The Pussification of the Chiefs...

[jspchief]

Vermeil's job is done. He's finally removed all semblance of sack from this team.

I just got done watching Gonzo on ESPN, bitching about contact that wasn't called. Of course it's the refs fault, exactly like DV taught you. I was sick of watching Vermeil pass blame 8 weeks ago, now I have to watch our players do it too. At what point does this team stop passing the buck and start taking responsibility? When will Vermeil stop bitching about the roster limits, that the rest of the NFL's coaches have learned to live with? When will he call out a player for a stupid personal foul, instead of justifying it by saying you get away with it half the time? When will the guys that aren't getting the job done get benched instead of hugged? When do we lose a game because we under-performed, instead of the other team outplaying us? When is anyone accountable for failure in the Chiefs organization? The only guys that get blasted are the kicker, the punter, and a guy that's never been given a real chance to prove himself and silence his critics.

This team has no attitude and IMO it's direct reflection of our eunuch head coach. Our D doesn't know how to hit, but they know how to get slapped around and made fools of. Our O won't fight for a reception, but will beg for a flag on every incompletion. They look like a bunch pussies right now, and instead of getting mad, they're rolling over.

Just once I'd like to see some Parcells type disgust directed at a poor performance, instead of a tear, a hug, and a pat on the ass.

[Wile_E_Coyote]

"Great point. Since other teams have looked like pusses in the past, it's OK for this team to do it. "

ESPN has a formula also

[Straight, No Chaser]

Originally Posted by The Bad Guy

Obviously the Patriots are doing something right. 2 Super Bowls in 3 years and a 9-1 record this year using offensive guys on defense and vice versa?

If this was the Chiefs, you would love the attention.

But sadly, the Chiefs aren't smart enough to pull off 1/100th of what the Pats do.

Yea, you could be right, but there's no chance I'll find out this year.

The Pats are a good team and damn good org. right now. I told Amniocentesis that I would consider them a "great" team when they win another SB. After last night they are one step closer (I guess). Amnio has a great run going; evangelizing (?) the masses on the Pats "Blueprint". IMO, they are walking a tightrope with all the coaching moves and player injuries, etc. They are bound to fall off. Better for them if it happens before the playoffs. I see them and Pittsburgh getting into it for the AFC title.


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[KCTitus]

Originally Posted by The Bad Guy

How many 6th round picks have the Chiefs hit the lottery with.

Obviously, Brady wouldn't come in and do this for any team. They have the perfect system for his talents and have coached him to the player he is.

I'm talking about winning with injuries, putting offensive players on defense and not having a huge fallout. Getting guys like Mike Vrabel, Rodney Harrison, Tyrone Poole and having them make a huge defensive impact.

Look at their offensive line, there's not one superstar, but they protect just as well as any line in the league.

Their receivers get the job done despite not being superstars.. Givens was a 6th rounder, Branch a 2nd rounder, Troy Brown has been around forever, David Patten was cast off 3 other teams.

I wasnt comparing KC to NE, I was speaking to getting lucky with a 6th rounder. I dont know really WTF that has to do with how many 'KC has hit the lottery with'--I wasnt really trying to make that point.

Two things... Let's not forget that before that season started, NE signed Bledsoe to the, then, largest contract in the NFL and NE started that season 1-3 when Brady came in everything changed.

Im glad for them, but I also realize that save for that injury to Bledsoe, they were nothing more than the average NFL team.

[Amnorix]

Originally Posted by KCTitus

You mean hit the lottery with a 6th round pick? I defy anyone to try to convince me that with Drew Bledsoe this team wins a single SB championship.

I'd agree that we wouldn't have won a SB with Bledsoe.

I also agree that the Brady pick was partly luck, as in we didn't know how good he could be for us. But obviously, it's not like we just picked his name out of a hat when we picked him. We scouted two guys hard for that draft -- Brady and Rattay of the Niners, and we decided we wanted Brady.

Note well that the Patriots rarely strike out on high picks, and do very well for themselves with low round picks, draft day manuevering, undrafted free agents, etc.

[KCTitus]

Originally Posted by Amnorix

...But obviously, it's not like we just picked his name out of a hat when we picked him.

Obviously...I would say every team in the NFL uses the same 'educated guess' approach to low round picks and hopes they pan out. This is nothing unique to the Patriots. Contrary to the conventional wisdom on this BB, even KC uses the same approach.

Im glad it worked out...it transformed a strong defense, shaky offense into a dynasty in a parity driven league.

[Amnorix]

Originally Posted by KCTitus

Two things... Let's not forget that before that season started, NE signed Bledsoe to the, then, largest contract in the NFL and NE started that season 1-3 when Brady came in everything changed.

Im glad for them, but I also realize that save for that injury to Bledsoe, they were nothing more than the average NFL team.

You have enough knowledge to be dangerous, so let me fill in the gaps:

1. The Bledsoe signing/extension was as much a restructuring as anything else. It was THAT element that allowed us to trade him to Buffalo the next offseason without crushing our cap. Also, I'm sure you know as well as I that the "X years at Y dollars" is always inflated to assume every incentive is met, etc. If it was really those numbers, he would've been untradeable due to the salary cap hit (read: Peyton Manning).

2. Without the injury to Bledsoe, we would not have won the SB in '01. I will point out, however, that Belichick was getting ready to pull the trigger on Bledsoe for Brady (remember Kosar for Testaverde), although it would've gone on long enough to guarantee us a lost season in '01. It was already clear at the end of training camp that Brady had passed Damon Huard (former starter for Miami) on the depth chart, and was pushing Drew.

Don't make the mistake for a second of assuming that absent Mo Lewis (praise be his name!) nailing Bledsoe, he'd still be the Patriots' starter today. That is definitely not correct.

[Amnorix]

Originally Posted by KCTitus

Obviously...I would say every team in the NFL uses the same 'educated guess' approach to low round picks and hopes they pan out. This is nothing unique to the Patriots. Contrary to the conventional wisdom on this BB, even KC uses the same approach.

Im glad it worked out...it transformed a strong defense, shaky offense into a dynasty in a parity driven league.

All draft picks at all positions and all rounds of the draft are "educated guesses".

Some organizations are better at educating themselves than others...

[KCTitus]

Originally Posted by Amnorix

You have enough knowledge to be dangerous, so let me fill in the gaps:

1. The Bledsoe signing/extension was as much a restructuring as anything else. It was THAT element that allowed us to trade him to Buffalo the next offseason without crushing our cap. Also, I'm sure you know as well as I that the "X years at Y dollars" is always inflated to assume every incentive is met, etc. If it was really those numbers, he would've been untradeable due to the salary cap hit (read: Peyton Manning).

2. Without the injury to Bledsoe, we would not have won the SB in '01. I will point out, however, that Belichick was getting ready to pull the trigger on Bledsoe for Brady (remember Kosar for Testaverde), although it would've gone on long enough to guarantee us a lost season in '01. It was already clear at the end of training camp that Brady had passed Damon Huard (former starter for Miami) on the depth chart, and was pushing Drew.

Don't make the mistake for a second of assuming that absent Mo Lewis (praise be his name!) nailing Bledsoe, he'd still be the Patriots' starter today. That is definitely not correct.

That's parsing...Since Im not a fan of the NE Pats, Im not going to pretend to know the 'inner workings' of the personnel decisions prior to that change. I can tell you what I saw as an observer from a disinterested position.

The above doesnt change my position that Brady is the key to a lion's share of NE's success.

[jspchief]

Didn't Bledsoe come in and jumpstart a stagnant offense to win one of your play-off games? I don't really have a point other than that without Bledsoe, you probably wouldn't have that first Superbowl.

[KCTitus]

Originally Posted by Amnorix

All draft picks at all positions and all rounds of the draft are "educated guesses".

Some organizations are better at educating themselves than others...

Preaching to the choir.

[Baby Lee]

DV is paralyzed by the success of sticking with his ingredients to cook up a SB stew with the Rams. He is convinced that playing together and cohering will eventually result in greater success than having his players in constant fear of being cut and the roster becoming a revolving door. I told you guys from jump street that was his approach. I also said that it working once is no guarantee here.

[Amnorix]

Originally Posted by jspchief

Didn't Bledsoe come in and jumpstart a stagnant offense to win one of your play-off games? I don't really have a point other than that without Bledsoe, you probably wouldn't have that first Superbowl.

He came in at the end of the first half of the Steelers AFC Championship game and threw a TD. It was our only offensive TD that game (we had 1 or 2 on Special Teams as well).

He gets a share of credit for it, but there's no way of knowing what would have happened in the 2nd half with Brady in there (Bledsoe was mediocre in the 2nd half).

[Amnorix]

Originally Posted by KCTitus

The above doesnt change my position that Brady is the key to a lion's share of NE's success.

I understand what you're saying, but all successful franchises have very good or great QBs under center, and it's hardly true that all of them were highly touted draft picks.

Only exception to this I can think of is the Gibbs' Redskins teams.

[Brock]

Originally Posted by Baby Lee

DV is paralyzed by the success of sticking with his ingredients to cook up a SB stew with the Rams. He is convinced that playing together and cohering will eventually result in greater success than having his players in constant fear of being cut and the roster becoming a revolving door. I told you guys from jump street that was his approach. I also said that it working once is no guarantee here.

I tiresome I told you so? You're better than that.

[KCTitus]

Originally Posted by Amnorix

I understand what you're saying, but all successful franchises have very good or great QBs under center, and it's hardly true that all of them were highly touted draft picks.

Only exception to this I can think of is the Gibbs' Redskins teams.

Again, it's not the point Im trying to make...Joe Montana wasnt a highly touted pick either. What Im trying to point out is that Brady coming onto the scene put the club over the hump as it were--kind of like what happened with Warner and the Rams.

That change was the catalyst to the success that NE is seeing to this day.

So, I guess, if KC were to follow NE's success, they need to get lucky and find a monster MLB or shutdown DB of the next Derrick Thomas in the 6th round...

Problem is, KC's not that lucky.