Query, did this game cost Allen his payday

**Baby Lee** · 11-25-2007, 05:10 PM

Not that he played particularly bad, but this unit presents itself as one with NO ONE deserving of a big payday.
There's no one who screams we need this guy or we'll fall apart. We've fallen apart. Now to rebuild.
Franchise him? Sure, if you sense he'll perform as a franchised player. Set the bar for D-Line Ks? Not with this squad.

CoMoChief · 11-25-2007, 05:15 PM

Allen is still in running for DPOY.

So what he had one bad game. The entire defense was bad, not just him.

He deserves to get paid, and he will get paid.

CupidStunt · 11-25-2007, 05:16 PM

Gotta sign him long-term and hope for the best, which isn't what I said about LJ. Allen is young, plays at a much, much more important position and should get better.

Even IF you get picks for him, who do you take? No one in this entire draft is worth Allen; MAYBE Chris Long or Glenn Dorsey are great but you just don't do that.

Mecca · 11-25-2007, 05:18 PM

Cost him his pay day.......depends on the rest of the year. If he turns invisible and does nothing the rest of the year then yes he will get a lot less money...

But after resigning a RB if they walked away from a DE it would be a bonehead move of monumental proportions.

**gblowfish** · 11-25-2007, 05:21 PM

Don't give up on him yet. I think he played most of the second half with a shoulder stinger. He looked like he was really hurt coming off the field in the 3rd Quarter. He chased the doctors off. I think he played with it, but it affected his mobility and strength.

Wouldn't be surprised to see him on the injury report next week.

**Baby Lee** · 11-25-2007, 05:24 PM

Again, I'm not talking about his personal performance. I'm talking about a team that needs a different approach than retaining superstars. Because at this point we don't have a UNIT that can bring out a superstar.
We need to coach up a bunch of 'nobodies' to mold into somebodies, not a bunch of scrubs to fill out a roster around a core of superstars.

We've already seen what surrounding our superstar RB with scrubs on the o-line paid off.

Mecca · 11-25-2007, 05:28 PM

You build a team around DE's you don't get rid of them.....they need better DT's and some other guys need to be replaced.

Hell Hali has been invisible nearly this entire year.

**Baby Lee** · 11-25-2007, 05:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mecca

You build a team around DE's you don't get rid of them.....they need better DT's and some other guys need to be replaced.

Hell Hali has been invisible nearly this entire year.

You build your team around LTs. That's the ONE surefire foundational position. It defines/d the Rams, Seahawks, and our offensive success. It's an underappreciated cog in the Pats' dynasty, it's effect is even now being shown in that 'shell' of a team, the Colts. The closest to having a 'foundation' DE is Cinci with Justin Smith, and they haven't exactly thrived either.

CupidStunt · 11-25-2007, 05:31 PM

I'm not the type of guy to go bumping old threads, especially after a loss like this, but I do love how people acknowledge things after a loss but fail to do so after the wins and good performances.

I said a long time ago this season Hali was not playing well and stated how invisible he'd been. People should've either buttoned it or watched the guy more to realize what I was saying was true; THAT way, your expectations won't be destroyed as the year goes on.

**Rain Man** · 11-25-2007, 05:34 PM

He's been great, and he had one bad game. Walter Payton and Barry Sanders had occasional bad games, too.

I don't know if he just felt bad today, or if that Raider LT was having a great day. Either way, he got shut down badly and it really hurt us.

**Rain Man** · 11-25-2007, 05:55 PM

You build your team around good coaching that has a philosophy that allows winning.

Extra Point · 11-25-2007, 05:57 PM

They got their yardage on the left side. Donnie Edwards was vacant in the flat. Hali got trapped/pushed out of contain. A lot of ooo's and oow's and "Oh, that's what I should have done"'s in the film room.

FAX · 11-25-2007, 06:04 PM

Great point, Mr. Baby Lee. That is, if I understand it correctly.

Every good team has one or two standout players, though. Now, do they stand out because they are that much better than their teammates or is it because the scheme showcases them?

Although true that Carl has proven once and for all that having a multi-million dollar RB and no offensive line is a bad plan. I don't think, however, that Allen's situation is identical. We have a lot of youth on defense and Allen was playing hurt today (or so I've heard).

The fact remains that, if Allen has a bad day - or doesn't play at all, the defense suffers. It should be easy to evaluate on film which should be enough to guarantee him a well-paying roster spot somewhere, if not on the Chiefs.

By the way, did we run any stunts with Allen today?

FAX

**Baby Lee** · 11-25-2007, 07:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FAX

Great point, Mr. Baby Lee. That is, if I understand it correctly.

Every good team has one or two standout players, though. Now, do they stand out because they are that much better than their teammates or is it because the scheme showcases them?

Although true that Carl has proven once and for all that having a multi-million dollar RB and no offensive line is a bad plan. I don't think, however, that Allen's situation is identical. We have a lot of youth on defense and Allen was playing hurt today (or so I've heard).

The fact remains that, if Allen has a bad day - or doesn't play at all, the defense suffers. It should be easy to evaluate on film which should be enough to guarantee him a well-paying roster spot somewhere, if not on the Chiefs.

By the way, did we run any stunts with Allen today?

FAX

I'm not talking about not paying him any payday. I'm talking about whether to make him THE DE gold standard for salary, given the state of the team.
To that end, I titled the thread incorrectly. Should've been 'cost Allen his payday as a Chief.' ie, if he's gonna get that payday, and he probably will, does the state of the team overall as evidenced today signify that it'll probably be a team closer to being a winner that grants it to him?

MadMax · 11-25-2007, 11:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Baby Lee

I'm not talking about not paying him any payday. I'm talking about whether to make him THE DE gold standard for salary, given the state of the team.
To that end, I titled the thread incorrectly. Should've been 'cost Allen his payday as a Chief.' ie, if he's gonna get that payday, and he probably will, does the state of the team overall as evidenced today signify that it'll probably be a team closer to being a winner that grants it to him?

I'm in favor of performance based contracts

11-25-2007, 05:10 PM	Topic Starter
Baby Lee Supporter Join Date: Aug 2000 Casino cash: $6838598	Query, did this game cost Allen his payday Not that he played particularly bad, but this unit presents itself as one with NO ONE deserving of a big payday. There's no one who screams we need this guy or we'll fall apart. We've fallen apart. Now to rebuild. Franchise him? Sure, if you sense he'll perform as a franchised player. Set the bar for D-Line Ks? Not with this squad.
Posts: 95,642

11-25-2007, 05:15 PM	#2
CoMoChief Mahomes Dynasty Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Parts Unknown Casino cash: $8042254	Allen is still in running for DPOY. So what he had one bad game. The entire defense was bad, not just him. He deserves to get paid, and he will get paid. __________________
Posts: 39,163

11-25-2007, 05:16 PM	#3
CupidStunt offense > defense Join Date: Jul 2005 Casino cash: $2423332	Gotta sign him long-term and hope for the best, which isn't what I said about LJ. Allen is young, plays at a much, much more important position and should get better. Even IF you get picks for him, who do you take? No one in this entire draft is worth Allen; MAYBE Chris Long or Glenn Dorsey are great but you just don't do that.
Posts: 8,920

11-25-2007, 05:18 PM	#4
Mecca Hockey Town Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Kansas City, Missouri Casino cash: $2497050	Cost him his pay day.......depends on the rest of the year. If he turns invisible and does nothing the rest of the year then yes he will get a lot less money... But after resigning a RB if they walked away from a DE it would be a bonehead move of monumental proportions.
Posts: 111,020

11-25-2007, 05:21 PM	#5
gblowfish Be Kind To Your Pets Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Glorious Independence, MO Casino cash: $17646178 VARSITY	Don't give up on him yet. I think he played most of the second half with a shoulder stinger. He looked like he was really hurt coming off the field in the 3rd Quarter. He chased the doctors off. I think he played with it, but it affected his mobility and strength. Wouldn't be surprised to see him on the injury report next week.
Posts: 40,839

11-25-2007, 05:24 PM	#6
Baby Lee Supporter Join Date: Aug 2000 Casino cash: $6838598	Again, I'm not talking about his personal performance. I'm talking about a team that needs a different approach than retaining superstars. Because at this point we don't have a UNIT that can bring out a superstar. We need to coach up a bunch of 'nobodies' to mold into somebodies, not a bunch of scrubs to fill out a roster around a core of superstars. We've already seen what surrounding our superstar RB with scrubs on the o-line paid off. __________________ We need the kind of courage that can withstand the subtle corruption of the cynics - E.W.
Posts: 95,642

11-25-2007, 05:28 PM	#7
Mecca Hockey Town Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Kansas City, Missouri Casino cash: $2497050	You build a team around DE's you don't get rid of them.....they need better DT's and some other guys need to be replaced. Hell Hali has been invisible nearly this entire year.
Posts: 111,020

11-25-2007, 05:31 PM	#9
CupidStunt offense > defense Join Date: Jul 2005 Casino cash: $2423332	I'm not the type of guy to go bumping old threads, especially after a loss like this, but I do love how people acknowledge things after a loss but fail to do so after the wins and good performances. I said a long time ago this season Hali was not playing well and stated how invisible he'd been. People should've either buttoned it or watched the guy more to realize what I was saying was true; THAT way, your expectations won't be destroyed as the year goes on.
Posts: 8,920

11-25-2007, 05:34 PM	#10
Rain Man NFL's #1 Ermines Fan Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: My house Casino cash: $3198491 VARSITY	He's been great, and he had one bad game. Walter Payton and Barry Sanders had occasional bad games, too. I don't know if he just felt bad today, or if that Raider LT was having a great day. Either way, he got shut down badly and it really hurt us. __________________ I'm putting random letters here as a celebration of free speech: xigrakgrah misorojeq rkemeseit.
Posts: 141,560

11-25-2007, 05:55 PM	#11
Rain Man NFL's #1 Ermines Fan Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: My house Casino cash: $3198491 VARSITY	You build your team around good coaching that has a philosophy that allows winning. __________________ I'm putting random letters here as a celebration of free speech: xigrakgrah misorojeq rkemeseit.
Posts: 141,560

11-25-2007, 05:57 PM	#12
Extra Point MVP Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Prairie Village, KS Casino cash: $10004900	They got their yardage on the left side. Donnie Edwards was vacant in the flat. Hali got trapped/pushed out of contain. A lot of ooo's and oow's and "Oh, that's what I should have done"'s in the film room. __________________ "Sometimes I sits and thinks, and sometimes I just sits." --Satchel Paige
Posts: 7,845

11-25-2007, 06:04 PM	#13
FAX testing ... 1, 2, 3 Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Tennessee Casino cash: $6753759	Great point, Mr. Baby Lee. That is, if I understand it correctly. Every good team has one or two standout players, though. Now, do they stand out because they are that much better than their teammates or is it because the scheme showcases them? Although true that Carl has proven once and for all that having a multi-million dollar RB and no offensive line is a bad plan. I don't think, however, that Allen's situation is identical. We have a lot of youth on defense and Allen was playing hurt today (or so I've heard). The fact remains that, if Allen has a bad day - or doesn't play at all, the defense suffers. It should be easy to evaluate on film which should be enough to guarantee him a well-paying roster spot somewhere, if not on the Chiefs. By the way, did we run any stunts with Allen today? FAX
Posts: 44,492