Is it conceivable for the Chiefs to dump Pioli & Haley and get Cowher for GM & HC?

[kcbubb]

I never wanted Pioli or Haley and I would love to see Cowher in KC. Is it possible?

[Chiefless]

Originally Posted by BossChief

I agree 100%

BUT

take into consideration that Pioli is working off information by HERMS SCOUTS.

The only players he knows and trusts the scouting on are the ones he had a "hands on" process with. I understand Dimitroff handled this mostly, but man Pioli is basicallly alone right now as far as talent goes. Not saying Im giving him a pass because the players he did bring in were of the fail to the tenth power, just sayin...

During the time when getting the lackadaisical, lazy loser mentality out of the teams brain, it isnt a complete fail to bring in players that are used to being around winning.

I have given them a leash in this situation that may be a little longer than I gave in past ones because of the total fail they were willing to take over and hopefully transform into a winning franchise and their records in doing so are there for all to see.

If we are still a team getting blown out by middle of the pack teams like the Chargers during the first quarter of next year, I will open the floodgates...but I didnt really expect too much progress up to this point because of what they were given.

That fair?

agree. good post.

[Danman]

Originally Posted by Bearcat

That's what I've been sayin'... the sooner we can get the next regime in here the sooner we can start picking them apart, finding every flaw in their system/personality/work history, and endlessly bitch about them.

The Pioli/Haley bitchfest is so week 3...

Why do you want a new regime again? Do you want to win only 3 games every year? Every new regime wants "our kind of players" or "the right 53" whatever you wanna call it. When they first come in they're gonna weed out the that don't fit their system. It happens all the time. If you change again, the new regime will start again at square 1 to get "our kind of players".

[TheGuardian]

Originally Posted by milkman

There's a lot of merit to what you're saying here.

However, the thing that pisses me off, and that can not be defended, IMO, is the total lack of of trying to upgrade this roster with any players outside of players that have a former association with the braintrust.

I get that every new regime likes to bring in guys they are familiar with, but have never seen any that have gone almost exclusively with those players.

I'm not exactly sure of the number anymore, with the additions made in the last couple of weeks, but it has to be something like 19 of 20 players added to this roster with previous NFL experience that have been associated with Parcells, Pioli or Haley.

That is ludicrous.

I hear you MM, but my take is this.

We'll see another big roster purge this offseason and a real run at players in FA and some more trading before the draft to load up on picks. I think for right now Pioli is simply keeping bodies on the roster that he is familiar with for comfort reasons only. I don't think in any way shape or form they will continue this after this season.

This team is probably shorter on talent than any team in the league. I think this season is nothing more than a throw away while Haley learns some HC ropes and Pioli does more scouting (I remember hearing a while back he himself was already out visiting and scouting college players). It's very possible that this team won't even be very competitive next season as well. When you've had 20+ years of crappy GM duties and bad drafting it's not an easy fix. I think personally, the Vermiel years were FAR worse from a drafting standpoint than the Herm years and IMO Vermiel set this franchise back more than anyone from a drafting standpoint. Or at least, he and Carl did during the years Vermiel was the HC.

[milkman]

Originally Posted by BossChief

here is what I actually said though, maybe it was taken wrong...I will try to be more clear in future posts.


Quote:
Originally Posted by 'Hamas' Jenkins View Post
It has nothing to do with the W's and L's. The problem stems from the myopic dipshittery of the regime, thinking that because players came from NE, Miami, Dallas, or Az that they are the only worthwhile NFL players. Compound that with the belief that the 3-4 is the only defense to run, and you have rampant one who sucks the penisy and ineffectiveness which belies itself in the weekly performance.

BossChief:

I agree 100%

BUT

take into consideration that Pioli is working off information by HERMS SCOUTS.

The only players he knows and trusts the scouting on are the ones he had a "hands on" process with. I understand Dimitroff handled this mostly, but man Pioli is basicallly alone right now as far as talent goes. Not saying Im giving him a pass because the players he did bring in were of the fail to the tenth power, just sayin...

During the time when getting the lackadaisical, lazy loser mentality out of the teams brain, it isnt a complete fail to bring in players that are used to being around winning.

I have given them a leash in this situation that may be a little longer than I gave in past ones because of the total fail they were willing to take over and hopefully transform into a winning franchise and their records in doing so are there for all to see.

If we are still a team getting blown out by middle of the pack teams like the Chargers during the first quarter of next year, I will open the floodgates...but I didnt really expect too much progress up to this point because of what they were given.

That fair?



If that is that far off base, we will hjust have to agree to disagree.

That is what discussion boards are for I guess. Would be hella boring if everyone agreed with everything.

What you said is essentially that Pioli/Haley are being given a pass in talent evaluation because they didn't have their guys in place.

That's bull.

Scouts gather info.

Even with the old staff, it is Pioli's responsibility to communicate to those guys what they are looking for and sift through the info provided.

Even with the old staff, he should have been able to make sound decisions.

And he did have his staff in place through the preseason whne they were looking at players on the bubble, and he still only brought in the "tree" players.

That's inexcusable.

[milkman]

Originally Posted by TheGuardian

I hear you MM, but my take is this.

We'll see another big roster purge this offseason and a real run at players in FA and some more trading before the draft to load up on picks. I think for right now Pioli is simply keeping bodies on the roster that he is familiar with for comfort reasons only. I don't think in any way shape or form they will continue this after this season.

This team is probably shorter on talent than any team in the league. I think this season is nothing more than a throw away while Haley learns some HC ropes and Pioli does more scouting (I remember hearing a while back he himself was already out visiting and scouting college players). It's very possible that this team won't even be very competitive next season as well. When you've had 20+ years of crappy GM duties and bad drafting it's not an easy fix. I think personally, the Vermiel years were FAR worse from a drafting standpoint than the Herm years and IMO Vermiel set this franchise back more than anyone from a drafting standpoint. Or at least, he and Carl did during the years Vermiel was the HC.

We agree on Dick and Carl.

[King_Chief_Fan]

Originally Posted by kcbubb

I never wanted Pioli or Haley and I would love to see Cowher in KC. Is it possible?

[BossChief]

Originally Posted by TheGuardian

I hear you MM, but my take is this.

We'll see another big roster purge this offseason and a real run at players in FA and some more trading before the draft to load up on picks. I think for right now Pioli is simply keeping bodies on the roster that he is familiar with for comfort reasons only. I don't think in any way shape or form they will continue this after this season.

This team is probably shorter on talent than any team in the league. I think this season is nothing more than a throw away while Haley learns some HC ropes and Pioli does more scouting (I remember hearing a while back he himself was already out visiting and scouting college players). It's very possible that this team won't even be very competitive next season as well. When you've had 20+ years of crappy GM duties and bad drafting it's not an easy fix. I think personally, the Vermiel years were FAR worse from a drafting standpoint than the Herm years and IMO Vermiel set this franchise back more than anyone from a drafting standpoint. Or at least, he and Carl did during the years Vermiel was the HC.

I agree with most of this and would add that the Hunts should shoulder some blame as well, we are 35 million or so under the cap and one of the only teams (if not the only one) to ever go under the salary floor.

that is the biggest reason we are in the basement afterall.

no talent
lots of unspent money
the guy with the wallet should shoulder some of the blame.

[Gonzo]

Goddammit....

We need a refined screening process for threads. Something like when you hit the submit button, the thread is emailed to a group of people on the site that have to vote on whether or not the thread is acceptable.
Posted via Mobile Device

[Bearcat]

Originally Posted by Danman

Why do you want a new regime again? Do you want to win only 3 games every year? Every new regime wants "our kind of players" or "the right 53" whatever you wanna call it. When they first come in they're gonna weed out the that don't fit their system. It happens all the time. If you change again, the new regime will start again at square 1 to get "our kind of players".

It was sarcasm.

Actually, for at least a year I've been mentioning that we're setting ourselves up to become an incredibly impatient franchise that has no long term vision... had Carl not left, I think it would have continued, but Pioli and Haley obviously want to do things their way and have both said from day one that they're in it for the long term... and the fans who are seriously wanting change at this point can rinse the sand out of their vaginas and become Steelers fans for all I (and Pioli and Haley) care. Like Marv Levy said, the minute you start listening to fans is the minute you'll be sitting with them.

[BossChief]

Originally Posted by milkman

What you said is essentially that Pioli/Haley are being given a pass in talent evaluation because they didn't have their guys in place.

That's bull.

Scouts gather info.

Even with the old staff, it is Pioli's responsibility to communicate to those guys what they are looking for and sift through the info provided.

Even with the old staff, he should have been able to make sound decisions.

And he did have his staff in place through the preseason whne they were looking at players on the bubble, and he still only brought in the "tree" players.

That's inexcusable.

Bobby wade is'nt a "tree" player to my knowledge, is he? He was a good fringe pickup, not great but obviously better than what we had.

take into account that the previous scouts that were feeding information to him were scouting 4-3 players all year and also had a short time to prepare for a draft in which we would be targeting 3-4 players.

[TheGuardian]

Originally Posted by BossChief

I agree with most of this and would add that the Hunts should shoulder some blame as well, we are 35 million or so under the cap and one of the only teams (if not the only one) to ever go under the salary floor.

that is the biggest reason we are in the basement afterall.

no talent
lots of unspent money
the guy with the wallet should shoulder some of the blame.

Spending has never had a correlation with winning. Every year the Raiders are like 50 million over the cap and every year they suck donkey balls. There is a happy medium here.

[The Bad Guy]

You are seriously the dumbest mother ****er ever.

You think Clark is going to shell out the remaining money for Pioli and Haley and THEN pay Cowher?

This when the guy didn't shell out any money for free agents?

Are you really this dumb?

[BossChief]

Originally Posted by milkman

What you said is essentially that Pioli/Haley are being given a pass in talent evaluation because they didn't have their guys in place.

That's bull.

Scouts gather info.

Even with the old staff, it is Pioli's responsibility to communicate to those guys what they are looking for and sift through the info provided.

Even with the old staff, he should have been able to make sound decisions.

And he did have his staff in place through the preseason whne they were looking at players on the bubble, and he still only brought in the "tree" players.

That's inexcusable.

really???

"Not saying Im giving him a pass because the players he did bring in were of the fail to the tenth power, just sayin..."

[Nzoner]

[BossChief]

Originally Posted by TheGuardian

Spending has never had a correlation with winning. Every year the Raiders are like 50 million over the cap and every year they suck donkey balls. There is a happy medium here.

tell me this line wouldnt protect Cassel much better with:

Albert

Waters

Jason Brown (went to Stlouis in free agency, so obviously he would have came here if it was an option)

Rudy/other fa Im unaware of (or better yet, a olinemen in the third round)

Runyan...reports are that he can pass a physical but wants too much $...look we have too much money, perfect fit! hold on what? Were gonna play a bunch of backup/ scrap heap style players to protect our 63,000,000 man and open holes for our 45,000,000 rb? If Runyan isnt your man, their were a few options we didnt choose to pursue for some reason including Taucher,Levi Jones and others.

I agree that $ doesnt win championships, but it sure does but olinemen!