Chiefs Teicher: Waters thinks Chiefs don’t need offensive-line upgrade - Page 6

**Tribal Warfare** · 01-04-2010, 11:49 PM

Waters thinks Chiefs don’t need offensive-line upgrade
By ADAM TEICHER
The Kansas City Star

To Brian Waters, the numbers speak with clarity. During the season’s final few games, the Chiefs became one of the league’s most explosive running teams while significantly reducing the number of times quarterback Matt Cassel was sacked.

There can be no better endorsement of the Chiefs’ much-maligned offensive line.

“They say stuff rolls downhill, and we’re at the bottom,” Waters said Monday as the Chiefs, who finished their 4-12 season with a 44-24 win over the Broncos on Sunday in Denver, cleared out their lockers and scattered for winter. “We take that burden because we’re big boys.

“But the last two years, I don’t think that some of my offensive linemates have been judged properly. I feel a lot of eyes that have been judging some of my teammates are unqualified eyes. There are a lot of people basing their opinions off what they know, and a lot of people don’t know football.

“In our position, everything is all about what other guys do. Everything is about how many times the quarterback got hit or it’s all about how many rushing yards we had. We’re pretty much (tied) to the numbers.”

His comments suggest that given Kansas City’s recent offensive improvements, Waters, a four-time Pro Bowl guard, believes the Chiefs don’t need to make upgrading their offensive line an offseason priority.

During the season’s final eight games, running back Jamaal Charles trailed only Tennessee’s Chris Johnson in rushing yards with 968. Charles averaged 6 yards per carry in that time.

Chiefs quarterbacks were sacked 37 times in the first 10 games, but Cassel went down only eight times in the final six. In Denver, he wasn’t sacked for the first time all season.

Some of the improvement has to do with changes on the line. On the right side, Ryan O’Callaghan replaced Ikechuku Ndukwe at tackle and Wade Smith replaced Mike Goff at guard.

The line also had time to adjust after the Chiefs abruptly changed their offense during the preseason when they fired coordinator Chan Gailey.

“That affected us greatly,” Waters said. “We’d be lying to ourselves to not think that the change in offense two weeks before the regular season started didn’t harm what we had already kind of got going. But that’s the head coach’s prerogative to make that type of change.”

The biggest reason for the line’s improved play was Charles, who is smaller and quicker than Johnson and doesn’t need as much space to be an effective runner.

“What we were trying to do offensively wasn’t to the strength of Larry,” Waters said. “We were trying to be a little more open-space, a little bit more no-huddle, a little bit more fast-hitting type of offense. We know Larry, and when he was in his greatest time, he was more of a pounder.

“We finally got comfortable in what we were trying to do. The idea of what we were trying to do from game to game has changed through the course of the year and we finally settled on who we are and we weren’t going to change that.

“Talentwise, I don’t think I’ve ever played with anybody as talented as (Charles) is, with the explosive ability he has. He has the ability to make a 5-yard run a 50-yard run just like that.

“He has the ability to make us look better.”

Monday’s interview ended Waters’ seasonlong silence. Waters asked to be traded last winter shortly after Todd Haley was hired as the Chiefs’ head coach.

Waters said his silence shouldn’t be interpreted that he was unhappy playing for the Chiefs.

“With the stuff I came back here with during the offseason, I just wanted to kind of stand out of the way and just do my job and allow this whole situation to show itself,” Waters said. “I didn’t want to get in the way. I know people are always trying to make it seem like you feel this way or you feel that way. I just wanted people to see this whole program for themselves. I didn’t want to be a distraction.

“It was just a good year for me to focus on my own job.”

Waters started 15 games this season, missing last month’s Cleveland game because of a sore hamstring. That ended a streak of 51 consecutive starts.

He also missed out on the Pro Bowl after playing in Hawaii the previous year,

“I think I had a solid year,” Waters said. “I don’t think I performed any worse than I’ve performed over the last few years.

“I feel I have plenty left in the tank.”

Mr. Laz · 01-05-2010, 03:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chiefnj2

Yes. Imagine that, the veteran team leader who flies in on his own time and dime to meet with the new coach and in return gets verbally slapped in the face and treated like a child. The very same head coach who would throw tantrums all season long, fire the OC a week before the season starts and struggle on offense the rest of the season.

what in the hell does Waters have to do with changing the coaches?

if waters really wants to get thing iron out he can stop missing blocks.

FAX · 01-05-2010, 03:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chiefnj2

Yes. Imagine that, the veteran team leader who flies in on his own time and dime to meet with the new coach and in return gets verbally slapped in the face and treated like a child. The very same head coach who would throw tantrums all season long, fire the OC a week before the season starts and struggle on offense the rest of the season.

Jeez, Mr. Chiefnj2. You're an awesome Planeteer with posting prowess that is the envy of internet users throughout the world, but come on ...

That whole thing was Whittle's version of events. Nobody but Nick Athan knows the real story. Clearly, Waters wasn't treated like the superstar, in-his-prime, game-changing, left guard that he is, but when all the smoke cleared and the chips hit the floor and the fat lady belted out high C after clutching her giant panties in one hand and a dead rat in the other, Waters showed up for camp and did his job (not so well, I might add). So, whatever happened couldn't have been all that bad.

Besides, if Haley did indeed state that he could win 2 games with 22 guys off the street, he essentially proved that claim to be correct. We've gone through years of Uncle Dick's weeping and unwarranted loyalty and Herm's "player friendly until it's time to throw your ass under the bus" approach. It was past time to bring in a guy who could crack the whip and get these guys to either shape up or hit the bricks.

FAX

Saccopoo · 01-05-2010, 03:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chiefnj2

Yes. Imagine that, the veteran team leader who flies in on his own time and dime to meet with the new coach and in return gets verbally slapped in the face and treated like a child. The very same head coach who would throw tantrums all season long, fire the OC a week before the season starts and struggle on offense the rest of the season.

The problem is, he showed up two days before the draft was to happen without an appointment and under contract wanting to know what the new regime was planning. Busiest time of the season for a brand new admin and coach and he shows up unannounced and uninvited and wants a sit down with the brass about the direction of the team? As an aging guard that's already under contract? That's ridiculous.

Saccopoo · 01-05-2010, 03:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FAX

Besides, if Haley did indeed state that he could win 2 games with 22 guys off the street, he essentially proved that claim to be correct. We've gone through years of Uncle Dick's weeping and unwarranted loyalty and Herm's "player friendly until it's time to throw your ass under the bus" approach. It was past time to bring in a guy who could crack the whip and get these guys to either shape up or hit the bricks.

FAX

Bingo. In fact, Haley showed it was possible to win FOUR games with 22 guys off the street and do something that Dick or Herm was unable to do - win at Invesco (with the playoffs on the line to boot!).

Because fact of the matter is, top to bottom, the Chiefs are probably the least talented team in the league. The offensive line is made of one first round draft pick that's playing out of position (Albert), and a converted free agent full back that made his name playing between Roaf and Weigmann (Waters), and a bunch of first day cut cast offs from various teams. Linebackers? Other than an overachieving converted 4-3 LDE, an aging ROLB forced to play SSOLB (Vrabel) because your former frist round draft pick at SSOLB only decides to show up twice a year (Johnson), there's a bunch of special teamers at best at the rest of the positions (Mays, Williams) and one rookie who shows a little promise (Belcher). Tight end? Please. Defensive line? Rookie and a bunch of guys playing in the wrong scheme. Safety? Tragic.

I mean, other than Flowers, Cassel, Charles (who was finally given a chance due to LJ's ineptitude), Vrabel, Hali and possibly Albert, it would be hard to find anyone on this team that could/would challenge for a starting position on another team in the league. Jackson might, but he's a rook and had the learning curve thrown at him. Dorsey is so obviously out of position it borders on sad - please trade him for his sake and the teams sake.

Four games with 22 guys off the street. I think Haley short changed himself.

Hammock Parties · 01-05-2010, 04:24 PM

Albert is not out of position.

**HemiEd** · 01-05-2010, 04:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chiefnj2

Yes. Imagine that, the veteran team leader who flies in on his own time and dime to meet with the new coach and in return gets verbally slapped in the face and treated like a child. The very same head coach who would throw tantrums all season long, fire the OC a week before the season starts and struggle on offense the rest of the season.

That is not being a professional, he should have made an appointment and shown some respect for the new regimes time. They were trying to put together a staff and get ready for the draft.

No matter how you spin it, he was wrong. He was trying to do then, the same as he is now, make sure his job is safe. Nothing more, nothing less.

**HemiEd** · 01-05-2010, 04:38 PM

Furthermore, the distraction that Water's caused at that time, was anything but being a team leader. He was just another problem the new regime had to deal with.

Saccopoo · 01-05-2010, 04:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GoChiefs

Albert is not out of position.

Square peg in a round hole. The guy could be a dominating Pro Bowl level LG in this league. Let him be one. Let's get a guy in here that can actually play LT at a high level so Albert can be that special guy on the line - at his natural position.

Hammock Parties · 01-05-2010, 04:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Saccopoo

Square peg in a round hole. The guy could be a dominating Pro Bowl level LG in this league. Let him be one. Let's get a guy in here that can actually play LT at a high level so Albert can be that special guy on the line - at his natural position.

He is going to be an excellent left tackle. He has clearly gotten over his little slump as proven by the last month. He SHUT DOWN Dumervil Sunday.

suds79 · 01-05-2010, 04:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Saccopoo

Square peg in a round hole. The guy could be a dominating Pro Bowl level LG in this league. Let him be one. Let's get a guy in here that can actually play LT at a high level so Albert can be that special guy on the line - at his natural position.

How do you know that he'd be a pro bowl LG???

The guy had a real nice rookie year at LT. Started slow this year but finished strong.

And you already want to move our 1st rounder to a position that is normally filled by 5th round type of guys? We're talking about a Guard here...

We spent our 1st on a LT and we have one. We need interior O-line help and that can be filled middle to late in the draft.

Saccopoo · 01-05-2010, 04:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GoChiefs

He is going to be an excellent left tackle. He has clearly gotten over his little slump as proven by the last month. He SHUT DOWN Dumervil Sunday.

I don't know. I wouldn't complain if the Chiefs picked Okung, Campbell or Davis in the draft with their first pick or Beadles or Fox in the second/third and move Albert over to guard. Why not better two positions on the line rather than keep hoping that some guy will improve as he learns to play a new position? Albert, at this stage, has got to be an improvement over Waters at the LG position and a guy like Beadles or Black or Okung or Davis have played LT almost exclusively through their entire four year college career. Albert at LG would help make the transition from college to the pros a much faster one for both a new LT and a new C (which we all know we need). It's a win-win scenario for everyone.

SDChiefs · 01-05-2010, 05:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chiefnj2

Waters is always professional. Haley could learn a lot from the guy.

I hope you don't go to a game next year because Haley will flip you off for this.

Saccopoo · 01-05-2010, 05:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by suds79

How do you know that he'd be a pro bowl LG???

The guy had a real nice rookie year at LT. Started slow this year but finished strong.

And you already want to move our 1st rounder to a position that is normally filled by 5th round type of guys? We're talking about a Guard here...

We spent our 1st on a LT and we have one. We need interior O-line help and that can be filled middle to late in the draft.

Our first rounder never played a snap at LT until camp with the Chiefs. We drafted a LG with a first round pick. That's the fact of the matter. We are talking about a guard here. We did not spend our first round pick on a LT. He was a guard. And we do need interior line help. He would be that help. And he would be a major assest in developing both a new LT and a new C.

**DaneMcCloud** · 01-05-2010, 05:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Saccopoo

Square peg in a round hole. The guy could be a dominating Pro Bowl level LG in this league. Let him be one. Let's get a guy in here that can actually play LT at a high level so Albert can be that special guy on the line - at his natural position.

Fully disagree.

First off, left guard is NOT his natural position. Period.

Secondly, he has neither the upper or lower body strength to take on DT's and MLB's.

Thirdly, he plays best in space. He shut down Dumerville on Sunday.

He would be an absolutely failure at left guard.

He's a left tackle. Leave him the **** alone.

**DaneMcCloud** · 01-05-2010, 05:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Saccopoo

Our first rounder never played a snap at LT until camp with the Chiefs. We drafted a LG with a first round pick. That's the fact of the matter. We are talking about a guard here. We did not spend our first round pick on a LT. He was a guard. And we do need interior line help. He would be that help. And he would be a major assest in developing both a new LT and a new C.

JFC.

He was a GUARD because Eugene Monroe was incapable of playing anything but left tackle, so Albert moved to guard.

He is NOT a natural guard.

01-04-2010, 11:49 PM
Tribal Warfare Man of Culture Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Far Beyond Comprehension Casino cash: $-2877187	Teicher: Waters thinks Chiefs don’t need offensive-line upgrade Waters thinks Chiefs don’t need offensive-line upgrade By ADAM TEICHER The Kansas City Star To Brian Waters, the numbers speak with clarity. During the season’s final few games, the Chiefs became one of the league’s most explosive running teams while significantly reducing the number of times quarterback Matt Cassel was sacked. There can be no better endorsement of the Chiefs’ much-maligned offensive line. “They say stuff rolls downhill, and we’re at the bottom,” Waters said Monday as the Chiefs, who finished their 4-12 season with a 44-24 win over the Broncos on Sunday in Denver, cleared out their lockers and scattered for winter. “We take that burden because we’re big boys. “But the last two years, I don’t think that some of my offensive linemates have been judged properly. I feel a lot of eyes that have been judging some of my teammates are unqualified eyes. There are a lot of people basing their opinions off what they know, and a lot of people don’t know football. “In our position, everything is all about what other guys do. Everything is about how many times the quarterback got hit or it’s all about how many rushing yards we had. We’re pretty much (tied) to the numbers.” His comments suggest that given Kansas City’s recent offensive improvements, Waters, a four-time Pro Bowl guard, believes the Chiefs don’t need to make upgrading their offensive line an offseason priority. During the season’s final eight games, running back Jamaal Charles trailed only Tennessee’s Chris Johnson in rushing yards with 968. Charles averaged 6 yards per carry in that time. Chiefs quarterbacks were sacked 37 times in the first 10 games, but Cassel went down only eight times in the final six. In Denver, he wasn’t sacked for the first time all season. Some of the improvement has to do with changes on the line. On the right side, Ryan O’Callaghan replaced Ikechuku Ndukwe at tackle and Wade Smith replaced Mike Goff at guard. The line also had time to adjust after the Chiefs abruptly changed their offense during the preseason when they fired coordinator Chan Gailey. “That affected us greatly,” Waters said. “We’d be lying to ourselves to not think that the change in offense two weeks before the regular season started didn’t harm what we had already kind of got going. But that’s the head coach’s prerogative to make that type of change.” The biggest reason for the line’s improved play was Charles, who is smaller and quicker than Johnson and doesn’t need as much space to be an effective runner. “What we were trying to do offensively wasn’t to the strength of Larry,” Waters said. “We were trying to be a little more open-space, a little bit more no-huddle, a little bit more fast-hitting type of offense. We know Larry, and when he was in his greatest time, he was more of a pounder. “We finally got comfortable in what we were trying to do. The idea of what we were trying to do from game to game has changed through the course of the year and we finally settled on who we are and we weren’t going to change that. “Talentwise, I don’t think I’ve ever played with anybody as talented as (Charles) is, with the explosive ability he has. He has the ability to make a 5-yard run a 50-yard run just like that. “He has the ability to make us look better.” Monday’s interview ended Waters’ seasonlong silence. Waters asked to be traded last winter shortly after Todd Haley was hired as the Chiefs’ head coach. Waters said his silence shouldn’t be interpreted that he was unhappy playing for the Chiefs. “With the stuff I came back here with during the offseason, I just wanted to kind of stand out of the way and just do my job and allow this whole situation to show itself,” Waters said. “I didn’t want to get in the way. I know people are always trying to make it seem like you feel this way or you feel that way. I just wanted people to see this whole program for themselves. I didn’t want to be a distraction. “It was just a good year for me to focus on my own job.” Waters started 15 games this season, missing last month’s Cleveland game because of a sore hamstring. That ended a streak of 51 consecutive starts. He also missed out on the Pro Bowl after playing in Hawaii the previous year, “I think I had a solid year,” Waters said. “I don’t think I performed any worse than I’ve performed over the last few years. “I feel I have plenty left in the tank.”
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01-05-2010, 04:24 PM	#80
Hammock Parties I'll be back. Join Date: Nov 2002 Casino cash: $920478	Albert is not out of position. __________________ Chiefs game films
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01-05-2010, 04:38 PM	#82
HemiEd Supporter Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Ozarks Casino cash: $-389436	Furthermore, the distraction that Water's caused at that time, was anything but being a team leader. He was just another problem the new regime had to deal with.
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