Evaluate the Defense Game #1

[petegz28]

I thought they looked improved from several aspects. Keep in mind this was Jax and not a high-powered offense.

Tackling = Much, MUCH better

Coverage = Tighter. Few plays without a defender right on the WR

Run Defense = Stellar start, let's not get cocky

Pass Defense = Not a ton of pressure today. Missed a huge sack which ended up leading to a TD. Coverage overall was decent. Made a backup look all-world but that happens when a backup comes in mid-game.

Overall it looked like we were more sound fundamentally. Run gaps were getting filled, screens were getting blown up and not a ton of YAC. Hopefully as the season progresses our defense will as well.

Overall grade today: C+

[Halfcan]

The defense knocked out their starting QB with a big hit by Jones and Clark, didn't allow Fornette to go over 100 yards rushing and held the Jags to 13 points for most of the game until it was already over.

The Foles TD was basically perfect coverage by Fuller- pretty hard to defend that. Minshew was dumping the ball off on most every pass except a few lucky ones on a blown coverage. It was hot and the D was also playing together for the first meaningful game.

The Offense scored every time we had the ball until the clock ran out to end the game.

Not sure why people are treating this as a loss and the D still sucks?

[R Clark]

Originally Posted by Halfcan

The defense knocked out their starting QB with a big hit by Jones and Clark, didn't allow Fornette to go over 100 yards rushing and held the Jags to 13 points for most of the game until it was already over.

The Foles TD was basically perfect coverage by Fuller- pretty hard to defend that. Minshew was dumping the ball off on most every pass except a few lucky ones on a blown coverage. It was hot and the D was also playing together for the first meaningful game.

The Offense scored every time we had the ball until the clock ran out to end the game.

Not sure why people are treating this as a loss and the D still sucks?

Spot on, but yeah room for improvement

[DJ's left nut]

Originally Posted by Halfcan

The defense knocked out their starting QB with a big hit by Jones and Clark, didn't allow Fornette to go over 100 yards rushing and held the Jags to 13 points for most of the game until it was already over.

The Foles TD was basically perfect coverage by Fuller- pretty hard to defend that. Minshew was dumping the ball off on most every pass except a few lucky ones on a blown coverage. It was hot and the D was also playing together for the first meaningful game.

The Offense scored every time we had the ball until the clock ran out to end the game.

Not sure why people are treating this as a loss and the D still sucks?

The offense is the reason Fournette stayed under 100 yards; he averaged over 5 YPC but the Chiefs offense took him out of the gameplan.

And what good is knocking the starting QB out (on a deep TD he completed, no less) when you make a 6th round rookie come in and look like Tom Brady? "Lucky completions into blown coverage..." is sure a convenient way to handwaive the same thing that happened under Sutton game after game after game last season. Blown coverage counts, man. And it's absolutely worth criticizing. Especially if the guy has time to scan the field because - again - the pass rush was nowhere to be seen.

The defense played poorly on Sunday. You can point to the new scheme and all that - fine. You can give justifications for it. But to try to deny it didn't happen is silly. The pass rush went nowhere, a starting RB who's team tried to void his deal last season went for better than 5 YPC and a no-name QB with a handful of no-name WRs set about shredding our secondary. What about those statements is even debatable?

"The defense played poorly but here's why and here's why it will improve" - is a valid line of discussion and there's merit to that position. "The defense didn't play poorly" - isn't. The defense played poorly.

[BryanBusby]

It was mother****ing hot and both Defenses looked like shit. Wouldn't snap take this Week 1 game too hard.

[Aspengc8]

Made it through the first quarter of A22 film. Defense doesn't look that bad at all. They had a mis-alignment on one of Fournette's larger runs. Pass rush is not bad, Foles wriggled out of a sack on the 3rd and long play, and they went max protect on the bomb to chark and the rush still got to him. Some tackling issues by CB's, but I think they can work out the kinks easily. A lot of the jags passes with the rookie were 3 step and hard to judge pass rush on those. i'll get through the rest of the game tonight.

[DJ's left nut]

FWIW (very little) -- PFF Grades for Sunday on the defense:

Wilson -- 83.9
Breeland -- 77.0
Thornill -- 69.5
Ogbah -- 68.6
Ward -- 65.1
Okafor -- 61.2
Jones -- 61.1
Mathieu -- 60.3
Fuller -- 58.8
Hitchens -- 54.8
Clark -- 54.0

I've said before that I don't think PFF is worth a damn for rank ordering a performance but I think it can be useful for establishing 'tiers'. For instance, I don't know that I can say that Thornhill was a tick better than Ogbah yesterday despite PFFs numbers, but in real time it felt like Thornhill and Ogbah were similarly impactful. That's a fine tier.

Wilson and Breeland were the two guys I thought actually played quite well yesterday and PFF gave them the two highest grades. When you're looking for general impressions, PFF can give you some solid datapoints.

And PFF said that Frank Clark was hot garbage yesterday. Was he the worst player on the defense yesterday? Well no, I don't think I can say that. But was he definitely among the worst players on the defense? Oh yes, yes he was. Against a rummy.

On the offense - a 91.6 for Watkins - yeah, that'll play. G'damn he was good yesterday. And yeah, the interior OL was exactly as bad as it seemed - Wylie, Reiter and LDT with a 54.6 - 51.2 - 50.7 respectively. Yikes - that'll get our cherub killed. You just cannot give them that kind of highway right up the middle. Everything else was about what you'd expect; a poor grade for Hardman, good grade for Mahomes (not elite, which I think we'd all agree with) and generally respectable grades elsewhere on the O.

[lawrenceRaider]

Jax offense isn't good. Beating up on a cripple isn't a good barometer. Oakland looks more like a cripple now, so not a good measurement next week either. I have no faith in the Ravens repeating Sunday's performance. So you might not face a good offense until the Packers in week 8.

[Halfcan]

Originally Posted by DJ's left nut

The offense is the reason Fournette stayed under 100 yards; he averaged over 5 YPC but the Chiefs offense took him out of the gameplan.

And what good is knocking the starting QB out (on a deep TD he completed, no less) when you make a 6th round rookie come in and look like Tom Brady? "Lucky completions into blown coverage..." is sure a convenient way to handwaive the same thing that happened under Sutton game after game after game last season. Blown coverage counts, man. And it's absolutely worth criticizing. Especially if the guy has time to scan the field because - again - the pass rush was nowhere to be seen.

The defense played poorly on Sunday. You can point to the new scheme and all that - fine. You can give justifications for it. But to try to deny it didn't happen is silly. The pass rush went nowhere, a starting RB who's team tried to void his deal last season went for better than 5 YPC and a no-name QB with a handful of no-name WRs set about shredding our secondary. What about those statements is even debatable?

"The defense played poorly but here's why and here's why it will improve" - is a valid line of discussion and there's merit to that position. "The defense didn't play poorly" - isn't. The defense played poorly.

Fournette had a couple of late-game runs that padded his stats- he was pretty much a non-factor running with only 66 yards. Add in his receiving and he was still under 100 yards with a Huge fumble.

Jags were doing zip the first part of the game until that pass by Foles- which cost him the season. Fuller was right on his ass so I am not sure what else he could have done? This is the NFL- guys make plays.

As far as Minshew shredding us- most were dump-offs. Yes. the secondary had communication problems with 2 new safties out there that need to play much better. But most of those yards were in garbage time when Spags called off the dogs and was only rushing 4.

Now, how Mahomes dismantled the Jags "awesome" defense- that was a shredding. Chiefs D played much better than the Jags D and it was only the first game of the year- their first game together, on the road and it was hot as hell.

What more did you expect?

[Halfcan]

Let's not forget the D. almost had a Pick 6 on a batted down pass by Moustache Minshew.

That would have changed the narrative on his NFL debut.

[suzzer99]

Originally Posted by Aspengc8

Made it through the first quarter of A22 film. Defense doesn't look that bad at all. They had a mis-alignment on one of Fournette's larger runs. Pass rush is not bad, Foles wriggled out of a sack on the 3rd and long play, and they went max protect on the bomb to chark and the rush still got to him. Some tackling issues by CB's, but I think they can work out the kinks easily. A lot of the jags passes with the rookie were 3 step and hard to judge pass rush on those. i'll get through the rest of the game tonight.

Can you post a gif of Clark's INT - or is that against some kind of agreement?

[Beef Supreme]

The defense didn't exactly play very well, but I think they can improve. And they did seem to tackle better than last year.

[O.city]

They weren't good but they weren't last years ass highway to mc****sville.

So it's a decent starting point. They got off the field and held the Jags to 13 points. I don't give a shit about what a team does when they're down by 4 scores in the 4th quarter

[DJ's left nut]

Originally Posted by Halfcan

Fournette had a couple of late-game runs that padded his stats- he was pretty much a non-factor running with only 66 yards. Add in his receiving and he was still under 100 yards with a Huge fumble.

He was a non-factor because they had to stop running. How thin do we really need to parse this out? It's not like they were just out there in the 4th quarter handing him the ball for garbage time yards - when the game mattered he was still getting the ball and in so doing he managed more than 5 YPC. Most RBs 'pad their stats' by larger runs and it was hardly trash carries that got him those.

The fumble I acknowledged, BTW. Wilson was the best player on that defense yesterday and that was a MASSIVE play. It deserves credit and got credit but it was pretty much an individual effort that doesn't obviate criticism of the rest of the unit. Wilson's play was a big time bright spot, though. If he can continue to show out like that after looking good in the pre-season, that would be one of those under the radar finds that great teams often find (and almost always need).

Jags were doing zip the first part of the game until that pass by Foles- which cost him the season. Fuller was right on his ass so I am not sure what else he could have done? This is the NFL- guys make plays.

"Zip in the first part of the game..." - you mean their one drive? The Foles TD came on their second drive and finished a drive that had already moved them into FG range. I'd hardly say they had done zip. And yes, Fuller had good coverage there; never said he didn't. The problem was that Foles had that kind of time despite Clark being singled by a friggen TE. Yeah, Clark eventually got there - too late to prevent the TD. But hey, at least they got a hit on Foles and Jones injured him with a fall that any of use would've screamed bloody murder over had someone done it to Mahomes. THAT'S as close to a feather in their cap you can find - that time a borderline dirty hit injured the QB when our $20 million DE almost beat a tight end in time to prevent a touchdown...but didn't. Okay.

As far as Minshew shredding us- most were dump-offs. Yes. the secondary had communication problems with 2 new safties out there that need to play much better. But most of those yards were in garbage time when Spags called off the dogs and was only rushing 4.

"Dogs" -- there was a difference? And wasn't that the point of getting Clark and why people love Jones? The switch to the 4-3 and Clark acquisition wasn't so we could send Damien Wilson and Anthony Hitchens on blitzes - it was so we can get pressure with 4. Do you really think we're gonna be sending Darron Lee and safeties after the QB most games? They should've still been getting there. "Only rushing 4" is going to be how this defense operates most of the time. It isn't going to be blitz heavy, nor should it be.

Now, how Mahomes dismantled the Jags "awesome" defense- that was a shredding. Chiefs D played much better than the Jags D and it was only the first game of the year- their first game together, on the road and it was hot as hell.

You really wanna compare the respective offensive units? The Jags offense sucks horrifically. You cite holding Fournette under 100 as though the guy is Walter Payton - I reiterate, they were going to try to cut this guy as recently as last year. The WR corps is fringe average on a good day. Of course the Jags D got beat up worse than the Chiefs - their offense sucks and the Chiefs offense is historically great. Duh.

[Halfcan]

No matter what anyone post, DJ- you think the D. sucked yesterday. You are viewing them with the most critical glasses possible and nothing anyone can say will change your mind. The Jags only had 13 points until late in the game when it was over. I will take that all year.

If Clark corals that batted pass for the Pick 6- it would have been an even bigger blowout than it was.

The Jags were never a threat to win against this Defense or Offense- that is the bottom line.

[FAX]

Originally Posted by Halfcan

The defense knocked out their starting QB with a big hit by Jones and Clark, didn't allow Fornette to go over 100 yards rushing and held the Jags to 13 points for most of the game until it was already over.

The Foles TD was basically perfect coverage by Fuller- pretty hard to defend that. Minshew was dumping the ball off on most every pass except a few lucky ones on a blown coverage. It was hot and the D was also playing together for the first meaningful game.

The Offense scored every time we had the ball until the clock ran out to end the game.

Not sure why people are treating this as a loss and the D still sucks?

Speaking for myself, it's about expectations ... specifically from the premier acquisitions (Clark and Mathieu) and the rebuilt linebacker group playing against this specific team's offense.

This wasn't the Lambs or the Immigrant Blowjobbers. This was the Yaguars.

When I take into consideration the strength of their o-line and their skill players, I am very disappointed that they couldn't shut those guys down in humiliating fashion.

Mathieu had 2 tackles and 1 assist. Clark had 1 tackle total on the day. Other than Wilson and Hitch (5 tackles each), the linebacker group often looked confused and I don't think they had a single tackle between them.

Again, I haven't seen the All-22 and I don't know the calls, so what do I know? But based on the eye-test and the stats, I am far from impressed. It was the damn Yaguars with a barber-shop tenor at QB and there's no way (in my mind) that they should have been that effective.

FAX