Whitlock: Why should the Chiefs bring Haley back?

[Tribal Warfare]

Why should the Chiefs bring Haley back?
By JASON WHITLOCK
The Kansas City Star

I’m not arguing that Todd Haley should be fired. I’m wondering what’s the justification for bringing him back.

Loyalty? Fairness?

You throw them overboard with the waiting list for season-ticket holders. Anyone arguing the Chiefs have made progress this season hasn’t heard about what happened inside Arrowhead Stadium on Sunday when the Cleveland Browns visited.

On a day when Cleveland quarterback Brady Quinn threw for 66 yards and two interceptions, the Browns rumbled for 351 yards on the ground and surpassed the 40-point barrier in a 41-34 victory over Haley’s Chiefs.

Keep in mind, the Browns are in the process of wooing Mike Holmgren to take over their organization and can embattled head coach Eric “Dead Man Coaching” Mangini. The Browns are bad. The Chiefs are worse.

It took a total team effort to give Cleveland a road victory.

“When you allow two returns for touchdowns, that’s generally not going to end up being a good thing,” Haley said, scolding the special-teams unit that allowed Josh Cribbs to find the end zone twice on kickoff returns.

“When you drop nine balls, and we had 39 to 40 by the NFL’s count going into this game — 50-plus by my count — it’s going to be very difficult,” Haley said, scolding his receivers for their inability to catch.

“When you allow a team to run the football the way they were able to run the football, you’re not going to have much of a chance to win,” Haley said, scolding a defensive unit that has surrendered 800-plus rushing yards in its last three games at Arrowhead Stadium.

That’s all three units, folks. Special teams. Offense. And defense.

It’s Christmas, and all three phases of Haley’s team are in disarray.

We’ve spent so much time focusing on the shortcomings within Kansas City’s roster, we’ve failed to mention that it’s likely Haley will overhaul his entire coaching staff, too.

You think Clancy Pendergast is coming back as defensive coordinator after some kid named Jerome Harrison gained 286 yards and finished 10 yards shy of the NFL’s all-time rushing record? We know Haley is a hothead. He booted his most qualified assistant (Chan Gailey) before the season. He’s already demoted a receivers coach. He benches receivers when his mood dictates.

Come on, you know Haley’s instincts will tell him to fire everyone except his wingman, Maurice Carthon. Haley can argue that he got this head-coaching position so late last offseason that he was unable to lure top-flight assistants.

Will top assistants want to come work for Haley this offseason? Let’s don’t even deal with the damage Haley has done to his reputation with his wild-man coaching routine and his handling of Gailey. Why would a top assistant come to KC when Haley is going to enter next season on the hot seat?

You know who would come? A coach with ties to Scott Pioli; a coach who thinks he could be the interim head coach if Haley gets fired six weeks into the season. Charlie Weis. Romeo Crennel.

Yes, more of the Patriots Way. A continuation of the flawed philosophy that you can export a winning culture from one city to another. Winning produces its own unique culture wherever it lands.

Let me get back on topic. I’m not saying Todd Haley should be fired. I’m wondering what’s the justification for bringing him back.

Mike Shanahan appears to be headed to Washington. Mike Holmgren apparently is going to take over Cleveland’s front office. Bill Cowher might rejoin the coaching ranks. The Chiefs are going to stand pat with Haley?

What has he shown us that gives us confidence he’ll hire a competent coaching staff? And if the Chiefs are going to be starting over with a new assistant-coaching staff, why not just start all the way over with a new head coach?

I did not say fire Todd Haley. I’m searching for reasons to bring him back. Right now, loyalty and fairness come to mind.

Scott Pioli stuck Haley with a craptastic roster. The stupidity of playing all season with special-team players masquerading as starting linebackers and safeties has caught up with the Chiefs the last month. And so has playing musical waiver wire at receiver.

Haley’s defenders can argue quite persuasively that he hasn’t been given a fair shot. Haley’s critics could argue that Haley has made a bad situation worse.

I’m not arguing anything. And I’m cool with Haley coming back ... as long as he realizes he has to make a boatload of fundamental changes to his coaching approach.

[Chiefnj2]

Originally Posted by SDChiefs

Its because they sucked, and everyother franchise knew they sucked. Except Scott Pioli. Masterful.

So now the argument is that he shouldn't have brought in anyone to try to improve the team. I get it.

[DaneMcCloud]

Originally Posted by BigChiefFan

Most knew this season was going to be trash. Welcome to reality. Haley's the coach and will continue to be. Time to move on. It's been 14 games, with the worst roster in the entire NFL and some act like he's been here for years ****ing things up. Newsflash-he hasn't.

This is just spillover of years of ineptness and it's coming to a boil.
Reality is, we are a horrible team and have been for some time. We've been on the downward spiral for a long time and people are fed-up and figured Haley as the scapegoat. It's a sad tune that needs to be changed, because it's not giving him a fair shake to establish his system, with his guys.
Give the guy a break, for God's sake.

This whole post reeks of complete and utter nonsense

[ToxSocks]

Originally Posted by DaneMcCloud

No.

It's called Due Diligence.

A great owner would have scoured the league for a player personnel guru like Eric DeCosta. He would have paid insane money for Chris Polian. He would have found a guy like Tom Dimitroff.

He wouldn't taken a poll, found out the name of the hottest candidate and guaranteed him a five year contract.

One look at Pioli's draft record should be an indication. Another indication would be that he wasn't the GM at New England. Another would be the fact that he allowed Haley to go unchecked this season and hire Clancy Pendergast, keep Tim Krumrie, cut Bernie Pollard, fire Chan Gailey the week before the season started and so on and so forth.

GREAT owners, owners with RINGS on their fingers, do NOT allow their people to go UNCHECKED.

Unfortunately, the Hunt family allows "their people" to go unchecked for decades at a time.

So why are you a Chiefs fan?

You don't like the owner
You don't like the GM
You don't like the Head Coach
You don't like the Assistant coaches
You don't like the players
You don't even live in KC

So why are you here? Why do you root for the Chiefs?

If you think the root of the problem is the owner, well guess what, that isn't going to change. And Scott Pioli had much better credentials than Eric DeCosta. Personally, i wanted DeCosta, but you can't fault Clark for going with Pioli. The Giants wanted Pioli. Is that Giants owner stupid too?

I mean really, if you think the root of the problem is Clark Hunt, then maybe you should find another team. Because by your logic, this team will never be good as long as Clark is the owner. Come back when either Clark dies or sells the team.

[SDChiefs]

Originally Posted by Chiefnj2

So now the argument is that he shouldn't have brought in anyone to try to improve the team. I get it.

No, he should have tried to bring in good players. Not the garbage off the Pats, Cards, and Dolphins practice squads.

[DaneMcCloud]

Originally Posted by Chiefnj2

So now the argument is that he shouldn't have brought in anyone to try to improve the team. I get it.

The argument should be this:

Why wasn't Todd Haley able to properly evaluate the existing talent on his roster from day one?

Why did it take 15 weeks of the regular season, four weeks of pre-season, and countless weeks of OTA & workouts to realize that his most talented receivers are Bowe, Bradley & Cottam?

Why did it take all this time to put the best offensive line on the field? Albert, Alleman, Niswanger, Smith & Richardson performed incredibly well together but it took 4 months to figure this out? Furthermore, why in the HELL was Richardson cut and stuck on the Practice Squad?

I don't have as many problems with the defensive side of the ball because they lack so much talent that I don't think there's a "gem" in hiding. But I do have issues with Vrabel over Studebaker and Brown over ANYONE.

Todd Haley is supposed to be an offensive mastermind, yet he can't determine his best skill position players or best offensive line unit until after he's been on the job for more than 10 months?

I think this is a problem going forward...

[DaneMcCloud]

Originally Posted by Detoxing

So why are you a Chiefs fan?

You don't like the owner
You don't like the GM
You don't like the Head Coach
You don't like the Assistant coaches
You don't like the players
You don't even live in KC

So why are you here? Why do you root for the Chiefs?

If you think the root of the problem is the owner, well guess what, that isn't going to change. And Scott Pioli had much better credentials than Eric DeCosta. Personally, i wanted DeCosta, but you can't fault Clark for going with Pioli. The Giants wanted Pioli. Is that Giants owner stupid too?

I mean really, if you think the root of the problem is Clark Hunt, then maybe you should find another team. Because by your logic, this team will never be good as long as Clark is the owner. Come back when either Clark dies or sells the team.

Maybe you should just go fist yourself

[Fish]

Originally Posted by Chiefnj2

Did you honestly believe that the WRs they brought in (Lelie, Long, etc.) were going to be some long term solution? There is a reason why those guys were on the market and some are still without a home. There's also a reason why so many of the players released are still without a job as well.

No I don't believe any of the WRs they signed were in the plans long term. But how does that excuse anything? They spent $63M on a QB, and knowingly gave him zero help. We all knew that the old castoffs they signed at WR were worthless. That's the point. They did nothing to help their new "Franchise" QB. And it was obvious to the whole ****ing world.

My question is WHY? Why wouldn't they bring in a legit WR when everyone knew what we had was shit? The same could be said for the OLine. There was no reason to stand pat at any position. We were already the least talented team. There's no benefit to bringing in players to "Just get by" till next season. None.

When you're starting at ground level like they were with this team, the only option you have is to build. Form a plan, and lay a foundation. Instead, they brought in a giant metal plate to cover the ground work for a year similar to MODOT's road fixing philosophy and ignored any actual building till next year. And somehow they convinced fans that this is all they could have possibly done this year.

We started the new regime with nothing. Now 80% through the season, and we still have nothing. Still waiting to get started. I'm willing to be patient with the building process if you can show me a single ****ing brick of the foundation was laid this year. As it stands, I'm still staring at that giant metal plate wondering what they could have done.

[chiefzilla1501]

Originally Posted by DaneMcCloud

The argument should be this:

Why wasn't Todd Haley able to properly evaluate the existing talent on his roster from day one?

Why did it take 15 weeks of the regular season, four weeks of pre-season, and countless weeks of OTA & workouts to realize that his most talented receivers are Bowe, Bradley & Cottam?

Why did it take all this time to put the best offensive line on the field? Albert, Alleman, Niswanger, Smith & Richardson performed incredibly well together but it took 4 months to figure this out? Furthermore, why in the HELL was Richardson cut and stuck on the Practice Squad?

I don't have as many problems with the defensive side of the ball because they lack so much talent that I don't think there's a "gem" in hiding. But I do have issues with Vrabel over Studebaker and Brown over ANYONE.

Todd Haley is supposed to be an offensive mastermind, yet he can't determine his best skill position players or best offensive line unit until after he's been on the job for more than 10 months?

I think this is a problem going forward...

Finally, points we can agree upon.

I agree with everything you've said here. If this is a rebuild, I'm confused as to why Morgan, Studebaker, Charles (previously) weren't seeing more time. And I completely agree that Ryan/O'Connell over Cottam is a WTF of epic proportions.

[ToxSocks]

Originally Posted by DaneMcCloud

Maybe you should just go fist yourself

That's wonderful. Great post.

Really though, if you hate this Franchise so much, why are you here? At least Mecca and Hamas have hope for the team and want to see them do well. You on the other hand just seem to be on the rag 24/7. You never have anything positive to say. You just bitch. you never have anything to say until the organization does something you don't like. And then you just bitch some more.

If you are a Chiefs fan, and you are so concerned about the Franchise, what do you suggest they do?

We Chiefs fans are holding out hope that this franchise can turn it back around. yes, bad decisions have been made, but there is hope that Pioli can fix this. He failed this year, but it doesn't mean he'll fail next year.

you have no hope for the team. You dont like anyone in the organization except for who? maybe D-Bowe? Maybe Flowers?

Seriously, for your own mental health, find another team that has an owner that you like. A Coach that you like. Because by your logic, this team is doomed till Clark sells it.

Im looking out for you dude. Find another team, it'll make you a happier person.

[Fish]

And please don't bother with the "If you hate this team so much... why...."

It's been said many times... I can criticize the team without hating them. Do you agree with everything your wife or children do? If you disagree, why not find a new wife and child. Well you don't, because that's just not the way it works.

[DaneMcCloud]

Originally Posted by Detoxing

That's wonderful. Great post.

Really though, if you hate this Franchise so much, why are you here? At least Mecca and Hamas have hope for the team and want to see them do well. You on the other hand just seem to be on the rag 24/7. You never have anything positive to say. You just bitch. you never have anything to say until the organization does something you don't like. And then you just bitch some more.

This HAS to be a joke

Originally Posted by Detoxing

If you are a Chiefs fan, and you are so concerned about the Franchise, what do you suggest they do?

Again, are you joking? I've got about 10,000 posts suggesting what they should "do".

Read them.

Originally Posted by Detoxing

We Chiefs fans are holding out hope that this franchise can turn it back around. yes, bad decisions have been made, but there is hope that Pioli can fix this. He failed this year, but it doesn't mean he'll fail next year.

He failed miserably this year. I see absolutely no indication that won't occur next year.

Originally Posted by Detoxing

you have no hope for the team. You dont like anyone in the organization except for who? maybe D-Bowe? Maybe Flowers?

JFC, are you an n00b? In preseason, I was all over Darryl Harris and Colin Brown. Bowe, Cottam, Charles, Carr, Flowers, Dorsey, Albert, Morgan, Richardson, Leggett and Page ALL SHOULD BE the foundation in which the Chiefs build around.

Considering that many of them haven't seen the field as much as they should have this year, I have my doubts about Haley & Pioli's talent evaluations.

But quite honestly, I think you must have missed 95% of my posts this year.

Originally Posted by Detoxing

Seriously, for your own mental health, find another team that has an owner that you like. A Coach that you like. Because by your logic, this team is doomed till Clark sells it.

Gee, thanks.

[ToxSocks]

Originally Posted by KC Fish

And please don't bother with the "If you hate this team so much... why...."

It's been said many times... I can criticize the team without hating them. Do you agree with everything your wife or children do? If you disagree, why not find a new wife and child. Well you don't, because that's just not the way it works.

That's kind of a bad comparison there.

Obviously we all have things to critique about this awful season. Some do it in a peacfull manner with out talking down to others. Some, at least have a positive outlook.

Im just keeping it real, calling it how i see it. Most are not happy with what is going on right now. Most of us know that Pioli and Haley have ****ed up. But, there are reasons to believe shit can and will get better.

[RedThat]

Originally Posted by DaneMcCloud

More bullshit.

There are 45 new players. The overwhelming majority come from the SAME EXACT SYSTEM, whether it be from Miami, Arizona or New England.

Well, look at the quality of players that the Chiefs got on defense. I blame Pioli for that.

For example, Corey Mays, special teamer, always has been throughout his whole career. Im sure he knows how to play in a 3-4 but he is just not that good at it. Vrabel is pretty much on his last legs, but still a decent role player imo, who knows and understands how to play in a 3-4. And then lets not forget about a broken down injury riddled Mike Brown.

Its important to find players that can play in a scheme, and that are intellegent enough to learn. But also those players have to be good quality players that have the potential to ascend. The Chiefs didn't do that obviously. They got players who are on the decline. but Im sure they still know how to play in a 3-4. Vrabel is an example and nobody can deny that. The Chiefs didn't focus enough on quality.

Originally Posted by DaneMcCloud

Again, more bullshit.

The Pittsburgh Steelers ARE the Pittsburgh Steelers for one reason and one reason alone:

Ownership. PERIOD.

They do have a good owner. Like I said to OTWP58, a bad owner is a reason why certain teams are bad. Ownership determines a lot whether a team is going to be either good or bad. I never ever questioned the Steelers ownership EVER! In fact I think Dan Rooney is one of the brightest minds in football, and he has an excellent team of architects, lieutenants, and captains to help build championship caliber football teams. But he is an example of what Im talking about, he has a good understanding and believes that if you stick with a plan and carry it out over time you'll succeed provided that you have the right people to help carry out your plan, that can transcend to success. Thats all Im saying. And that is factual. And it proved to work and it happened. How many coaches have the Steelers had throughout their franchise history? THREE! Thats it!

But thev're always had an excellent front office. Dick Haley, Todd Haleys dad, was a HUGE reason for that dynasty team built in 70's. Both he and Chuck Knoll worked great together and they did the exact same thing and found the right guys that were intellegent to fit into their philosophy and schemes. But they also had great chemistry. Thats what has to exist in a successful organization.

[The Franchise]

I have one question......

When Vrabel went down and Studebaker stepped in.....and had a lights out ****ing game.......

Why the **** did Vrabel immediately go back to his starting job? He's old and broken down and he's not helping this team out physically. Let Studebaker step into the starting role and see if he can repeat his performance. Vrabel is nothing more and should be nothing more than a part-time player right now. The same thing goes for Mike Brown.

[DaneMcCloud]

Originally Posted by RedThat

They do have a good owner. Like I said to OTWP58, a bad owner is a reason why certain teams are bad.

I've said that for YEARS in this forum.

So, you have owners like the Mara's, Rooney's, Krafts, DeBartolo's and Jones' that have multiple Super Bowls.

Then you have a team that hasn't won but three playoff games in 40 years, a team that went 15 straight years without a playoff appearance and a team that has now gone 16 years straight without a playoff win.

If the Mara's, Rooney's Kraft's, et al are "good owners" what does that make the owner of a team that has been virtually winless in the post-season for 40 years?