking heads staple "KC has the number one scoring offense" to the Chiefs, it suddenly becomes the most important stat in the world.


But I get it, I guess. it's fun to throw that stuff around.

we got lucky that a generational talent played the exact way he's been playing for ten years? Or do you mean we are lucky that last season was indicative of his entire career? If you mean the latter, you're right. We are lucky to have found Kelce. If you mean the former, you're wrong. Consistent, reliable production isn't luck.

[Chris Meck]

Anyway, we know that Juju and Hardman were playing hurt. I'd think it's reasonable to draw the conclusion that hurt their effectiveness somewhat. I don't think either suck really, but both have significant issues that keep them from being great. Hardman appears to be mentally not there, Juju has limited athleticism at this point, likely due to a long injury history. Both contributed, both were let go without fuss, and I expect no drop-off as a floor from this year's group.

[Megatron96]

Originally Posted by saphojunkie

we got lucky that a generational talent played the exact way he's been playing for ten years? Or do you mean we are lucky that last season was indicative of his entire career? If you mean the latter, you're right. We are lucky to have found Kelce. If you mean the former, you're wrong. Consistent, reliable production isn't luck.

Sigh.

No. We got "lucky" with the synchronicity of Kelce/Hardman/McKinnon all happening at the right time(s) in 2022.

Similar to the synchronicity of Skyy having that great return in the AFCCG, after all those drops earlier in the season, combined with MVS stepping up in a big way in that game, etc.

I'm speaking of the timeliness of several players spontaneously having big games/plays at just the right time. It doesn't happen like that all that often, so there's obviously some "luck" involved when it does.

[BWillie]

Originally Posted by Megatron96

Sigh.

No. We got "lucky" with the synchronicity of Kelce/Hardman/McKinnon all happening at the right time(s) in 2022.

Similar to the synchronicity of Skyy having that great return in the AFCCG, after all those drops earlier in the season, combined with MVS stepping up in a big way in that game, etc.

I'm speaking of the timeliness of several players spontaneously having big games/plays at just the right time. It doesn't happen like that all that often, so there's obviously some "luck" involved when it does.

This post is absolutely right...and as such it will piss some people off.

[O.city]

Of course there's luck.

You guys are shooting yourself in the foot with the "luck involved" talk though you may not realize it.

If there's so much luck involved, you want to give yourself as many chances as you can so that the luck bounces your way inevitably at some point. It's why pressing the accelerator down and going all in doesn't usually work out.

Because we're talking about the bounces of an oblong ball and an imperfect game.

[staylor26]

The season can't get here soon enough. The takes are only getting more reeruned.

[Bowser]

Originally Posted by T-post Tom

Not necessarily the Chiefs.

I'll call it - he'll be a Buffalo Bill

[O.city]

The Chiefs view Toney as the next big #1 WR. They'll have him under contract for a couple more cheap years if that hits, so that's the route they're going.

Like it or not, it is what it is. It's a risk for sure, but with this current regime....shit I don't now how you can't give them the benefit of the doubt.

[Bowser]

Originally Posted by O.city

The Chiefs view Toney as the next big #1 WR. They'll have him under contract for a couple more cheap years if that hits, so that's the route they're going.

Like it or not, it is what it is. It's a risk for sure, but with this current regime....shit I don't now how you can't give them the benefit of the doubt.

Agreed.

I just really hope they've hooked him up with the best trainers and flexibility coaches they can find. His history of not staying healthy is concerning, to put it lightly.