Let's talk about the Ravens

[TLO]

Quite possibly a preview of the AFC Championship game.

Hopefully we can get healthy by Sunday

[Hamwallet]

Originally Posted by Ravens213

Just moved to Iowa for work and this state stinks so sorry to hear you’re “foreveriowan”. Also I’ll pop in Tuesday regardless of the outcome. Not trying to make excuses for him just amazed at how much shit he continues to receive after being the unanimous mvp. He’s also 23 years old haha... it’s actually insane what he’s doing. Mahomes and Lamar can both be good, I think we live in a world where that’s possible.

I like Lamar, but would you trade him straight up for Mahomes?

[mr. tegu]

Originally Posted by Ravens213

Wow, you’re dumb. Saying Lamar connects with a group of people more than Mahomes because they come from similar backgrounds makes me racist? This will be my last post because frankly no one wants me here anyways (understandably so).

But will finish with a comment on the actual game. The theory that Lamar can’t play from behind is false. Just look at the stats. And saying he’s a terrible player because of the titans playoff game doesn’t make any sense. He didn’t play great but the ravens also dropped 6 passes. 2 of which would have gone for TDs. Won’t let me post a url but there are plenty of article out there talking about the drops.

Jackson is noticeably worst when playing from behind. Not sure what stats you are referring to. He also piles up stats in the fourth quarter when the team is comfortably ahead.

In 2019 when ahead Jackson threw 27 TDs on 217 attempts. A TD pass on 12% of attempts. When behind he had 99 attempts and only two TD passes, easy math at 2% of passes resulting in a TD. That’s a gigantic difference to the negative for him. Not surprising he falls so much when teams can more comfortably play his passing game.

And blaming drops is just lazy excuse making. In week 1 Mahomes had two TD passes dropped. In week 2 trying to take the lead at the end of regulation he had to overcome two plays that resulted in first downs coming back because of penalties. One of those took the Chiefs from the 15 of the Chargers to their own 45 yard line leaving him having to complete a 3rd and 20. No one cares to hear about drops since at least those don’t back you up.

[MIAdragon]

Originally Posted by Hamwallet

I like Lamar, but would you trade him straight up for Mahomes?

No ****ing way

[Ravens213]

Originally Posted by Hamwallet

I like Lamar, but would you trade him straight up for Mahomes?

Mahomes is safer and a better player right now but I wouldn’t because there’s something to drafting your guy and believing him. He’s also proven he can be an elite player. They 100% believe they can win a supeebowl/be in contention every year with LJ at qb and they’ve built the team around him. I legitimately don’t think Eric Decosta would make that trade but who the hell knows.

[Red Dawg]

Originally Posted by Hamwallet

I like Lamar, but would you trade him straight up for Mahomes?

Yes, they would. Mahomes life span will be longer.

[Hamwallet]

Originally Posted by Ravens213

Mahomes is safer and a better player right now but I wouldn’t because there’s something to drafting your guy and believing him. He’s also proven he can be an elite player. They 100% believe they can win a supeebowl/be in contention every year with LJ at qb and they’ve built the team around him. I legitimately don’t think Eric Decosta would make that trade but who the hell knows.

Very fair answer. You seem like a good sport.

[Ravens213]

Originally Posted by mr. tegu

Jackson is noticeably worst when playing from behind. Not sure what stats you are referring to. He also piles up stats in the fourth quarter when the team is comfortably ahead.

In 2019 when ahead Jackson threw 27 TDs on 217 attempts. A TD pass on 12% of attempts. When behind he had 99 attempts and only two TD passes, easy math at 2% of passes resulting in a TD. That’s a gigantic difference to the negative for him. Not surprising he falls so much when teams can more comfortably play his passing game.

And blaming drops is just lazy excuse making. In week 1 Mahomes had two TD passes dropped. In week 2 trying to take the lead at the end of regulation he had to overcome two plays that resulted in first downs coming back because of penalties. One of those took the Chiefs from the 15 of the Chargers to their own 45 yard line leaving him having to complete a 3rd and 20. No one cares to hear about drops since at least those don’t back you up.

Every qb in the league is worse when playing from behind. Here are the stats from 2019 I posted earlier in this thread. Not sure where you’re getting the 2td passes from? Also of course the td rate is going to be higher when ahead bc that’s why they are ahead... the team is scoring tds.

Lamar Jackson - 60/99, 60.5% comp., 707 yds, 5td, 2int, 90.8 qbr
Mahomes - 88/144, 61% comp., 1120 yds, 7td, 2 int, 95.5 qbr

Fair on the drops... it’s a lame excuse but 6 drops is pretty insane. The broader point is that I think it’s unfair to judge a player on one game when his body of work tells a different story.

[Megatron96]

Originally Posted by Ravens213

Every qb in the league is worse when playing from behind. Here are the stats from 2019 I posted earlier in this thread. Not sure where you’re getting the 2td passes from? Also of course the td rate is going to be higher when ahead bc that’s why they are ahead... the team is scoring tds.

Lamar Jackson - 60/99, 60.5% comp., 707 yds, 5td, 2int, 90.8 qbr
Mahomes - 88/144, 61% comp., 1120 yds, 7td, 2 int, 95.5 qbr

Fair on the drops... it’s a lame excuse but 6 drops is pretty insane. The broader point is that I think it’s unfair to judge a player on one game when his body of work tells a different story.

Assuming those are stats from 2019 pertaining to "comeback" attempts, I'm curious why 2018 stats aren't included. And what about playoff stats for both years?

Stats are only as good as the data provided/gathered. Even then they leave out a lot of pertinent information.

But if you're going to use statistical data to describe each player's efficiency in "comeback" attempts, then it would be necessary to use as much of the relevant data as possible.

[Deberg_1990]

Originally Posted by Hamwallet

I like Lamar, but would you trade him straight up for Mahomes?

I’d trade Mahomes for Kyler Murray and Joe Burrow before id trade him for Lamaar.

[mr. tegu]

Originally Posted by Ravens213

Every qb in the league is worse when playing from behind. Here are the stats from 2019 I posted earlier in this thread. Not sure where you’re getting the 2td passes from? Also of course the td rate is going to be higher when ahead bc that’s why they are ahead... the team is scoring tds.

Lamar Jackson - 60/99, 60.5% comp., 707 yds, 5td, 2int, 90.8 qbr
Mahomes - 88/144, 61% comp., 1120 yds, 7td, 2 int, 95.5 qbr

Fair on the drops... it’s a lame excuse but 6 drops is pretty insane. The broader point is that I think it’s unfair to judge a player on one game when his body of work tells a different story.

I was looking at rushing instead of passing so my bad there, but point remains. As far as comparing the two what’s more telling on how a player is when behind verse ahead is how they compare to themselves. Mahomes has shown much less drop off in production with the ability to make the big plays needed. Until Jackson shows that ability there are legitimate questions about how good he is when behind.

On drops we spent years here having to focus on those things due to an inferior QB and now we see the opposite and aren’t likely to view drops as anything short of making excuses when the QB could have overcome them.

Originally Posted by Ravens213

Also of course the td rate is going to be higher when ahead bc that’s why they are ahead... the team is scoring tds.

This doesn’t make any sense. The stats are for when ahead, not tied, so the majority of his stats are done when the team is ahead with less pressure on the QB. So it’s nice to pile them up for MVP purposes and more comfortable wins but it shows a pretty well known trend of the Ravens being much more likely to keep scoring when not needed. Though at times I wish we did that more often. The Chiefs were 18th in fourth quarter ppg last season, the Ravens were 3rd.

[scho63]

If we tackle anything like we did in the Chargers game, we will get blown away.

[Stryker]

Originally Posted by scho63

If we tackle anything like we did in the Chargers game, we will get blown away.

Unfortunately, this. This will be our first loss. We will meet again in the playoffs but the OLINE can't protect Mahomes - their defense is lethal. LJ can run and break ankles. IF we win this I will believe but this team is our achilles.
We lose this one and I will be so GLAD to EAT CROW if I am wrong. Keeping the band together and a disappearing of the D is actually heart breaking at this point of the season.

[Halfcan]

Originally Posted by Stryker

Unfortunately, this. This will be our first loss. We will meet again in the playoffs but the OLINE can't protect Mahomes - their defense is lethal. LJ can run and break ankles. IF we win this I will believe but this team is our achilles.
We lose this one and I will be so GLAD to EAT CROW if I am wrong. Keeping the band together and a disappearing of the D is actually heart breaking at this point of the season.

We saw these same kind of post before the Ravens game last year and we came out and manhandled them.

Their defense is lethal? I guess we will see after Mahomes drags them up and down the field.

So how do you like your Crow? Bar B Qued?

[Simply Red]

we'll be fine.

[St. Patty's Fire]

Originally Posted by Stryker

Unfortunately, this. This will be our first loss. We will meet again in the playoffs but the OLINE can't protect Mahomes - their defense is lethal. LJ can run and break ankles. IF we win this I will believe but this team is our achilles.
We lose this one and I will be so GLAD to EAT CROW if I am wrong. Keeping the band together and a disappearing of the D is actually heart breaking at this point of the season.

My friend, the a Ravens don’t have Joey Bosa. Or Melvin Ingram. Or even Jerry Tillery.

The only way they’re getting consistent pressure is from bringing 6-7 guys. And if they do that with any sort of regularity, Mahomes will eviscerate them.