A case for Tyler Thigpen

[MMXcalibur]

http://blogs.nfl.com/2009/08/27/a-ca...tyler-thigpen/

Thursday, August 27 2009
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Jason La Canfora
A case for Tyler Thigpen
Posted: August 27th, 2009 | Jason La Canfora | Tags: Baltimore Ravens, Ben Roethlisberger, Brodie Croyle, Buffalo Bills, Chicago Bears, Green Bay Packers, Jacksonville Jaguars, Joe Flacco, Kansas City Chiefs, Matt Cassel, Matt Ryan, New England Patriots, New Orleans Saints, trades, Tyler Thigpen, Wildcat

I have a question for you guys: Name a first-year starting quarterback who accounted for more touchdowns than Super Bowl-winning veteran Ben Roethlisberger or standout rookies Joe Flacco and Matt Ryan last season? Here’s another one: Of all the players who ran the ball at least 50 times last season, who led the NFL in yards per carry?

OK, so the title of this blog makes the answer pretty much a dead giveaway. I think we all know who I’m talking about here (for the record, he averaged 6.2 yards per carry on 62 rushes). But I’m going to say it (read: type it): I like Tyler Thigpen. I’m not afraid to admit it, and I know some savvy NFL scouts/executives who value him, too.

I like Thigpen’s guts and competitiveness. I love his athleticism. I think he’s a playmaker who’s still quite raw (a 25-year-old who became a starter for a lame-duck staff last season, out of Coastal Carolina of all places) and has some warts but a ton of upside. He’s a kid who flashed some real talent, yet was surrounded by an Amy Winehouse-thin roster in Kansas City last season (having no defense and no running game did him no favors).

And it’s clear that the new Chiefs regime prefers Matt Cassel and Brodie Croyle to him — because Thigpen is being shopped — but if I’m running the average NFL team (which means I probably have 1.5 capable QBs on my roster, and, yeah I’m going to use a lot of parenthesis in this post), I’m making a play for this kid, even if it costs me more than a fifth-round draft pick (the current asking price).

So, let’s go back to the beginning here, a very good place to start.

Thigpen was thrust into duty after the Chiefs’ other quarterbacks went down with season-ending injuries. He ended up accounting for 22 touchdowns (18 passing, three rushing and one receiving) in just 11 starts for a 2-14 team that had some deep flaws. Roethlisberger, a $100 million QB, won a Super Bowl with help from the game’s best defense and accounted for 19 TDs (17 passing, two rushing) in 16 starts.

So Thigpen, as a second-year pro with no prior experience and a last-place roster around him, threw for 2,608 yards and 18 TDs with 12 interceptions in the first 11 starts of his career. And Roethlisberger, already fully polished and with a Super Bowl-quality roster around him, threw for 3,301 yards and 17 TDs with 15 interceptions in 16 games. Hmm, interesting. And Roethlisberger had as many turnovers as Thigpen did scores.

OK. In no way am I trying to say Thigpen is remotely the QB and playmaker than Big Ben is (nor could anyone expect him to be), but tell me this kid might not be worth a shot at being better than most teams’ current backup passer. (Personally, I think he’s a heck of a lot better than Croyle, for one, but I’m obviously not running any NFL teams). Hang with me here.

Ryan, the third overall pick in the 2008 draft, won the NFL Offensive Rookie of the Year award, had the league’s best running game and a stout Falcons defense behind him, and he accounted for 17 total TDs in 16 starts. Flacco also was a first-round pick in 2008, started 16 games for a Ravens team with the league’s second-best defense and a robust running attack, and he accounted for 16 total TDs.

Let’s take it a little deeper. Well, Jason, you dope, the Chiefs stunk and Thigpen just put up a bunch of meaningless numbers while chasing teams in the second half of games, right?

Not so fast. The Chiefs either led entering the fourth quarter, led in the fourth quarter or were tied entering the fourth quarter in seven of Thigpen’s final 10 games. If anything, questionable play-calling, a horrid running game and an atrocious defense conspired against the young QB.

Overall, could Thigpen be better in the fourth quarter? Sure, he had a 62.0 rating and completed just 50 percent of his passes (four fourth-quarter TDs to four fourth-quarter interceptions isn’t that bad, though). This was a kid from a small school thrust into emergency starts with little coaching, and as we know, inexperienced passers tend to have issues late in games. Thigpen also was sacked 11 times on just 123 fourth-quarter pass attempts, so a suspect offensive line and lack of any sort of competent defense didn’t make things any easier on him.

Well, what about Thigpen completing just 55 percent of his passes and throwing 12 interceptions in just 14 games? Neither is ideal, no doubt. But let’s look at his offensive weapons. Dwayne Bowe and Devard Darling were his starting receivers. It wasn’t exactly the sure-hands crew. Besides having perennial Pro Bowl TE Tony Gonzalez, this kid was on his own.

As I said, Thigpen is raw and has some flaws, so coach him up (he was the first quarterback in Coastal Carolina history for goodness sake, with the program starting in 2003) and help him with film study and fundamentals. There is plenty to work with there.

This kid is incredibly fast — on his runs, he was almost never tackled by someone in the front seven. You can’t tell me he’s not one of the 64 best QBs out there, and given his skills and speed, he definitely could be someone who could help in the Wildcat. At 6-foot-1 and 224 pounds, Thigpen can take a hit.

As for the interceptions, that’s pretty common with young QBs. And the first came in a mop-up role in his first appearance of 2008, and three more came in his first NFL start, against the eventual NFC South champion Falcons, when you’d expect him to be nervous.

In the final 10 games, all starts, Thigpen threw 16 touchdown passes to eight interceptions. Not too shabby. And that’s far beyond anything the first-round bonus babies (JaMarcus Russell and Brady Quinn) from Thigpen’s draft year (2007) have accomplished.

Well, sure, those are decent numbers, but come on, the dude was in a shotgun most of the time and not a traditional offense?

Yep, the Chiefs, in desperation, got a bit gimmicky last season and spread things out. But a lot of teams are going more that route, and you guys tell me that Tom Brady (and last year, Cassel) and Flacco and Roethlisberger aren’t back there quite a bit, too.

Wow, I never thought I’d write this much about Tyler Thigpen, but, alas, it has happened. But how can you not like the kid? Never invited to the combine, seventh-round pick by the Vikings, claimed off waivers by the Chiefs in September 2007, tore his medial collateral ligament that rookie season and then ended up starting 11 games the next year when no one expected it, and, best as I can tell, did some pretty nice stuff.

And now, someone, if they’re smart, will meet the Chiefs’ price and trade for Thigpen. Sure, a third- or fourth-round pick is considerable, but when you look at what the kid has done, how valuable his position is and how few quality alternatives exist (let alone talented 25-year-olds), to me, a fourth-round pick is surely worth the shot.

The Jaguars have expressed the most interest to this point, and that’s one of several teams with a significant need for a backup QB. The Bills, Bears, Packers and Saints also have been closely monitoring the QB market. And people I talk to around the league don’t discount the Patriots making a move for a QB, too — particularly one who could provide a Wildcat element. The Ravens seriously considered trading for Thigpen before ultimately opting to sign Cleo Lemon a little while back, league sources said.

Some team will come away with a solid prospect in Thigpen, and frankly, I’m not quite sure why the Chiefs didn’t give him more of a look before locking in on Cassel.

Thigpen overload lately.

[Reaper16]

Is this thread really happening?

[OnTheWarpath15]

You can sum up the pro-Thigpen folks thoughts this way:

Pioli is a genius, except in this case. He's an idiot for choosing Croyle/Gutierrez over Thigpen.

Y'all have a serious case of the red ass.

[chiefzilla1501]

Originally Posted by OnTheWarpath58

The Kansas City Chiefs apparently don't think he's worth a shit, and IMO, neither do other teams, seeing as how nothing better than a 5th round pick has been offered.

If Thigpen wad the player you claim he is, teams would be fighting over his services. But that's not the case.

This late in the game? Not a lot of teams want to bring in a raw backup QB. They either want a veteran who can immediately compete for a starting job or they want a veteran backup who can quickly learn the offense and be a safety seal in case the starter gets hurt. Last thing you want is to walk into game 1, get your starter injured, and you're suddenly forced to play a QB who has no idea how to run your offense. Couple that with the fact that these discussions are being made so close to the cut deadline.

I think most teams know if the Chiefs are shopping him around, that they have a lot of negotiating leverage. For the same reason that Cassel could command almost no value in the trade market.

[Sweet Daddy Hate]

Originally Posted by JASONSAUTO

someone could say this about you and the cassel situation also

Someone could tell you to "fetch-a Sake".


SAUTO; FETCH-A SAKE!


*Here we see SAUTO preparing to fetch-a Sake directly from the source.

[Bane]

Originally Posted by OnTheWarpath58

You can sum up the pro-Thigpen folks thoughts this way:

Pioli is a genius, except in this case. He's an idiot for choosing Croyle/Gutierrez over Thigpen.

Y'all have a serious case of the red ass.

You cant sum me up any way cause you don't know me.I think who ever plays the best should be the starter,then they guys thats next should be the back up.I would think every team in the league would apply that same logic.They can keep/trade/cut whoever,I'm just tired of watching Brodie spend the whole damn season on the IR.

[chiefzilla1501]

Originally Posted by OnTheWarpath58

He got his shot and apparently whiffed.

It's funny that so many have given Pioli a pass so far, but are implying he's an idiot for choosing Croyle and Gutierrez over him.

I sure as shit am not giving Pioli a pass. I think he whiffed big time on the offensive line and wide receiver situation and I've spoken out about it. And I still contend that it was stupid to trade away Gonzalez. And if he keeps Guttierrez over Thigpen, so be it... I just happen to think it will be the absolute wrong decision and I can't help but wonder if it is motivated in some way by croneyism.

[KCDC]

Originally Posted by OnTheWarpath58

You can sum up the pro-Thigpen folks thoughts this way:

Pioli is a genius, except in this case. He's an idiot for choosing Croyle/Gutierrez over Thigpen.

Y'all have a serious case of the red ass.

We "pro-Thigpen" people are not questioning Pioli at all. The fact that he may be shopping him is fine with me. I am glad that Pioli is holding out for more than a 5th rounder. It only strengthens my opinion of him as a GM. The anti-Thigpen folks here would cut him for nothing. It only weakens my opinion of them.

Pioli/Haley may keep Thigpen as a backup, which is fine with me. If you are going to trade the guy, get better than a 5th round pick, who likely will be lucky to make our practice squad next year.

[the Talking Can]

Originally Posted by chiefzilla1501

I don't think there are many "pro Thigpen" people out there saying he should be a starter either. Most just want to see him develop on the bench and see what comes of him.

But go to any Thigpen thread. 90% of the posters say they can't wait for him to be gone. Many of them say that no GM thinks he's any good and some of them say he doesn't deserve to be in an NFL uniform. Almost all of them are saying that a GM is stupid to trade any kind of pick for Thigpen. Basically, almost all the posts say he's garbage and he always will be, and there is no chance he will ever be better than garbage.

I don't know why it came to people despising the man, but it has. And that's a shame.

people like you who cry over thigpen like he were a wounded vet from Iraq make me relish the day his over rated ass gets shipped out of here into obscurity...the radio in kc today was full broken hearts telling us how unfair it was, how great he was, how his stats were the same as real QBs, that he was worth a second, that we should create a special offense for him, and on and on....**** me in the eye socket


Cassel is a real QB. Thigpen is a novelty.

[Bane]

Originally Posted by KCDC

We "pro-Thigpen" people are not questioning Pioli at all. The fact that he may be shopping him is fine with me. I am glad that Pioli is holding out for more than a 5th rounder. It only strengthens my opinion of him as a GM. The anti-Thigpen folks here would cut him for nothing. It only weakens my opinion of them.

Pioli/Haley may keep Thigpen as a backup, which is fine with me. If you are going to trade the guy, get better than a 5th round pick, who likely will be lucky to make our practice squad next year.

Im pro-whoever is the best player.

[Sweet Daddy Hate]

Originally Posted by KCDC

We "pro-Thigpen" people are not questioning Pioli at all. The fact that he may be shopping him is fine with me. I am glad that Pioli is holding out for more than a 5th rounder. It only strengthens my opinion of him as a GM. The anti-Thigpen folks here would cut him for nothing. It only weakens my opinion of them.

Pioli/Haley may keep Thigpen as a backup, which is fine with me. If you are going to trade the guy, get better than a 5th round pick, who likely will be lucky to make our practice squad next year.

[Bane]

Originally Posted by the Talking Can

people like you who cry over thigpen like he were a wounded vet from Iraq make me relish the day his over rated ass gets shipped out of here into obscurity...


Cassel is a real QB. Thigpen is a novelty.

I hope you are right.

[chiefzilla1501]

Originally Posted by the Talking Can

people like you who cry over thigpen like he were a wounded vet from Iraq make me relish the day his over rated ass gets shipped out of here into obscurity...the radio in kc today was full broken hearts telling us how unfair it was, how great he was, how his stats were the same as real QBs, that he was worth a second, that we should create a special offense for him, and on and on....**** me in the eye socket


Cassel is a real QB. Thigpen is a novelty.

You get those idiots no matter what. I could care less about those people. I care more about making the right decisions for the Chiefs.

He doesn't deserve that kind of ridiculous praise, but that's what you get with a home team--lots of homers. He also doesn't deserve all the hate.

[Titty Meat]

The Chiefs better hurry up and trade Thigpen for a 5th. The Bucs are shopping Leftwich, Mccown, and Johnson.

[OnTheWarpath15]

Originally Posted by billay

The Chiefs better hurry up and trade Thigpen for a 5th. The Bucs are shopping Leftwich, Mccown, and Johnson.

McCown might be going to Green Bay.

[SAUTO]

Originally Posted by OnTheWarpath58

The Kansas City Chiefs apparently don't think he's worth a shit, and IMO, neither do other teams, seeing as how nothing better than a 5th round pick has been offered.

If Thigpen wad the player you claim he is, teams would be fighting over his services. But that's not the case.

what makes you say that? they have released him? no. they supposedly were offered a 5th and turned it down. obviously they think he's worth something