Singer Lauryn Hill Blames Slavery For Not Paying Her Taxes

[SPATCH]

Originally Posted by Donger

I think it's pretty clear that Black people have a propensity to commit crimes that land them in jail at a higher rate than White people.

Originally Posted by loochy

I don't know! Why do white people dance badly?

Also, even if these problems do stem from slavery, how in the hell is giving them money going to fix it? How is affirmative action going to fix it? Answer: It's not. It gives no stimulus to change the behaviors causing the problem in the first place. I think that can only be cured over time.

I would like both of you to answer this one question, right now. Yes or no. Nothing else. Just YES or NO.

If a brand new society was started on Mars using the DNA of blacks and whites to create the children that would make up this brand new society (obviously, everybody in the society starts on completely equal footing). Do you think (generations down the road) that blacks would commit a statistically significant more amount of the crime there?

YES or NO

[Donger]

Originally Posted by the_spatula

I would like both of you to answer this one question, right now. Yes or no. Nothing else. Just YES or NO.

If a brand new society was started on Mars using the DNA of blacks and whites to create the children that would make up this brand new society (obviously, everybody in the society starts on completely equal footing). Do you think (generations down the road) that blacks would commit a statistically significant more amount of the crime there?

YES or NO

No.

[Chief_For_Life58]

Originally Posted by the_spatula

I would like both of you to answer this one question, right now. Yes or no. Nothing else. Just YES or NO.

If a brand new society was started on Mars using the DNA of blacks and whites to create the children that would make up this brand new society (obviously, everybody in the society starts on completely equal footing). Do you think (generations down the road) that blacks would commit a statistically significant more amount of the crime there?

YES or NO

Would the coca plant grow on this planet?

[SPATCH]

Originally Posted by Chief_For_Life58

Would the coca plant grow on this planet?

Yes

[loochy]

Originally Posted by the_spatula

I would like both of you to answer this one question, right now. Yes or no. Nothing else. Just YES or NO.

If a brand new society was started on Mars using the DNA of blacks and whites to create the children that would make up this brand new society (obviously, everybody in the society starts on completely equal footing). Do you think (generations down the road) that blacks would commit a statistically significant more amount of the crime there?

YES or NO

NO

DUhr

unless of course there is some kind of genetic predisposition - after all there is genetic predisposition to make dudes like other dudes

reparations and affirmative action don't fix the problem NOW though

generations of blacks need to unlearn destructive behavior and generations of whites need to unlearn their racist/whatever behavior

[SPATCH]

Originally Posted by loochy

NO

DUhr

unless of course there is some kind of genetic predisposition - after all there is genetic predisposition to make dudes like other dudes

reparations and affirmative action don't fix the problem NOW though

generations of blacks need to unlearn destructive behavior and generations of whites need to unlearn their racist/whatever behavior

...and I definitely agree with you.

However, there were a few people in this thread that were getting carried away with the idea that believing in a need for reparations makes a person "crazy". It is not crazy. But, it is also not the answer (which you have pointed out).

Government initiatives to further the education of minorities have a much more lasting benefit (as was pointed out by another poster).

[DJ's left nut]

Originally Posted by the_spatula

I would like both of you to answer this one question, right now. Yes or no. Nothing else. Just YES or NO.

If a brand new society was started on Mars using the DNA of blacks and whites to create the children that would make up this brand new society (obviously, everybody in the society starts on completely equal footing). Do you think (generations down the road) that blacks would commit a statistically significant more amount of the crime there?

YES or NO

Unless you're a trained genetics expert, your answer here means precisely dick.

Oh sure, we can try to take the kind, cuddly approach to it and say "well hell no!" but what the hell do I know?

Whites are more genetically predisposed to certain diseases and physical maladies. Blacks are more predisposed to others. There are physical distinctions as well.

There might be behavioral or cognitive distinctions as well. I don't know. I don't claim to know - I know exactly jack shit about the biological makeup of the respective races.

Which is why your question is clearly little more than a trap question. None of us are even remotely qualified to answer it. Everyone knows the answer they should give, but their basis for giving it is based on...well nothing really.

Personally, I think if you dropped 100,000 black babies on Mars and 100,000 white babies on Mars, after several generations you'd see some kind of split in where they excelled and did not. I don't think there would be a predisposition towards criminal conduct, no. I don't know what the differences would be - but I'm confident there would be quite a few of them.

I also don't think that's terribly relevant to this discussion. I don't think biology is the problem in this instance.

[SPATCH]

Originally Posted by DJ's left nut

Unless you're a trained genetics expert, your answer here means precisely dick.

Oh sure, we can try to take the kind, cuddly approach to it and say "well hell no!" but what the hell do I know?

Whites are more genetically predisposed to certain diseases and physical maladies. Blacks are more predisposed to others. There are physical distinctions as well.

There might be behavioral or cognitive distinctions as well. I don't know. I don't claim to know - I know exactly jack shit about the biological makeup of the respective races.

Which is why your question is clearly little more than a trap question. None of us are even remotely qualified to answer it. Everyone knows the answer they should give, but their basis for giving it is based on...well nothing really.

Personally, I think if you dropped 100,000 black babies on Mars and 100,000 white babies on Mars, after several generations you'd see some kind of split in where they excelled and did not. I don't think there would be a predisposition towards criminal conduct, no. I don't know what the differences would be - but I'm confident there would be quite a few of them.

I also don't think that's terribly relevant to this discussion. I don't think biology is the problem in this instance.

Which proves my point, precisely!

The issues that have arisen do not have a basis in biology. They have a basis in society.

African Americans were not born genetically predisposed to being criminals and dead-beat dads. Those are learned behaviors. Nuture, not nature. It has everything to do with environment and nothing to do with genetics.

Now that we have agreed that (all things being equal) these issues would not arise in our society on Mars (ruling out biology) we can begin to analyze the reasons why they exist in America. I have asserted that it has to do with the previous ills of our society. Do you have any other ideas?

*Also: I have a bachelor's degree in biochemistry and know a fair bit about genetics. I can tell you with 100% certainty that blacks/whites/asians/hispanics are all members of homo sapiens (meaning our genetic makeup is nearly identical).

[Donger]

Originally Posted by the_spatula

Which proves my point, precisely!

The issues that have arisen do not have a basis in biology. They have a basis in society.

African Americans were not born genetically predisposed to being criminals and dead-beat dads. Those are learned behaviors. Nuture, not nature. It has everything to do with environment and nothing to do with genetics.

Now that we have agreed that (all things being equal) these issues would not arise in our society on Mars (ruling out biology) we can begin to analyze the reasons why they exist in America. I have asserted that it has to with the previous ills of our society. Do you have any other ideas?

*Also: I have a bachelor's degree in biochemistry and know a fair bit about genetics. I can tell you with 100% certainty that blacks/whites/asians/hispanics are all members of homo sapiens (meaning our genetic makeup is nearly identical).

As long as you aren't saying that ALL of Black societal ills can be traced to slavery and racism, I'm with you.

I think we have some Black people on CP. What do you people say?

[Radar Chief]

Originally Posted by Donger

What do you people say?

[Setsuna]

Originally Posted by Radar Chief

[DJ's left nut]

Originally Posted by the_spatula

Which proves my point, precisely!

The issues that have arisen do not have a basis in biology. They have a basis in society.

Slow down there, sport - this is where your leap in logic falls apart.

These things absolutely have a basis in biology but it's not biology that's exclusive to the black community.

They started in a hole - they've stayed in the hole. 'Society' has done its damndest to stop digging and I think by and large that has been done quite well. Additionally, 'society' has also taken steps to try to throw some dirt into said hole and help raise people out of it.

But the folks in it aren't doing a hell of a lot of scooping on their own. Had you taken whites out of Europe, tossed them into Africa, disenfranchised them for 200 years and then set them free - well they'd probably be in shitty shape in comparison to the 'native' Africans as well. I don't subscribe to an idea that white's would've done this any better (afterall, look at backwoods Kentucky).

What I am saying is that you're claiming that the system is getting in the way and that's simply not the case. The system is trying to take measured, reasoned steps towards leveling the playing field and all to often those people they are trying to help go limp and act as dead weight.

At this point, the efforts are being made. It's time to set down the axes that people like Lauryn Hill are grinding and help yourselves as well. The die has been cast; it can't just be undone. Sorry - just as I wasn't born into a the Vanderbilt clan - some people just have a shittier path than others. Such is the way of it.

Now take ownership of where you are, where you can be and more importantly, where your children can be.

Quit blaming 'society' for everything. Society can only do so much and at some point you're just going to have to help yourselves or {gasp} make hard choices and sacrifices for the benefit of your family.

[SPATCH]

Originally Posted by DJ's left nut

Slow down there, sport - this is where your leap in logic falls apart.

These things absolutely have a basis in biology but it's not biology that's exclusive to the black community.

They started in a hole - they've stayed in the hole. 'Society' has done its damndest to stop digging and I think by and large that has been done quite well. Additionally, 'society' has also taken steps to try to throw some dirt into said hole and help raise people out of it.

But the folks in it aren't doing a hell of a lot of scooping on their own. Had you taken whites out of Europe, tossed them into Africa, disenfranchised them for 200 years and then set them free - well they'd probably be in shitty shape in comparison to the 'native' Africans as well. I don't subscribe to an idea that white's would've done this any better (afterall, look at backwoods Kentucky).

What I am saying is that you're claiming that the system is getting in the way and that's simply not the case. The system is trying to take measured, reasoned steps towards leveling the playing field and all to often those people they are trying to help go limp and act as dead weight.

At this point, the efforts are being made. It's time to set down the axes that people like Lauryn Hill are grinding and help yourselves as well. The die has been cast; it can't just be undone. Sorry - just as I wasn't born into a the Vanderbilt clan - some people just have a shittier path than others. Such is the way of it.

Now take ownership of where you are, where you can be and more importantly, where your children can be.

Quit blaming 'society' for everything. Society can only do so much and at some point you're just going to have to help yourselves or {gasp} make hard choices and sacrifices for the benefit of your family.

We're on the same page, dude. I agree with you.

[LoneWolf]

Originally Posted by DJ's left nut

Personally, I think if you dropped 100,000 black babies on Mars and 100,000 white babies on Mars, after several generations you'd see some kind of split in where they excelled and did not. I don't think there would be a predisposition towards criminal conduct, no. I don't know what the differences would be - but I'm confident there would be quite a few of them.

I think you would have 200,000 dead babies. Even if they survived being dropped, they couldn't survive on Mars.