Chiefs Whitlock: Why should the Chiefs bring Haley back? - Page 31

**Tribal Warfare** · 12-20-2009, 11:17 PM

Why should the Chiefs bring Haley back?
By JASON WHITLOCK
The Kansas City Star

I’m not arguing that Todd Haley should be fired. I’m wondering what’s the justification for bringing him back.

Loyalty? Fairness?

You throw them overboard with the waiting list for season-ticket holders. Anyone arguing the Chiefs have made progress this season hasn’t heard about what happened inside Arrowhead Stadium on Sunday when the Cleveland Browns visited.

On a day when Cleveland quarterback Brady Quinn threw for 66 yards and two interceptions, the Browns rumbled for 351 yards on the ground and surpassed the 40-point barrier in a 41-34 victory over Haley’s Chiefs.

Keep in mind, the Browns are in the process of wooing Mike Holmgren to take over their organization and can embattled head coach Eric “Dead Man Coaching” Mangini. The Browns are bad. The Chiefs are worse.

It took a total team effort to give Cleveland a road victory.

“When you allow two returns for touchdowns, that’s generally not going to end up being a good thing,” Haley said, scolding the special-teams unit that allowed Josh Cribbs to find the end zone twice on kickoff returns.

“When you drop nine balls, and we had 39 to 40 by the NFL’s count going into this game — 50-plus by my count — it’s going to be very difficult,” Haley said, scolding his receivers for their inability to catch.

“When you allow a team to run the football the way they were able to run the football, you’re not going to have much of a chance to win,” Haley said, scolding a defensive unit that has surrendered 800-plus rushing yards in its last three games at Arrowhead Stadium.

That’s all three units, folks. Special teams. Offense. And defense.

It’s Christmas, and all three phases of Haley’s team are in disarray.

We’ve spent so much time focusing on the shortcomings within Kansas City’s roster, we’ve failed to mention that it’s likely Haley will overhaul his entire coaching staff, too.

You think Clancy Pendergast is coming back as defensive coordinator after some kid named Jerome Harrison gained 286 yards and finished 10 yards shy of the NFL’s all-time rushing record? We know Haley is a hothead. He booted his most qualified assistant (Chan Gailey) before the season. He’s already demoted a receivers coach. He benches receivers when his mood dictates.

Come on, you know Haley’s instincts will tell him to fire everyone except his wingman, Maurice Carthon. Haley can argue that he got this head-coaching position so late last offseason that he was unable to lure top-flight assistants.

Will top assistants want to come work for Haley this offseason? Let’s don’t even deal with the damage Haley has done to his reputation with his wild-man coaching routine and his handling of Gailey. Why would a top assistant come to KC when Haley is going to enter next season on the hot seat?

You know who would come? A coach with ties to Scott Pioli; a coach who thinks he could be the interim head coach if Haley gets fired six weeks into the season. Charlie Weis. Romeo Crennel.

Yes, more of the Patriots Way. A continuation of the flawed philosophy that you can export a winning culture from one city to another. Winning produces its own unique culture wherever it lands.

Let me get back on topic. I’m not saying Todd Haley should be fired. I’m wondering what’s the justification for bringing him back.

Mike Shanahan appears to be headed to Washington. Mike Holmgren apparently is going to take over Cleveland’s front office. Bill Cowher might rejoin the coaching ranks. The Chiefs are going to stand pat with Haley?

What has he shown us that gives us confidence he’ll hire a competent coaching staff? And if the Chiefs are going to be starting over with a new assistant-coaching staff, why not just start all the way over with a new head coach?

I did not say fire Todd Haley. I’m searching for reasons to bring him back. Right now, loyalty and fairness come to mind.

Scott Pioli stuck Haley with a craptastic roster. The stupidity of playing all season with special-team players masquerading as starting linebackers and safeties has caught up with the Chiefs the last month. And so has playing musical waiver wire at receiver.

Haley’s defenders can argue quite persuasively that he hasn’t been given a fair shot. Haley’s critics could argue that Haley has made a bad situation worse.

I’m not arguing anything. And I’m cool with Haley coming back ... as long as he realizes he has to make a boatload of fundamental changes to his coaching approach.

**DaneMcCloud** · 12-22-2009, 10:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by beach tribe

God you are so unbelievably dense.

Hey Crackhead, let us know the next time you sit down with some NFL execs, okay?

You REALLY don't have a ****ing clue.

Seriously.

Fish · 12-22-2009, 10:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OnTheWarpath58

Sure as shit, they dropped the lead-in's to those questions:

Nothing like censoring press conferences...

Wow... that reeks of a coach blaming WRs for his QB's ineptness...

Quote:

Originally Posted by We Todd

Coming off that game I believe there are some encouraging signs.

Just ****ing chew on a loaded shotgun already....

**DaneMcCloud** · 12-22-2009, 10:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OnTheWarpath58

Yes, he's made some boneheaded in-game decisions, but to me, it comes back to talent evaluation.

It took LJ mouthing off for us to learn that Charles is capable of being the man.

It took injury to find our best 5 offensive linemen.

We're still starting Vrabel over Studebaker.

And then yesterday, I hear this beauty:

Cassel was speaking with a reporter about his past performances being sub-par, and Cassel told him that he was graded out as having ZERO ERRORS during the Buffalo game.

This is a game in which Cassel threw 4 INT's and had a 35.4 QB rating.

I have a hard time trusting the guys doing the grading after that.

I decided the guy needed to guy immediately after hearing that nonsense.

When asked whether or not Cassel had been intellectually honest about his play and could look in the mirror, Haley said "I don't worry about such things".

Yeah, that Todd Haley. He's QUITE the QB coach.

**DaneMcCloud** · 12-22-2009, 10:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chiefnj2

Link??

It was spoken by Haley during his PC yesterday.

I have no idea if it's up on the site.

**OnTheWarpath15** · 12-22-2009, 10:51 AM

They didn't cut it out of the video:

http://www.kcchiefs.com/news/2009/12...ference__1221/

**DaneMcCloud** · 12-22-2009, 10:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RedThat

Pretty much EVERYTHING is new! So the players have to adjust accordingly.

More bullshit.

There are 45 new players. The overwhelming majority come from the SAME EXACT SYSTEM, whether it be from Miami, Arizona or New England.

Quote:

Originally Posted by RedThat

The Steelers are an example of sticking with their plan, and are rewarded for it.

Again, more bullshit.

The Pittsburgh Steelers ARE the Pittsburgh Steelers for one reason and one reason alone:

Ownership. PERIOD.

Chiefnj2 · 12-22-2009, 11:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OnTheWarpath58

They didn't cut it out of the video:

http://www.kcchiefs.com/news/2009/12...ference__1221/

Thanks.

Cassel supposedly said he had zero "mental" errors in the Buffalo game. That first pick looked like a huge mental error to me. The others may have been tipped and/or a Hail Mary, but that first one was definitely a mental error.

**OnTheWarpath15** · 12-22-2009, 11:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chiefnj2

Thanks.

Cassel supposedly said he had zero "mental" errors in the Buffalo game. That first pick looked like a huge mental error to me. The others may have been tipped and/or a Hail Mary, but that first one was definitely a mental error.

Here's the other thing:

Did every pass, INT or not go where it was supposed to go? Did he make the right decision EVERY time?

As you've pointed out, the first INT was without question a dumb decision.

You can't tell me he made the right decision 40+ times in a game he was picked off 4 times.

BigChiefFan · 12-22-2009, 11:55 AM

Most knew this season was going to be trash. Welcome to reality. Haley's the coach and will continue to be. Time to move on. It's been 14 games, with the worst roster in the entire NFL and some act like he's been here for years ****ing things up. Newsflash-he hasn't.

This is just spillover of years of ineptness and it's coming to a boil.
Reality is, we are a horrible team and have been for some time. We've been on the downward spiral for a long time and people are fed-up and figured Haley as the scapegoat. It's a sad tune that needs to be changed, because it's not giving him a fair shake to establish his system, with his guys.
Give the guy a break, for God's sake.

Fish · 12-22-2009, 11:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigChiefFan

Most knew this season was going to be trash. Welcome to reality. Haley's the coach and will continue to be. Time to move on. It's been 14 games, with the worst roster in the entire NFL and some act like he's been here for years ****ing things up. Newsflash-he hasn't.

This is just spillover of years of ineptness and it's coming to a boil.
Reality is, we are a horrible team and have been for some time. We've been on the downward spiral for a long time and people are fed-up and figured Haley as the scapegoat. It's a sad tune that needs to be changed, because it's not giving him a fair shake to establish his system, with his guys.
Give the guy a break, for God's sake.

How do you explain the fact that well over half the team is Pioli picked players and we're still the worst roster in the entire NFL. Worse than last year. The best playmakers on the team right now aren't even Pioli picked players, they're Herm picked players. It's as simple as that.

BigChiefFan · 12-22-2009, 12:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KC Fish

How do you explain the fact that well over half the team is Pioli picked players and we're still the worst roster in the entire NFL. Worse than last year. The best playmakers on the team right now aren't even Pioli picked players, they're Herm picked players. It's as simple as that.

You act as if we went out and signed all of these hand-picked players to huge contracts, as if they were some kind of huge acquisitions and staples of the team, when nothing could be further from the truth.

The team was HORRIBLE, EVIDENCED by a team total of 10 sacks on defense last year. The offense was just as inept, as we had to run a gimmick offense just to stay close in games and do we really need to talk about Herm's carousel of kickers on special teams? All three phases of the game we're attrocious.

They(current FO and coaching staff) KNEW what they had, wouldn't work, so they had to take a conservative approach to see if any low-cost free agents could actually upgrade the roster, making the monumental task of over-hauling this roster, slightly easier, in the hopes that a few could pan out-

I would say that move has actually paid off, in now knowing there's a few players, who deserve a shot back at making this team next year. Others CLEARLY DON'T and now we can easily walk away from those, that don't, with little to NO cost.

Chiefnj2 · 12-22-2009, 12:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OnTheWarpath58

Here's the other thing:

Did every pass, INT or not go where it was supposed to go? Did he make the right decision EVERY time?

As you've pointed out, the first INT was without question a dumb decision.

You can't tell me he made the right decision 40+ times in a game he was picked off 4 times.

1 pick was a hail mary, and two were tipped balls. I guess he doesn't count those as mental errors.

Fish · 12-22-2009, 12:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigChiefFan

You act as if we went out and signed all of these hand-picked players to huge contracts, as if they were some kind of huge acquisitions and staples of the team, when nothing could be further from the truth.

So we had the least talented team in the NFL and they knew it. And even though they turned over more than half the roster, they couldn't find a "Staple" player out of that that turned out better than the least talented team in the NFL?

That indicates very poor talent acquisition if you can't find a "Staple" player when turning over more than half the roster of the least talented team in the NFL. That's basically saying the team was the worst, yet after replacing half of the worst team, we still have the worst team in the NFL. Think about that.

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigChiefFan

The team was HORRIBLE, EVIDENCED by a team total of 10 sacks on defense last year. The offense was just as inept, as we had to run a gimmick offense just to stay close in games and do we really need to talk about Herm's carousel of kickers?

They(current FO and coaching staff) KNEW what they had, wouldn't work, so they had to take a conservative approach to see if any low-cost free agents could actually upgrade the roster, making the monumental task of over-hauling this roster, slightly easier, in the hopes that a few could pan out-

And you think the current FO and coaching staff went into the season knowing what they wanted to do wouldn't work? They "hoped" that a few out of more than half the roster would "pan out"? **** me, how low of expectations can they possibly have? That sounds like the approach of a completely inept franchise, not one that is supposedly headed in the right direction under new management.

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigChiefFan

I would say that move has actually paid off, in now knowing there's a few players, who deserve a shot back at making this team next year. Others CLEARLY DON'T and now we can easily walk away from those, that don't, with little to NO cost.

Baffling. Totally baffling. They wasted an entire season for the benefit of evaluating "a few players" that should come back. And you say it actually paid off. We were the worst team in the NFL last season, by your own words. And the only positive to come of this entire season is knowing "a few players" should be back.

Holy hell.

Chiefnj2 · 12-22-2009, 12:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KC Fish

That indicates very poor talent acquisition if you can't find a "Staple" player when turning over more than half the roster of the least talented team in the NFL. That's basically saying the team was the worst, yet after replacing half of the worst team, we still have the worst team in the NFL. Think about that.

.

Did you honestly believe that the WRs they brought in (Lelie, Long, etc.) were going to be some long term solution? There is a reason why those guys were on the market and some are still without a home. There's also a reason why so many of the players released are still without a job as well.

SDChiefs · 12-22-2009, 12:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chiefnj2

Did you honestly believe that the WRs they brought in (Lelie, Long, etc.) were going to be some long term solution? There is a reason why those guys were on the market and some are still without a home. There's also a reason why so many of the players released are still without a job as well.

Its because they sucked, and everyother franchise knew they sucked. Except Scott Pioli. Masterful.

12-20-2009, 11:17 PM
Tribal Warfare Man of Culture Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Far Beyond Comprehension Casino cash: $-2997187	Whitlock: Why should the Chiefs bring Haley back? Why should the Chiefs bring Haley back? By JASON WHITLOCK The Kansas City Star I’m not arguing that Todd Haley should be fired. I’m wondering what’s the justification for bringing him back. Loyalty? Fairness? You throw them overboard with the waiting list for season-ticket holders. Anyone arguing the Chiefs have made progress this season hasn’t heard about what happened inside Arrowhead Stadium on Sunday when the Cleveland Browns visited. On a day when Cleveland quarterback Brady Quinn threw for 66 yards and two interceptions, the Browns rumbled for 351 yards on the ground and surpassed the 40-point barrier in a 41-34 victory over Haley’s Chiefs. Keep in mind, the Browns are in the process of wooing Mike Holmgren to take over their organization and can embattled head coach Eric “Dead Man Coaching” Mangini. The Browns are bad. The Chiefs are worse. It took a total team effort to give Cleveland a road victory. “When you allow two returns for touchdowns, that’s generally not going to end up being a good thing,” Haley said, scolding the special-teams unit that allowed Josh Cribbs to find the end zone twice on kickoff returns. “When you drop nine balls, and we had 39 to 40 by the NFL’s count going into this game — 50-plus by my count — it’s going to be very difficult,” Haley said, scolding his receivers for their inability to catch. “When you allow a team to run the football the way they were able to run the football, you’re not going to have much of a chance to win,” Haley said, scolding a defensive unit that has surrendered 800-plus rushing yards in its last three games at Arrowhead Stadium. That’s all three units, folks. Special teams. Offense. And defense. It’s Christmas, and all three phases of Haley’s team are in disarray. We’ve spent so much time focusing on the shortcomings within Kansas City’s roster, we’ve failed to mention that it’s likely Haley will overhaul his entire coaching staff, too. You think Clancy Pendergast is coming back as defensive coordinator after some kid named Jerome Harrison gained 286 yards and finished 10 yards shy of the NFL’s all-time rushing record? We know Haley is a hothead. He booted his most qualified assistant (Chan Gailey) before the season. He’s already demoted a receivers coach. He benches receivers when his mood dictates. Come on, you know Haley’s instincts will tell him to fire everyone except his wingman, Maurice Carthon. Haley can argue that he got this head-coaching position so late last offseason that he was unable to lure top-flight assistants. Will top assistants want to come work for Haley this offseason? Let’s don’t even deal with the damage Haley has done to his reputation with his wild-man coaching routine and his handling of Gailey. Why would a top assistant come to KC when Haley is going to enter next season on the hot seat? You know who would come? A coach with ties to Scott Pioli; a coach who thinks he could be the interim head coach if Haley gets fired six weeks into the season. Charlie Weis. Romeo Crennel. Yes, more of the Patriots Way. A continuation of the flawed philosophy that you can export a winning culture from one city to another. Winning produces its own unique culture wherever it lands. Let me get back on topic. I’m not saying Todd Haley should be fired. I’m wondering what’s the justification for bringing him back. Mike Shanahan appears to be headed to Washington. Mike Holmgren apparently is going to take over Cleveland’s front office. Bill Cowher might rejoin the coaching ranks. The Chiefs are going to stand pat with Haley? What has he shown us that gives us confidence he’ll hire a competent coaching staff? And if the Chiefs are going to be starting over with a new assistant-coaching staff, why not just start all the way over with a new head coach? I did not say fire Todd Haley. I’m searching for reasons to bring him back. Right now, loyalty and fairness come to mind. Scott Pioli stuck Haley with a craptastic roster. The stupidity of playing all season with special-team players masquerading as starting linebackers and safeties has caught up with the Chiefs the last month. And so has playing musical waiver wire at receiver. Haley’s defenders can argue quite persuasively that he hasn’t been given a fair shot. Haley’s critics could argue that Haley has made a bad situation worse. I’m not arguing anything. And I’m cool with Haley coming back ... as long as he realizes he has to make a boatload of fundamental changes to his coaching approach.
Posts: 43,454

12-22-2009, 10:51 AM	#455
OnTheWarpath15 MVP Join Date: Sep 2005 Casino cash: $2051115	They didn't cut it out of the video: http://www.kcchiefs.com/news/2009/12...ference__1221/
Posts: 60,758

12-22-2009, 11:55 AM	#459
BigChiefFan MVP Join Date: Feb 2001 Location: In the Top 10 Casino cash: $9924205	Most knew this season was going to be trash. Welcome to reality. Haley's the coach and will continue to be. Time to move on. It's been 14 games, with the worst roster in the entire NFL and some act like he's been here for years ****ing things up. Newsflash-he hasn't. This is just spillover of years of ineptness and it's coming to a boil. Reality is, we are a horrible team and have been for some time. We've been on the downward spiral for a long time and people are fed-up and figured Haley as the scapegoat. It's a sad tune that needs to be changed, because it's not giving him a fair shake to establish his system, with his guys. Give the guy a break, for God's sake. __________________ A 35 year drought can make you thirsty.
Posts: 15,777