Why is Mahomes incapable of running a 4 minute offense

[DRM08]

Originally Posted by tman

Or Tyreek when he ran backward for 10 to 15 yards, Cam for holding or Dee for lining-up off sides. It took a whole lot of stupid by multiple players to lose this game.

Yep, lot of big mistakes by everyone in all three phases of the game.

Brady had his share of mistakes too. His two interceptions led to a 14 point swing in favor of the Chiefs and he was bailed out in the biggest way possible by the Dee Ford mistake.

[carcosa]

Shut the **** up

[Indian Chief]

If scoring too fast is an issue, you have bigger problems -- like a shitty defense.

[TimeForWasp]

Originally Posted by Indian Chief

If scoring too fast is an issue, you have bigger problems -- like a shitty defense.

And us knowing our defense sucks is a good reason not to score too fast. Needed to burn time off.

[Scorpion05]

Originally Posted by Indian Chief

If scoring too fast is an issue, you have bigger problems -- like a shitty defense.

Some of you are way too childish, or haven't been watching football for too long.

Tell me the last time a quick strike offense won the Super Bowl. Name a recent one, if ever. I'll wait

Ball control matters. I argued it on this forum and some of you stubbornly wouldn't listen. Reid's problem has always been ball control and a consistent run game or run play calling. Even Doug Pederson understood the importance of the run game last year. That Jay Ajayi trade was the smartest thing the front office did last season. They leveraged that with an explosive offense. Take the short passes and the 5 yard runs. The problem is, you have a ridiculously talented QB in Mahomes, and a ridiculous talented passing play caller in Reid. They don't balance each other out in that sense

Reid rarely leverages his explosive passing game with a good run game. Even with Hunt, he's never been known as a grind it out coach. It can win you PLENTY of regular season games. It doesn't work for the playoffs. It's why Peyton Manning struggled in the playoffs at times.

[chiefzilla1501]

Originally Posted by Scorpion05

Some of you are way too childish, or haven't been watching football for too long.

Tell me the last time a quick strike offense won the Super Bowl. Name a recent one, if ever. I'll wait

Ball control matters. I argued it on this forum and some of you stubbornly wouldn't listen. Reid's problem has always been ball control and a consistent run game or run play calling. Even Doug Pederson understood the importance of the run game last year. That Jay Ajayi trade was the smartest thing the front office did last season. They leveraged that with an explosive offense. Take the short passes and the 5 yard runs. The problem is, you have a ridiculously talented QB in Mahomes, and a ridiculous talented passing play caller in Reid. They don't balance each other out in that sense

Reid rarely leverages his explosive passing game with a good run game. Even with Hunt, he's never been known as a grind it out coach. It can win you PLENTY of regular season games. It doesn't work for the playoffs. It's why Peyton Manning struggled in the playoffs at times.

And yet our attacking qb was inches away and a coin flip away from taking not only the Chiefs but most of the afc to the closest they've gotten to a super bowl. We proved beyond a shadow of a doubt that as our qb gets better, we're going to be really tough to beat. And he's not going to do it by managing games.

[Scorpion05]

Originally Posted by chiefzilla1501

And yet our attacking qb was inches away and a coin flip away from taking not only the Chiefs but most of the afc to the closest they've gotten to a super bowl. We proved beyond a shadow of a doubt that as our qb gets better, we're going to be really tough to beat. And he's not going to do it by managing games.

Yea and the Panthers, and the Falcons, and the Seahawks, and and and...

Seriously, at some point you have to stop talking about almost and realize that football games are won a certain way. That’s why I asked when was the last time a team with a quick strike offense won the Super Bowl. You can live in almost, or you can accept that there are flaws to the Reid style regardless of the regular season. Call it “managing” games all you want, I call it smart football. Winning football is about balance and toughness, and no matter how much the rules change it always will be

['Hamas' Jenkins]

Originally Posted by Scorpion05

Some of you are way too childish, or haven't been watching football for too long.

Tell me the last time a quick strike offense won the Super Bowl. Name a recent one, if ever. I'll wait

Ball control matters. I argued it on this forum and some of you stubbornly wouldn't listen. Reid's problem has always been ball control and a consistent run game or run play calling. Even Doug Pederson understood the importance of the run game last year. That Jay Ajayi trade was the smartest thing the front office did last season. They leveraged that with an explosive offense. Take the short passes and the 5 yard runs. The problem is, you have a ridiculously talented QB in Mahomes, and a ridiculous talented passing play caller in Reid. They don't balance each other out in that sense

Reid rarely leverages his explosive passing game with a good run game. Even with Hunt, he's never been known as a grind it out coach. It can win you PLENTY of regular season games. It doesn't work for the playoffs. It's why Peyton Manning struggled in the playoffs at times.

99 Rams, ''08 Steelers, '09 Saints, '10 Packers, and numerous others made the Super Bowl.

[Scorpion05]

Originally Posted by 'Hamas' Jenkins

99 Rams, ''08 Steelers, '09 Saints, '10 Packers, and numerous others made the Super Bowl.

They were not “quick strike” offenses. They had balance, WAY more balance than what the Chiefs have. My point still stands

Even the greatest show on turf methodically broke teams down with runs and short catches from Marshall Faulk. Even the Saints this year, contrary to popular belief aren’t quick strike. They’re methodical and efficient with Kamara and Ingram. They don’t leave their defense out on the field all day. So, what were you saying?

[Indian Chief]

Originally Posted by Scorpion05

Some of you are way too childish, or haven't been watching football for too long.

Tell me the last time a quick strike offense won the Super Bowl. Name a recent one, if ever. I'll wait

Ball control matters. I argued it on this forum and some of you stubbornly wouldn't listen. Reid's problem has always been ball control and a consistent run game or run play calling. Even Doug Pederson understood the importance of the run game last year. That Jay Ajayi trade was the smartest thing the front office did last season. They leveraged that with an explosive offense. Take the short passes and the 5 yard runs. The problem is, you have a ridiculously talented QB in Mahomes, and a ridiculous talented passing play caller in Reid. They don't balance each other out in that sense

Reid rarely leverages his explosive passing game with a good run game. Even with Hunt, he's never been known as a grind it out coach. It can win you PLENTY of regular season games. It doesn't work for the playoffs. It's why Peyton Manning struggled in the playoffs at times.

I'm not certain why you chose to quote me.

Originally Posted by Indian Chief

If scoring too fast is an issue, you have bigger problems -- like a shitty defense.

Everything I said there is 100% accurate.

Let me make it simple. If you start messing around in a game that you're losing, you might never score. Would it have been better for the Chiefs to score the go ahead touchdown with 14 seconds left on the clock? Of course. Everyone knows that. You're arguing something that isn't in doubt. The Chiefs were taking what the Patriots were giving them. It's possible they could have sprinkled in a few runs. It's also possible they do that and end up turning it over on downs. I don't know and neither do you. The four minute offense is not for screwing around while you're losing. The results were negative for the Chiefs, but that doesn't open the door to criticism of how they scored.

So I emphatically restate my case: If scoring too fast is an issue, you have bigger problems -- like a shitty defense.

[Sannyasi]

Originally Posted by Indian Chief

I'm not certain why you chose to quote me.



Everything I said there is 100% accurate.

Let me make it simple. If you start messing around in a game that you're losing, you might never score. Would it have been better for the Chiefs to score the go ahead touchdown with 14 seconds left on the clock? Of course. Everyone knows that. You're arguing something that isn't in doubt. The Chiefs were taking what the Patriots were giving them. It's possible they could have sprinkled in a few runs. It's also possible they do that and end up turning it over on downs. I don't know and neither do you. The four minute offense is not for screwing around while you're losing. The results were negative for the Chiefs, but that doesn't open the door to criticism of how they scored.

So I emphatically restate my case: If scoring too fast is an issue, you have bigger problems -- like a shitty defense.

I agree that the defense is shitty, but we knew the defense was shitty before the game. So why was the plan to give the ball back to Brady with time on the clock, and put the worst defense in NFL history against the greatest QB of all time with the game on the line? You didn't need to be Tony Romo to predict that this was not going to work. Sometimes you have to play with the team you have, not the one you wish you had, which means trying to spare the D when you have a chance to run out the clock and end the game.

[Indian Chief]

Originally Posted by Sannyasi

I agree that the defense is shitty, but we knew the defense was shitty before the game. So why was the plan to give the ball back to Brady with time on the clock, and put the worst defense in NFL history against the greatest QB of all time with the game on the line? You didn't need to be Tony Romo to predict that this was not going to work. Sometimes you have to play with the team you have, not the one you wish you had, which means trying to spare the D when you have a chance to run out the clock and end the game.

I understand. But you just made the argument that the plan was to give Brady lots of time to score. I wasn't on that sideline but I will say with 100% certainty that the plan was not to give Brady plenty of time. It was to score -- to take the lead. And they did that. Everyone arguing that Reid/Mahomes were too aggressive are all ignoring the fact that you don't screw around when you're losing. If it was so easy to just take as much time as you want while still scoring, every team would do that. It's not. It's intellectually dishonest to claim that simply taking more time while doing exactly what they did was somehow a foregone conclusion. I'll say this again -- the Chiefs could have just as easily tried to take time off the clock and ended up not scoring.

[Rain Man]

Originally Posted by Indian Chief

I understand. But you just made the argument that the plan was to give Brady lots of time to score. I wasn't on that sideline but I will say with 100% certainty that the plan was not to give Brady plenty of time. It was to score -- to take the lead. And they did that. Everyone arguing that Reid/Mahomes were too aggressive are all ignoring the fact that you don't screw around when you're losing. If it was so easy to just take as much time as you want while still scoring, every team would do that. It's not. It's intellectually dishonest to claim that simply taking more time while doing exactly what they did was somehow a foregone conclusion. I'll say this again -- the Chiefs could have just as easily tried to take time off the clock and ended up not scoring.

The perfect game plan would be to run two 29 minute drives for scores. I wonder why we don't do that.

[Sannyasi]

Originally Posted by Indian Chief

I understand. But you just made the argument that the plan was to give Brady lots of time to score. I wasn't on that sideline but I will say with 100% certainty that the plan was not to give Brady plenty of time. It was to score -- to take the lead. And they did that. Everyone arguing that Reid/Mahomes were too aggressive are all ignoring the fact that you don't screw around when you're losing. If it was so easy to just take as much time as you want while still scoring, every team would do that. It's not. It's intellectually dishonest to claim that simply taking more time while doing exactly what they did was somehow a foregone conclusion. I'll say this again -- the Chiefs could have just as easily tried to take time off the clock and ended up not scoring.

You are right that it ups the degree of difficulty to run out the clock, because our normal offense really doesn't ever play that ball control style of offense. If we run the ball a couple of times on that second to last drive then that does put a lot of pressure on Mahomes. But I'd still rather have the ball in Mahomes' hands at the end rather than trusting our D. I think the winning teams really do play to get the last possession, I've seen Brady and Manning both do it. I'm sure that Brady was salivating when he saw how much time he had left to score at the end of the game.

[jjjayb]

Originally Posted by Sannyasi

I agree that the defense is shitty, but we knew the defense was shitty before the game. So why was the plan to give the ball back to Brady with time on the clock, and put the worst defense in NFL history against the greatest QB of all time with the game on the line? You didn't need to be Tony Romo to predict that this was not going to work. Sometimes you have to play with the team you have, not the one you wish you had, which means trying to spare the D when you have a chance to run out the clock and end the game.

Because it's better to give the ball back to Brady when we HAVE THE FRIGGING LEAD, than to use up all the time but not score. You're taking for granted that we could actually run a 4 minute offense and score. Again, how does it help us to run down the clock if we don't end up scoring?

As an offense, you're first priority is to put points on the board. Which they did. It's up to the defense to do their job. As it turned out, Brady and the super coach went down and scored so quickly that we had time to go down the field and score again. Are you saying that they ****ed up too?