Chiefs Chiefs have to decide if No. 5 pick is too high for a safety - Page 6

Coogs · 04-20-2010, 07:11 AM

http://www.kansascity.com/2010/04/19...e-if-no-5.html

Chiefs have to decide if No. 5 pick is too high for a safety
By KENT BABB
The Kansas City Star

They sold themselves as versatile and able, and if a team wanted a safety to be anything other than a safety, they said they’d be willing, too.

Eric Berry said he’d play cornerback. Taylor Mays said he’d be fine at linebacker. Earl Thomas said he’d be happy anywhere in an NFL defense. Whatever it takes. That’s what they said at the NFL’s scouting combine in late February.

“I’ll play whatever,” said Mays, a standout defensive back from Southern California. “If I’m on the field, it doesn’t really matter. I want to win. I want to contribute. I like football regardless.”

But sometimes, a safety needs to just be a safety. That’s what several NFL teams will be looking for when the three-day draft begins Thursday. The Chiefs are among those teams, and they’ll have a vast array of options.

The Chiefs could do the popular thing and select Berry with the No. 5 overall pick. Some scouts say Berry is the best safety prospect since Sean Taylor of Miami in 2004.

Berry, a former Tennessee star, possesses skills that have been compared with those of perennial Pro Bowlers Ed Reed and Troy Polamalu.

Then again, the Chiefs might pass on Berry — passing, in fact, on the big dollars they’d owe to someone playing a position that just isn’t valued the same way, the top-five money way, as a quarterback or left tackle or defensive end.

Not that Berry is the type to limit himself.

“I bring a lot to the table,” he said at the combine. “I can do pretty much anything the coaches ask me to.”

The Chiefs, of course, are at the center of a conundrum. They could draft Berry and, if he’s as good as advertised, be set at an important position that is becoming more important with each season. Offenses are becoming increasingly reliant on pass plays, and the game has evolved in such a way that safety might soon be seen as a premium defensive position — easily worth the money a player would command as the No. 5 pick.

“We’ve seen the evolution of the safety position to be one of the most important positions on the field,” ESPN analyst Ron Jaworski said. “It is a specific talent that you have to have. You have to be a (high-) quality cover guy; you have to be able to play in the box; you have to be able to blitz. It’s a position that now demands versatility.

“I think the safety position is now paramount in the NFL.”

Then again, the Chiefs could pass on Berry and target a safety in later rounds. This year’s draft is stacked that way: plenty of safeties, a desperate need for the Chiefs — one of the few weaknesses that general manager Scott Pioli didn’t address during free-agency — and a draft pool heavy on skilled players that will allow teams to draft early-round talent at midround prices.

What to do? The phenom or the value? Conventional thinking or a look toward a progressive future? It’s a tough one. And soon, the Chiefs will be on the clock.

“You hear this all the time: ‘You can’t take a safety that high,’ ” said Chris Landry, a former NFL scout who’s now a personnel consultant for 11 pro teams. “But some people get caught up in these sayings, and they don’t know why that’s the case. Eric Berry can line up in a number of schemes. … Would I consider taking him at 5? Yeah, I would.”

There’s an off chance, though, that Mays could fall to the early second round. It’s unlikely, but teams might be hung up on the fact that Mays’ ability to hit hard isn’t matched by coverage ability. The Chiefs might gamble that Mays will be there when they draft for the first time in the second round, the No. 36 overall pick. If Mays is gone, there will be others. Yes, this year’s draft is stacked that way.

“It’s harder and harder to find the well-rounded safety,” ESPN analyst and former NFL coach Jon Gruden said. “But I’ve seen a couple in this year’s draft that certainly fit my bill.”

The Chiefs could have their eyes on South Florida’s Nate Allen, Georgia Tech’s Morgan Burnett, Georgia’s Reshad Jones or Kansas’ Darrell Stuckey. All will be later-round choices; all could be terrific values for a team that likes a good bargain and could address needs at linebacker, wide receiver and nose tackle before plucking that mid- to late-round safety.

“It’s a good group,” Landry said. “There is incredible depth defensively in this draft, more so than normal.”

So the players aren’t the only ones with a bulging menu of options. Yes, the Chiefs have a tough decision ahead. Who could blame Berry for trying to sway a team into deciding on him?

“At the end of the day,” he said, “it’s on the GMs and the guys that make the decisions. I really do feel that I’m supposed to be up there with those guys.

“If you want a complete defensive back, a complete player as far as special teams — I played on kick return, kickoff, punt, punt return, all of those things. I definitely played free safety, strong safety, nickel corner, left and right corner. The list goes on. … So many things you could keep saying. I really want to sell myself.”

SenselessChiefsFan · 04-20-2010, 02:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pestilence

Yeah.....still waiting.

And I'll still be waiting 2 days from now because you have no response to that. Or maybe you're just too busy posting as Saccopoo right now.

Again, there were fewer bowl games then. It was harder to get to one. Now, 68 teams go to bowl games, roughly half.

You really didn't make a point, you understand that right?

The fact that Joe Montana went to bowl games means what exactly? I am sure many HOF QB's went to bowl games. I bet it is pretty much the norm, and not the exception. Especially as time has gone on and there are more and more bowl games.

About half of the college teams go to the bowls.

Also, do you think that teams, especially, college teams were as QB driven in 1983? You do realize that the rules have changed allowing for more success passing the football, and coaches have went away from the old college offenses.

Times of changed.

But, again, I really don't see your point about Joe Montana having gone to bowl games.

**The Franchise** · 04-20-2010, 02:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SensibleChiefsfan

Again, there were fewer bowl games then. It was harder to get to one. Now, 68 teams go to bowl games, roughly half.

You really didn't make a point, you understand that right?

The fact that Joe Montana went to bowl games means what exactly? I am sure many HOF QB's went to bowl games. I bet it is pretty much the norm, and not the exception. Especially as time has gone on and there are more and more bowl games.

About half of the college teams go to the bowls.

Also, do you think that teams, especially, college teams were as QB driven in 1983? You do realize that the rules have changed allowing for more success passing the football, and coaches have went away from the old college offenses.

Times of changed.

But, again, I really don't see your point about Joe Montana having gone to bowl games.

Then what was your point with the comment about how Clausen didn't even take his team to a good bowl game?

SenselessChiefsFan · 04-20-2010, 02:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pestilence

Then what was your point with the comment about how Clausen didn't even take his team to a good bowl game?

Okay, from the top: The big argument for a franchise qb is that he elevates the play of the team. Clausen never had a better than 6-6 season in college. And, it's not like he played in the SEC, he played at ND against some mediocre competition.

College isn't the NFL. A great QB can carry a college team even more so than in the NFL.

So, not getting a team to even a winning record is a pretty damning statement in my estimation.

It will be fun to see how it all pans out though.

Chiefnj2 · 04-20-2010, 03:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Laz

400+ passing attempts
68% completion percentage
8+ yards average
28 TD's / 4 ints
24 sacks (and even many more pressures)
161% QB rating for the year

The ND offense ran through Jimmy Clausen all year ....... period.

From highlights, it seems like it ran through Golden Tate.

Mecca · 04-20-2010, 03:04 PM

It's Jimmy Clausen's fault his team couldn't stop anyone.

Don't these same people relentlessly defend Trent Green for this same shit?

**The Franchise** · 04-20-2010, 03:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SensibleChiefsfan

Okay, from the top: The big argument for a franchise qb is that he elevates the play of the team. Clausen never had a better than 6-6 season in college. And, it's not like he played in the SEC, he played at ND against some mediocre competition.

College isn't the NFL. A great QB can carry a college team even more so than in the NFL.

So, not getting a team to even a winning record is a pretty damning statement in my estimation.

It will be fun to see how it all pans out though.

John Elway's best season at Stanford was 6-5.

Chiefs Pantalones · 04-20-2010, 03:14 PM

I really want Berry, but if I were the Chiefs, I'd take Clausen. The QB position is more important than safety and if Cassel doesn't work out this year...well we're back to square one. You HAVE to have a good QB to even think about a Super Bowl appearance, let alone a victory. Just my opinion though.

Mecca · 04-20-2010, 03:14 PM

Yea wins and losses matter so much, that's why Ken Dorsey is a great NFL QB, oh wait...

**The Franchise** · 04-20-2010, 03:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chiefnj2

From highlights, it seems like it ran through Golden Tate.

It was pretty equal until Michael Floyd got hurt.

**DaneMcCloud** · 04-20-2010, 03:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pestilence

John Elway's best season at Stanford was 6-5.

I've come to realize that this guy is not only the biggest asshole on the 'Planet, because he continually wastes people's time with his inane bullshit, but that there is no one, including Roy III, that knows less about college and NFL football.

**DeezNutz** · 04-20-2010, 03:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pestilence

John Elway's best season at Stanford was 6-5.

Roethlisberger was ****ing ridiculous in college. Dude's performance in huge bowl games, money.

'Hamas' Jenkins · 04-20-2010, 03:22 PM

How the hell could anyone argue that Matt Ryan had better numbers than Jimmy Clausen. Their last years aren't comparable at all.

**DeezNutz** · 04-20-2010, 03:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 'Hamas' Jenkins

How the hell could anyone argue that Matt Ryan had better numbers than Jimmy Clausen. Their last years aren't comparable at all.

All about wins.

Short-sighted and myopic as ****, but those are the fringe benefits of Chiefs fandom.

May we interest you in a season ticket package? Another one, that is?

Mecca · 04-20-2010, 03:25 PM

Why is it that all of the arguments against Clausen surround things that are not measurable?

- He isnt a leader
- He is arrogant/cocky
- He hasnt won enough

This would be like responding in a debate with "well you know, I just don't like him"

**DeezNutz** · 04-20-2010, 03:26 PM

I don't like how he looks. /CP

Chiefs fans: more interested in ****ing him than drafting him.

04-20-2010, 07:11 AM
Coogs In Search of a Life Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Northern Kansas Casino cash: $1204349	Chiefs have to decide if No. 5 pick is too high for a safety http://www.kansascity.com/2010/04/19...e-if-no-5.html Chiefs have to decide if No. 5 pick is too high for a safety By KENT BABB The Kansas City Star They sold themselves as versatile and able, and if a team wanted a safety to be anything other than a safety, they said they’d be willing, too. Eric Berry said he’d play cornerback. Taylor Mays said he’d be fine at linebacker. Earl Thomas said he’d be happy anywhere in an NFL defense. Whatever it takes. That’s what they said at the NFL’s scouting combine in late February. “I’ll play whatever,” said Mays, a standout defensive back from Southern California. “If I’m on the field, it doesn’t really matter. I want to win. I want to contribute. I like football regardless.” But sometimes, a safety needs to just be a safety. That’s what several NFL teams will be looking for when the three-day draft begins Thursday. The Chiefs are among those teams, and they’ll have a vast array of options. The Chiefs could do the popular thing and select Berry with the No. 5 overall pick. Some scouts say Berry is the best safety prospect since Sean Taylor of Miami in 2004. Berry, a former Tennessee star, possesses skills that have been compared with those of perennial Pro Bowlers Ed Reed and Troy Polamalu. Then again, the Chiefs might pass on Berry — passing, in fact, on the big dollars they’d owe to someone playing a position that just isn’t valued the same way, the top-five money way, as a quarterback or left tackle or defensive end. Not that Berry is the type to limit himself. “I bring a lot to the table,” he said at the combine. “I can do pretty much anything the coaches ask me to.” The Chiefs, of course, are at the center of a conundrum. They could draft Berry and, if he’s as good as advertised, be set at an important position that is becoming more important with each season. Offenses are becoming increasingly reliant on pass plays, and the game has evolved in such a way that safety might soon be seen as a premium defensive position — easily worth the money a player would command as the No. 5 pick. “We’ve seen the evolution of the safety position to be one of the most important positions on the field,” ESPN analyst Ron Jaworski said. “It is a specific talent that you have to have. You have to be a (high-) quality cover guy; you have to be able to play in the box; you have to be able to blitz. It’s a position that now demands versatility. “I think the safety position is now paramount in the NFL.” Then again, the Chiefs could pass on Berry and target a safety in later rounds. This year’s draft is stacked that way: plenty of safeties, a desperate need for the Chiefs — one of the few weaknesses that general manager Scott Pioli didn’t address during free-agency — and a draft pool heavy on skilled players that will allow teams to draft early-round talent at midround prices. What to do? The phenom or the value? Conventional thinking or a look toward a progressive future? It’s a tough one. And soon, the Chiefs will be on the clock. “You hear this all the time: ‘You can’t take a safety that high,’ ” said Chris Landry, a former NFL scout who’s now a personnel consultant for 11 pro teams. “But some people get caught up in these sayings, and they don’t know why that’s the case. Eric Berry can line up in a number of schemes. … Would I consider taking him at 5? Yeah, I would.” There’s an off chance, though, that Mays could fall to the early second round. It’s unlikely, but teams might be hung up on the fact that Mays’ ability to hit hard isn’t matched by coverage ability. The Chiefs might gamble that Mays will be there when they draft for the first time in the second round, the No. 36 overall pick. If Mays is gone, there will be others. Yes, this year’s draft is stacked that way. “It’s harder and harder to find the well-rounded safety,” ESPN analyst and former NFL coach Jon Gruden said. “But I’ve seen a couple in this year’s draft that certainly fit my bill.” The Chiefs could have their eyes on South Florida’s Nate Allen, Georgia Tech’s Morgan Burnett, Georgia’s Reshad Jones or Kansas’ Darrell Stuckey. All will be later-round choices; all could be terrific values for a team that likes a good bargain and could address needs at linebacker, wide receiver and nose tackle before plucking that mid- to late-round safety. “It’s a good group,” Landry said. “There is incredible depth defensively in this draft, more so than normal.” So the players aren’t the only ones with a bulging menu of options. Yes, the Chiefs have a tough decision ahead. Who could blame Berry for trying to sway a team into deciding on him? “At the end of the day,” he said, “it’s on the GMs and the guys that make the decisions. I really do feel that I’m supposed to be up there with those guys. “If you want a complete defensive back, a complete player as far as special teams — I played on kick return, kickoff, punt, punt return, all of those things. I definitely played free safety, strong safety, nickel corner, left and right corner. The list goes on. … So many things you could keep saying. I really want to sell myself.”
Posts: 21,645

04-20-2010, 03:04 PM	#80
Mecca Hockey Town Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Kansas City, Missouri Casino cash: $2217050	It's Jimmy Clausen's fault his team couldn't stop anyone. Don't these same people relentlessly defend Trent Green for this same shit?
Posts: 111,210

04-20-2010, 03:14 PM	#82
Chiefs Pantalones GO CHIEFS!!!!!! Join Date: Feb 2001 Location: Kansas City Casino cash: $7888717	I really want Berry, but if I were the Chiefs, I'd take Clausen. The QB position is more important than safety and if Cassel doesn't work out this year...well we're back to square one. You HAVE to have a good QB to even think about a Super Bowl appearance, let alone a victory. Just my opinion though. __________________ Don't be fooled by my username, I'm white.
Posts: 26,630

04-20-2010, 03:14 PM	#83
Mecca Hockey Town Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Kansas City, Missouri Casino cash: $2217050	Yea wins and losses matter so much, that's why Ken Dorsey is a great NFL QB, oh wait...
Posts: 111,210

04-20-2010, 03:22 PM	#87
'Hamas' Jenkins Now you've pissed me off! Join Date: Jan 2006 Casino cash: $7939572	How the hell could anyone argue that Matt Ryan had better numbers than Jimmy Clausen. Their last years aren't comparable at all. __________________ "When the Know-Nothings get control, it will read 'all men are created equal, except negroes, and foreigners, and Catholics.' When it comes to this I should prefer emigrating to some country where they make no pretense of loving liberty – to Russia, for instance, where despotism can be taken pure, and without the base alloy of hypocrisy.”--Abraham Lincoln
Posts: 74,853

04-20-2010, 03:25 PM	#89
Mecca Hockey Town Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Kansas City, Missouri Casino cash: $2217050	Why is it that all of the arguments against Clausen surround things that are not measurable? - He isnt a leader - He is arrogant/cocky - He hasnt won enough This would be like responding in a debate with "well you know, I just don't like him"
Posts: 111,210