Chiefs Chiefs Players: Don't Blame Herm - Page 4

KCJohnny · 07:23 AM

Chiefs Players: Don't Blame Herm

Quote:

• Among the players lobbying for Herm Edwards’ retention as Chiefs coach was QB Tyler Thigpen, whom Edwards has identified as his anticipated starter in 2009 should he be around to make that decision.

“I hope we’re not playing for his job,” said Thigpen, who saw the Chiefs build the “Pistol” offense around his spread-quarterback abilities at midseason.

“We’ve had some tough ones this year, but I don’t think his job should be in jeopardy,” Thigpen added. “He’s done what he should have done this year. Don’t blame him at all. If anyone wants to say that, come take it up with me.”

• Added Pro Bowl G Brian Waters, who was selected to his fourth Pro Bowl last week:

“Herm, without a shadow of a doubt, is the most resilient person in this organization. He understands the cards he was dealt when he got here (in 2006), and he understands what he has to deal with this season.

“If anybody leads by example, it’s him. He comes to work every day with the same energy, and he has not let this situation affect him one way or another. I don’t know of many coaches that could hold it together through the things we’ve had to go through for the past three years. I think a lot of coaches in that situation would be looking for the door.”

Reading the tea leaves, if Edwards is retained, Thiggy could be his guy. With Quinn Gray as a similarly styled athletic shotgun QB, the mold could be set for Pistol II. Chan Gailey is somehow omitted from the article, the true architect of the KC Pistol. I am wondering if Gailey's style of offense is ultimately welcome in Herm's scheme of maneuver. The low TOP figures (a mere 25 minutes last Sunday) and low rushing attempts (just 15 carries for RBs) are not BucBall.

I think that if Herm is retained (as some players seem to support) that Gailey should be given a blank check and maybe even some more weapons. Clearly, the emerging strength of the team is it's offense. Makes you wonder what a new GM/HC tandem might do with the Chiefs' roster...

KCJohnny · 12-23-2008, 10:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SensibleChiefsfan

I have always said that it is truly odd that so many of the NFL coaches, players, and analysts truly respect Herm as a coach.... yet the fans here think he is the worst ever.

The difference is that they have experience with the NFL and can see the hand Herm was dealt.

Herm has only been allowed to rebuild one year. One. Sure, he has three drafts. And, oddly, those three drafts have yielded more talent than the seven drafts prior to it.

I don't expect Herm and the scouting department to be perfect. I just expect them to go about building the Chiefs the right way.

They have.

Of course the players endorse him. Of course coaches like Billick, Shannahan and Gruden have endorsed him. Of course guys like Phil Simms has endorsed him. Of course, several guys on the Jets have talked about how much better Herm was as a coach.

They all have a true knowlege base to make a decision.

I am as frustrated as the next guy about certain things regarding Herm Edwards. But, EVERY coach has strengths and weaknesses.

All the complaints about Herm were very similar to the complaints about Bill Belichick until he stumbled onto this guy Tom Brady in the sixth round.

Exactly. Billick did not know me from Adam. It was a breakfast with 2-4 Soldiers present. I had no idea he was even there until I sat down with my military powdered eggs and recognized him. He could tell I was not seeking a "yes man, make the troops happy" answer.

Herm inherited a very tough situation with the Carl Peterson 20-yr plan. The coaches and players on the inside do not need this explained to them.

Otter · 12-23-2008, 10:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chief103182

This fanbase has some kind of obsession with holding on to EVERYTHING. Past and present, good or bad. Let the **** go and let this team develop into something new we haven't seen before: a winner.

Amen!

Seriously, let it go, move on. Herm is a Carl hire.

Half these guys still think a full back and TE should be the core of your offense.

beach tribe · 12-23-2008, 10:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CrazyCoffey

I understand that - but IMO its just a surface look. Last year sucked, it was more carl's way than herm's way (FA > Draft) - then this year seemed to flip that (draft > FA) and carl was being shown the door. I see changes with our football team that are positive and can be attributed to Herm.

I see those negatives like you do too, and most of that is his responsibility. 85-95% of it. So if the new GM wants him to go - it'll be ok. BUT if the new GM gets bought in and we see year two of a truely Herm plan, I'm ok with that too.

In fact, because I know this years players and see this years changes - I'm more interested to see that second plan of action play out, rather than start again for the third year in a row. But that may just be me.

I see some good things he has done as well. It's not all negative in my mind, and I think we could see a big turn around next season, which is one of the reasons I want him gone now. I think he could get us to 8-8 next season, and that might earn him an extension, and that's what I don't want. I do not want him to get that extension, and then squander away the good young team that is being built with his horrible gameday coaching. I can envision us losing to an inferior team in the POs because of him. That's why it's best to axe him now, and hire someone who can take us to the promised land.

crazycoffey · 12-23-2008, 10:12 AM

.

Quote:

Originally Posted by kcfanXIII

to all herm apologists:
1. no half time adjustments, 8 games now have been lost by 7 points or less, all because of second half adjustments by the other team. I disagree that this all falls on herm. HC plan for the year then the week. The half time adjustments fall more heavily on the coordinators and the players. I tend to lend toward Jopo's assessment on this - that the opposing players are more experience with adjustments, and are outplaying our rookies. Add to that all the changes, starting rookies at the first of the year are not the starting rookies at the end of the year. the rookie wheel is spinning at some postions. Hard to show improvement through that, yet we still have.

2. piss poor clock managment; this has plauged him throughout his coaching career. I offer no rebutal to this, certainly a weakness of his.

3. coaching a brand of football that died with hair bands; i love defense as much as anybody, but you can't run a soft zone all the time. with the development of 3 rookie DBs this year, the chiefs should be running more man to man, to free up blitzers to help the pass rush. which in turn would help the DBs. I don't like being nailed down to any one thing. He adjusted on Offense - that was good, he hasn't adjusted on D, that's bad.

these three things alone are enough to make me wish for a new head coach. throw in some questionable draft picks, and less than average FA signings, and i begin to question his talent evaluation abilities as well. you can make as many excuses for the guy as you want, but if winning a superbowl is your ultimate goal, having a coach like herm edwards is the definition of neurosis.

Reerun_KC · 12-23-2008, 10:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KCJohnny

Exactly. Billick did not know me from Adam. It was a breakfast with 2-4 Soldiers present. I had no idea he was even there until I sat down with my military powdered eggs and recognized him. He could tell I was not seeking a "yes man, make the troops happy" answer.

Herm inherited a very tough situation with the Carl Peterson 20-yr plan. The coaches and players on the inside do not need this explained to them.

Poor Herm his is always the victim....

Hes never had a fair shake in the NFL, but was promoted way beyound his skill level...

It would be like KCJohnny going from an e5 or e6 to and O9.... Just isnt a good idea and innocent people would pay for that decision...

beach tribe · 12-23-2008, 10:19 AM

Can we please leave the military out of this. One is game, the other is not.

King_Chief_Fan · 12-23-2008, 10:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SensibleChiefsfan

I have always said that it is truly odd that so many of the NFL coaches, players, and analysts truly respect Herm as a coach.... yet the fans here think he is the worst ever.

The difference is that they have experience with the NFL and can see the hand Herm was dealt.

Herm has only been allowed to rebuild one year. One. Sure, he has three drafts. And, oddly, those three drafts have yielded more talent than the seven drafts prior to it.

I don't expect Herm and the scouting department to be perfect. I just expect them to go about building the Chiefs the right way.

They have.

Of course the players endorse him. Of course coaches like Billick, Shannahan and Gruden have endorsed him. Of course guys like Phil Simms has endorsed him. Of course, several guys on the Jets have talked about how much better Herm was as a coach.

They all have a true knowlege base to make a decision.

I am as frustrated as the next guy about certain things regarding Herm Edwards. But, EVERY coach has strengths and weaknesses.

All the complaints about Herm were very similar to the complaints about Bill Belichick until he stumbled onto this guy Tom Brady in the sixth round.

of course some of the players want him back....their job is secure that way. You will have to give some proof about jets talking about how much better Herm was as a coach. Show the complaints about Belichick until Brady. You can't throw crap out there without proof. Chiefs been rebulding for two years.
This isn't about Herm's likeability, this is about his results. 6-26 says he is not much of a coach. THese results get people fired in the business world.

Otter · 12-23-2008, 10:22 AM

Herm's worked with these guys for three years. Should it really be used as an argument in his favor that 2 players are endorsing him?

PS Germ, take note: “We’ve had some tough ones this year, but I don’t think his job should be in jeopardy,” Thigpen added. “He’s done what he should have done this year. Don’t blame him at all. If anyone wants to say that, come take it up with me.”

InChiefsHeaven · 12-23-2008, 10:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kcfanXIII

to all herm apologists:
1. no half time adjustments, 8 games now have been lost by 7 points or less, all because of second half adjustments by the other team.

2. piss poor clock managment; this has plauged him throughout his coaching career.

3. coaching a brand of football that died with hair bands; i love defense as much as anybody, but you can't run a soft zone all the time. with the development of 3 rookie DBs this year, the chiefs should be running more man to man, to free up blitzers to help the pass rush. which in turn would help the DBs.

these three things alone are enough to make me wish for a new head coach. throw in some questionable draft picks, and less than average FA signings, and i begin to question his talent evaluation abilities as well. you can make as many excuses for the guy as you want, but if winning a superbowl is your ultimate goal, having a coach like herm edwards is the definition of neurosis.

WHAT THE HELL???! WHEN DID HAIR BANDS DIE??!??!?!!

Agent V · 12-23-2008, 10:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by beach tribe

Can we please leave the military out of this. One is game, the other is not.

Exactly. The fact that it's being brought up is absolutely ridiculous. As if it strengthens an argument about FOOTBALL.

Reerun_KC · 12-23-2008, 10:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CrazyCoffey

.

IF that is the case CC, then we are talking about a guy that can not lead by example or make adjustments or have his DC make any adjustments during the course of the game...

Problem is Herm was never a DC or anything other than a DB coach, He doesnt know how to make adjustments during a game...

Reerun_KC · 12-23-2008, 10:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by beach tribe

Can we please leave the military out of this. One is game, the other is not.

K my bad, I am going to be like Herm and blame KCJohnny for it...

Reerun_KC · 12-23-2008, 10:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Otter

Herm's worked with these guys for three years. Should it really be used as an argument in his favor that 2 players are endorsing him?

PS Germ, take note: “We’ve had some tough ones this year, but I don’t think his job should be in jeopardy,” Thigpen added. “He’s done what he should have done this year. Don’t blame him at all. If anyone wants to say that, come take it up with me.”

Thigpen knows that a new GM, HC and OC might go in another direction, and his playing time could come to a quick end...

Fish · 12-23-2008, 10:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by beach tribe

I see some good things he has done as well. It's not all negative in my mind, and I think we could see a big turn around next season, which is one of the reasons I want him gone now. I think he could get us to 8-8 next season, and that might earn him an extension, and that's what I don't want. I do not want him to get that extension, and then squander away the good young team that is being built with his horrible gameday coaching. I can envision us losing to an inferior team in the POs because of him. That's why it's best to axe him now, and hire someone who can take us to the promised land.

This mindset is quite fascinating to me. Many people have said they don't want Herm here next season, because they're afraid he'll win too many games and end up with an extension.

OK?

You think we could have a big turnaround, get over .500, and have a good young team (built by Herm). But you don't want the guy that made that happen? You're afraid we'd eventually lose in the playoffs? We've only been to the playoffs twice in the last decade, but another playoff appearance wouldn't be good enough for you? For shit's sake.... I think the only way some people will be happy is if a new coach came in and took us to the Superbowl the first year with every draft pick in the pro bowl.... No time for progress, we can't be losing a playoff game... that'd be terrible...

I just can't understand how you can wish for a coach to get fired because you're afraid he'll win too many games next year and deserve a contract extension... That's just putting dislike for the guy ahead of the team's progress....

**Dartgod** · 12-23-2008, 10:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KC Fish

I think the only way some people will be happy is if a new coach came in and took us to the Superbowl the first year with every draft pick in the pro bowl....

Print 'em!

12-23-2008, 10:19 AM	#51
beach tribe Keep doubting J MFing Houston Join Date: May 2007 Location: ft.lauderdale Casino cash: $3908036	Can we please leave the military out of this. One is game, the other is not.
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