***NON-POLITICAL COVID-19 Discussion Thread***

[JakeF]

A couple of reminders...

Originally Posted by Bwana

Once again, don't come in this thread with some kind of political agenda, or you will be shown the door. If you want to go that route, there is a thread about this in DC.

Originally Posted by Dartgod

People, there is a lot of good information in this thread, let's try to keep the petty bickering to a minimum.

We all have varying opinions about the impact of this, the numbers, etc. We will all never agree with each other. But we can all keep it civil.

Thanks!

Click here for the original OP:

Spoiler!

Apparently the CoronaVirus can survive on a inanimate objects, such as door knobs, for 9 days.

California coronavirus case could be first spread within U.S. community, CDC says
By SOUMYA KARLAMANGLA, JACLYN COSGROVE
FEB. 26, 2020 8:04 PM

The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention is investigating what could be the first case of novel coronavirus in the United States involving a patient in California who neither recently traveled out of the country nor was in contact with someone who did.

“At this time, the patient’s exposure is unknown. It’s possible this could be an instance of community spread of COVID-19, which would be the first time this has happened in the United States,” the CDC said in a statement. “Community spread means spread of an illness for which the source of infection is unknown. It’s also possible, however, that the patient may have been exposed to a returned traveler who was infected.”

The individual is a resident of Solano County and is receiving medical care in Sacramento County, according to the state Department of Public Health.

The CDC said the “case was detected through the U.S. public health system — picked up by astute clinicians.”

Officials at UC Davis Medical Center expanded on what the federal agency might have meant by that in an email sent Wednesday, as reported by the Davis Enterprise newspaper.

The patient arrived at UC Davis Medical Center from another hospital Feb. 19 and “had already been intubated, was on a ventilator, and given droplet protection orders because of an undiagnosed and suspected viral condition,” according to an email sent by UC Davis officials that was obtained by the Davis Enterprise.

The staff at UC Davis requested COVID-19 testing by the CDC, but because the patient didn’t fit the CDC’s existing criteria for the virus, a test wasn’t immediately administered, according to the email. The CDC then ordered the test Sunday, and results were announced Wednesday. Hospital administrators reportedly said in the email that despite these issues, there has been minimal exposure at the hospital because of safety protocols they have in place.

A UC Davis Health spokesperson declined Wednesday evening to share the email with The Times.

Since Feb. 2, more than 8,400 returning travelers from China have entered California, according to the state health department. They have been advised to self-quarantine for 14 days and limit interactions with others as much as possible, officials said.

“This is a new virus, and while we are still learning about it, there is a lot we already know,” Dr. Sonia Angell, director of the California Department of Public Health, said in a statement. “We have been anticipating the potential for such a case in the U.S., and given our close familial, social and business relationships with China, it is not unexpected that the first case in the U.S. would be in California.”

It is not clear how the person became infected, but public health workers could not identify any contacts with people who had traveled to China or other areas where the virus is widespread. That raises concern that the virus is spreading in the United States, creating a challenge for public health officials, experts say.

“It’s the first signal that we could be having silent transmission in the community,” said Lawrence Gostin, director of the World Health Organization Collaborating Center on National and Global Health Law. “It probably means there are many more cases out there, and it probably means this individual has infected others, and now it’s a race to try to find out who that person has infected.”

On Tuesday, the CDC offered its most serious warning to date that the United States should expect and prepare for the coronavirus to become a more widespread health issue.

“Ultimately, we expect we will see coronavirus spread in this country,” said Nancy Messonnier, director of the CDC’s National Center for Immunization and Respiratory Diseases. “It’s not so much a question of if, but a question of when.”

According to the CDC’s latest count Wednesday morning, 59 U.S. residents have tested positive for the new strain of coronavirus — 42 of whom are repatriated citizens from a Diamond Princess cruise. That number has grown by two since Messonnier’s last count Tuesday, although the CDC was not immediately available to offer details on the additional cases.

More than 82,000 cases of coronavirus have been reported globally, and more than 2,700 people have died, with the majority in mainland China, the epicenter of the outbreak.

But public health leaders have repeatedly reminded residents that the health risk from the novel coronavirus to the general public remains low.

“While COVID-19 has a high transmission rate, it has a low mortality rate,” the state Department of Public Health said in a statement Wednesday. “From the international data we have, of those who have tested positive for COVID-19, approximately 80% do not exhibit symptoms that would require hospitalization. There have been no confirmed deaths related to COVID-19 in the United States to date.”

CDC officials have also warned that although the virus is likely to spread in U.S. communities, the flu still poses a greater risk.

Gostin said the news of potential silent transmission does not eliminate the possibility of containing the virus in the U.S. and preventing an outbreak.

“There are few enough cases that we should at least try,” he said. “Most of us are not optimistic that that will be successful, but we’re still in the position to try.”

[Discuss Thrower]

Originally Posted by MahomesMagic

I side with workers in America and small enterprise and business in my country.

You mean selfish people.

[Donger]

Originally Posted by MahomesMagic

Yeah, you are just straight spewing lockdown propaganda now.

Of course Tegnell would not do everything the same. That's because he is a scientist and has a brain. He admitted that they should have gotten even more careful with the elderly homes. That's a piece of the overall strategy but does not say "I wish I killed more people like NY and ruined more lives".

Maybe the King Of Sweden met the British royals when they were discussing their plans in this brave new world. Good for them. Not my type.

I side with workers in America and small enterprise and business in my country.

His own words are propaganda, eh?

Now he has told Swedish public radio: "If we were to encounter the same disease again, knowing exactly what we know about it today, I think we would settle on doing something in between what Sweden did and what the rest of the world has done."

[MahomesMagic]

Originally Posted by Discuss Thrower

You mean selfish people.

Yes, if it's selfish for thinking one should have the right to feed your family then I'm selfish.

[MahomesMagic]

Originally Posted by Donger

His own words are propaganda, eh?

Now he has told Swedish public radio: "If we were to encounter the same disease again, knowing exactly what we know about it today, I think we would settle on doing something in between what Sweden did and what the rest of the world has done."

The only people you can sell on Sweden are the people like yourself with your head buried in the sand.

The more the media lies about Sweden the more it proves they are embarrassed that this country exposed their entire program.

Instead of adopting Chinese experimental medicine, Sweden just followed the standard Western pandemic playbook.

If you weren't hiding in your house if we got in a public debate I would destroy you. Too easy as your arguments are warmed over gruel.

[Donger]

Originally Posted by MahomesMagic

The only people you can sell on Sweden are the people like yourself with your head buried in the sand.

The more the media lies about Sweden the more it proves they are embarrassed that this country exposed their entire program.

Instead of adopting Chinese experimental medicine, Sweden just followed the standard Western pandemic playroom.

I don't need to sell anything. Anders' own words and the results that they have had sell themselves, not the media.

[KS Smitty]

Originally Posted by petegz28

Okay, if you say so. I don't see how one gets to be where he is doing sloppy work but whatevs......

I have seen you question the truth and/or veracity of people with credentials similar to his but whatevs pete.

[MahomesMagic]

Originally Posted by Donger

I don't need to sell anything. Anders' own words and the results that they have had sell themselves, not the media.

Yep, is he now saying he is going to lock down the schools, businesses and issue mask mandates?

Go find those quotes. You can't. You're just a sad old man that is scared.

Here is someone that is in Sweden traveling right now...

Scary!

Last evening in Stockholm!

Cosy bar... ��and �� tartar

Absolutely love this place!

Tomorrow - Lisbon!

Stay tuned! �� pic.twitter.com/5yQkzoYP0p

— Lilith of Assyria �� (@LilithAssyria) December 25, 2020

[Donger]

Originally Posted by MahomesMagic

Yep, is he now saying he is going to lock down the schools, businesses and issue mask mandates?

Go find those quotes. You can't. You're just a sad old man that is scared.

Here is someone that is in Sweden traveling right now...

Scary!

Last evening in Stockholm!

Cosy bar... ��and �� tartar

Absolutely love this place!

Tomorrow - Lisbon!

Stay tuned! �� pic.twitter.com/5yQkzoYP0p

— Lilith of Assyria �� (@LilithAssyria) December 25, 2020

I don't know what he's saying now. I doubt that many Swedes care what he says. Anyway, it's already been done earlier this month:

Sweden’s Covid-19 experiment is over.

After a late autumn surge in infections led to rising hospitalizations and deaths, the government has abandoned its attempt—unique among Western nations—to combat the pandemic through voluntary measures.

Like other Europeans, Swedes are now heading into the winter facing restrictions ranging from a ban on large gatherings to curbs on alcohol sales and school closures—all aimed at preventing the country’s health system from being swamped by patients and capping what is already among the highest per capita death tolls in the world.

Weeks later, with total Covid-19-related deaths reaching almost 700 per million inhabitants, infections growing exponentially and hospital wards filling up, the government made a U-turn.

In an emotional televised address on Nov. 22, Prime Minister Stefan Löfven pleaded with Swedes to cancel all nonessential meetings and announced a ban on gatherings of more than eight people, which triggered the closure of cinemas and other entertainment venues. Starting Monday, high schools will be closed.

“Authorities chose a strategy totally different to the rest of Europe, and because of it the country has suffered a lot in the first wave,” said Piotr Nowak, a physician working with Covid-19 patients at the Karolinska University Hospital in Stockholm. “We have no idea how they failed to predict the second wave.”

In recent months, Dr. Tegnell predicted that Swedes would gradually build immunity to the virus through controlled exposure, that vaccines would take longer than expected to develop, and that death rates across the West would converge.

Instead, the West’s first coronavirus vaccine was authorized in Britain last week, Sweden’s death rate remains an outlier among its neighbors, and Dr. Tegnell acknowledged in late November that the new surge in infections showed there was “no sign” of herd immunity in the country.

Meanwhile, Sweden’s laissez-faire pandemic strategy has failed to deliver the economic benefits its proponents had predicted. In the first half of the year, Sweden’s gross domestic product fell by 8.5% and unemployment is projected to rise to nearly 10% in the beginning of 2021, according to the central bank and several economic institutes.

Businesses such as restaurants, hotels and retail outfits are facing a wave of closures; unlike in the rest of Europe, where governments coupled restrictions with generous stimulus, Swedish authorities have offered comparatively less support to businesses since they didn’t impose closures.

“This is worse than a lockdown and it has been a catastrophic year for everyone in the business: they haven’t closed us so they don’t give us any substantial support, yet they say to people ‘don’t go to restaurants’,” said Jonas Hamlund, who was forced to close one of his two restaurants in the coastal city of Sundsvall, laying off 30 people.

Fear of the virus and the government’s advice to avoid social interactions have weighed on domestic demand, damaging business and investor confidence, said Lars Calmfors, an economist and member of the Royal Swedish Academy of Sciences.

“Countries that had mandatory restrictions have done better than us,” he added.

In Stockholm, Anna Lallerstedt runs a chain of three popular restaurants that was started by her parents in the 1980s. Last month she closed two of them, shedding nearly 100 jobs. She says she fears that her last restaurant, now employing just over 10 people, might also be at risk with the current surge expected to peak around the Christmas season, which traditionally brings substantial revenues.

“Maybe we should have had masks earlier,” Ms. Lallerstedt said.

[MahomesMagic]

Originally Posted by Donger

I don't know what he's saying now. I doubt that many Swedes care what he says. Anyway, it's already been done earlier this month:

Sweden’s Covid-19 experiment is over.

After a late autumn surge in infections led to rising hospitalizations and deaths, the government has abandoned its attempt—unique among Western nations—to combat the pandemic through voluntary measures.

Like other Europeans, Swedes are now heading into the winter facing restrictions ranging from a ban on large gatherings to curbs on alcohol sales and school closures—all aimed at preventing the country’s health system from being swamped by patients and capping what is already among the highest per capita death tolls in the world.

Weeks later, with total Covid-19-related deaths reaching almost 700 per million inhabitants, infections growing exponentially and hospital wards filling up, the government made a U-turn.

In an emotional televised address on Nov. 22, Prime Minister Stefan Löfven pleaded with Swedes to cancel all nonessential meetings and announced a ban on gatherings of more than eight people, which triggered the closure of cinemas and other entertainment venues. Starting Monday, high schools will be closed.

“Authorities chose a strategy totally different to the rest of Europe, and because of it the country has suffered a lot in the first wave,” said Piotr Nowak, a physician working with Covid-19 patients at the Karolinska University Hospital in Stockholm. “We have no idea how they failed to predict the second wave.”

In recent months, Dr. Tegnell predicted that Swedes would gradually build immunity to the virus through controlled exposure, that vaccines would take longer than expected to develop, and that death rates across the West would converge.

Instead, the West’s first coronavirus vaccine was authorized in Britain last week, Sweden’s death rate remains an outlier among its neighbors, and Dr. Tegnell acknowledged in late November that the new surge in infections showed there was “no sign” of herd immunity in the country.

Meanwhile, Sweden’s laissez-faire pandemic strategy has failed to deliver the economic benefits its proponents had predicted. In the first half of the year, Sweden’s gross domestic product fell by 8.5% and unemployment is projected to rise to nearly 10% in the beginning of 2021, according to the central bank and several economic institutes.

Businesses such as restaurants, hotels and retail outfits are facing a wave of closures; unlike in the rest of Europe, where governments coupled restrictions with generous stimulus, Swedish authorities have offered comparatively less support to businesses since they didn’t impose closures.

“This is worse than a lockdown and it has been a catastrophic year for everyone in the business: they haven’t closed us so they don’t give us any substantial support, yet they say to people ‘don’t go to restaurants’,” said Jonas Hamlund, who was forced to close one of his two restaurants in the coastal city of Sundsvall, laying off 30 people.

Fear of the virus and the government’s advice to avoid social interactions have weighed on domestic demand, damaging business and investor confidence, said Lars Calmfors, an economist and member of the Royal Swedish Academy of Sciences.

“Countries that had mandatory restrictions have done better than us,” he added.

In Stockholm, Anna Lallerstedt runs a chain of three popular restaurants that was started by her parents in the 1980s. Last month she closed two of them, shedding nearly 100 jobs. She says she fears that her last restaurant, now employing just over 10 people, might also be at risk with the current surge expected to peak around the Christmas season, which traditionally brings substantial revenues.

“Maybe we should have had masks earlier,” Ms. Lallerstedt said.

Boring.Where are the quotes from Tegnell saying he is going to shut down schools and require masks?

You upload this propaganda?!

And BTW, the experiment was not Sweden. The followed the standard Western pandemic guidelines. It's US who are the experiment. China said they did a lockdown so we did one too..no evidence for these prior to 2020. We took their word for it.

And you swallowed the Chinese party line 100%.

[petegz28]

Originally Posted by KS Smitty

I have seen you question the truth and/or veracity of people with credentials similar to his but whatevs pete.

Really? That's all you got?

Mind you what was your reaction when I did said questioning???

[Donger]

Originally Posted by MahomesMagic

Boring.Where are the quotes from Tegnell saying he is going to shut down schools and require masks?

You upload this propaganda?!

And BTW, the experiment was not Sweden. The followed the standard Western pandemic guidelines. It's US who are the experiment. China said they did a lockdown so we did one too..no evidence for these prior to 2020. We took their word for it.

And you swallowed the Chinese party line 100%.

I don't have any quotes of him saying that, nor are they needed. His quote above about not doing the same thing again is sufficient.

Propaganda again? Are you disputing that Sweden implemented these mitigation efforts earlier this month?

Actually, we did use similar mitigation efforts during the Spanish Flu pandemic. Weren't aware of that, eh?

[MahomesMagic]

Originally Posted by Donger

I don't have any quotes of him saying that, nor are they needed. His quote above about not doing the same thing again is sufficient.

Propaganda again? Are you disputing that Sweden implemented these mitigation efforts earlier this month?

Actually, we did use similar mitigation efforts during the Spanish Flu pandemic. Weren't aware of that, eh?

Dude, you don't know shit about Sweden. Shut up and sit down until you learn ANYTHING interesting.

BTW, where are the 100,000+ dead Swedes?

[dirk digler]

MM they are currently passing legislation that will allow them to lock down the entire country. Sweden is in a bad spot and shouldn't have went on the herd immunity path.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-h...-idUSKBN2920WH

The Swedish government has proposed a bill that would allow it to close businesses and fine Covid-19 rule-breakers. Officials previously said the old model of containing the virus was a "failure."

If approved by parliament, the law would take effect on January 10 and stand until the end of September 2021.

[Donger]

Originally Posted by MahomesMagic

Dude, you don't know shit about Sweden. Shut up and sit down until you learn ANYTHING interesting.

BTW, where are the 100,000+ dead Swedes?

Is that a yes? That would fit, actually. You seem allergic to information which doesn't confirm your bias, and there's a lot of that.

Resistance to mitigation efforts isn't a new phenomena. There was an anti-mask league in San Francisco during the Spanish Flu.

Me learn something? I've given you lots of corrective information in just the last few hours.

Odd duck, you are.

[Donger]

Originally Posted by dirk digler

MM they are currently passing legislation that will allow them to lock down the entire country. Sweden is in a bad spot and shouldn't have went on the herd immunity path.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-h...-idUSKBN2920WH

THEY'VE FALLENSZ FOR CHINA PROPAGANDAAZ!!!