Missed this comment from Clark on QBs

[the Talking Can]

just replayed it on 810, from petro interview

Clark talked about the fact that the Patriots drafted a QB almost every year, and went on to say "I'm sure Scott Pioli's teams will draft a QB every year...and we'll hit on one of them and that will be our franchise QB..."


2 obvious points:

1. Clark gets it - we have to have a QB, and we have to draft QBs to find the right one...doesn't mean we'll take one at #3, but it is a clear change from Carl...

2. Thigpen is not our franchise QB

[OnTheWarpath15]

Originally Posted by ChiefsCountry

Isn't Super Bowl wins what defines QB play? Its the reason why Marino, Kelly and others arent thought of as highly as they should.

Only by reeruns that don't know shit about football.

Christ, we're talking about 2 Hall Of Famers.

There are great QB's that have never won a SB, and less than average QB's that have.

It's reeruned to say that because a 5th round QB has never won a SB, that it will never happen.

Of the 27 QB's that HAVE won a SB, 14 of them were taken in the 1st.

That means the other 13 weren't.

[DaneMcCloud]

Originally Posted by stevieray

I wonder how many first round QB's flamed out and never won squat.....

Someday, I'll take the time to research and report.

Originally Posted by stevieray

it's not just the QB...it's getting the right players and staff together at the right time...it is extremely hard to do....

This is true but in the era of free-agency, a stellar QB should be able to move onto a better team, thus improving his chances at a Super Bowl.

Jim Plunkett is one example, as is Steve Young. Trent Dilfer (a former first rounder) even won a Super Bowl.

[OnTheWarpath15]

Originally Posted by stevieray

I wonder how many first round QB's flamed out and never won squat.....

it's not just the QB...it's getting the right players and staff together at the right time...it is extremely hard to do....

Exactly.

It's a team sport.

Hell, Jim Kelly took a pretty damn good team to the SB FOUR times, only to run into a better TEAM 3 times, and get let down by a kicker on the other.

[DaneMcCloud]

Originally Posted by OnTheWarpath58

Only by reeruns that don't know shit about football.

Christ, we're talking about 2 Hall Of Famers.

There are great QB's that have never won a SB, and less than average QB's that have.

It's reeruned to say that because a 5th round QB has never won a SB, that it will never happen.

Of the 27 QB's that HAVE won a SB, 14 of them were taken in the 1st.

That means the other 13 weren't.

Regardless, the odds of winning a Super Bowl are greatly increased if you have a first round QB at the helm.

That cannot be disputed.

[Ebolapox]

Originally Posted by Basileus777

I don't think you can extrapolate from what happened in New England that Pioli doesn't like to draft QBs high. They had Bledsoe and then Brady, they never had any need to spend a high pick on a QB.

bledsoe went first overall in 1993. that's a pretty high pick for a QB, isn't it?

[OnTheWarpath15]

Originally Posted by DaneMcCloud

Regardless, the odds of winning a Super Bowl are greatly increased if you have a first round QB at the helm.

That cannot be disputed.

Really?

Because of the 27 that have won a SB, only 14 (52%) were 1st round picks. I don't see how that's "greatly increased."

That stat aside, again, it's a ridiculously small sample size.

It's something people who can't back their argument up say.

"There's never been a QB drafted in the 5th round win the SB."

BFD.

There HAVE been QB's win in every other round except the 7th, including the 9th round, 10th round and an UDFA.

It all means NOTHING, because football is a TEAM sport.

[DaneMcCloud]

Originally Posted by OnTheWarpath58

Exactly.

It's a team sport.

Hell, Jim Kelly took a pretty damn good team to the SB FOUR times, only to run into a better TEAM 3 times, and get let down by a kicker on the other.

Don't forget that Jim Kelly was a first rounder.

[OnTheWarpath15]

Originally Posted by DaneMcCloud

Don't forget that Jim Kelly was a first rounder.

But according to some, he's a POS because he never won a SB.

And without doing the research, there are several late round QB's that also went the the SB and lost, Hasselbeck and Bulger being the most recent.

[aturnis]

Originally Posted by BigChiefDave

This. When I was 24 I could throw a better deep ball.

no you couldn't.

[Mecca]

Originally Posted by OnTheWarpath58

Really?

Because of the 27 that have won a SB, only 14 (52%) were 1st round picks. I don't see how that's "greatly increased."

That stat aside, again, it's a ridiculously small sample size.

It's something people who can't back their argument up say.

"There's never been a QB drafted in the 5th round win the SB."

BFD.

There HAVE been QB's win in every other round except the 7th, including the 9th round, 10th round and an UDFA.

It all means NOTHING, because football is a TEAM sport.

Probably because that 52% is more than all the other rounds combined....then you factor in that 2 guys account for 7 of the non first 1st round bowls.

[Thig Lyfe]

Originally Posted by DaneMcCloud

And unless Kurt Warner wins the Super Bowl, that number will grow to 25.

He already has...

EDIT: Wait, I think I see what you mean.

[DrRyan]

Originally Posted by ChiefsCountry

Oh yes lets dont take the QB bc of the bust factor. Its about 70% that you will get at least a Pro Bowl QB with a top 5 pick.

I would love to see any kind of real facts to back this up. This is a blatantly made up statistic. You are claiming that 70% of QBs drafted in the top 5 become Pro Bowlers????

[ChiefsCountry]

Montana and Brady own I think its 16% of all-time Super Bowl wins. Not to mention Roger Stabuach, he was a 10th round pick bc of Vietnam.

[DaneMcCloud]

Originally Posted by OnTheWarpath58

Really?

Because of the 27 that have won a SB, only 14 (52%) were 1st round picks. I don't see how that's "greatly increased."

That stat aside, again, it's a ridiculously small sample size.

It's something people who can't back their argument up say.

"There's never been a QB drafted in the 5th round win the SB."

BFD.

There HAVE been QB's win in every other round except the 7th, including the 9th round, 10th round and an UDFA.

It all means NOTHING, because football is a TEAM sport.

Whoa, Cowboy.

It absolutely means SOMETHING.

If it were a meaningless stat, why would anyone bother drafting a QB in the first round, much like guards and centers?

If it were such a meaningless stat, why are 3 out of the 4 remaining teams left in the 2008 playoffs helmed by first round QB's?

Regardless of the fact that no QB drafted in the 5th and 7th rounds have never won a Super Bowl and regardless of the fact that four Super Bowls were won by Joe Montana (a third round choice) and three were won by Tom Brady (6th rounder), the best chance of winning the Super Bowl is with a first round selection.

Brady and Montana were anomalies that skew the stats. Both weren't "System QB's" that won on flukes. It was fluke that both were overlooked by scouts. In hindsight, there's absolutely no question that both would have gone number one overall in their respective draft years.

It's not a fluke that both are Hall of Fame players.

[OnTheWarpath15]

Originally Posted by Mecca

Probably because that 52% is more than all the other rounds combined....then you factor in that 2 guys account for 7 of the non first 1st round bowls.

Well, using that theory, there should be a LOT more.

After all, a 1st round pick SHOULD be a better player than a 5th round pick, right?

Regardless, as I've pointed out, it's a pointless stat.

You're basing this on TWENTY SEVEN QB's out of over a THOUSAND that have played the game at this level.