Chiefs At the Quarter Mark: Better or Worse? - Page 3

**OnTheWarpath15** · 05:47 PM

After the Haley hire, you couldn't throw a stick through this place without hitting someone that made the following comment:

"We'll be a better team based on coaching alone," or, "we'll win X amount of games due to coaching alone."

Yes, it's only been 4 games, and this is NOT a call for Haley's head - but is deserved criticism of the way he's prepared this team over the first 4 games of the regular season.

Also, IN NO WAY is the following an endorsement of Herman Edwards. What it is, however, is a giant red flag - this team - of which 60% has been handpicked by Pioli and Haley - is actually worse in almost all statistical categories when compared to the 2008 team after 4 games - which many here claimed were the darkest days of last season. We'll call it, B.S. - or, Before Spread.

Offensively (bolded number is 2009 totals):

1st downs: (63) (62)

3rd down conversions: (25/62 - 40%) (9/51 - 18%)

Total yards: (1145) (986)

Rushing yards: (554) (406)

Passing yards: (591) (580)

Sacks Allowed: (12) (13)

Penalties/Yardage: (10/109) 29/230

Scoring: (16.25 PPG) (16 PPG)

Not a single category in which we've improved over 2008, which happened to include going through 3 QB's - playing the 3rd stringer in 2 of the 4.

Defensively:

1st downs allowed: (74) (85)

3rd down conversions against: (25/54 - 46%) (25/58 - 43%)

Total yards allowed: (1517) (1516)

Rushing yards allowed: (706) (514)

Passing yards allowed: (811) (1002)

Sacks: (3) (5)

Points allowed: (24.25 PPG) (28 PPG)

Turnover margin: (+2) (Even)

Yea! 2 more sacks! And nice to see the 192 yard improvement from the rush defense, only to see 191 of it be given back up by the pass defense.

The 2008 team was apparently so bad that management felt the need to purge 30 players, yet is playing worse with a roster that is 60% their handpicked players?

What message are you trying to send, Todd? It seems like it changes on a weekly ****ing basis.

As someone who predicted a 3 win season, the losses aren't surprising me.

The way we are losing, after hearing the phrase, "we're going to be a big, strong, fast, smart, tough, disciplined football team" IS surprising me.

There is no improvement over the "Dark Ages" of last season in ANY of those areas. And there's no excuse for it, especially the lack of discipline. Make 'em run some more, Todd - it seems to be working...

Enough excuses - enough with the "messages" - enough petty bullshit sitting players - time to see some ****ing improvement. Not necessarily wins.

IMPROVEMENT.

raybec 4 · 10-05-2009, 02:47 PM

9 of 51 on third down is ****ing horrible. how in the blue **** can you call yourself an offensive coach when you can't fall ass first into 25% of your third down conversions.

**DaneMcCloud** · 10-05-2009, 02:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Buehler445

Good analysis OTW. Third Down futility had a lot to with replacing Gonzo with shit on a ****ing shingle.

I was telling someone yesterday, that I had no idea why Pioli and Haley didn't go get some different starters.
Posted via Mobile Device

This entire first quarter of the season is sickening.

I sat here and watched dozens of forum members suck off Pioli and Haley, all the while pointing fingers at Josh McDaniels and the Denver Broncos.

Denver is 4-0, has seven new starters on defense and has given up a league low of 6.5 points per game on defense.

The Chiefs are 0-4, look like a freakin' disaster both offensively and defensively. Their defense has given up 28 points per game and is ranked 30th, just ahead of Cleveland and Detroit.

I don't know what the **** is going on at One Arrowhead Drive but if I'm Clark Hunt, I'm there first thing this morning demanding some answers.

Of course, I'm not Clark Hunt. He's in Dallas, counting his money.

raybec 4 · 10-05-2009, 02:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaneMcCloud

This entire first quarter of the season is sickening.

I sat here and watched dozens of forum members suck off Pioli and Haley, all the while pointing fingers at Josh McDaniels and the Denver Broncos.

Denver is 4-0, has seven new starters on defense and has given up a league low of 6.5 points per game on defense.

The Chiefs are 0-4, look like a freakin' disaster both offensively and defensively. Their defense has given up 28 points per game and is ranked 30th, just ahead of Cleveland and Detroit.

I don't know what the **** is going on at One Arrowhead Drive but if I'm Clark Hunt, I'm there first thing this morning demanding some answers.

Of course, I'm not Clark Hunt. He's in Dallas, counting his money.

And ****ing Mexican soccer players

**DaneMcCloud** · 10-05-2009, 02:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OnTheWarpath58

IMPROVEMENT.

Most excellent post, Dude.

MOST excellent.

**DaneMcCloud** · 10-05-2009, 02:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by raybec 4

And ****ing Mexican soccer players

He's gay?

NTTATWWT

Just Passin' By · 10-05-2009, 03:07 PM

Last season:
Patriots lost Brady in the first game and had Cassel come in cold. That was followed by the Raiders, Falcons and Broncos.

This season:
Chiefs started their season against the Ravens. That was followed by the Raiders, Eagles and Giants.

In other words, the schedule broke much easier last season than it has so far this season. The Chiefs don't have Gonzalez and Bowe's been hurt. Despite that, the scoring is just about the same, at 65 points last season to 64 this season. The defense had surrendered 97 points through 4 games last season, and has surrendered 112 through 4 games this season. Unless people expect the Chiefs to be shut out by the Cowboys this week, this season's offense will surpass last season's offense in points scored, and everyone knew that the defense would have problems due to the switch from the 4-3 to the 3-4, the tougher schedule, and the lack of talent.

Also, for all the complaining people did about the team daring to lose against the Raiders, it lost to Oakland in K.C. last season, too.

TEX · 10-05-2009, 03:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaneMcCloud

This entire first quarter of the season is sickening.

I sat here and watched dozens of forum members suck off Pioli and Haley, all the while pointing fingers at Josh McDaniels and the Denver Broncos.

Denver is 4-0, has seven new starters on defense and has given up a league low of 6.5 points per game on defense.

The Chiefs are 0-4, look like a freakin' disaster both offensively and defensively. Their defense has given up 28 points per game and is ranked 30th, just ahead of Cleveland and Detroit.

I don't know what the **** is going on at One Arrowhead Drive but if I'm Clark Hunt, I'm there first thing this morning demanding some answers.

Of course, I'm not Clark Hunt. He's in Dallas, counting his money.

This.

TEX · 10-05-2009, 03:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GoChiefs

Exactly. That is a huge difference.

You were in Herm's camp. Nothing you say counts.

Fish · 10-05-2009, 03:10 PM

Helluva thread OTWP. Pretty telling stats there..

L.A. Chieffan · 10-05-2009, 03:11 PM

Get over it

Chiefnj2 · 10-05-2009, 03:12 PM

The Lions have a better 3rd down defense and more sacks than KC. Gunther laughs.

L.A. Chieffan · 10-05-2009, 03:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chiefnj2

The Lions have a better 3rd down defense and more sacks than KC. Gunther laughs.

If matrix were here, he would laugh too

ToxSocks · 10-05-2009, 03:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr_Tomahawk

It would be interesting to see these numbers during Haley's 3rd year when he has been at the helm.

All these numbers tell me is that Haley has put up near identical numbers with an overhauled team in his first year compared to Herms team which had been 3 years in the making...

QFT

Lets also not forget the strength of schedule this year vs last year. And you also have to take into consideration that Herm was on the DECLINE with his team. They were getting progressivly worse each year. I wonder how Herm's team would look out there this season.

**Buehler445** · 10-05-2009, 03:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaneMcCloud

This entire first quarter of the season is sickening.

I sat here and watched dozens of forum members suck off Pioli and Haley, all the while pointing fingers at Josh McDaniels and the Denver Broncos.

Denver is 4-0, has seven new starters on defense and has given up a league low of 6.5 points per game on defense.

The Chiefs are 0-4, look like a freakin' disaster both offensively and defensively. Their defense has given up 28 points per game and is ranked 30th, just ahead of Cleveland and Detroit.

I don't know what the **** is going on at One Arrowhead Drive but if I'm Clark Hunt, I'm there first thing this morning demanding some answers.

Of course, I'm not Clark Hunt. He's in Dallas, counting his money.

I had a minor meltdown, check that, I MELTED THE **** DOWN last night when I heard the Donko ****s beat the Cowgirls. IIRC, I was talking to Reerun, but seriously. Their defense was on par with ours last year, they spend much fewer picks than we do, and they're the 4th best Defense currently? ****ing how? Do they even have a nose tackle? WTF?

The only thing I can think of is that Dumerville provides enough of a passrush to mask some of their holes (I recognize they played Cleveland, which helps them out).

Offensively, I thought they would be average. A good OL and WR corps with a non-reeruned QB will get you average.

I'm surprised as hell about their D though. I just don't ****ing get it.
Posted via Mobile Device

**dirk digler** · 10-05-2009, 03:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Just Passin' By

Last season:
Patriots lost Brady in the first game and had Cassel come in cold. That was followed by the Raiders, Falcons and Broncos.

This season:
Chiefs started their season against the Ravens. That was followed by the Raiders, Eagles and Giants.

In other words, the schedule broke much easier last season than it has so far this season. The Chiefs don't have Gonzalez and Bowe's been hurt. Despite that, the scoring is just about the same, at 65 points last season to 64 this season. The defense had surrendered 97 points through 4 games last season, and has surrendered 112 through 4 games this season. Unless people expect the Chiefs to be shut out by the Cowboys this week, this season's offense will surpass last season's offense in points scored, and everyone knew that the defense would have problems due to the switch from the 4-3 to the 3-4, the tougher schedule, and the lack of talent.

Also, for all the complaining people did about the team daring to lose against the Raiders, it lost to Oakland in K.C. last season, too.

Yep.

I have come to the conclusion though by listening to Haley's comments yesterday and observing Pioli and Clark Hunt chatting it up and laughing and joking yesterday for about 30 minutes that there is little or no pressure to win this season. Haley's comments reinforce that when it says they are still evaluating players that this year is more like extended pre-season.

10-05-2009, 01:50 PM
OnTheWarpath15 MVP Join Date: Sep 2005 Casino cash: $2021115	At the Quarter Mark: Better or Worse? After the Haley hire, you couldn't throw a stick through this place without hitting someone that made the following comment: "We'll be a better team based on coaching alone," or, "we'll win X amount of games due to coaching alone." Yes, it's only been 4 games, and this is NOT a call for Haley's head - but is deserved criticism of the way he's prepared this team over the first 4 games of the regular season. Also, IN NO WAY is the following an endorsement of Herman Edwards. What it is, however, is a giant red flag - this team - of which 60% has been handpicked by Pioli and Haley - is actually worse in almost all statistical categories when compared to the 2008 team after 4 games - which many here claimed were the darkest days of last season. We'll call it, B.S. - or, Before Spread. Offensively (bolded number is 2009 totals): 1st downs: (63) (62) 3rd down conversions: (25/62 - 40%) (9/51 - 18%) Total yards: (1145) (986) Rushing yards: (554) (406) Passing yards: (591) (580) Sacks Allowed: (12) (13) Penalties/Yardage: (10/109) 29/230 Scoring: (16.25 PPG) (16 PPG) Not a single category in which we've improved over 2008, which happened to include going through 3 QB's - playing the 3rd stringer in 2 of the 4. Defensively: 1st downs allowed: (74) (85) 3rd down conversions against: (25/54 - 46%) (25/58 - 43%) Total yards allowed: (1517) (1516) Rushing yards allowed: (706) (514) Passing yards allowed: (811) (1002) Sacks: (3) (5) Points allowed: (24.25 PPG) (28 PPG) Turnover margin: (+2) (Even) Yea! 2 more sacks! And nice to see the 192 yard improvement from the rush defense, only to see 191 of it be given back up by the pass defense. The 2008 team was apparently so bad that management felt the need to purge 30 players, yet is playing worse with a roster that is 60% their handpicked players? What message are you trying to send, Todd? It seems like it changes on a weekly **ing basis. As someone who predicted a 3 win season, the losses aren't surprising me. The way we are losing, after hearing the phrase, "we're going to be a big, strong, fast, smart, tough, disciplined football team" IS surprising me. There is no improvement over the "Dark Ages" of last season in ANY of those areas. And there's no excuse for it, especially the lack of discipline. Make 'em run some more, Todd - it seems to be working... Enough excuses - enough with the "messages" - enough petty bullshit sitting players - time to see some *ing improvement. Not necessarily wins. IMPROVEMENT. Last edited by OnTheWarpath15; 10-05-2009 at 05:47 PM..*
Posts: 60,758

10-05-2009, 02:47 PM	#31
raybec 4 MVP Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: East Jabip Casino cash: $4593807	9 of 51 on third down is **ing horrible. how in the blue ** can you call yourself an offensive coach when you can't fall ass first into 25% of your third down conversions.
Posts: 11,058

10-05-2009, 03:07 PM	#36
Just Passin' By In Search of a Life Join Date: Feb 2009 Casino cash: $5450524	Last season: Patriots lost Brady in the first game and had Cassel come in cold. That was followed by the Raiders, Falcons and Broncos. This season: Chiefs started their season against the Ravens. That was followed by the Raiders, Eagles and Giants. In other words, the schedule broke much easier last season than it has so far this season. The Chiefs don't have Gonzalez and Bowe's been hurt. Despite that, the scoring is just about the same, at 65 points last season to 64 this season. The defense had surrendered 97 points through 4 games last season, and has surrendered 112 through 4 games this season. Unless people expect the Chiefs to be shut out by the Cowboys this week, this season's offense will surpass last season's offense in points scored, and everyone knew that the defense would have problems due to the switch from the 4-3 to the 3-4, the tougher schedule, and the lack of talent. Also, for all the complaining people did about the team daring to lose against the Raiders, it lost to Oakland in K.C. last season, too.
Posts: 69,748

10-05-2009, 03:10 PM	#39
Fish Ain't no relax! Join Date: Sep 2005 Casino cash: $-1511081	Helluva thread OTWP. Pretty telling stats there.. __________________
Posts: 48,904

10-05-2009, 03:11 PM	#40
L.A. Chieffan PLAY GOOD FOOTBALL Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: American Gardens Building Casino cash: $2688654	Get over it
Posts: 17,400

10-05-2009, 03:12 PM	#41
Chiefnj2 In Search of a Life Join Date: Mar 2007 Casino cash: $6654388	The Lions have a better 3rd down defense and more sacks than KC. Gunther laughs. __________________ Mismanaging the clock.
Posts: 22,541