Buying out a Business Partner?

[Jenson71]

Originally Posted by R8ers

Option 3


Never go into a partnership with anyone in business... Messy Messy Messy

Well, I wouldn't go that far . . .

[Bill Lundberg]

Originally Posted by DaneMcCloud

Hiring a CPA to "go over the books" is meaningless.

What you need is a valuation of the business. It doesn't matter if they put $100k into the business if it's worth $5k.

Good luck!

Dane is wise. Having been through this myself, he's absolutely correct. Don't forget, you're not only buying their share of the business. You're also buying their share of the debt and liability/risk, it is absolutely crazy to think you can get $ for $ that soon after starting a business.

[Codered]

I agree with a lot that has been said already. It's almost laughable that they expect money at this point in the business juncture.

[BIG_DADDY]

Your friend isn't very bright. The value of the business is the value of the business. If she was taking money and making it look like it's losing money you are going to get it back on the valuation. You can go down the other road and try and prove embezzlement but that may turn out being far more costly.

[tooge]

really, a combination of all of the above. Here is what I would do.
1. Have the partner produce receipts for everything they are claiming they put into the business. This is a must. If they are unable to do so, then it doesn't count.
2. Decide which costs they contend they put in are actually requirments for the business. In other words, gas, lunch, lap top for home, etc. don't count.
3. Have an accountant go over the receipts as well as the business records to show a true split of assets and worth. You will probably need to get an outside accountant that isn't associated with either of you so there is no bias.
4. If it seems that there is cash flow to operate the business without you having to sadle yourselves with debt that cant be covered by the business, then you have a tough decision to make. You may have to cut your losses if not. If there is, then you can buy them out and move forward.
5. Have an attorney draft a buy out agreement that includes all the pertinent stuff like no compete, etc. and move forward. Otherwise, have them draft a dissolution agreement.

[Ace Gunner]

Change out the locks. Hire a CPA asap. then let them come with their BS. make your offer, if they don't take, let them make the next move. courts usually assign arbitration in these matters.

[LOCOChief]

#3

[Rain Man]

There are several informal methods for valuing a company. The ones I use in our own accounting are:

1. Average of the last five years of profit (Average profit per year) There's some adjustment you make, and I don't remember why, but I divide that number by 0.15 to get a value estimate. You also have to add in any salary the owner takes.
2. Average of the last five years of revenue.
3. Most recent year of revenues, plus any salary the owner takes.
4. Dividend paying ability, which is more or less the amount of total salary and profit the owner takes (in the most recent year)

I use all four and then average them since they can vary widely depending on a number of factors. These figures do not include things like the value of inventory, cash on hand, and the liability of a lease.

[Ace Gunner]

Originally Posted by Rain Man

There are several informal methods for valuing a company. The ones I use in our own accounting are:

1. Average of the last five years of profit (Average profit per year) There's some adjustment you make, and I don't remember why, but I divide that number by 0.15 to get a value estimate. You also have to add in any salary the owner takes.
2. Average of the last five years of revenue.
3. Most recent year of revenues, plus any salary the owner takes.
4. Dividend paying ability, which is more or less the amount of total salary and profit the owner takes (in the most recent year)

I use all four and then average them since they can vary widely depending on a number of factors. These figures do not include things like the value of inventory, cash on hand, and the liability of a lease.

these are great points and I use similar methods, but this situation is different because the business hasn't matured -- he's in the investment stage and now his partner wants to "uninvest" which, unless there were a previous agreement regard "money back" etc, there is no such thing.

Really, all this comes down to is that the OP has a conscience and would like to at least give some of that investment back. Nobel, I guess, if that's the proper way to handle it. But there is no refunds in starting a business. Not that I'm aware of, unless there was previous arrangements.

[jiveturkey]

You have to get a 3rd party involved and a CPA would be a good start.

[Saul Good]

Originally Posted by jiveturkey

You have to get a 3rd party involved and a CPA would be a good start.

I doubt it based on what I've heard so far. This is a "take it or leave it" offer waiting to happen.

[Lzen]

I would try option 3 first, then maybe option 2 and 1, if necessary.

Edit: Forget what I said. There are a lot more knowledgeable people on CP than I realized.

[Mosbonian]

NOt sure why you would want to hire a CPA to charge you for something you are probably already aware of.....there is little value in the business.

Hiring CPA's or Attorney's in something like this are just added expenses that aren't needed. It's like watching a Chapter 7 proceeding as Attorney's and CPA's pay themselves from the proceeds of the estate and whittle away what little assets that are left only to tell everyone there are no assets available.

** Apologies to Amonorix and any other Attorney's along with an CPA's on this board. Guess I have had to sit on too many Unsecured Creditor's Committee's lately.

[Amnorix]

Originally Posted by Mosbonian

NOt sure why you would want to hire a CPA to charge you for something you are probably already aware of.....there is little value in the business.

Hiring CPA's or Attorney's in something like this are just added expenses that aren't needed. It's like watching a Chapter 7 proceeding as Attorney's and CPA's pay themselves from the proceeds of the estate and whittle away what little assets that are left only to tell everyone there are no assets available.

** Apologies to Amonorix and any other Attorney's along with an CPA's on this board. Guess I have had to sit on too many Unsecured Creditor's Committee's lately.

I'm not a bankruptcy attorney nor a CPA, but I definitely understand where you're coming from. I do alot of bank work (though not DIP financings) so I see the end result sometimes.

[Ace Gunner]

The reason he can use a CPA now is to thoroughly document financial of the company to date using a qualified 3rd party source. No retainer necessary, just get this snapshot now.