Chiefs The hypocritical analysis of Todd Haley - Page 4

**petegz28** · 09-20-2009, 10:42 PM

Week 1:

Chiefs D gives up 500 yards of O, the team committs 2 penalties, no turnovers and keeps the game close scoring 24 points by a special teams play and defensive play while only putting up 160ish yards of offense.

Pundit Analysis:

Haley has the team going in the right direction, they were disciplined and aggressive.

Week 2:

Chiefs put up 400 yards of offense, the defense only allows 160ish yards of O, the team gets 9 penalites, a rusty QB throws 2 picks and makes a terrible decision to end the 1st half and only scoring 10 points in the game. Haley takes responisibilty for things that clearly were not his fault. Something a Chiefs head coach has not done in 3 years.

Pundit Analysis:

Haley sucks, he is an embarrasment, this team lacks discipline, they are the worst in the NFL.

My analysis:

Our team looked damn good today and we kicked the crap out of a team we should have. We just had a couple things go wrong at the worst possible times. This will happen with a new team, new coach and rusty QB. All in all, if we played the same game again we route the other team. My only criticism of Haley in the Raiders game was the prevent defense at the end of the game. Other than that, we man-handled a team that man-handled the alleged Super Bowl favorite SD Chargers a week ago.

All in all, this team is heading in the right direction and today sucked. But I still saw promise in our team. A promise we haven't seen in the last 3 years.

ferrarispider95 · 09-21-2009, 10:38 AM

Here is the difference I see between Haley and Herm...

Haley will make changes. Herm was way too soft, no one was worrying about losing their job, herm was their buddy.

A young team and new coach is going to make mistakes. I don't think you can criticize Haley until you see him make the same mistakes over and over. Herm would, it was the same story every week.

I see more of a team out there with Cassel behind center, than I ever did with Herm and Gunther's BS.

BigChiefFan · 09-21-2009, 10:46 AM

I agree with the thread starter. Haley has the team going in the right direction, IMO. Give him some talent and we start winning some of these close games. I expect, the team will play better in the future.

FringeNC · 09-21-2009, 11:04 AM

The Chiefs outgained the opposition by over 200 yards, something Herm Edwards accomplished one time during his 49 games here. ONCE.

The idea that yardage differentials have no bearing on the future is ridiculous. It is a variable that Vegas uses in line determination -- for good reason -- it has predictive power. I just don't get why some refuse to acknowledge that luck plays a major role in the outcome of NFL games, but tends to average out for a team over the course of the season.

JFC, the Raiders RAN for over 300 yards on us last year, and we dominated the LOS under a new coach and some are having a meltdown and calling the coach incompetent? WTF?

jidar · 09-21-2009, 11:19 AM

We DOMINATED by the box score.

I don't know why so many people want to ignore that.

If we were Raiders fans right now this board would be full of threads about how much we sucked but got lucky. I'm sure it would be the same people too and all of them quoting our box scores.

Chiefs -vs- Raiders
Time of possession: 38mins vs 22mins
Rushing Yards: 173 vs 67
Passing Yards: 236 vs 99
Total Yards: 409 vs 166
Avg gain per play ran: 5.2yds vs 3.3yds
First Downs: 25 vs 11
3rd Down Efficiency: 33% vs 22%
Completions: 24/39 vs 7/24

We just got hurt by:
Penalties: 9 - 70 vs 4 - 45
Turnovers: 2 vs 0
And of course the dumb pass at the end of the 2nd.

These are solvable things. We can play better and have a lot of things to fix, but we're not as bad as people are posting on here.

MMXcalibur · 09-21-2009, 11:33 AM

I'll admit, I was pissed yesterday after the game ended. Losing 25 out of the last 27 has sort of "numbed" me from the losing, but yesterday's stung because we had the win right there and it was closer than ever. That sting from losing is a good thing, I think. Normally, I'd acknowledge we'd get our ass kicked with Herm at the headset and there'd be shit we could do about it with Carl in office.

However, with the new administration and seeing every step I've seen them take since their inception, I'm liking what I'm seeing. I'm seeing accountability, a new infusion of toughness and the idea that "losing" isn't acceptable. I can completely understand why people are taking whiffle ball bats to Haley. However, I'm still giving him a pass. Minus some very ill-timed throws by Cassel and absolutely shitty defensive playcalling in the final 2 minutes, we're halfway to our 2008 record right now. Perhaps it's because I'm a "glass is half full" kind of guy, but I'm just as excited about next week's game vs Philly as I was this past week. Until Haley and Cassel exhibit trends and repetitive ****ups that cost us games like past tenures, I'm going to continue being excited and hopeful with this new regime.

**DaneMcCloud** · 09-21-2009, 11:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jidar

We DOMINATED by the box score.

I don't know why so many people want to ignore that.

Because it's absolutely meaningless when you lose the game.

The Chiefs under Vermeil "dominated" the box score.

They got exactly ZERO playoff wins, one playoff appearances and four losing seasons (I'm sorry but 8-8 is a loss).

Fish · 09-21-2009, 11:39 AM

Hooray! We're the box score champions!!

Still not a single win, and just as many mistakes as last year, but hey.. stats are great....

**Baby Lee** · 09-21-2009, 11:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jidar

We DOMINATED by the box score.

I'll give them credit for blowing up a decent running attack, but we dominated the rest because JaMarcus was ABYSMAL, in the parlance of Denny Green with JR 'they were who we thought Terri Schiavo was' and we let 'em off the hook.

That said, I WILL stand by my long held stance that 'crappy but improving teams will look a million different types of crappy . . . until they don't any more.'

Remember, it's like tuning an automobile, until every setting is dialed in, it's a powerless rough running machine.

**SAUTO** · 09-21-2009, 11:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mecca

They looked good at times and looked extremely sloppy at others. The game was a mixed bag they never had any complete drives.
This is what I think when I think about it, last week with a backup QB on the road with the Ravens they were conservative trying to stay in it, the Ravens were aggressive and had some ****ups so while dominating the Chiefs stayed close.

Today against a team they felt they were better than with Cassel back they were more aggressive resulting in more penalties and turnovers giving the game to the Raiders.

yeah going down the field and scoring a td with 2something left isnt a complete drive

**SAUTO** · 09-21-2009, 11:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OnTheWarpath58

Really?

Because I spent all last season on this board reading how the Head Coach is responsible for EVERYTHING that takes place.

Let me make something PERFECTLY CLEAR: The following is NOT a defense of Herman Edwards.

When clock/time out management was an issue, it was HERM'S FAULT.

When the playcalling was questionable, it was HERM'S FAULT.

When the players made mistakes, it was HERM'S FAULT.

Guess what, dude. The same shit is happening in 2009, and with 30 different players.

Haley hasn't done anything to deserve the pass your giving him, especially considering I spent the summer reading that we'd win more games this year based on coaching alone.

guess what: it doesnt matter what you think or what you have read all ****ing summer. it's not your choice whether haley deserves the credit i'm or others are giving him

**SAUTO** · 09-21-2009, 11:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mikey23545

Finally - a truthspeaker.

It's going to be hard for a lot of posters on this BB to understand another reason Haley is going to catch a lot of shit, and deserves it...A majority of posters in this thread who are sticking up for Haley are immature, arrogant, condescending pricks just like him...And they can never understand that when you constantly treat people like absolute shit, and act like you are doing them a favor just to acknowledge their existence, you better be ready for some payback if your mouth writes a check your coaching ass can't cash....Don't think anyone is going to cut you any slack after you've done the "Genius Strut" all over their face...

the EXACT same could be said about the idiots bashing haley. hell THEY are the ones who said the raiders would run all over us. THEY are the ones who said that the TE would GASH us. neither happened.

Lex Luthors · 09-21-2009, 11:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KC Fish

Moral improvement is one thing. But improving the W column is still the only thing that matters. And so far there hasn't been any of that. Haley is 0-6 already as a head coach. And the team is still making some terrible mistakes. I like some of what I see as well, but until we learn how to win, encouragement isn't worth much.

Here's to hoping they learn from these mistakes as well!

I hate to interrupt your rant, but Haley isn't 0-6. He's 0-2. Preseason games are meaningless.

The Chiefs will probably start this season 0-7. But that will still be WAY too early to draw a meaningful conclusion about either Scott Pioli or Todd Haley. They inherited a team that was 2-23 in the last 25 games of the Carl/Herm era. It's unreasonable to think they can turn it around overnight. The win-lost record for this entire season is irrelevant. The time to judge them will be at the end of next season.

Fish · 09-21-2009, 11:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JASONSAUTO

the EXACT same could be said about the idiots bashing haley. hell THEY are the ones who said the raiders would run all over us. THEY are the ones who said that the TE would GASH us. neither happened.

Well hooray!! Neither happened! Another moral victory we didn't think of....

**OnTheWarpath15** · 09-21-2009, 11:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JASONSAUTO

guess what: it doesnt matter what you think or what you have read all ****ing summer. it's not your choice whether haley deserves the credit i'm or others are giving him

Of course it doesn't, and I never claimed it does.

I'm just pointing out where the true hypocrisy lies - with the people who absolutely blasted Herm Edwards for the same bullshit we saw yesterday - bad clock management, use of time-outs, undisciplined football and a litany of mistakes.

So if you want to be one of the hypocrites, that's your choice. Just don't complain if you get called out for it.

Pasta Little Brioni · 09-21-2009, 12:25 PM

The team was competitive the last half of last year as well. They STILL just can't get over the hump and get the W. It was very frustrating that the Fade couldn't do ANYTHING the entire day until thier final drive. Close losses are common in the NFL, but when you don't have a pass rush you are going to lose alot of games like this.

09-20-2009, 10:42 PM
petegz28 Supporter Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Olathe, Ks Casino cash: $2404127	The hypocritical analysis of Todd Haley Week 1: Chiefs D gives up 500 yards of O, the team committs 2 penalties, no turnovers and keeps the game close scoring 24 points by a special teams play and defensive play while only putting up 160ish yards of offense. Pundit Analysis: Haley has the team going in the right direction, they were disciplined and aggressive. Week 2: Chiefs put up 400 yards of offense, the defense only allows 160ish yards of O, the team gets 9 penalites, a rusty QB throws 2 picks and makes a terrible decision to end the 1st half and only scoring 10 points in the game. Haley takes responisibilty for things that clearly were not his fault. Something a Chiefs head coach has not done in 3 years. Pundit Analysis: Haley sucks, he is an embarrasment, this team lacks discipline, they are the worst in the NFL. My analysis: Our team looked damn good today and we kicked the crap out of a team we should have. We just had a couple things go wrong at the worst possible times. This will happen with a new team, new coach and rusty QB. All in all, if we played the same game again we route the other team. My only criticism of Haley in the Raiders game was the prevent defense at the end of the game. Other than that, we man-handled a team that man-handled the alleged Super Bowl favorite SD Chargers a week ago. All in all, this team is heading in the right direction and today sucked. But I still saw promise in our team. A promise we haven't seen in the last 3 years.
Posts: 128,326

09-21-2009, 10:38 AM	#46
ferrarispider95 She reads at a sophomore level Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: KANSAS Casino cash: $10004945	Here is the difference I see between Haley and Herm... Haley will make changes. Herm was way too soft, no one was worrying about losing their job, herm was their buddy. A young team and new coach is going to make mistakes. I don't think you can criticize Haley until you see him make the same mistakes over and over. Herm would, it was the same story every week. I see more of a team out there with Cassel behind center, than I ever did with Herm and Gunther's BS. __________________ www.steerplanet.com Show Steers Directory and Forum www.emporiaks.org Free Emporia, KS Apartment Rental Listings
Posts: 1,493

09-21-2009, 10:46 AM	#47
BigChiefFan MVP Join Date: Feb 2001 Location: In the Top 10 Casino cash: $9924205	I agree with the thread starter. Haley has the team going in the right direction, IMO. Give him some talent and we start winning some of these close games. I expect, the team will play better in the future. __________________ A 35 year drought can make you thirsty.
Posts: 15,777

09-21-2009, 11:04 AM	#48
FringeNC MVP Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: NC Casino cash: $1426014	The Chiefs outgained the opposition by over 200 yards, something Herm Edwards accomplished one time during his 49 games here. ONCE. The idea that yardage differentials have no bearing on the future is ridiculous. It is a variable that Vegas uses in line determination -- for good reason -- it has predictive power. I just don't get why some refuse to acknowledge that luck plays a major role in the outcome of NFL games, but tends to average out for a team over the course of the season. JFC, the Raiders RAN for over 300 yards on us last year, and we dominated the LOS under a new coach and some are having a meltdown and calling the coach incompetent? WTF?
Posts: 10,174

09-21-2009, 11:19 AM	#49
jidar MVP Join Date: May 2005 Location: a Casino cash: $10004900	We DOMINATED by the box score. I don't know why so many people want to ignore that. If we were Raiders fans right now this board would be full of threads about how much we sucked but got lucky. I'm sure it would be the same people too and all of them quoting our box scores. Chiefs -vs- Raiders Time of possession: 38mins vs 22mins Rushing Yards: 173 vs 67 Passing Yards: 236 vs 99 Total Yards: 409 vs 166 Avg gain per play ran: 5.2yds vs 3.3yds First Downs: 25 vs 11 3rd Down Efficiency: 33% vs 22% Completions: 24/39 vs 7/24 We just got hurt by: Penalties: 9 - 70 vs 4 - 45 Turnovers: 2 vs 0 And of course the dumb pass at the end of the 2nd. These are solvable things. We can play better and have a lot of things to fix, but we're not as bad as people are posting on here.
Posts: 5,502

09-21-2009, 11:33 AM	#50
MMXcalibur Pessimistically optimistic. Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Denver, CO Casino cash: $2105086	I'll admit, I was pissed yesterday after the game ended. Losing 25 out of the last 27 has sort of "numbed" me from the losing, but yesterday's stung because we had the win right there and it was closer than ever. That sting from losing is a good thing, I think. Normally, I'd acknowledge we'd get our ass kicked with Herm at the headset and there'd be shit we could do about it with Carl in office. However, with the new administration and seeing every step I've seen them take since their inception, I'm liking what I'm seeing. I'm seeing accountability, a new infusion of toughness and the idea that "losing" isn't acceptable. I can completely understand why people are taking whiffle ball bats to Haley. However, I'm still giving him a pass. Minus some very ill-timed throws by Cassel and absolutely shitty defensive playcalling in the final 2 minutes, we're halfway to our 2008 record right now. Perhaps it's because I'm a "glass is half full" kind of guy, but I'm just as excited about next week's game vs Philly as I was this past week. Until Haley and Cassel exhibit trends and repetitive ****ups that cost us games like past tenures, I'm going to continue being excited and hopeful with this new regime.
Posts: 16,437

09-21-2009, 11:39 AM	#52
Fish Ain't no relax! Join Date: Sep 2005 Casino cash: $1888919	Hooray! We're the box score champions!! Still not a single win, and just as many mistakes as last year, but hey.. stats are great.... __________________
Posts: 47,718

09-21-2009, 12:25 PM	#60
Pasta Little Brioni Consuming CP souls Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: U.S.A. Casino cash: $3598880	The team was competitive the last half of last year as well. They STILL just can't get over the hump and get the W. It was very frustrating that the Fade couldn't do ANYTHING the entire day until thier final drive. Close losses are common in the NFL, but when you don't have a pass rush you are going to lose alot of games like this.
Posts: 69,050