Chiefs Whitlock: Why should the Chiefs bring Haley back? - Page 29

**Tribal Warfare** · 12-20-2009, 11:17 PM

Why should the Chiefs bring Haley back?
By JASON WHITLOCK
The Kansas City Star

I’m not arguing that Todd Haley should be fired. I’m wondering what’s the justification for bringing him back.

Loyalty? Fairness?

You throw them overboard with the waiting list for season-ticket holders. Anyone arguing the Chiefs have made progress this season hasn’t heard about what happened inside Arrowhead Stadium on Sunday when the Cleveland Browns visited.

On a day when Cleveland quarterback Brady Quinn threw for 66 yards and two interceptions, the Browns rumbled for 351 yards on the ground and surpassed the 40-point barrier in a 41-34 victory over Haley’s Chiefs.

Keep in mind, the Browns are in the process of wooing Mike Holmgren to take over their organization and can embattled head coach Eric “Dead Man Coaching” Mangini. The Browns are bad. The Chiefs are worse.

It took a total team effort to give Cleveland a road victory.

“When you allow two returns for touchdowns, that’s generally not going to end up being a good thing,” Haley said, scolding the special-teams unit that allowed Josh Cribbs to find the end zone twice on kickoff returns.

“When you drop nine balls, and we had 39 to 40 by the NFL’s count going into this game — 50-plus by my count — it’s going to be very difficult,” Haley said, scolding his receivers for their inability to catch.

“When you allow a team to run the football the way they were able to run the football, you’re not going to have much of a chance to win,” Haley said, scolding a defensive unit that has surrendered 800-plus rushing yards in its last three games at Arrowhead Stadium.

That’s all three units, folks. Special teams. Offense. And defense.

It’s Christmas, and all three phases of Haley’s team are in disarray.

We’ve spent so much time focusing on the shortcomings within Kansas City’s roster, we’ve failed to mention that it’s likely Haley will overhaul his entire coaching staff, too.

You think Clancy Pendergast is coming back as defensive coordinator after some kid named Jerome Harrison gained 286 yards and finished 10 yards shy of the NFL’s all-time rushing record? We know Haley is a hothead. He booted his most qualified assistant (Chan Gailey) before the season. He’s already demoted a receivers coach. He benches receivers when his mood dictates.

Come on, you know Haley’s instincts will tell him to fire everyone except his wingman, Maurice Carthon. Haley can argue that he got this head-coaching position so late last offseason that he was unable to lure top-flight assistants.

Will top assistants want to come work for Haley this offseason? Let’s don’t even deal with the damage Haley has done to his reputation with his wild-man coaching routine and his handling of Gailey. Why would a top assistant come to KC when Haley is going to enter next season on the hot seat?

You know who would come? A coach with ties to Scott Pioli; a coach who thinks he could be the interim head coach if Haley gets fired six weeks into the season. Charlie Weis. Romeo Crennel.

Yes, more of the Patriots Way. A continuation of the flawed philosophy that you can export a winning culture from one city to another. Winning produces its own unique culture wherever it lands.

Let me get back on topic. I’m not saying Todd Haley should be fired. I’m wondering what’s the justification for bringing him back.

Mike Shanahan appears to be headed to Washington. Mike Holmgren apparently is going to take over Cleveland’s front office. Bill Cowher might rejoin the coaching ranks. The Chiefs are going to stand pat with Haley?

What has he shown us that gives us confidence he’ll hire a competent coaching staff? And if the Chiefs are going to be starting over with a new assistant-coaching staff, why not just start all the way over with a new head coach?

I did not say fire Todd Haley. I’m searching for reasons to bring him back. Right now, loyalty and fairness come to mind.

Scott Pioli stuck Haley with a craptastic roster. The stupidity of playing all season with special-team players masquerading as starting linebackers and safeties has caught up with the Chiefs the last month. And so has playing musical waiver wire at receiver.

Haley’s defenders can argue quite persuasively that he hasn’t been given a fair shot. Haley’s critics could argue that Haley has made a bad situation worse.

I’m not arguing anything. And I’m cool with Haley coming back ... as long as he realizes he has to make a boatload of fundamental changes to his coaching approach.

beach tribe · 12-22-2009, 07:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaneMcCloud

He did just that

God you are so unbelievably dense.

beach tribe · 12-22-2009, 07:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BossChief

. I lobbied for both Decosta and Polian and was shown the truth through conversation that neither even contemplated leaving either team.

Anybody with a brain knows these guys weren't leaving their organizations for the Chiefs. Especially Polian.

Unfortunately Dane is too ****ing arrogant, and hard headed to look in any other direction through his "**** all but mine" binoculars.

Chiefnj2 · 12-22-2009, 08:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BossChief

Decosta wasnt leaving Baltimore. Period. Might as well not even bring him up.

Chris Polian was gonna succeed his dad and everyone knew it. No way he was gonna up and leave that organization. NO CHANCE. Same as Decosta.

Tom Dimtroff was in charge of all those "drafts" that you hate and have labeled failures for NE. Why clamour for him anyway, he went the year before.

Pioli was the executive of the decade and if we passed on him, you know as well as I do that Clark would be burned at the stake, by now, for not signing him.

Its NOT Piolis draft record. Stop saying that, its not true. I dont like the guy, but be fair man...those drafts were Tom Dimitroffs. right or wrong?

You are right, he wasnt the GM for NE, he was director of player personel..meaning he was in charge of trades and free agent signings..you know, the part of the machine in NE that made the ship sail so well. The part that allowed them to stay competitive over the course of a entire decade and compete for the majority of the championships of that time span.

He wanted Clancy to be a position coach, which would be good for us IMHO. He was the defacto DC after no better alternative was available that fit perameters.

Keeping Krummrie was a GOOD decision IMHO, letting Gibbs go wasnt. I will eternally wonder why people hate TK so badly, I think he is a very good position coach. Who has he failed to develop? He has done a fine job with about every player sent his way. I would have prefered to keep Gibbs at all costs, but if he wasnt allowed to interview with Houston and we chose a DC that wanted his own staff, it would leave us in a rough spot as far as league rep goes with how we handle our coaches. Believe me, there is a reason that Gun was allowed to leave but Krummrie was retained and we tried to keep Gibbs.

I HATED cutting Pollard, but also realize he has reacted poorly to hard coaching in the past for Purdue and was suspended in college for blow ups at coaches, you simply cant have that in the NFL...should he have been cut and not just suspended as Brandon Marshall was? NO, but something needed done and we openly tried to trade him before cutting him. I will always look back at that as a monumental mistake by us that set us back another step on our journey.

I also have no response for the firing of Gailey, but I also am not privy to info that was included in the decision.

I seriously cant fault Clark at this point for going out and getting one of the better GMs available.

For the most part, an excellent post. But I'm not sure why you are arguing facts with a knee jerk reactionary crowd.

beach tribe · 12-22-2009, 09:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chiefnj2

For the most part, an excellent post. But I'm not sure why you are arguing facts with a knee jerk reactionary crowd.

Agreed

Brock · 12-22-2009, 09:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Taco John

Pioli - or any GM - would be a moron to fire a new coach after one single year. But especially the Chiefs. Between Carl Peterson and Herm Edwards, your franchise was a walking corpse. That isn't going to be fixed in one season. What Haley brought back to KC was someone on the sidelines who channelled the frustration that Chiefs fans have been feeling for at least a decade onto the field. He has been great for you guys in that respect. He cusses, he cries, he cusses some more.

Well, Holmgren is going to fire Mangini. And I don't think Holmgren is a moron. If you think what this team needed is somebody to cuss, cry, and cuss some more, I have news for you. They needed and still need, somebody who can coach players up and make good sideline decisions. I've not seen anything like that from Haley.

Reerun_KC · 12-22-2009, 09:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brock

Well, Holmgren is going to fire Mangini. And I don't think Holmgren is a moron. If you think what this team needed is somebody to cuss, cry, and cuss some more, I have news for you. They needed and still need, somebody who can coach players up and make good sideline decisions. I've not seen anything like that from Haley.

While I agree with Taco John to a certian point. Haley is channeling our frustration to the players, just we all do to the TV on sunday...

Also your bolded part? We have seen this in 4 years. People are acting like this is something new to the Chiefs...

We have be deprived of talent evaluation for years, coaching the day Herm was hired...

**DeezNutz** · 12-22-2009, 10:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reerun_KC

While I agree with Taco John to a certian point. Haley is channeling our frustration to the players, just we all do to the TV on sunday...

Also your bolded part? We have seen this in 4 years. People are acting like this is something new to the Chiefs...

We have be deprived of talent evaluation for years, coaching the day Herm was hired...

Just because we've been failing for years doesn't mean that we should be content to continue to roll with the status quo.

Brock · 12-22-2009, 10:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reerun_KC

Also your bolded part? We have seen this in 4 years. People are acting like this is something new to the Chiefs...

We have be deprived of talent evaluation for years, coaching the day Herm was hired...

So what? Let's just keep doing it?

beach tribe · 12-22-2009, 10:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brock

Well, Holmgren is going to fire Mangini. And I don't think Holmgren is a moron. If you think what this team needed is somebody to cuss, cry, and cuss some more, I have news for you. They needed and still need, somebody who can coach players up and make good sideline decisions. I've not seen anything like that from Haley.

Yeah, but Holmgren didn't pick Mangini, and probably doesn't share any of his philosophies.
Apples to oranges.

Reerun_KC · 12-22-2009, 10:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brock

So what? Let's just keep doing it?

Like I have a say so in the matter.... I seriously doubt Clark or Scott give a flying **** about what Reerun_KC says....

'Hamas' Jenkins · 12-22-2009, 10:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Taco John

Pioli - or any GM - would be a moron to fire a new coach after one single year. But especially the Chiefs. Between Carl Peterson and Herm Edwards, your franchise was a walking corpse. That isn't going to be fixed in one season. What Haley brought back to KC was someone on the sidelines who channelled the frustration that Chiefs fans have been feeling for at least a decade onto the field. He has been great for you guys in that respect. He cusses, he cries, he cusses some more.

He should be given at least as much time to install his program as Herm was given. He's not perfect, to be sure. Hell, who knows if he's even any good? But whatever he is, it isn't Herm Edwards. And Pioli isn't Carl Peterson.

The disease that Carl installed into your franchise isn't going to go away overnight. To even ask the question about bringing Haley back shows a weakness of intellect to me. How can Whitlock not understand all the reasons why Haley should be given the opportunity to install his program?

JFC.

The reasons listed to keep Haley--

1) Herm got three years
2) He's a raving lunatic on the sidelines
3) He's not Herm

Of course you want us to keep Haley, when we last played you ran a fake punt on 4th and 8 from his own ****ing 28 with our backup quarterback in a one score game.

Brock · 12-22-2009, 10:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by beach tribe

Yeah, but Holmgren didn't pick Mangini, and probably doesn't share any of his philosophies.
Apples to oranges.

Read the post I was replying to.

Brock · 12-22-2009, 10:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reerun_KC

Like I have a say so in the matter.... I seriously doubt Clark or Scott give a flying **** about what Reerun_KC says....

Advance the topic or grab a broom.

Reerun_KC · 12-22-2009, 10:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 'Hamas' Jenkins

JFC.

The reasons listed to keep Haley--

1) Herm got three years
2) He's a raving lunatic on the sidelines
3) He's not Herm

Of course you want us to keep Haley, when we last played you ran a fake punt on 4th and 8 from his own ****ing 28 with our backup quarterback in a one score game.

So is it fair to say that the Chiefs and not the Broncos had the "best offseason eva"?

Reerun_KC · 12-22-2009, 10:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brock

Advance the topic or grab a broom.

R u stalking me? I just got done sweeping the whole house.... Creep...

guess I need to throw more speculation out there? I have zero facts from Clark or Pioli or Haley to add to this matter... Otherwise I would just be spewing crap from my mouth about a subject that I have zero evidence to back it up....

I wasnt one of the chosen ones on here to get the inside scoop on from Hunt or Pioli...

12-20-2009, 11:17 PM
Tribal Warfare Man of Culture Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Far Beyond Comprehension Casino cash: $-2997187	Whitlock: Why should the Chiefs bring Haley back? Why should the Chiefs bring Haley back? By JASON WHITLOCK The Kansas City Star I’m not arguing that Todd Haley should be fired. I’m wondering what’s the justification for bringing him back. Loyalty? Fairness? You throw them overboard with the waiting list for season-ticket holders. Anyone arguing the Chiefs have made progress this season hasn’t heard about what happened inside Arrowhead Stadium on Sunday when the Cleveland Browns visited. On a day when Cleveland quarterback Brady Quinn threw for 66 yards and two interceptions, the Browns rumbled for 351 yards on the ground and surpassed the 40-point barrier in a 41-34 victory over Haley’s Chiefs. Keep in mind, the Browns are in the process of wooing Mike Holmgren to take over their organization and can embattled head coach Eric “Dead Man Coaching” Mangini. The Browns are bad. The Chiefs are worse. It took a total team effort to give Cleveland a road victory. “When you allow two returns for touchdowns, that’s generally not going to end up being a good thing,” Haley said, scolding the special-teams unit that allowed Josh Cribbs to find the end zone twice on kickoff returns. “When you drop nine balls, and we had 39 to 40 by the NFL’s count going into this game — 50-plus by my count — it’s going to be very difficult,” Haley said, scolding his receivers for their inability to catch. “When you allow a team to run the football the way they were able to run the football, you’re not going to have much of a chance to win,” Haley said, scolding a defensive unit that has surrendered 800-plus rushing yards in its last three games at Arrowhead Stadium. That’s all three units, folks. Special teams. Offense. And defense. It’s Christmas, and all three phases of Haley’s team are in disarray. We’ve spent so much time focusing on the shortcomings within Kansas City’s roster, we’ve failed to mention that it’s likely Haley will overhaul his entire coaching staff, too. You think Clancy Pendergast is coming back as defensive coordinator after some kid named Jerome Harrison gained 286 yards and finished 10 yards shy of the NFL’s all-time rushing record? We know Haley is a hothead. He booted his most qualified assistant (Chan Gailey) before the season. He’s already demoted a receivers coach. He benches receivers when his mood dictates. Come on, you know Haley’s instincts will tell him to fire everyone except his wingman, Maurice Carthon. Haley can argue that he got this head-coaching position so late last offseason that he was unable to lure top-flight assistants. Will top assistants want to come work for Haley this offseason? Let’s don’t even deal with the damage Haley has done to his reputation with his wild-man coaching routine and his handling of Gailey. Why would a top assistant come to KC when Haley is going to enter next season on the hot seat? You know who would come? A coach with ties to Scott Pioli; a coach who thinks he could be the interim head coach if Haley gets fired six weeks into the season. Charlie Weis. Romeo Crennel. Yes, more of the Patriots Way. A continuation of the flawed philosophy that you can export a winning culture from one city to another. Winning produces its own unique culture wherever it lands. Let me get back on topic. I’m not saying Todd Haley should be fired. I’m wondering what’s the justification for bringing him back. Mike Shanahan appears to be headed to Washington. Mike Holmgren apparently is going to take over Cleveland’s front office. Bill Cowher might rejoin the coaching ranks. The Chiefs are going to stand pat with Haley? What has he shown us that gives us confidence he’ll hire a competent coaching staff? And if the Chiefs are going to be starting over with a new assistant-coaching staff, why not just start all the way over with a new head coach? I did not say fire Todd Haley. I’m searching for reasons to bring him back. Right now, loyalty and fairness come to mind. Scott Pioli stuck Haley with a craptastic roster. The stupidity of playing all season with special-team players masquerading as starting linebackers and safeties has caught up with the Chiefs the last month. And so has playing musical waiver wire at receiver. Haley’s defenders can argue quite persuasively that he hasn’t been given a fair shot. Haley’s critics could argue that Haley has made a bad situation worse. I’m not arguing anything. And I’m cool with Haley coming back ... as long as he realizes he has to make a boatload of fundamental changes to his coaching approach.
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