Phelps clan getting sued

[cookster50]

http://www.eveningsun.com/ci_7277523?source=most_viewed

Father: Funeral protest made him sick
By ALEX DOMINGUEZ
Associated Press Writer
Article Launched: 10/25/2007 10:24:57 AM EDT



BALTIMORE -- The father of a Marine killed in Iraq took the stand in his invasion of privacy suit against a fundamentalist church that pickets soldiers' funerals, saying protesters carrying signs at his son's burial made him sick to his stomach.

Albert Snyder said Wednesday he had hoped for a private funeral for his son, Lance Cpl. Matthew Snyder.

"They turned this funeral into a media circus and they wanted to hurt my family," Snyder testified. "They wanted their message heard and they didn't care who they stepped over. My son should have been buried with dignity, not with a bunch of clowns outside."

Snyder is suing the Westboro Baptist church, whose members have picketed the funerals of military personnel killed in Iraq and Afghanistan, claiming the deaths are punishment for the country's tolerance of homosexuality. The York resident is seeking unspecified monetary damages in the case for invasion of privacy and intent to inflect emotional distress as a result of the Topeka, Kan., church's protest at his son's funeral in Westminster in March 2006.

The church's protests have inspired several state laws and a federal law about funeral protests, but the Maryland suit is believed to be the first filed by the family of a fallen serviceman.

Asked Wednesday about a sign that read "Thank God for dead soldiers," Snyder said he thinks about it daily.

"I see that sign when I lay in bed," Snyder said.

Asked about statements issued by the group that his son was raised to support the "Roman Catholic monstrosity" and then sent to fight for the "United States of Sodomy," Snyder said "they have no right to do this to people they didn't know."

During cross-examination, defense attorney Jonathan Katz focused on obituaries and death notices and questioned Snyder on whether they said the funeral services were private. Snyder replied that the notices said friends and family were welcome, but admitted that he did not know all of the 500 or so people who attended.

The case tests the limits of the First Amendment right to free speech.

U.S. District Court Judge Richard Bennett instructed jurors at the start of testimony Tuesday that the First Amendment protection of free speech has limits, including vulgar, offensive and shocking statements. Bennett said the jurors must decide "whether the defendant's actions would be highly offensive to a reasonable person, whether they were extreme and outrageous, and whether these actions were so offensive and shocking as to not be entitled to First Amendment protection."

Church members said they are motivated by the fear of God and their need to warn America about its moral decay, rather than a desire to hurt anyone.

Katz told jurors Tuesday the protests took place 1,000 feet away from St. John Catholic Church, where the funeral was held, down a hill and out of sight and hearing from participants.

Snyder said American military personnel are in Iraq fighting for freedom of speech "they're not fighting for hate speech." One photo showing a child holding a sign at the funeral protest was particularly disturbing, the father said.

"I pray for their children. Their children need help. To be brought up with that kind of hatred," Snyder said.

"My God is loving God," Snyder said, adding later "I don't look for hatred in the Bible."

The church's founder and pastor, Fred Phelps, took the stand after Snyder and prompted a strong admonition from Bennett when the pastor said he had not considered whether children would see a sign carried by protesters with the words "Semper Fi bundle of stickss" and two stick figures that appear to be engaged in sodomy.

"No, it's an irrelevancy," Phelps said.

Bennett then interjected sharply.

"Just answer the question, sir. Don't determine what's relevant or not relevant. You just answer the question," Bennett said.

Phelps said he chose to use the term "bundle of sticks" in the group's signs because it comes from scripture but could also have used Sodomite or dog. When asked by Katz why the group made a "Semper Fi bundle of stickss" sign, Phelps said it was in response to the need for a warning to the country "that your wicked ways are going to be your doom shortly."

[MIAdragon]

forget that, hang'em

[CoMoChief]

This is one of the very few groups that I actually wish death upon them.

[KCChiefsMan]

these Phelps people all need to be shot.

[HypnotizedMonkey]

yeah that's not cool

[mcan]

Shouldn't be found guilty of anything. As much as I hate them and think they are insane, we can't start down this path... I have a right to speak my opinions no matter I am the only one who thinks it, or if the rest of the world finds my opinion to be monstrous. We need to stand as a nation and defend that right to the nth degree... It's hard though, to recognize that freedom extends to people and actions that we disapprove of. But, the fact remains, the Westboro clan thinks that homosexuality is worse than what they are doing, yet they don't sue homosexuals. They protest. So, if you don't like what Westboro is doing, you have a voice... Use it.

[mcan]

If you think about it... Sueing these guys puts everybody in a lose-lose situation.


If they win, we will only strengthen their resolve and they will escalate their actions under the guise that they have the right and a court case to prove it.

If they lose, we all lose our right to express disagreement with the majority. We add even more caveats to free speach and make vulgarity against the law. Sure, a family might feel vindicated for a short while and Westboro might be stopped. But we all lose in the end. And it won't bring back their son.

[Dartgod]

helps said he chose to use the term "Rump Ranger" in the group's signs because it comes from scripture...

Rump Ranger is in the Bible?

[beach tribe]

My best friend died in Iraq last year. We pelted their asses with rocks and spitt as we drove out of the parking lot. The cops laughed.

[Mr. Plow]

I may have an opinion that everyone doesn't like, but I don't have the right to interfere with the funeral of someone I don't know just to get my opinion heard.

[Mr. Plow]

On second thought, just kill them all.

[mcan]

Originally Posted by Mr. Plow

I may have an opinion that everyone doesn't like, but I don't have the right to interfere with the funeral of someone I don't know just to get my opinion heard.

How far away do they have to be for it to be legal then? Can they protest it from the next town? From their own living rooms? These are all slippery slope arguments. The law says you have to be a certain distance away. So they are. Increase the distance if you want, but don't make it illegal... We're heading down a crazy road then.

[cookster50]

Originally Posted by Dartgod

Rump Ranger is in the Bible?

Yeah, here is the text:

"And Dartgod is thy Rump Ranger, Satan." Exodus 99:9

[kaplin42]

Originally Posted by mcan

Shouldn't be found guilty of anything. As much as I hate them and think they are insane, we can't start down this path... I have a right to speak my opinions no matter I am the only one who thinks it, or if the rest of the world finds my opinion to be monstrous. We need to stand as a nation and defend that right to the nth degree... It's hard though, to recognize that freedom extends to people and actions that we disapprove of. But, the fact remains, the Westboro clan thinks that homosexuality is worse than what they are doing, yet they don't sue homosexuals. They protest. So, if you don't like what Westboro is doing, you have a voice... Use it.

I agree 100%. They have a right to say what ever they want to and as long as they have the proper permits and legal stuff for their demonstrations, then they are protected by the 1st amendment.


Now, as a personal aside, I would glady take crowbar to each and every one of them for being raging assholes.

[Adept Havelock]

Originally Posted by mcan

How far away do they have to be for it to be legal then? Can they protest it from the next town? From their own living rooms? These are all slippery slope arguments. The law says you have to be a certain distance away. So they are. Increase the distance if you want, but don't make it illegal... We're heading down a crazy road then.

I have to agree. I find the Phelps clan absolutely loathsome, but they have a right to say whatever hateful nonsense they want.

Originally Posted by beach tribe

My best friend died in Iraq last year. We pelted their asses with rocks and spitt as we drove out of the parking lot. The cops laughed.

Glad to hear it.

I also am a big fan of the "Patriot Guard" who block the families from these nuts.