Chiefs Haley's termination. Cliff notes and highlites? - Page 8

milkman · 12-13-2011, 10:33 PM

So I've worked long hours the last couple of days, and haven't had much time to read the threads.

In perusing a couple of threads, I've seen someone alluding to "things we've learned" about this firing.

Can someone enlighten me what it is we've learned?

jd1020 · 12-14-2011, 01:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dave

2 words: Jamaal Charles

So if a RB was cause for Cassels success then he didn't progress at all. Weis just designed an offense to make the best of what he had and Haley doesn't deserve shit for Cassel because nothing changed.

Hammock Parties · 12-14-2011, 01:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jd1020

So if a RB was cause for Cassels success then he didn't progress at all. Weis just designed an offense to make the best of what he had and Haley doesn't deserve shit for Cassel because nothing changed.

Haley probably made Cassel protect the ball better, maybe improved his footwork a little.

We scored because of Charles.

Hammock Parties · 12-14-2011, 01:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BossChief

Haley did a fine job of polishing a turd in 2010. He made Cassel look like a NFL quarterback....that alone should tell you how good of a coach he is.

And then that coaching fell apart in 2011?

Sounds like bullshit to me.

Cassel won 11 games and looked like an NFL QB in 2008.

**BigMeatballDave** · 12-14-2011, 01:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jd1020

So if a RB was cause for Cassels success they he didn't progress at all. Weis just designed an offense to make the best of what he had and Haley doesn't deserve shit for Cassel because nothing changed.

You can only mask a turd so much.

Jc is the type of player Defenses have to gameplan for.

**cdcox** · 12-14-2011, 01:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fritz88

Then why wasn't Cassel improving this season? Why didn't Cassel show any flashes of being an average QB in Haley's first season?

It was all Weis who got the most out of Cassel by calling the right plays and knowing how to maximize the potential of those around him.
Posted via Mobile Device

All of your questions can be answered by the realization that at his core, Cassel is a lousy QB. Cassel had a few good games against a weak schedule. It wasn't by accident that I put quotes around "improvements".

Charles Robinson's tweets are the most parsimonious rumors/speculation/reading-between-the-lines story that could explain all of the stupidity we've seen surrounding this franchise. Not to mention that he has a ton of credibility. The only guy that has a clue about QB play (Weis) thinks Cassel is not worth his time.

Hammock Parties · 12-14-2011, 01:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BossChief

I will always believe that Haley would have saved his job if he had just moved on to Stanzi after Palkos first game.

I will be interested to see what you say when Haley is coaching WRs in 5 years.

**BossChief** · 12-14-2011, 01:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fritz88

Then why wasn't Cassel improving this season? Why didn't Cassel show any flashes of being an average QB in Haley's first season?

It was all Weis who got the most out of Cassel by calling the right plays and knowing how to maximize the potential of those around him.
Posted via Mobile Device

Im gonna go ahead and believe one of the most rock solid sources in the media over your opinion.

Haley coached Cassel up after Weis quit on the project.

That info also makes me wonder if Weis really did want Clausen and that him quitting on Cassel that early was a sign that the team needed to draft or trade for somebody to replace him with.

Watch Weis get back into the NFL after another year and for him to make a trade for Jimmy to be his QB.

Stranger things have happened.

Quote:

Originally Posted by jd1020

So if a RB was cause for Cassels success then he didn't progress at all. Weis just designed an offense to make the best of what he had and Haley doesn't deserve shit for Cassel because nothing changed.

If you really believe this, you are one of the most "football stupid" posters here.

It was against bad defenses, but Cassel looked really good during part of 2010.

Guys like The Bad Guy talked about him as if he was in the MVP race.

**BigMeatballDave** · 12-14-2011, 01:38 AM

I don't care who gets credit for it now.

Think about the 1st 2 games of the 2010 season. Remember how shitty Matt was? Wtf was Weis doing then?

BigRock · 12-14-2011, 01:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cdcox

Pioli loves Weis.
Weis hated Cassel.
Pioli loves Cassel.
Haley loves Cassel.
Pioli won't listen to his guy Weis about Cassel.
Haley is on the same page as Pioli on Cassel, yet they openly war.
Obviously the whole franchise is dys-****ing-functional.
Meanwhile Clark fiddles while Rome burns.

I don't understand where anyone got "Haley loved Cassel" in anything Charles Robinson was tweeting yesterday. For that matter, Robinson has since said that "Weis hated Cassel" isn't an accurate summary either, pointing out that Pioli never would have hired Weis if he didn't think Cassel could be great.

Robinson said that Haley and Weis disagreed on Cassel's development. Whatever Haley wanted to get from Cassel, Weis didn't think Cassel was capable of it. Presumably, what Haley wanted was how Cassel was playing down the stretch last year, since Robinson says that was the direct result of Haley working with him. What Weis wanted to do is anyone's guess.

None of that translates into "Haley loved Cassel". Cassel is the quarterback. The team and Haley's career were tied to Cassel's performance. Of course Haley's going to want to get everything he can out of him.

The only thing that seems clear from Robinson's tweets is that Weis came in here and didn't really give a shit. Rock Chalk~!

jd1020 · 12-14-2011, 01:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BossChief

If you really believe this, you are one of the most "football stupid" posters here.

It was against bad defenses, but Cassel looked really good during part of 2010.

Guys like The Bad Guy talked about him as if he was in the MVP race.

Cassel was good against bad defenses, coincidentally the same ****ing opponents, in 2008.

So what changed?

**BossChief** · 12-14-2011, 01:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Omega

Haley probably made Cassel protect the ball better, maybe improved his footwork a little.

We scored because of Charles.

true

Quote:

Originally Posted by Omega

And then that coaching fell apart in 2011?

Sounds like bullshit to me.

Cassel won 11 games and looked like an NFL QB in 2008.

Its not that it "fell apart" its that Haley was asking Cassel to take that next step.

Haley is smart enough to know that you arent gonna win big playoff games with the gameplan we had in 2010....Baltimore reinforced that...Cassel was put in position to take the next step in his development and showed the world he was incapable of doing so.

Dont you remember us all talking about how Cassel was being asked to do more at the start of the year and was failing at it?

I sure as hell do.

Cassel is costing really good coaches their jobs left and right since 2009.

Hopefully, that ends.

I have some level of hope that Pioli is gonna make a smoke screen to make it seem as if we have no interest in drafting a quarterback.

I doubt he brings any of the top guys in for a private workout (only the guys that are looked at as late round picks), but brings in every single linemen, linebacker, running back and safety thats thought of as a first round pick.

Throw everyone off the scent so teams dont think they have to leapfrog us to draft their guy.

Why, you might ask?

Because thats pretty close to what I would do.

Then, BOOM goes the dynamite and Pioli becomes the golden God of KC.

(I can dream, cant I?)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Omega

I will be interested to see what you say when Haley is coaching WRs in 5 years.

If that happens, I will have no problem admitting I am wrong.

Never have.

Now, when Haley does as I say....I fully expect you to say this conversation never happened and I will be too lazy to look it up.

Hammock Parties · 12-14-2011, 01:51 AM

Well, I will give you your due if Haley even coordinates a top 10 offense in this league again.

I think he probably got screwed over here a little bit, but that he was never going to be more than an average head coach.

For the record I always liked the guy, but I used to like Gunther, too.

**BossChief** · 12-14-2011, 01:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jd1020

Cassel was good against bad defenses, coincidentally the same ****ing opponents, in 2008.

So what changed?

I dont even know what you're asking here.

I said it was mostly against bad defenses...

I can also say that I watched 11 of those 2008 games of his in NE (on NFL replay) and had my eyes totally wide open as to his strengths and weaknesses well before he was traded for.

The same strengths and weaknesses he still has to this day.

Hammock Parties · 12-14-2011, 01:54 AM

Quote:

Its not that it "fell apart" its that Haley was asking Cassel to take that next step.

Haley is smart enough to know that you arent gonna win big playoff games with the gameplan we had in 2010....Baltimore reinforced that...Cassel was put in position to take the next step in his development and showed the world he was incapable of doing so.

I don't buy that.

See the first half of the San Diego game as proof.

JCharles1981 · 12-14-2011, 01:55 AM

We learned that.....

1. the moment our team ends a season by winning their division, Team Personnel lets the offensive coordinator go and hires someone with little to no experience in his place.

2. Scott Pioli is Clark Hunt's b*tch.

3. our streak of signing career back up QB's may never end.

4. King Carl is capable of putting the Chiefs in the playoffs year after year, but Pioli isn't.

5. you don't hire a guy to be Head Coach just because he was offensive coordinator for a Superbowl team that lost. Plus, let's not forget that Haley made himself both HC and OC his first year with the Chiefs after firing the OC that was brought in prior to the 2009 preseason.

12-13-2011, 10:33 PM
milkman Dumbass! Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Leading the Marty bashing Casino cash: $10029395	Haley's termination. Cliff notes and highlites? So I've worked long hours the last couple of days, and haven't had much time to read the threads. In perusing a couple of threads, I've seen someone alluding to "things we've learned" about this firing. Can someone enlighten me what it is we've learned?
Posts: 70,769

12-14-2011, 01:38 AM	#113
BigMeatballDave GBM 8-12-15 Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Dayton, Oh. Casino cash: $10052154	I don't care who gets credit for it now. Think about the 1st 2 games of the 2010 season. Remember how shitty Matt was? Wtf was Weis doing then?
Posts: 59,997

12-14-2011, 01:51 AM	#117
Hammock Parties I'll be back. Join Date: Nov 2002 Casino cash: $830478	Well, I will give you your due if Haley even coordinates a top 10 offense in this league again. I think he probably got screwed over here a little bit, but that he was never going to be more than an average head coach. For the record I always liked the guy, but I used to like Gunther, too. __________________ Chiefs game films
Posts: 297,373

12-14-2011, 01:55 AM	#120
JCharles1981 Starter Join Date: Nov 2011 Casino cash: $10005489	We learned that..... 1. the moment our team ends a season by winning their division, Team Personnel lets the offensive coordinator go and hires someone with little to no experience in his place. 2. Scott Pioli is Clark Hunt's b*tch. 3. our streak of signing career back up QB's may never end. 4. King Carl is capable of putting the Chiefs in the playoffs year after year, but Pioli isn't. 5. you don't hire a guy to be Head Coach just because he was offensive coordinator for a Superbowl team that lost. Plus, let's not forget that Haley made himself both HC and OC his first year with the Chiefs after firing the OC that was brought in prior to the 2009 preseason.
Posts: 497