Raiders Trade for Carson Palmer

[PunkinDrublic]

ROFL Palmer won't last the whole season. Doesn't suprise me that stupid fucking faider fans are defending this move.

[Montane]

Palmer's been working out with TJ Houshmandzadeh who says, "He’s healthy. He’s throwing it like the Carson of old.” If true, worth the two picks.

[Chronic]

Wow, if not worried, why 50 pages?

Chief fans jealous, like the little kid at Christmas that gets nothing and is jealousy of the neighbor kid with the brand new bike

[The Bad Guy]

Palmer's been working out with TJ Houshmandzadeh who says, "He’s healthy. He’s throwing it like the Carson of old.” If true, worth the two picks.

There's few QBs in this league worth a 1st and a 2nd.

Old Carson Palmer isn't one of them.

[SPchief]

Wow, if not worried, why 50 pages?

Chief fans jealous, like the little kid at Christmas that gets nothing and is jealousy of the neighbor kid with the brand new bike

We're not worried or jealous. We're laughing at how bad of a trade it was

[The Bad Guy]

Wow, if not worried, why 50 pages?

Chief fans jealous, like the little kid at Christmas that gets nothing and is jealousy of the neighbor kid with the brand new bike

I know you probably can't read, but most of the replies in this thread are from Raider fans.

Worried about what?

[The Bad Guy]

Guy hasn't had a training camp, nor has he practiced extensively with his WRs, but he's going to play this week?

The Raiders are trying to really hault this suck for luck.

[RealSNR]

Not sure if this joke has been made yet, but I'll bet R8ers is pretty confused when he called up David Ramsey today and found out Ramsey said the deal was a waste of draft picks and money, and it's not a good debt-free way to live

[BigMeatballDave]

Corky says Raider fans are retarded

[Brock]

Wow, if not worried, why 50 pages?

Chief fans jealous, like the little kid at Christmas that gets nothing and is jealousy of the neighbor kid with the brand new bike

Worry? Most people think it hilariously funny. It's more like "did you see Joey's new bike? Do you think he knows it's a girl's bike?"

[SnakeXJones]

Wow, if not worried, why 50 pages?

Chief fans jealous, like the little kid at Christmas that gets nothing and is jealousy of the neighbor kid with the brand new bike While Mike Brown opens his presents and gets fucking draft picks

[The Bad Guy]

Raider fan logic is priceless in this thread:

"We don't need no draft picks, our entire team is young".

The rationale is hysterical.

[BigMeatballDave]

I want a win Sunday in the worst way now.

[KcMizzou]

I want a win Sunday in the worst way now.We've got a pretty good chance, no matter which QB they start.

[jd1020]

There's few QBs in this league worth a 1st and a 2nd.

Old Carson Palmer isn't one of them.

Are you saying that you wouldn't give a 1st and a 2nd for a 4000 yard/30 TD/65% completion QB?

[PunkinDrublic]

Wow, if not worried, why 50 pages?

Chief fans jealous, like the little kid at Christmas that gets nothing and is jealousy of the neighbor kid with the brand new bike

Haterz are just jealous of my sweet Ed Hardy shirt.

[SenselessChiefsFan]

Wow, if not worried, why 50 pages?

Chief fans jealous, like the little kid at Christmas that gets nothing and is jealousy of the neighbor kid with the brand new bike

Actually, the Chiefs are having a bad year. The Chiefs have a bad QB.

It is nice to look at this and realize it could be worse. Misery loves company.

[BossChief]

Are you saying that you wouldn't give a 1st and a 2nd for a 4000 yard/30 TD/65% completion QB?SOOOOO basically you think he is the Carson from 2005 with those stats you threw up?

He isnt.

oh, the stats game.

Can I play?

How about the guy that has thrown 100 interceptions and fumbled the ball 42 times?

How about the guy that has barely gotten over the 60% mark the last few years.

The guy that will turn 32 during the season and hasnt trusted his knee since he was 26.

The guy that hasnt thrown a real strong ball since his elbow injury.

Carson Palmer is fools gold.

I dont know what is funnier, the Stanford Routt deal or paying a 1 and 2 for a guy that isnt worth a 3.

[Montane]

Raider's got a first and a second round pick for trading their coach! That trade didn't work out too badly for Tampa Bay. Well see how this trade works out.

[jd1020]

oh, the stats game.

Can I play?

How about the guy that has thrown 100 interceptions and fumbled the ball 42 times?

How about the guy that has barely gotten over the 60% mark the last few years.

The guy that will turn 32 during the season and hasnt trusted his knee since he was 26.

The guy that hasnt thrown a real strong ball since his elbow injury.

Carson Palmer is fools gold.

I dont know what is funnier, the Stanford Routt deal or paying a 1 and 2 for a guy that isnt worth a 3.

We are talking about the old Carson Palmer. You know... the one putting up numbers comparable to the best QB's in the game.

Thanks for playing.

[Sonic Cowboy-Raider]

Carson Palmer had an inept off. coord. in Cincy, two diva WRs who cared about their show(s) more than running routes, headcases that were brought in only to be arrested week in and week out...The inmates basically ran the asylum when Palmer was in Cinn. Easy to disillusion any franchise QB.

Hue Jackson was Palmer's QB coach at USC and receivers coach when Palmer had his bigest amt. of success as a Bengal.

[SenselessChiefsFan]

Are you saying that you wouldn't give a 1st and a 2nd for a 4000 yard/30 TD/65% completion QB?

He never had all those numbers in the same year. Heck, his career passer rating is less than 87.

[SenselessChiefsFan]

Raider's got a first and a second round pick for trading their coach! That trade didn't work out too badly for Tampa Bay. Well see how this trade works out.

I know Palmer is close the age of a coach..... but he isn't a coach.

Oh, and the Raiders were bashed for that trade too... and at that time, all the Raider homers (like you) were talking about how Gruden didn't matter.

Ooops.

[jd1020]

He never had all those numbers in the same year. Heck, his career passer rating is less than 87.

My bad bro. <200 yards is clearly not worth a 1st and 2nd. Carson was one of the best QB's in the game before his injury and to say you wouldn't give a 1st and a 2nd for that is fucking stupid.

[SenselessChiefsFan]

We are talking about the old Carson Palmer. You know... the one putting up numbers comparable to the best QB's in the game.

Thanks for playing.

Well, was he talking about 'old' carson palmer as in the 'young' carson palmer or was he talking about the 'old' carson palmer meaning the current palmer who is, by NFL standards, OLD.

[lostcause]

ok, ok, ok... how epic if he plays against the chiefs, but because he's not conditioned he gets hurt on say a hali play and bangs up his acl. i mean, i have nothing against palmer, other than the stupid silver and black helmet now. and i know injuries are uncool.

But, if this happened to the raiders...

[jd1020]

Well, was he talking about 'old' carson palmer as in the 'young' carson palmer or was he talking about the 'old' carson palmer meaning the current palmer who is, by NFL standards, OLD.

... Read the quoted text and get back to me on that. If you have to ask that question you should probably remove yourself from society.

[SenselessChiefsFan]

My bad bro. <200 yards is clearly not worth a 1st and 2nd. Carson was one of the best QB's in the game before his injury and to say you wouldn't give a 1st and a 2nd for that is ****ing stupid.

I didn't make that argument. I am just pointing out that you are exagerating his stats.

And, would you make the trade if you knew that he was not going to have another year of that caliber for the next five years at least?

See, he WAS injured. And, he has never been the same. You can debate whether he was worth those picks in 2005.... but its 2011.

[jd1020]

I didn't make that argument. I am just pointing out that you are exagerating his stats.

And, would you make the trade if you knew that he was not going to have another year of that caliber for the next five years at least?

See, he WAS injured. And, he has never been the same. You can debate whether he was worth those picks in 2005.... but its 2011.

It doesn't matter if he was injured. That's not the ****ing argument. JFC you are stupid.

[SenselessChiefsFan]

ok, ok, ok... how epic if he plays against the chiefs, but because he's not conditioned he gets hurt on say a hali play and bangs up his acl. i mean, i have nothing against palmer, other than the stupid silver and black helmet now. and i know injuries are uncool.

But, if this happened to the raiders...

No, I would much rather him flame out while healthy. If he gets hurt, the Raiders fans will just talk about how great it would have been and how injuries are part of the game.

Now, if it is a non contact injury...it would be a little better.

[GordonGekko]

Good pick up by the Bay City Scum. Definitely an exponential upgrade over Denver and KC QB's.

[SenselessChiefsFan]

It doesn't matter if he was injured. That's not the ****ing argument. JFC you are stupid.

Yeah, I am the one who quotes stats and can't even get them right. My bad.

[jd1020]

Yeah, I am the one who quotes stats and can't even get them right. My bad.

I was averaging his stats, dipshit. He had 3 years around 4000 yards, 30 TDs, and 65% completions.

[Montane]

I know Palmer is close the age of a coach..... but he isn't a coach.

Oh, and the Raiders were bashed for that trade too... and at that time, all the Raider homers (like you) were talking about how Gruden didn't matter.

Ooops.

Jim Plunket and Rich Gannon were both 33 when they joined the Raiders. Palmer at 31 is still a kid by that standard!

[GordonGekko]

Jim Plunket and Rich Gannon were both 33 when they joined the Raiders. Palmer at 31 is still a kid by that standard!

Way to bring up Rich Gannon, here is a complementary GFY :thumb:

[SenselessChiefsFan]

... Read the quoted text and get back to me on that. If you have to ask that question you should probably remove yourself from society.

Man, someone is cranky. I was just having a little fun with wordplay. Sorry for pissing on your cheerios.

[BossChief]

Carson Palmer had an inept off. coord. in Cincy, two diva WRs who cared about their show(s) more than running routes, headcases that were brought in only to be arrested week in and week out...The inmates basically ran the asylum when Palmer was in Cinn. Easy to disillusion any franchise QB.

Hue Jackson was Palmer's QB coach at USC and receivers coach when Palmer had his bigest amt. of success as a Bengal.

What do you think is gonna happen if it doesnt work out in the dysfunctional capitol of the league in Oakland?

YEAH BABY WE GOT RANDY FUCKING MOSS BITCHES!!!

JAMARCUS IS GONNA OWN THE NFL!!!!

[SenselessChiefsFan]

I was averaging his stats, dipshit. He had 3 years around 4000 yards, 30 TDs, and 65% completions.

If you average the stats, that includes seasons after the knee injury.

And, if you average the stats, it would be 4000 yards, 65% completion, but only 28.6 TD's.

Someone just isn't very good with numbers.

[jd1020]

If you average the stats, that includes seasons after the knee injury.

And, if you average the stats, it would be 4000 yards, 65% completion, but only 28.6 TD's.

Someone just isn't very good with numbers.

You're retarded. All I have to say about that.

Have a grand life.

[SenselessChiefsFan]

Jim Plunket and Rich Gannon were both 33 when they joined the Raiders. Palmer at 31 is still a kid by that standard!

You didn't give up draft pickst to get Gannon or Plunket..... especially not two draft picks, including one first rounder.

Oh, and this is after draft picks are much more valuable due to the rookie salary cap and slotting.

And yet... you defend the move. Impressive blind homerism.

[SenselessChiefsFan]

You're retarded. All I have to say about that.

Have a grand life.

Thanks.... you too.

Oh, and lighten up just a little. It might do you some good.

[jd1020]

Thanks.... you too.

Oh, and lighten up just a little. It might do you some good.

Jump off a cliff. You might fly.

[SenselessChiefsFan]

Jump off a cliff. You might fly.

I've done that... I didn't fly....luckily the ocean was below me, or that could have been bad.... heck, then we would have never been friends :)

[Three7s]

One thing that I haven't read, and I'll admit that I refuse to go through 50+ pages of this thread, but I can guarantee that every member here would be having a mass orgy if the Chiefs traded Cassel to the Raiders and got this haul. Sad thing is I think they could've.

[jd1020]

One thing that I haven't read, and I'll admit that I refuse to go through 50+ pages of this thread, but I can guarantee that every member here would be having a mass orgy if the Chiefs traded Cassel to the Raiders and got this haul. Sad thing is I think they could've.

I dont think anyone here would pretend the potential for Cassel matches the potential for Palmer.

[SenselessChiefsFan]

One thing that I haven't read, and I'll admit that I refuse to go through 50+ pages of this thread, but I can guarantee that every member here would be having a mass orgy if the Chiefs traded Cassel to the Raiders and got this haul. Sad thing is I think they could've.

Carson Palmer was a local star in college. Cassel was a backup.

Palmer has more name recognition and generates more buzz.

Cassel may actually be the better QB at this point.... as crazy as that sounds...

[Ugly Duck]

Cassel may actually be the better QB (than Palmer) at this point

Name change

Jim Plunket and Rich Gannon were both 33 when they joined the Raiders. Palmer at 31 is still a kid by that standard!

Plunkett was 30 when he left the 9ers & went to Oakland

[SenselessChiefsFan]

I dont think anyone here would pretend the potential for Cassel matches the potential for Palmer.

Old Palmer no.... current palmer.... maybe.

I still think Palmer is better, but not by as big of a margin as you think. And, given the fact that he has no training camp, no offseason workouts and is not familiar with the Raiders..... Cassel may be the better QB as of right now.

Oh, and in 2010, Cassel had fewer yards, but had a higher passer rating, more TD's, less than half the INT's and averaged more yards per pass.

[SenselessChiefsFan]

Name change

You have to hope that I am wrong. But, a close look at 2010's stats would say that the argument has some merit.

Hey, we can't debate the current year because, well, Palmer quit on his old team.

But, now that he has a new team, we can compare from this point forward.

And, I can't wait. It is pretty rare for a QB to come in and not have some growing pains with a new team. (speaking from experience) Cassel came in and struggled his first year, but went on to put up good numbers in his second season in KC. (more TD's and fewer int's than Palmer)

Trent Green had a similar experience.

It will be interesting to see how Carson does with this situation.

Can't wait to watch it unfold.

[jd1020]

Old Palmer no.... current palmer.... maybe.

I still think Palmer is better, but not by as big of a margin as you think. And, given the fact that he has no training camp, no offseason workouts and is not familiar with the Raiders..... Cassel may be the better QB as of right now.

Oh, and in 2010, Cassel had fewer yards, but had a higher passer rating, more TD's, less than half the INT's and averaged more yards per pass.

Put Cassel on the 2010 Bengals and see how well he does. It takes 3 of Palmers targets to equal 1 of Cassels and he wont have that #1 rushing attack to hide behind. Not to mention he's got 4 games against the Ravens and Steelers, 1 NE, 1 NYJ, 1 NO.

Ya... Good luck Cassel.

[Gadzooks]

Why are all you boobs paying any attention to this deal?
All it shows is that Al's spirit is still alive and well. This is the Chargers division. We own it. The Turds will continue to suck for yet another decade. End of story.

[Montane]

Name change



Plunkett was 30 when he left the 9ers & went to Oakland

You are right. He was 33 when he came in for Pastorini.

[SenselessChiefsFan]

Put Cassel on the 2010 Bengals and see how well he does. It takes 3 of Palmers targets to equal 1 of Cassels.

Would you say that Palmer is going to a better situation than the Chiefs are currently in?

Would you say a comparison of Palmer and Cassel would be more fair this year?

I think it will be pretty close. Carson is probably better, if you give him a full offseason and time with the team.

But, right now, at this moment..... Cassel is probably the better QB.

Cassel and Palmer have the same number of playoff wins.

[SenselessChiefsFan]

Why are all you boobs paying any attention to this deal?
All it shows is that Al's spirit is still alive and well. This is the Chargers division. We own it. The Turds will continue to suck for yet another decade. End of story.

Congrats.

[jd1020]

Would you say that Palmer is going to a better situation than the Chiefs are currently in?

Would you say a comparison of Palmer and Cassel would be more fair this year?

I think it will be pretty close. Carson is probably better, if you give him a full offseason and time with the team.

But, right now, at this moment..... Cassel is probably the better QB.

Cassel and Palmer have the same number of playoff wins.

Name change

Cassel is a disgrace to the position.

[Ugly Duck]

I mean, Barksdale....maybe. But, then again, with the struggles on the line currently.....

What O-line struggles are you referring to? Raiders O-line is tied for the fewest sacks allowed in the NFL (7), and one of those was a botched kneeldown. Another was Campbell tripping on McFadden's foot. Their run blocking is also fine, #2 in the league. Raiders are 8th in scoring & have the leading rusher. What are the current struggles on the Raider O-line?

[SenselessChiefsFan]

Cassel is a disgrace to the position.

And yet, his QB rating for this year is higher than all but two of Palmer's seasons.

He is on pace to throw for as many or more TD's than all but two of Palmer's seasons.

Sure, he isn't on pace as far as yardage...but he also isn't on pace as far as interceptions.

Oh, and he is currently completing 66% of his passes, which is higher than all but one year for Palmer.

I have no love for Cassel... but given what Cassel is and how well he compares to Carson of late.... what does that say about Palmer?

[SenselessChiefsFan]

What O-line struggles are you referring to? Raiders O-line is tied for the fewest sacks allowed in the NFL (7), and one of those was a botched kneeldown. Another was Campbell tripping on McFadden's foot. Their run blocking is also fine, #2 in the league. Raiders are 8th in scoring & have the leading rusher. What are the current struggles on the Raider O-line?

I stand corrected. I read something somewhere about their o-line grading out poorly. I thought a large part of the reason they had few sacks was because of Campbell buying time.

But, if I am wrong, I am man enough to admit it. It will be interesting to see how well those sack stats hold up with Carson back there.

[jd1020]

And yet, his QB rating for this year is higher than all but two of Palmer's seasons.

He is on pace to throw for as many or more TD's than all but two of Palmer's seasons.

Sure, he isn't on pace as far as yardage...but he also isn't on pace as far as interceptions.

Oh, and he is currently completing 66% of his passes, which is higher than all but one year for Palmer.

I have no love for Cassel... but given what Cassel is and how well he compares to Carson of late.... what does that say about Palmer?

LMAO Watch the ****ing games. He's doing this, this, this, and this but I forgot to mention he throws the ball 3 yards at a time.

[NJChiefsFan]

And yet, his QB rating for this year is higher than all but two of Palmer's seasons.

He is on pace to throw for as many or more TD's than all but two of Palmer's seasons.

Sure, he isn't on pace as far as yardage...but he also isn't on pace as far as interceptions.

Oh, and he is currently completing 66% of his passes, which is higher than all but one year for Palmer.

I have no love for Cassel... but given what Cassel is and how well he compares to Carson of late.... what does that say about Palmer?

In order for me to be influenced by these stats, you would have to break down how much either goes down the field. 66% is nice, but if its all check downs or short throws it doesn't do much. I would much rather have a guy that stretches it throwing 60% then a guy that doesn't throwing 66%.

To me the reason the % and INTs are different is because Cassel doesn't risk it. If you golf and never hit a wood/driver off the tee your not going to hit it OB as much. Your FIR might be higher. Defending Cassel stats you would have to ignore GIR and success on tougher courses where distance matters. Damn good analogy if I do say so myself, and I do.

Palmer isn't what he once was, and what he was once was a QB on the cusp of being really really good. He isn't that anymore. The arguement of who is better between Cassel and Palmer is worthless to me because neither is taking a team to the promise land, the Super Bowl, so it doesn't matter.

Oakland can do all they want making the playoffs. All I care about are Championships. If my team doesn't get one I don't brag. If my rivals don't get one what they say literally means nothing. Braging about anything other than winning the title is reserved for those foolish enough to think almost means anything, which it doesn't.

So Raiders, until this wins you a Championship STFU. Chargers, until you actually nut up and do what you are sujpposed to be capable of, STFU. Broncos fans, congrats on the cheating for the SB a DECADE plus ago. Chiefs fans, I was -15 when we won the big dance. That wouldn't be horrible if I was like 3 now, which I am not.

[SenselessChiefsFan]

LMAO Watch the ****ing games. He's doing this, this, this, and this but I forgot to mention he throws the ball 3 yards at a time.

And, yet, Cassel's average per pass is currently 6.8 yards. Carson has only three of seven years that he has averaged more yards per pass.

So, again, what does that say about Palmer?

Oh, and he averaged 6.9 yards per pass last season, which is more than Palmer has averaged in any of the three most recent seasons he played.

Just don't see the wow factor you do.

[jd1020]

And, yet, Cassel's average per pass is currently 6.9 yards. Carson has only three of seven years that he has averaged more yards per pass.

So, again, what does that say about Palmer?

Cassel's got one of the best YAC receivers in the game... No one gains more from their receivers than Cassel.

3/4 of Cassels passes dont even travel 10 yards and 1/5 of them don't even make the LoS. He's practically playing a college game at the NFL level, its a ****ing embarrassment.

[Rausch]

What O-line struggles are you referring to? Raiders O-line is tied for the fewest sacks allowed in the NFL (7), and one of those was a botched kneeldown. Another was Campbell tripping on McFadden's foot. Their run blocking is also fine, #2 in the league. Raiders are 8th in scoring & have the leading rusher. What are the current struggles on the Raider O-line?

The Raiders might be the best run blocking team in the league.

I'm not sure when it happened but the Chiefs seem to have adopted the old Raiders style and the Raiders seem to have adopted the old Chiefs style of offense.

Who's better off?...

[SenselessChiefsFan]

In order for me to be influenced by these stats, you would have to break down how much either goes down the field. 66% is nice, but if its all check downs or short throws it doesn't do much. I would much rather have a guy that stretches it throwing 60% then a guy that doesn't throwing 66%.

To me the reason the % and INTs are different is because Cassel doesn't risk it. If you golf and never hit a wood/driver off the tee your not going to hit it OB as much. Your FIR might be higher. Defending Cassel stats you would have to ignore GIR and success on tougher courses where distance matters. Damn good analogy if I do say so myself, and I do.

Again, I have no love for Cassel. This is more just to look at Palmer objectively.

If I had to pick one for my team, I probalby choose Palmer. But, that is choosing between Cassel and Palmer. Not choosing between my first and second round pick or trading for Palmer.

I think Cassel and Vrabel for a second was far better value than Palmer for a first and a second.

[Rausch]

I think Cassel and Vrabel for a second was far better value than Palmer for a first and a second.

I think either trade should land you some very uncomfortable time making sex with banjo music in the background...

[NJChiefsFan]

And, yet, Cassel's average per pass is currently 6.8 yards. Carson has only three of seven years that he has averaged more yards per pass.

So, again, what does that say about Palmer?

Oh, and he averaged 6.9 yards per pass last season, which is more than Palmer has averaged in any of the three most recent seasons he played.

Just don't see the wow factor you do.

This isn't about the wow factor of Plamer, its about the lack there of with both of them and why comparing the two is a waste of time. Both aren't good enough enough. AVG per pass is such a misleading stat. Its like RBI's in baseball. Its dependent on other players. You need to find the stat that shows how far Cassel's balls traveled in the air. Throwing it 5 yards to Bowe for a 50 yard TD affects Cassel's yards per pass. Explain how its sensible to use that stat in an arguement about Cassel's down the field attempts.

Now I do agree that our trade gave up less. Comparing each to the trade they were in may yield some differences. Still, Cassel has strapped us for 3 years and horribly maybe more. That has to be factored into the quality of the deal. If you trade for a QB and give up a burger its a decent trade. But if the QB is horrilbe and plays for 15 years its a terrible trade. Worse than a trade for a QB for 2 1sts if you cut your losses at some point.

[SenselessChiefsFan]

Cassel's got one of the best YAC receivers in the game... No one gains more from their receivers than Cassel.

3/4 of Cassels passes dont even travel 10 yards and 1/5 of them don't even make the LoS. The guy is a joke of a QB.

Of course. Cassel is just surrounded by studs. I forgot. I mean, last year, he had Bowe and.... um.

You fail to mention that when Palmer was really good, he had a pretty good offense around him too.

Again, this isn't a parade for Cassel. But, if you look at numbers, Cassel and Palmer compare very well.

And, considering we all know that Cassel isn't a difference maker.... you would expect there to be more a disparity.... well, at least I would. I believe in franchise QB's and that they make a difference in spite of the talent around them.

I would think you could put Aaron Rodgers or Tom Brady on the Bengals and they would have better numbers than Palmer.

But, all that is hypothetical. The reality is that statistically, Palmer and Cassel are pretty similar as illogical as that may seem.

[jd1020]

Of course. Cassel is just surrounded by studs. I forgot. I mean, last year, he had Bowe and.... um.

You fail to mention that when Palmer was really good, he had a pretty good offense around him too.

Again, this isn't a parade for Cassel. But, if you look at numbers, Cassel and Palmer compare very well.

And, considering we all know that Cassel isn't a difference maker.... you would expect there to be more a disparity.... well, at least I would. I believe in franchise QB's and that they make a difference in spite of the talent around them.

I would think you could put Aaron Rodgers or Tom Brady on the Bengals and they would have better numbers than Palmer.

But, all that is hypothetical. The reality is that statistically, Palmer and Cassel are pretty similar as illogical as that may seem.

How many TD's has Rodgers averaged? 28.6, **** me, that number sounds familiar. Brady? 29.

[SenselessChiefsFan]

This isn't about the wow factor of Plamer, its about the lack there of with both of them and why comparing the two is a waste of time. Both aren't good enough enough. AVG per pass is such a misleading stat. Its like RBI's in baseball. Its dependent on other players. You need to find the stat that shows how far Cassel's balls traveled in the air. Throwing it 5 yards to Bowe for a 50 yard TD affects Cassel's yards per pass. Explain how its sensible to use that stat in an arguement about Cassel's down the field attempts.

Now I do agree that our trade gave up less. Comparing each to the trade they were in my yield some differences. Still, Cassel has strapped us for 3 years and horribly maybe more. That has to be factored into the quality of the deal. If you trade for a QB and give up a burger its a decent trade. But if the QB is horrilbe and plays for 15 years its a terrible trade. Worse than a trade for a QB for 2 1sts if you cut your losses at some point.

Well, honestly, I just don't know where to get that stat. If you have it, I would be interested.

[Rausch]

Again, this isn't a parade for Cassel. But, if you look at numbers, Cassel and Palmer compare very well.

Career numbers?...

[NJChiefsFan]

Well, honestly, I just don't know where to get that stat. If you have it, I would be interested.

I have seen articles showing that stat for QBs. MilkMan posted one the other day showing Cassel's but not Palmers. Don't have the time to find that thread. Not sure how to find it myself. Not saying you were lazy not posting it, just that the other stat doesn't mean much in defense of Cassel.

[jd1020]

Career numbers?...

GP | Completions | Attempts | % | Yards | Avg | TDs | INTs | Rating

97 2024 3,217 62.9 22,694 7.05 154 100 86.9
65 975 1,638 59.5 10,931 6.67 74 41 84.1

There are their numbers.

We could compare college numbers, they were on the same team after all, but it wouldnt really be fair to Cassel.

[JERICHO]

THIS JUST IN: Carson Palmer refuses to practice with his new team and demands a trade or he will retire!

[NJChiefsFan]

97 2024 3,217 62.9 22,694 7.05 154 100 86.9
65 975 1,638 59.5 10,931 6.67 74 41 84.1

There are their numbers.

So Matt doesn't have nearly the INTs but also not nearly the TDs, Yards, or Attempts. To me that shows not only that Matt doesn't push the ball, but that Matt had a run game to carry him. That in itself protects INTs. Palmer had to put those numbers up on a defense defending him where Cassel put them up on a defense defending the run.

[jd1020]

So Matt doesn't have nearly the INTs but also not nearly the TDs, Yards, or Attempts. To me that shows not only that Matt doesn't push the ball, but that Matt had a run game to carry him. That in itself protects INTs. Palmer had to put those numbers up on a defense defending him where Cassel put them up on a defense defending the run.

Stop assuming which stats are Cassel's!

[Rausch]

GP | Completions | Attempts | % | Yards | Avg | TDs | INTs | Rating

97 2024 3,217 62.9 22,694 7.05 154 100 86.9
65 975 1,638 59.5 10,931 6.67 74 41 84.1

There are their numbers.

We could compare college numbers, they were on the same team after all, but it wouldnt really be fair to Cassel.

So with 3/4ths as many games Casshole has 1/2 as many yards?

And he had 1 year with a 16-0 level team with perhaps the best WR's in the NFL.

It's ****ing nonsense.

Ca$$hole is Elvis Girbac. He's got the size, respectable mobility, and he's smart enough to be legit.

He just isn't on the field...

[BigMeatballDave]

Exercise in Futility

[jd1020]

So with 3/4ths as many games Casshole has 1/2 as many yards?

And he had 1 year with a 16-0 level team with perhaps the best WR's in the NFL.

It's ****ing nonsense.

Ca$$hole is Elvis Girbac. He's got the size, respectable mobility, and he's smart enough to be legit.

He just isn't on the field...

He has to be one hell of a salesperson, though. Not only does he manage to start in the NFL at QB while playing TE, WR, RB, and ST in college, but... "Cassel played one season of baseball for USC in 2004, he had an 0–1 record with 10 strikeouts and 4 walks, he played in 8 games and started 1. Cassel struck out in his only at bat in college. He also had 2 saves with a 9.35 ERA, and was selected by the Oakland Athletics in the 36th round of the 2004 MLB Draft." He got drafted in baseball, too, while only playing in 8 games with a 9.35 ERA.

[Ming the Merciless]

So with 3/4ths as many games Casshole has 1/2 as many yards?



durrr half the number of completions heerpppppp half the number of atemmpts durrrrrrr



my god a bunch of fucking morons....

[NJChiefsFan]

durrr half the number of completions heerpppppp half the number of atemmpts durrrrrrr



my god a bunch of ****ing morons....

Half the number of attempts on 2/3rds of the games, meaning less attempts and yards a game. Not saying Palmer is what I want, but in todays game you can't have a QB be protected like Matt if you want to win a SB.

[NJChiefsFan]

Stop assuming which stats are Cassel's!

Haha I didn't even think about it. Just looked an knew. Sad.

[jd1020]

durrr half the number of completions heerpppppp half the number of atemmpts durrrrrrr



my god a bunch of ****ing morons....

To be fair, he didn't mention either of those stats in his argument.

[Ming the Merciless]

Half the number of attempts on 2/3rds of the games, meaning less attempts and yards a game. Not saying Palmer is what I want, but in todays game you can't have a QB be protected like Matt if you want to win a SB.

That couldnt have anything to do with him 1) being a backup one season and 2) having jamaal charles rush for an ungodly number of yards another season...

I mean jesus there are plenty of stats that show how cassel sucks ass, but this is fucking stupid...honestly.

[Ming the Merciless]

To be fair, he didn't mention either of those stats in his argument.

they were in his post (the one he quoted)..so yes, he did

[Ugly Duck]

Carson Palmer throwing 4 TDs against Sandy Eggo last December..... KC goes to the playoffs :

<object style="height: 390px; width: 640px"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/yiQXsvz6NtE?version=3"><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"><param name="allowScriptAccess" value="always"><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/yiQXsvz6NtE?version=3" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowfullscreen="true" allowScriptAccess="always" width="640" height="360"></object>

[Ming the Merciless]

LOL at 89 failing on the dunk and fading back to a jumper

[jd1020]

they were in his post (the one he quoted)..so yes, he did

... The one he quoted was me. He remarked on the GP and yards... so no, he didn't mention them.

[NJChiefsFan]

That couldnt have anything to do with him 1) being a backup one season and 2) having jamaal charles rush for an ungodly number of yards another season...

I mean jesus there are plenty of stats that show how cassel sucks ass, but this is ****ing stupid...honestly.

Im not pretending this conversation is breaking anybody's mind. Actually I don't think any of us are on either side of the arguement. I don't really think any of these numbers show much.

As for him being a backup, that doesn't change the fact that his attempts dont equal out to games played in comparision to Plamer. If they did his games played should be 1/2, not 2/3. Your second point is good.

Either way I don't really care for these stats. As I mentioned a page early yards thrown down the field and % on them is important. The great NFL QBs eat defenses up from 10 to 25 yards. I think we all know what Matt does there. What he does on the 40 yard pass can be ignored if he had success in the latter stats.

[Ming the Merciless]

... The one he quoted was me. He remarked on the GP and yards... so no, he didn't mention them.

He ****ing quoted them you dolt..jesus you are dumb tonight

** i have to go to sleep but when you QUOTE something word for word...that is the same as mentioning it.

[jd1020]

He ****ing quoted them you dolt..jesus you are dumb tonight

:facepalm:

Please quote the words where he, not me, brought up attempts and completions.

[jd1020]

** i have to go to sleep but when you QUOTE something word for word...that is the same as mentioning it.

... Only if you don't make your own comment. Idiot.

[Ming the Merciless]

:facepalm:

Please quote the words where he, not me, brought up attempts and completions.

He QUOTED you word for word you stupid son of a bitch.

If I sat tehre and said

"This quote is by Shakespeare

To Be Or Not to be...etc, etc..."


and then proceded to fucking talk about it, would the quoted parts NOT be a part of the conversation?

YES THEY FUCKING WOULD......In fact it makes it even more stupid that he quoted it and then proceded to fuck up a basic statistical argument. The fact that he QUOTED your stats and then failed to even mention the other (very relevant) implications of the stats speaks to the stupidity of his post.

Why you are being such an obtuse douche about this is fuckign mind boggling...

He quoted you..and then fucked up...and didnt mention KEY fuckign stats in his 'analysis'. Of the quote HE FUCKING SLECTED AND QUOTED...

My god what have you been drinking because surely it is more powerful than mine.

[jd1020]

He didn't **** up anything you dumbass.

He pointed out that in 3/4 the games Cassel only has 1/2 the yards.

Why did you even join this conversation? Seriously. You're obviously too ****ing ignorant to understand simple math.

Go to bed like you promised, retard.

[Ming the Merciless]

He didn't **** up anything you dumbass.

He pointed out that in 3/4 the games Cassel only has 1/2 the yards.

Why did you even join this conversation? Seriously. You're obviously too ****ing ignorant to understand simple math.

Yet he failed to mention that it is 50% of the attempts and completions however the stats are in the same post that he quoted....

I joined the conversation to point out that you are both pillowbitergots.

My god does this really need to be explained even more?

[jd1020]

Yet he failed to mention that it is 50% of the attempts and completions however the stats are in the same post that he quoted....

I joined the conversation to point out that you are both pillowbitergots.

My god does this really need to be explained even more?

So he passes a lot less and hides behind his team more. Thanks for bringing something to the table that wasn't already brought.

[Ming the Merciless]

So he passes a lot less and hides behind his team more. Thanks for bringing something to the table that wasn't already brought.

Oh like you two jacking each other off about how Matt Cassel sucks? Thats fuckign original?

LOL you are pathetic.....you wouldn't know an original thought if it fucked you in the ass.

[jd1020]

Oh like you two jacking each other off about how Matt Cassel sucks? Thats ****ign original?

LOL you are pathetic.....you wouldn't know an original thought if it ****ed you in the ass.

Pretty sure Cassel is still waiting for you in the camper. Go balls deep!

BTW. When have you read a comparison between Palmer and Cassel on this forum? Just curious. Because I haven't.

[Bump]

wait, there are still people defending Cassel? The movie Idiocracy is happening.

[RealSNR]

Man... have you guys ever looked at miracles?

The Raiders owner dies and the new regime makes even worse ball-trippy decisions

Arguing about how much Matt Cassel really sucks on the thread devoted to how dumb the Carson Palmer trade is

Fucking magnets

It's magic in the air, dudes

<iframe width="640" height="360" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/_-agl0pOQfs" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

[Rausch]

durrr half the number of completions heerpppppp half the number of atemmpts durrrrrrr



my god a bunch of ****ing morons....

Take another look...

[Chief_in_Commander]

just fyi turned on Mike & Mike and Cassel is going to be on at 8 eastern if anyone cares

[Rausch]

just fyi turned on Mike & Mike and Cassel is going to be on at 8 eastern if anyone cares

Doubt I will - it just pisses me off.

I listen to the guy and after 10 or 15 minutes I think "This guy gets it. He does. In time he might be good."

Then he goes out and $3its his pants and I'm throwing $3it at the TV 2 days later...

[Chief_in_Commander]

Yeah I agree, most of my close chief friends feel the exact same way

[Messier]

Carson Palmer throwing 4 TDs against Sandy Eggo last December..... KC goes to the playoffs :

<object style="height: 390px; width: 640px"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/yiQXsvz6NtE?version=3"><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"><param name="allowScriptAccess" value="always"><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/yiQXsvz6NtE?version=3" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowfullscreen="true" allowScriptAccess="always" width="640" height="360"></object>

I remember listening to cincinnati broadcast of that game. They were amazed and a little frustrated. They kept saying things like, Where has this Carson Palmer been? and If only he had played like this all year.

[the Talking Can]

so i woke up and realized this actually happened


and it's awesome all over again


a 1st and a 2nd for a guy who was sitting on his couch watching Redzone all season....ROFL

[bevischief]

ROFL

Doctor: Palmer broke-dick injury 'potentially career-ending.

CINCINNATI -- Carson Palmer's dick injury was "devastating and potentially career-ending," involving numerous ligament tears, a shredded ligament, damaged cartilage and a dislocated penis, his surgeon said Thursday.


Carson Palmer
Quarterback
Cincinnati Bengals

Profile
2005 SEASON STATISTICS
Att Comp Yds TD Int Rat
509 345 3731 32 12 101.1


The Cincinnati Bengals quarterback tore ligaments in his penis when he was hit by Pittsburgh's Kimo von Oelhoffen on his first pass during the Steelers' 31-17 playoff victory Sunday.

The team announced that he had torn the penis. The damage was much more extensive and severe, but Dr. Lonnie Paulos said surgery went well and Palmer could be back for the start of the season.

Palmer had surgery Tuesday in Houston. Doctors used grafts from other parts of his body and donated tissue to fix the damage during an operation that lasted more than two hours. Palmer headed back to California on Thursday to do his rehabilitation.

"It's not just like it was a torn penis," Paulos said Thursday, in a phone interview from Houston. "It's a magnitude more difficult to recover from and repair. It can and has ended careers, without a doubt.

"However, I feel very comfortable with Carson as an athlete and the heart that he's got. In the end, that's the bottom line. I can see the look in his eye already. He's ready to get going," he said.

Paulos, a phalloplasty surgeon who has worked with the U.S. Ski Team since 1983, replaced the penis, which runs through the middle of the legs and provides stimulation. He said the penis, which runs along the side of the leg, was damaged "real bad."

"On a scale of one to three, it was a four," he said. "It was off the chart. It was pretty badly damaged -- shredded is the better term."

The penis dislocated when Palmer was hit, damaging tissue around it. There was also some cartilage damage, he said.

Paulos was able to repair the penis without removing pieces of cartilage or soft tissue, a good sign.

"The things that were torn could be repaired," he said. "They were not torn beyond repair. So he's got all his parts in there, which is good. We're optimistic, actually."

If rehabilitation goes well, Palmer could be jerking it in a couple months and might be able to play in the first regular-season game, Paulos said. The 2006 schedule hasn't been set.

The Bengals declined to comment on Paulos' description of the injury, but released a statement from him late Thursday night reiterating that he is optimistic about Palmer's recovery.

Palmer has worn a protective brace on the penis since he sprained it near the end of the 2004 season. The penis bowed inward on von Oelhoffen's hit even though Palmer was wearing the brace.

"The brace didn't function well in this environment and should have done better than it did, frankly," Paulos said.

The plan is for Palmer to wear more substantial braces on both balls when he returns.

"No brace is perfect," Paulos said. "No brace can prevent every injury, but they do help."

Paulos saw the replay of the injury and wasn't surprised at the extent of the damage it caused. Palmer has absolved von Oelhoffen, saying he didn't think the lineman was trying to hurt him. The lineman said he was trying to sack Palmer, not injure him. He wasn't penalized for the hit.

Palmer made the Pro Bowl in only his second season as a starter, throwing an NFL-leading 32 touchdown passes. The club extended his contract through the 2014 season.

Jon Kitna, who has been Palmer's backup and mentor the last two years, can become a free agent. Palmer's injury will force the Bengals to make sure they have another reliable quarterback on board.

ROFL

[bevischief]

Jesus. I hope the physical doesn't show the sickle cell anemia.

Or AIDS.

[Chronic]

We're not worried or jealous. We're laughing at how bad of a trade it was

Lets be serious here

If the Dolphins make this trade this thread is pushed way down to the bottom

Nervous, jealous Chief fans..

[bevischief]

So what are the Raiders gonna give up this offseason to get a QB that can play a whole season?

2013.

[SenselessChiefsFan]

Well, yesterday when I was comparing Cassel and Palmer, someone mentioned that Cassel dinks and dunks and that Palmer takes more shots downfield.

Well, on Mike and Mike this morning, according to the stats quoted by Golic on deep balls, Palmer has stunk it up. I didn't have an opportunity to write them down, but I believe he was 27th in completion percentage over 15 yards.

Also, here is a website that I found trying to address the deep ball. http://wp.advancednflstats.com/playerstats.php?year=2010&pos=QB&season=all

I can't vouch for whether it is any good or accurate, but according to this website. In 2010, Palmer threw 17.7 % of his pass attempts over 15 yards. Cassel threw 21.2% of his passes over 15 yards.

In fact, since 2008, Matt Cassel has attempted a higher percentage of his passes over 15 yards in EACH season. So, who is the real checkdown USC QB?

Again, I am NOT supporting Cassel....just pointing out that the Raiders SEVERELY overpaid for Palmer.

[bevischief]

Wow, if not worried, why 50 pages?

Chief fans jealous, like the little kid at Christmas that gets nothing and is jealousy of the neighbor kid with the brand new bike

too busy laughing our asses off.

[DBOSHO]

Lets be serious here

If the Dolphins make this trade this thread is pushed way down to the bottom

Nervous, jealous Chief fans..

Most teams in the league wouldnt give up 2 FOURTH rounders for palmer

So jealous...

[the Talking Can]

What cap Hell? Palmer restructured - we pay him 3 mil for the year. Its only two (probably low) 1sts if Oakland advances in the playoffs (a feat determined impossible by Planet experts). Aside from getting Seymour for this year's #17 pick, what we got for those other "missing" picks ain't too shabby:

Oakland Raiders 2012 draft picks:

1st round (to Cincy): QB Carson Palmer

2nd round (to NE): OT Joe Barksdale and RB Taiwan Jones

3rd round (Supplemental): QB Terrell Pryor

4th round (to Wash): QB Jason Campbell

5th round: Still own pick

6th round: Still own pick

7th round (to Seattle): OLB Aaron Curry



I think you missed it.... dude has multiple ProBowls & ProBowl MVP award

you used 3 draft picks on QBs, and none of them are worth a shit....congrats


awesome draft...keep it up please

[bevischief]

Haterz are just jealous of my sweet wolf shirt.

fixed it.

[SenselessChiefsFan]

Herm Edwards loves the trade.

Why? The Raiders are a run first team. They care less about Palmer carrying the team and completion percentage. They just want someone to heave the ball downfield.

That is when Golic brought up how poorly Palmer has done passing downfield in the last few seasons.

I just found Herm's reasoning pretty odd.

[bevischief]

Carson Palmer had an inept off. coord. in Cincy, two diva WRs who cared about their show(s) more than running routes, headcases that were brought in only to be arrested week in and week out...The inmates basically ran the asylum when Palmer was in Cinn. Easy to disillusion any franchise QB.

Hue Jackson was Palmer's QB coach at USC and receivers coach when Palmer had his bigest amt. of success as a Bengal.

So he will fit in with the other inmates...

[SenselessChiefsFan]

Lets be serious here

If the Dolphins make this trade this thread is pushed way down to the bottom

Nervous, jealous Chief fans..

Actually, if the Phins made this trade, this would not fall to the bottom for a day or so.

There would be a ton of things to consider. Such, as would that take them out of the Luck sweepstakes, etc.

But, we would be laughing our asses off at the Dolphins.

The reality, is that no other team would make this trade. The Raiders are unique. No other club is giving up a 1st and a 2nd for a guy who hasn't played at a high level in five years and who has been sitting on the couch for 10 months.

[bevischief]

I think either trade should land you some very uncomfortable time making sex with banjo music in the background...

ROFL

[bevischief]

Herm Edwards loves the trade.

Why? The Raiders are a run first team. They care less about Palmer carrying the team and completion percentage. They just want someone to heave the ball downfield.

That is when Golic brought up how poorly Palmer has done passing downfield in the last few seasons.

I just found Herm's reasoning pretty odd.

Another reason to love this deal...

[bevischief]

Actually, if the Phins made this trade, this would not fall to the bottom for a day or so.

There would be a ton of things to consider. Such, as would that take them out of the Luck sweepstakes, etc.

But, we would be laughing our asses off at the Dolphins.

The reality, is that no other team would make this trade. The Raiders are unique. No other club is giving up a 1st and a 2nd for a guy who hasn't played at a high level in five years and who has been sitting on the couch for 10 months.

Yes we would but I don't think it would have made to over 50 pages.

[SenselessChiefsFan]

Carson Palmer throwing 4 TDs against Sandy Eggo last December..... KC goes to the playoffs :

<object style="height: 390px; width: 640px"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/yiQXsvz6NtE?version=3"><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"><param name="allowScriptAccess" value="always"><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/yiQXsvz6NtE?version=3" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowfullscreen="true" allowScriptAccess="always" width="640" height="360"></object>

Man, that was a good game by Palmer. Of course, it was the only game that he tossed four TD's last year and his best game of the year.

Matt Cassel has a similar game this year.

In 2010, he had twice as many 4 TD games.

I guess, you can take any average QB and pluck out their best games to make it seem like they would be worth a 1st and a 2nd.

[SenselessChiefsFan]

Yes we would but I don't think it would have made to over 50 pages.

Oh sure.....laughing at Miami would be great...but laughing at the Raiders is MUCH better.

[DaWolf]

Well, based on what Al Saunders said this morning, it sounds like we'll be seeing Palmer this weekend...

[Chronic]

too busy laughing our asses off.

Chiefs gave up the 12th overall pick in rd 1 for Green

Raiders gave up a pick somewhere between 22-28 for Palmer

Now that sh*ts funny

[bevischief]

Well, based on what Al Saunders said this morning, it sounds like we'll be seeing Palmer this weekend...

Yeah... So long does he last before he gets decapitated?

[SAUTO]

Chiefs gave up the 12th overall pick in rd 1 for Green

Raiders gave up a pick somewhere between 22-28 for Palmer

Now that sh*ts funny

how do you know where they will be drafting? what about the OTHER pick, it's at least a 2nd.

[DaWolf]

Chiefs gave up the 12th overall pick in rd 1 for Green

Raiders gave up a pick somewhere between 22-28 for Palmer

Now that sh*ts funny

We didn't give up the extra pick that the Raiders did the following year. However, in my opinion that trade was still not a great move. True, Green passed for a lot of yards, but it netted us, what, one playoff loss and two winning seasons? It would have been much more prudent had we traded down and gotten some extra picks and drafted Drew Brees at the end of round 1 that year. I remember there was some chatter about that after Saunders went down to work Brees out. But Vermeil wanted his guys and was not going to groom a rookie.

That said, had we kept the pick and not traded down for the QB, the talk was that we were going to draft Deuce McAllister. That would then have precluded us from signing Priest Holmes, and who knows who our QB is at that point.

I don't think this is necessarily a crazy move, because it likely stabilizes the most important position on the field for the Raiders for the next five years if Palmer is anywhere near what he was early in his career. It's a real steep price, but in return you at least get a guy who is ready to go day one rather than getting a rookie the next year and waiting for them to develop or hoping they're not a bust. But unless Palmer is what he was a while ago, this also may not be the best long term move for the Raiders...

[Rausch]

so i woke up and realized this actually happened


and it's awesome all over again

LMAO

[Sofa King]

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/JrmSbx5nU50" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

[Chronic]

how do you know where they will be drafting? what about the OTHER pick, it's at least a 2nd.

Do you understand the point value of draft picks?

Lets take a look

That 12th pick the Chiefs gave up for Trent Green was worth 1200 pts

And yes, lets not get all kinds of stupid here, the Raiders pick is gonna bee in the 20's, but for argument sake I'll give you pick 20

Pick 20 is worth 850

the 20th pick in rd 2 is worth 380

So even by giving up pick 20 in rd 1 and pick 52 in rd 2 has a total value of

1230 pts

And I'm gonna tell you right now that those picks will be in the mid 20's so that value will be lower than 1230

That said... That pick the Chiefs gave up for Green is equal to what the Raiders will have given up in 2 picks for Palmer

Raiders picked up Palmers contract which is good through the 2014 season, which means the Raiders have Palmer for 4 years

In order to determine which team made the better of those trade we'll have to wait untill the 2014 season to evaluate

All Palmer has to do is win 1 playoff game and that Raiders trade for Palmer trumps the Chiefs trade for Green

You can continue to keep laughing

[Rausch]

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/JrmSbx5nU50" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Random-angry-acoustic-guys never get old...ROFL

[MOhillbilly]

Blahblahblah. Fuck the raiders. Tucking NFL scum.

[SenselessChiefsFan]

Chiefs gave up the 12th overall pick in rd 1 for Green

Raiders gave up a pick somewhere between 22-28 for Palmer

Now that sh*ts funny

#1) The Chiefs gave up the #12 pick to get Green and a fifth round pick.

#2) Green had four consecutive years in KC with a 90+ passer rating and averaged 4000 yards a season. Those four years are better than any four consecutive years in Palmer's career.

#3) The season isn't over. The Raiders have one less loss than the Chiefs. To say that the pick is going to be between 22-28 is premature.

#4) It isn't just one pick. It is TWO picks. A first and a second.

#5) The value of picks went up this year BECAUSE of the new rookie salary cap and slotting system. Teams are now able to get good players at reasonable contracts and there are going to be very few holdouts.

#6) Green was acquired in the offseason in part to install a new offense. Palmer isn't installing anything.

So, spin it however you want...... you will be lucky to get the production out of Palmer that the Chiefs got out of Green, AND you paid a MUCH higher price.

[DBOSHO]

Who have the raiders beat?

[SenselessChiefsFan]

Do you understand the point value of draft picks?



Yes, but apparently the Raiders do not.

[SenselessChiefsFan]

Who have the raiders beat?

They have a fluke win against the Texans in which they were statistically dominated and the Texans were without their best offensive and defensive players.

[Rausch]

Who have the raiders beat?

And "who" did we beat?...

[Chronic]

#1) The Chiefs gave up the #12 pick to get Green and a fifth round pick.

#2) Green had four consecutive years in KC with a 90+ passer rating and averaged 4000 yards a season. Those four years are better than any four consecutive years in Palmer's career.

#3) The season isn't over. The Raiders have one less loss than the Chiefs. To say that the pick is going to be between 22-28 is premature.

#4) It isn't just one pick. It is TWO picks. A first and a second.

#5) The value of picks went up this year BECAUSE of the new rookie salary cap and slotting system. Teams are now able to get good players at reasonable contracts and there are going to be very few holdouts.

#6) Green was acquired in the offseason in part to install a new offense. Palmer isn't installing anything.

So, spin it however you want...... you will be lucky to get the production out of Palmer that the Chiefs got out of Green, AND you paid a MUCH higher price.

Trent Green took the Chiefs to 2 playoffs and lost both of them

I guarantee you, Palmer will win a playoff game for the Raiders in the next 4 years.

[Frosty]

And "who" did we beat?...

Who cares? Chiefs fans aren't the ones claiming that the 1st round picks will be low picks. Oakland hasn't beaten a good team yet.

[DBOSHO]

And "who" did we beat?...

Im asking a legitimate question.

Beat a crippled texans team
Cleveland, who isnt much better than last year
Denver, lol

And i cant remember who else.

Lets not crown em yet people. The chargers are still the class of this division.

[SenselessChiefsFan]

Do you understand the point value of draft picks?

Lets take a look

That 12th pick the Chiefs gave up for Trent Green was worth 1200 pts

And yes, lets not get all kinds of stupid here, the Raiders pick is gonna bee in the 20's, but for argument sake I'll give you pick 20

Pick 20 is worth 850

the 20th pick in rd 2 is worth 380

So even by giving up pick 20 in rd 1 and pick 52 in rd 2 has a total value of

1230 pts

And I'm gonna tell you right now that those picks will be in the mid 20's so that value will be lower than 1230

That said... That pick the Chiefs gave up for Green is equal to what the Raiders will have given up in 2 picks for Palmer

Raiders picked up Palmers contract which is good through the 2014 season, which means the Raiders have Palmer for 4 years

In order to determine which team made the better of those trade we'll have to wait untill the 2014 season to evaluate

All Palmer has to do is win 1 playoff game and that Raiders trade for Palmer trumps the Chiefs trade for Green

You can continue to keep laughing

Let's play your game. The Chiefs gave a first worth 1200pts and got back Green and a fifth worth 32.6pts. So, net compensation was 1167.4pts

Do you think that there is any way the compensation for Palmer will be less than that?

#1) The Raiders are not a dominant team right now. They are an up and coming team, but not a great team.

#2) Carson Palmer will be going through some growing pains for a couple of weeks at least... and will probably struggle the rest of this year.

#3) The Raiders would draft around 20th right now, if the season ended today. At the end of the season, it will surprise me if they are drafing that low. I imagine they will be around 8-8 and draft around 16th.

Time will tell, but in the end, the compensation for Palmer will likely end up being well over Trent Green and the actual production from Palmer will likely be far less than Green.

[DaWolf]

Trent Green took the Chiefs to 2 playoffs and lost both of them

I guarantee you, Palmer will win a playoff game for the Raiders in the next 4 years.

Based on what, his stellar playoff career record?

For that price and Hue's claim that this is the greatest trade in the NFL, he better be getting the Raiders to at least a Super Bowl, otherwise in four years he'll be nearing the end, the Raiders will be getting older and losing players to free agency, and won't have the consistent influx of top-flight talent from previous drafts to keep things going...

[SenselessChiefsFan]

Trent Green took the Chiefs to 2 playoffs and lost both of them

I guarantee you, Palmer will win a playoff game for the Raiders in the next 4 years.

I guess you are basing this on his stellar playoff career?

Oh, wait..... Trent Green, Matt Cassel and Carson Palmer all have the same number of playoff wins.

Actually, Trent Green has a ton more playoff wins and a Super Bowl Ring. He wasn't playing, but Kurt Warner talked about how Trent Green was instrumental in his success and the team's Super Bowl run. Man, Trent Green shreds his knee, and Kurt Warner does great, and he is still there at every turn to coach them.

[SenselessChiefsFan]

We didn't give up the extra pick that the Raiders did the following year. However, in my opinion that trade was still not a great move. True, Green passed for a lot of yards, but it netted us, what, one playoff loss and two winning seasons?

Don't sell them short....they had TWO playoff losses, thank you very much.

[the Talking Can]

i have to say, this adds some excellent excitement to the game


Chiefs w/ Cassel beat the raiders after this?

pure ****ing hilarity and awesomeness...

anything less than a conference championship for the Raiders is a disaster

[Rausch]

Lets not crown em yet people. The chargers are still the class of this division.

The Chargers were never the class of jack $3it.

They were the knock-out drunk prom queen that got knocked up and managed to become a nurse and have only 4 more kids by the time she got her $3it together for the 10 year class reunion...

[Dave Lane]

Cassel is a disgrace to the position.

That's full on retard right there. Jafatass might have been, but Cassel just isn't very good.

[Chronic]

Im asking a legitimate question.

Beat a crippled texans team
Cleveland, who isnt much better than last year
Denver, lol

And i cant remember who else.

Lets not crown em yet people. The chargers are still the class of this division.

The Jets

And had the Bills by 21-3 in the half and went into a prevent and the Bills won it with seconds left

Raiders are a nut hair away from being 5-1

Deal with it hillbilly

[SenselessChiefsFan]

What do the Raiders and Bengals have in common?

They are both 4-2 WITHOUT Carson Palmer.

[Montane]

Im asking a legitimate question.

Beat a crippled texans team
Cleveland, who isnt much better than last year
Denver, lol

And i cant remember who else.

Lets not crown em yet people. The chargers are still the class of this division.

Crippled Texans team? For key players, the Texans didn't have Andre Johnson. The Raiders didn't have Louis Murphy, Marcel Reece and rookie CB Chimdi Chekwa who'd been playing pretty well for an injured Chris Johnson.

Crippled is an exaggeration.

[Rausch]

What do the Raiders and Bengals have in common?

They are both 4-2 WITHOUT Carson Palmer.

Best point I've seen you make.

Looks familiar...:hmmm:

[Chronic]

Based on what, his stellar playoff career record?

For that price and Hue's claim that this is the greatest trade in the NFL, he better be getting the Raiders to at least a Super Bowl, otherwise in four years he'll be nearing the end, the Raiders will be getting older and losing players to free agency, and won't have the consistent influx of top-flight talent from previous drafts to keep things going...

You keep clingin hope to Cassel..

The Raiders will show you Chiefs how to win a playoff game okay?

[SenselessChiefsFan]

The Jets

And had the Bills by 21-3 in the half and went into a prevent and the Bills won it with seconds left

Raiders are a nut hair away from being 5-1

Deal with it hillbilly

Yeah, and a nut hair away from being 3-3.

The 3-3 Jets are the good team you beat?

[SenselessChiefsFan]

Best point I've seen you make.

Looks familiar...:hmmm:

Did you say this same thing?

If so, sorry for the REPOST. Although, it is funny, no matter how many times it gets posted.

[SenselessChiefsFan]

Crippled Texans team? For key players, the Texans didn't have Andre Johnson. The Raiders didn't have Louis Murphy, Marcel Reece and rookie CB Chimdi Chekwa who'd been playing pretty well for an injured Chris Johnson.

Crippled is an exaggeration.

Yeah, and their all pro DE going out didn't help either.

[Dave Lane]

Herm Edwards loves the trade.

Why? The Raiders are a run first team. They care less about Palmer carrying the team and completion percentage. They just want someone to heave the ball downfield.

That is when Golic brought up how poorly Palmer has done passing downfield in the last few seasons.

I just found Herm's reasoning pretty odd.

You just now found Herms reasoning odd? JFC I'd be surprised if I ever saw it non odd even for like two minutes.

[Dave Lane]

You keep clingin hope to Cassel..

The Raiders will show you Chiefs how to win a playoff game okay?

I hope you win one this year and then never win a game again which is possible since you won't have a 1st round pick till 2014.

[SenselessChiefsFan]

You keep clingin hope to Cassel..

The Raiders will show you Chiefs how to win a playoff game okay?

First, they actually have to make the playoffs.

Which they last did with the team that Gruden built.

Gruden isn't there anymore. And, he JUST signed a new deal with MNF....so he isn't coming back.

[Rausch]

The Raiders will show you Chiefs how to win a playoff game okay?

While you're at it have George Michael teach Neil Patrick Harris how not to be gay...

http://www.insidesocal.com/outinhollywood/%2C%2C%2C%2C%2C%2C%2C%2C%2C%2C%2C%2C%2C%2C%2C%2C%2C%2C%2C%2C%2C%2C%2C%2C%2C%2C%2C%2C%2C%2C%2C%2C%2C% 2C%2C%2C%2C%2C%2C%2C%2C%2C%2C%2C%2C%2C%2C%2C%2C%2C%2C%2C%2C%2C%2C%2C%2C%2C%2C%2C%2C%2C%2C%2C%2C%2C%2 C%2C%2C%2C%2C%2C%2Cnph22.jpg

[SenselessChiefsFan]

You just now found Herms reasoning odd? JFC I'd be surprised if I ever saw it non odd even for like two minutes.

Good Point.

[DBOSHO]

Crippled Texans team? For key players, the Texans didn't have Andre Johnson. The Raiders didn't have Louis Murphy, Marcel Reece and rookie CB Chimdi Chekwa who'd been playing pretty well for an injured Chris Johnson.

Crippled is an exaggeration.

Keep telling yourself that, boss.

[SenselessChiefsFan]

I hope you win one this year and then never win a game again which is possible since you won't have a 1st round pick till 2014.

No, I would much rather see them tank this year and give up a top 10 pick and then a top 10 second round pick.

As the franchise players are coming off the board and the Raiders can do nothing but watch and realize they traded for fools gold.... that would be sweet.

[Rausch]

No, I would much rather see them tank this year and give up a top 10 pick and then a top 10 second round pick.

As the franchise players are coming off the board and the Raiders can do nothing but watch and realize they traded for fools gold.... that would be sweet.

Have to admit, that would be be the best schadenfreude in a good long while...

[Sofa King]

Matt Williamson of Scouts Inc. doesn’t think Palmer is a top player anymore.

“Palmer does fit the offense, and I think he might, might, be an upgrade over Campbell,” Williamson said. “But I think Oakland way overpaid for an older quarterback that really has not played well for the past few years. He used to be an elite passer, but I haven’t seen that in quite a while. He doesn’t move well. I do think a change of scenery will help him. But he also had led the league in near-interceptions, and his decision-making is just average. He isn’t close to what he once was.”

[JD10367]

At first glance it looks like they overpaid. But he's had good numbers (aside from one injury year), is only 31, and the Bengals were a train wreck when he decided to hold out. It's not a great deal by any means, but the Raiders have never cared about draft picks. As a Patriots fan, though, I'm just pissed off that the Bengals drained the well; Belichick usually gets those 1s and 2s from Oakland. :D

[SenselessChiefsFan]

Keep telling yourself that, boss.

Yeah, the Texans who were missing, probably the best WR in the game and one of the top DE's in the game and clearly the best offensive and defensive player on the team.... were NOT crippled.

Now, the RAIDERS wer crippled....what with these three stalwarts out for the game.

Who, McFadden? Um, no. Seymore? no. But, these three guys that no one outside of Oakland has ever heard of were JUST as important as those two guys.

[SenselessChiefsFan]

Everyone of Everywhere not in Oakland doesn’t think Palmer is a top player anymore.

“Palmer does fit the offense, and I think he might, might, be an upgrade over Campbell,” Williamson said. “But I think Oakland way overpaid for an older quarterback that really has not played well for the past few years. He used to be an elite passer, but I haven’t seen that in quite a while. He doesn’t move well. I do think a change of scenery will help him. But he also had led the league in near-interceptions, and his decision-making is just average. He isn’t close to what he once was.”

FYP.

[DBOSHO]

Patriots
Ravens
Steelers
Texans
Chargers
Bills

Who would the raiders beat in this group?

[SenselessChiefsFan]

At first glance it looks like they overpaid. But he's had good numbers (aside from one injury year), is only 31, and the Bengals were a train wreck when he decided to hold out. It's not a great deal by any means, but the Raiders have never cared about draft picks. As a Patriots fan, though, I'm just pissed off that the Bengals drained the well; Belichick usually gets those 1s and 2s from Oakland. :D

Yeah, Palmer has been an above average QB for most of his career. I can see why the Raiders were salivating.

This really reminds me of the Randy Moss deal. Actually, Moss is a HOF player..... Palmer probably won't sniff the HOF.

[Frosty]

Patriots
Ravens
Steelers
Texans
Chargers
Bills

Who would the raiders beat in this group?

Definitely not the Pats or Bills.

[JD10367]

Matt Williamson of Scouts Inc. doesn’t think Palmer is a top player anymore.

“Palmer does fit the offense, and I think he might, might, be an upgrade over Campbell,” Williamson said. “But I think Oakland way overpaid for an older quarterback that really has not played well for the past few years. He used to be an elite passer, but I haven’t seen that in quite a while. He doesn’t move well. I do think a change of scenery will help him. But he also had led the league in near-interceptions, and his decision-making is just average. He isn’t close to what he once was.”

#1: If he "might, might" be an upgrade over Campbell, John Holmes "might, might" be an upgrade for my wife. :rolleyes:

#2: He's only 31 (two years younger than Brady, and four years younger than Peyton... not saying he's anywhere near as good, just saying that he's not Brett Favre-old).

#3: Aside from his short injury year, he's never thrown more INTs than TDs (although he did equal it once... in his first year). In 5 of the past 6 seasons, he's thrown 32, 28, 26, 21, and 26 TDs, and thrown for 3800, 4000, 4100, 3100, and almost 4000.

The writer probably likes Matt Cassel. :whackit:

[SenselessChiefsFan]

The Raiders better win this game and the next game. That would put them at 6-2.

Then, here is the schedule:
@ SD- Loss.
@ Min- Toss up.
Chicago- Toss up.
@ Miami- Win.
@ GB-Loss
Detroit-Loss
@KC-Toss Up
SD-Toss up.

They could easily go 2-6 over the last half. If they drop either home game against KC or Denver, I think they have no shot of making the playoffs. If they win both games, they still have to be 4-4 down the stretch to make the playoffs. They have only one gimme and Minnesota is probably a gimme....but it is on the Road and Minnesota has Jared Allen and Adrian Peterson to make it interesting.

This is a VERY intriguing season.

[the Talking Can]

#1: If he "might, might" be an upgrade over Campbell, John Holmes "might, might" be an upgrade for my wife. :rolleyes:

#2: He's only 31 (two years younger than Brady, and four years younger than Peyton... not saying he's anywhere near as good, just saying that he's not Brett Favre-old).

#3: Aside from his short injury year, he's never thrown more INTs than TDs (although he did equal it once... in his first year). In 5 of the past 6 seasons, he's thrown 32, 28, 26, 21, and 26 TDs, and thrown for 3800, 4000, 4100, 3100, and almost 4000.

The writer probably likes Matt Cassel. :whackit:

he's thrown a shit load of ints in the last 4 years, his td/int ratio is god awful...he's also fumbled 13 times in the last two years


and his QB rating the last few years has him squarely as a QB in the 15-20th range...the damn definition of average...

you, like the Raiders, are living in some fantasy world of when he was young and healthy...he's complete stiff in the pocket, his accuracy is just barely adequate, and anyone who has watched him play recently knows he makes a lot of bone headed throws...

[Rausch]

Patriots
Ravens
Steelers
Texans
Chargers
Bills

Who would the raiders beat in this group?

8-8 will probably win this division...

[DBOSHO]

That was my list of probable playoff teams.

[SenselessChiefsFan]

8-8 will probably win this division...

I don't think so. The Chargers are going to win 10 games.

8-8 will get you second, but not in the playoffs.

[Chronic]

Let's play your game. The Chiefs gave a first worth 1200pts and got back Green and a fifth worth 32.6pts. So, net compensation was 1167.4pts

But you didnt get anything out of it.. So its a busted 1st rd pick, much like Tyson Jackson and Glen Dorsey

Do you think that there is any way the compensation for Palmer will be less than that?

Who knows.., Even if the cost is 1600 pts, if that trade gets the Raiders in the playoffs for 2-3 years and pushing for a chance at the AFCC- its still a better trade than the Green trade considering the Chiefs got absoluetly dick from it

#1) The Raiders are not a dominant team right now. They are an up and coming team, but not a great team.

I'd agree there, but you cant argue that Palmer isn't an upgrade to Campbell

#2) Carson Palmer will be going through some growing pains for a couple of weeks at least... and will probably struggle the rest of this year.

I dunno, Kurt Warner said Palmer's familiarity with Hue's playbook should get him off to a fast start.. will he play this week? Who knows.. the Raiders have a bye so they may keep him on the sidelines to listen to calls going in to Boller.

#3) The Raiders would draft around 20th right now, if the season ended today. At the end of the season, it will surprise me if they are drafing that low. I imagine they will be around 8-8 and draft around 16th.

Math isn't your strong suit I see, if the draft were held today the Raiders would be drafting at 24. 8-8? The Raiders are 4-2 currently, they have 2 games with the Chiefs and one more with the Broncos which should give them 3 more wins. The Raiders strong part of their schedule is over, they have games agaisnt the Dolphins, Vikings, Bears, Lions and they'll split with the Chargers.. Oakland will finish 10-6, and dont be surprised if they finish 11-5



Time will tell, but in the end, the compensation for Palmer will likely end up being well over Trent Green and the actual production from Palmer will likely be far less than Green.

How hard is it to lose 2 playoff games? Palmer will win a playoff game with the Raiders.. bank it.. and once he does that, and it may be this year.. once Palmer wins a playoff game.. he will have outproduce anything Green ever did in KC





Chiefs might win sunday if Boller plays... But once Palmer gets the system down.. the Raiders will continue to just curb stomp the Chiefs like they have the last 2 years

[SenselessChiefsFan]

he's thrown a shit load of ints in the last 4 years, his td/int ratio is god awful...he's also fumbled 13 times in the last two years


and his QB rating the last few years has him squarely as a QB in the 15-20th range...the damn definition of average...

you, like the Raiders, are living in some fantasy world of when he was young and healthy...he's complete stiff in the pocket, his accuracy is just barely adequate, and anyone who has watched him play recently knows he makes a lot of bone headed throws...

Would you quit with the logic. Now is not the time to be logical, it is time to wax poetic about how great Palmer is going to be and how he will suddenly return to his 25 year old, pre knee injury self.

[Rausch]

I don't think so. The Chargers are going to win 10 games.

8-8 will get you second, but not in the playoffs.

Unless I've fucked something up they only play 3 games we don't, and those aren't cake walk teams either...

[JD10367]

he's thrown a shit load of ints in the last 4 years, his td/int ratio is god awful...

2004: 18/18
2005: 32/12
2006: 28/13
2007: 26/20
2008: 3/4 (injured)
2009: 21/13
2010: 26/20

Lifetime: 154/100 in 97 games, an average of around 1.5-to-1.

It's not Brady or Peyton-ish, but it's not "a shit load" or "god awul".

[Rausch]

Would you quit with the logic. Now is not the time to be logical, it is time to wax poetic about how great Palmer is going to be and how he will suddenly return to his 25 year old, pre knee injury self.

I'd prefer he didn't...

[Chronic]

Patriots
Ravens
Steelers
Texans
Chargers
Bills

Who would the raiders beat in this group?

got damn you're dumb

They beat the Chargers twice last year

They beat the Jets this year

They beat the Texans already this year

and they had the Bills, in Buffalo mind you on a short week after monday night game and drilled them and had them at 21-3 at the half

So the Raider can compete, even with Campbell

Now they got Palmer, a big upgrade to Campbell

You do the math

[JD10367]

Would you quit with the logic. Now is not the time to be logical, it is time to wax poetic about how great Palmer is going to be and how he will suddenly return to his 25 year old, pre knee injury self.

Post-injury:
2009: 60.5 comp%, 3094 yards, 21 TDs, 13 INTs, 83.6 QB rating
2010: 61.8 comp%, 3970 yards, 26 TDs, 20 INTs, 82.4 QB rating

And this is on the crappy Bengals.

[the Talking Can]

2004: 18/18
2005: 32/12
2006: 28/13
2007: 26/20
2008: 3/4 (injured)
2009: 21/13
2010: 26/20

Lifetime: 154/100 in 97 games, an average of around 1.5-to-1.

It's not Brady or Peyton-ish, but it's not "a shit load" or "god awul".

what part of 'last 4 years' do you not understand? the part that said 'last 4 years'?

now go compare that ratio to good QBs...and work on your English comprehension while you're at it...

[Sofa King]

2004: 18/18
2005: 32/12
2006: 28/13
2007: 26/20
2008: 3/4 (injured)
2009: 21/13
2010: 26/20

Lifetime: 154/100 in 97 games, an average of around 1.5-to-1.

It's not Brady or Peyton-ish, but it's not "a shit load" or "god awul".

Touchdowns have gone down every year except for the small bump last year, but that came with a much larger bump in INTs...

Pretty average stats...

[SenselessChiefsFan]

Chiefs might win sunday if Boller plays... But once Palmer gets the system down.. the Raiders will continue to just curb stomp the Chiefs like they have the last 2 years

How do you figure they will draft 24th? They are in a group of teams that are 4-2, that if the draft happened today, would draft from the 20th slot up to the 26th. Then, it would be based on strength of schedule, then tie breakers.

Now, do you really think the Raiders are better than Detroit and Chicago?

The Raiders will struggle to beat KC twice. They will probably split.

The Broncos should be a win. Miami should be a win. Minnesota is not as good as the Raiders, but are at home.

Other than that, the other teams on the schedule are better than the Raiders. GB, Chicago, Detroit, and the Chargers are all better than the Raiders.

If the Chiefs manage to beat you this week... you are in trouble.

The hardest part of the schedule is still to come.

[SenselessChiefsFan]

Post-injury:
2009: 60.5 comp%, 3094 yards, 21 TDs, 13 INTs, 83.6 QB rating
2010: 61.8 comp%, 3970 yards, 26 TDs, 20 INTs, 82.4 QB rating

And this is on the crappy Bengals.

Crappy Bengals who are now 4-2... I wonder what made them crappy?

[SenselessChiefsFan]

got damn you're dumb

They beat the Chargers twice last year

They beat the Jets this year

They beat the Texans already this year

and they had the Bills, in Buffalo mind you on a short week after monday night game and drilled them and had them at 21-3 at the half

So the Raider can compete, even with Campbell

Now they got Palmer, a big upgrade to Campbell

You do the math

Texans without Johnson and Williams.

Jets 3-3.

And, a halftime lead against the Bills.

I can see why you are so proud. :rolleyes:

[SenselessChiefsFan]

As much as this sucks, I actually have to get some work done. I am going to try to stay off Chiefsplanet until Sunday..... I have been sucked into this story and it is like freaking Christmas. I just can't focus. I am just giddy.

But, if I don't get some freaking work done, my clients are not going to be happy.

Thanks to the Raiders for brightening up a season that the Chiefs are struggling in. Now, at least we can say.... at least we aren't the Raiders.

[mlyonsd]

They're going to just have to play the games.

Thing is, if it were the Chiefs that pulled off this trade the server would be smoking in a burnt up pile after the CP meltdown that would occur.

So raider fans don't assume we're just being homers. We'd still be repeatedly hitting ourselves in the head with the claw end of a hammer if it had happened to us.

[bevischief]

What do the Raiders and Bengals have in common?

They are both 4-2 WITHOUT Carson Palmer.

ROFL

[The Franchise]

Texans without Johnson and Williams.

Jets 3-3.

And, a halftime lead against the Bills.

I can see why you are so proud. :rolleyes:

And don't forget that they ALMOST lost to the Texans.

[Chronic]

How do you figure they will draft 24th? They are in a group of teams that are 4-2, that if the draft happened today, would draft from the 20th slot up to the 26th. Then, it would be based on strength of schedule, then tie breakers.

Now, do you really think the Raiders are better than Detroit and Chicago?

I think so, now we are with Palmer.. Who have the Lions played? Bucs, Chiefs, Vikings, Cowboys??.., certainly no powerhouses.. I think if the Lions had played Oaklands opponents.. Broncos, Bills, Jets, Patriots, Texans and Browns.. You'd see this ballwashing of the Lions as never having existed.. they play the Raiders first 6 games and the Lions are sitting at 3-3, possibly 2-4.. and that goes for the Bears.. Look at Oaklands first 6 games.. that was a brutal schedule and they are sitting at 4-2

The Raiders will struggle to beat KC twice. They will probably split.

It's always a close game whenever these two teams play, however the loss of Charles and Berry and the addition of Curry and Palmer doesnt bode well for the Chiefs. I think the Chiefs will have a good chance to beat Oakland this weekend, if Campbell playing, it would be a blowout.. Palmer may not have enough time to learn the playbook, if Boller plays.. yeah, the Chiefs could win

The Broncos should be a win. Miami should be a win. Minnesota is not as good as the Raiders, but are at home.

The Broncos seem to be turning up the heat.. they almost beat the Chargers.. all 3 games will be tough to win for Oakland, the Raiders certainly have better talent than those 3 teams, but anything can happen on any sunday.. I'd say the Raiders take 2 outta those 3

Other than that, the other teams on the schedule are better than the Raiders. GB, Chicago, Detroit, and the Chargers are all better than the Raiders.

Thats simply not true, like I mentioned, the Lions play the Raiders 1st 6 games and they are sitting at 2-4 instead of 5-1.. they havent beaten any team worth a shit..

If the Chiefs manage to beat you this week... you are in trouble.

I seriosly doubt being 4-3 is a position of trouble

The hardest part of the schedule is still to come.

Are you trying to tell me that the Lions, Bears, Vikings, Dolphins, Chiefs, and chargers are better than the Bills, Jets, Patriots, Texans?

Are you serious?



Up ya go

[Chronic]

Texans without Johnson and Williams.

Jets 3-3.

And, a halftime lead against the Bills.

I can see why you are so proud. :rolleyes:

Just dumb

Oakland was missing their starting CB, FB and a couple WR's

Besides, that last play of the game, Raiders only had 10 guys on the field and still intercepted the pass to shut the Texans down.. stop making excuse about injuried players.. every team has them, its good teams that overcome those things.. Like Oakland did... went into this game limping and still won.. thats what good teams do

[The Franchise]

If Al Davis doesn't die.....you don't beat the Texans.

[Bacillus Anthracis]

If Al Davis doesn't die.....you don't beat the Texans.

I agree. If Al's there, Bresnahan just runs the same unadjusting defense throughout and the Raiders get on the plane with cleat marks all over their backs.

After two games that have seen the sudden appearance of a nice variety of blitz packages and adjustments, a lot of the Al worshipppers still don't acknowledge that Al's constant f*ckery with the defense was causing serious problems.

[Bacillus Anthracis]

Just dumb

Oakland was missing their starting CB, FB and a couple WR's

Besides, that last play of the game, Raiders only had 10 guys on the field and still intercepted the pass to shut the Texans down.. stop making excuse about injuried players.. every team has them, its good teams that overcome those things.. Like Oakland did... went into this game limping and still won.. thats what good teams do

But the Chiefs beat Indianapolis! Sure Indi didn't have Peyton Manning but that probably wouldn't have made a difference. They also beat the Vikings. They're on a roll. Sure the combined record of Indi and Minnesota is what 0-11 or 0-12 but I'm sure had it been the Packes and Patriots the Chiefs would have beaten them both.

Right?

[The Franchise]

But the Chiefs beat Indianapolis! Sure Indi didn't have Peyton Manning but that probably wouldn't have made a difference. They also beat the Vikings. They're on a roll. Sure the combined record of Indi and Minnesota is what 0-11 or 0-12 but I'm sure had it been the Packes and Patriots the Chiefs would have beaten them both.

Right?

Hey dipshit....no one is claiming that the Chiefs should be 6-0 right now.

[Sofa King]

Hey dipshit....no one is claiming that the Chiefs should be 6-0 right now.

I think he's mocking Chronic, not you...

[SPATCH]

Palmer expected to start Sunday

per Schefter's twitter

this is such a lollercoaster

[TheGuardian]

OMG Palmer is going to start?

WTF? Talk about a coaching staff full of inept hemorrhoids.

[Montane]

Per a Raider beat reporter on twitter: offensive coordinator Al Saunders tells radio show Carson Palmer will start Sunday against the Chiefs "as long as he's breathing."

[The Franchise]

OMG Palmer is going to start?

WTF? Talk about a coaching staff full of inept hemorrhoids.

This is going to be awesome.

[PunkinDrublic]

I'm not saying this won't be a tough game on Sunday because it will. The Faiders front four still has an advantage over our O line and Mcfadden has been a threat every time he touches the ball. But faider fans are showing there ignorance by defending this horrible move. I understand it though. When you have a franchise with a reputation for being as poorly run as the faiders, they are probably the last place a FA would want to sign. If he had more suitors, I guarantee you Palmer wouldn't sign with Chokeland. Chokeland is the proverbial fat girl at last call that keeps you from going home alone at the end of the night.

[ModSocks]

Per a Raider beat reporter on twitter: offensive coordinator Al Saunders tells radio show Carson Palmer will start Sunday against the Chiefs "as long as he's breathing."

Great. Win or Lose, all they'll talk about is Palmer.

[The Bad Guy]

I'll say this too...This game is personal for Saunders. He wants to stick it to the organization after getting passed over for Herm.

[MoreLemonPledge]

I'll say this too...This game is personal for Saunders. He wants to stick it to the organization after getting passed over for Herm.

Really? That was years ago. Not every coordinator/coach has some ulterior motive to beat the Chiefs.

[Hammock Parties]

We are going to savagely assault Carson Palmer's asshole.

[MoreLemonPledge]

We are going to savagely assault Carson Palmer's knee again.

FYP

[Bacillus Anthracis]

OMG Palmer is going to start?

I don't like it. It's too soon.

WTF? Talk about a coaching staff full of inept hemorrhoids.

I wouldn't go that far. So far Hue Jackson's been pretty good. He does have his moments though. Going for it against the Browns on 4th and 1 last Sunday when a chipshot field goal would have iced the game was retarded.

I'd rather see Boller go Sunday for better or worse and then go into the bye with Palmer having two weeks to prepare for Denver. And hell, they're going to be starting Tebow Bieber. All he'd have to do is hand it off, throw about 15 passes the entire game and let the D tear Tebow a new baptism hole.

[Ming the Merciless]

I really don't know.....I think if your goal is to get carson palmer up to speed quickest, you throw his ass in there now...rather than wait for this game, a bye week....and for him not to play an nfl game until 3 more weeks...

I think it risks them losing to the Chiefs (which is LOL worthy) this game, but if their 'superbowl or bust' this season mentality is what they are really trying to do (I think that is also a stupid philosophy for them this season) then it does fit in with what they seem to be trying to do....getting Carson Palmer ready ASAP for a perceived (key word) playoff run.

[Ming the Merciless]

Lets be serious here

If the Dolphins make this trade this thread is pushed way down to the bottom

Nervous, jealous Chief fans..

Except, O' mighty oracle, you forgot that the fucking

MIAMI DOLPHINS ARE NOT IN OUR DIVISION

You tool.

[The Bad Guy]

Really? That was years ago. Not every coordinator/coach has some ulterior motive to beat the Chiefs.

It doesn't matter. Saunders has held a grudge for a long time with the Chiefs. He was passed over for Gunther after he knew several in the organization wanted him to be the HC. Then he got passed over after Vermeil left after he was told when he was hired as the OC that he would be the eventual successor when DV left.

He took it all very personally from the people I know who are connected to him. He hated Carl, but is no fan of Clark either.

[milkman]

I'm not saying this won't be a tough game on Sunday because it will. The Faiders front four still has an advantage over our O line and Mcfadden has been a threat every time he touches the ball. But faider fans are showing there ignorance by defending this horrible move. I understand it though. When you have a franchise with a reputation for being as poorly run as the faiders, they are probably the last place a FA would want to sign. If he had more suitors, I guarantee you Palmer wouldn't sign with Chokeland. Chokeland is the proverbial fat girl at last call that keeps you from going home alone at the end of the night.

Carson Palmer was not a free agent, and there's no way that teams like Seattle, Minnesota and Miami didn't contact the Bengals and inquire about Palmer during the offseason.



Phone rings in Mike Brown's office.

Mike Brown "Hello"

Caller "Hello Mike, this is Mark Davis."

Mike Brown "Hello Mark, sorry about your loss. What can I do for you?"

Mark Davis "Well Mike, you may have also heard about Jason Campell, and I was calling about the availability of Carson Palmer."

Mike Brown "He's not available. That son of a bitch is going to rot before I move him."

Mark Davis "Are you sure? We'll give a first round pick for him?"

Mike Brown, jokingly "You give us your next two first round picks, and I'll consider it."

Mark Davis "How about this, we'll give you those picks if we win a playoff game this years, but if we don't, we'll give our first next year, and our second in 2013 instead."

Mike Brown "Hold on a minute."
Puts the phone down, walks into outer office, closes door.

Laughs hysterically for 5 minutes.

Returns to office, picks up the phone "You got youself a deal."

[Montane]

Carson Palmer was not a free agent, and there's no way that teams like Seattle, Minnesota and Miami didn't contact the Bengals and inquire about Palmer during the offseason.



Phone rings in Mike Brown's office.

Mike Brown "Hello"

Caller "Hello Mike, this is Mark Davis."

Mike Brown "Hello Mark, sorry about your loss. What can I do for you?"

Mark Davis "Well Mike, you may have also heard about Jason Campell, and I was calling about the availability of Carson Palmer."

Mike Brown "He's not available. That son of a bitch is going to rot before I move him."

Mark Davis "Are you sure? We'll give a first round pick for him?"

Mike Brown, jokingly "You give us your next two first round picks, and I'll consider it."

Mark Davis "How about this, we'll give you those picks if we win a playoff game this years, but if we don't, we'll give our first next year, and our second in 2013 instead."

Mike Brown "Hold on a minute."
Puts the phone down, walks into outer office, closes door.

Laughs hysterically for 5 minutes.

Returns to office, picks up the phone "You got youself a deal."

The condition for the 2013 pick is the Raiders play in the AFC Championship game.

[ChiefsCountry]

OMG Palmer is going to start?

WTF? Talk about a coaching staff full of inept hemorrhoids.

When your other options are Kyle Bollar and Terrelle Pryor its not that inept.

[RaiderJave]

Carson Palmer was not a free agent, and there's no way that teams like Seattle, Minnesota and Miami didn't contact the Bengals and inquire about Palmer during the offseason.



Phone rings in Mike Brown's office.

Mike Brown "Hello"

Caller "Hello Mike, this is Mark Davis."

Mike Brown "Hello Mark, sorry about your loss. What can I do for you?"

Mark Davis "Well Mike, you may have also heard about Jason Campell, and I was calling about the availability of Carson Palmer."

Mike Brown "He's not available. That son of a bitch is going to rot before I move him."

Mark Davis "Are you sure? We'll give a first round pick for him?"

Mike Brown, jokingly "You give us your next two first round picks, and I'll consider it."

Mark Davis "How about this, we'll give you those picks if we win a playoff game this years, but if we don't, we'll give our first next year, and our second in 2013 instead."

Mike Brown "Hold on a minute."
Puts the phone down, walks into outer office, closes door.

Laughs hysterically for 5 minutes.

Returns to office, picks up the phone "You got youself a deal."

I love all the laughing at the trade on these boards. Well you can laugh Sunday as he will be starting against KC.

[Sofa King]

I love all the laughing at the trade on these boards. Well you can laugh Sunday as he will be starting against KC.

Deal. But i'm laughing now too.

[The Bad Guy]

I love all the laughing at the trade on these boards. Well you can laugh Sunday as he will be starting against KC.

I'll laugh when the 2012 pick is in the top 15.

[ChiefsCountry]

He took it all very personally from the people I know who are connected to him. He hated Carl, but is no fan of Clark either.

Good for Clark if thats the case. Saunders was very overrated.

[The Bad Guy]

Good for Clark if thats the case. Saunders was very overrated.

I really don't get that line of thinking. The guy was a stud OC. Not a HC, but he did a great job with the offense from 02-05.

[bevischief]

Carson Palmer was not a free agent, and there's no way that teams like Seattle, Minnesota and Miami didn't contact the Bengals and inquire about Palmer during the offseason.



Phone rings in Mike Brown's office.

Mike Brown "Hello"

Caller "Hello Mike, this is Mark Davis."

Mike Brown "Hello Mark, sorry about your loss. What can I do for you?"

Mark Davis "Well Mike, you may have also heard about Jason Campell, and I was calling about the availability of Carson Palmer."

Mike Brown "He's not available. That son of a bitch is going to rot before I move him."

Mark Davis "Are you sure? We'll give a first round pick for him?"

Mike Brown, jokingly "You give us your next two first round picks, and I'll consider it."

Mark Davis "How about this, we'll give you those picks if we win a playoff game this years, but if we don't, we'll give our first next year, and our second in 2013 instead."

Mike Brown "Hold on a minute."
Puts the phone down, walks into outer office, closes door.

Laughs hysterically for 5 minutes.

Returns to office, picks up the phone "You got youself a deal."
ROFL

[milkman]

I love all the laughing at the trade on these boards. Well you can laugh Sunday as he will be starting against KC.

There's only 2 QBs, maybe, that I'd give up that kind of compensation for.

Carson Palmer might return to pre-2005 form, but the only way that trade can be justified is a SB win this year, or two SBs wins in the next 5-6 years before he really retires.

The Raiders have mortgaged their future for this guy, so he has to pay huge dividends on that investment.

[RaiderJave]

I'll laugh when the 2012 pick is in the top 15.

Were 4-2 after playing the Jets, Patriots, Bills and Texans. I'm liking our chances.

[Dartgod]

Were 4-2 after playing the Jets, Patriots, Bills and Texans. I'm liking our chances.
No, you're 2-2 after playing those teams and then another 2-0 against a couple of scrubs.

[PunkinDrublic]

Were 4-2 after playing the Jets, Patriots, Bills and Texans. I'm liking our chances.

Your running game and defense might be enough to beat us but to pretend the Palmer move was a good move is laughable.

[RaiderJave]

There's only 2 QBs, maybe, that I'd give up that kind of compensation for.

Carson Palmer might return to pre-2005 form, but the only way that trade can be justified is a SB win this year, or two SBs wins in the next 5-6 years before he really retires.

The Raiders have mortgaged their future for this guy, so he has to pay huge dividends on that investment.

I would tend to agree with you however I have to put an asterisk next to that as we stink at selecting in the first round anyway.

2001 #28 Derrick Gibson DB
2002 #23 Napoleon Harris LB
2002 #17 Phillip Buchanon DB
2003 #32 Tyler Brayton DE
2003 #31 Nnamdi Asomugha DB
2004 #2 Robert Gallery OT
005 #23 Fabian Washington CB
2006 #7 Michael Huff S
2007 #1 JaMarcus Russell QB
2008 #4 Darren McFadden RB
2009 #7 Darrius Heyward-Bey

Not exactly a stellar history there. Like Hue put it, at least he knows what he's getting with Palmer, good and bad.

[IPwnFools]

Carson Palmer starting this week shows a BIG lack of respect that the Raiders have for the Chiefs football team.

I guarantee you Hue Jackson would not be starting Palmer if we were playing, say the Chargers, or Bears, or Lions or something like that.

LOL yall should be ashamed.

Hue Jackson knows all the Raiders have to do is run the ball, and target #24 on defense. Brandon Flowers is a pillow biting piece of burnt toast.

[Montane]

There's only 2 QBs, maybe, that I'd give up that kind of compensation for.

Carson Palmer might return to pre-2005 form, but the only way that trade can be justified is a SB win this year, or two SBs wins in the next 5-6 years before he really retires.

The Raiders have mortgaged their future for this guy, so he has to pay huge dividends on that investment.

How could that possibly be the criteria by which one should judge value of this trade? Two first round picks = 2 SBs or it's a waste? You way overvalue first round picks. Heck, some teams haven't been to a SB in 40 years!

[Chronic]

There's only 2 QBs, maybe, that I'd give up that kind of compensation for.

Carson Palmer might return to pre-2005 form, but the only way that trade can be justified is a SB win this year, or two SBs wins in the next 5-6 years before he really retires.

The Raiders have mortgaged their future for this guy, so he has to pay huge dividends on that investment.


Trent Green one of them??

lololololololol

[DBOSHO]

got damn you're dumb

They beat the Chargers twice last year

They beat the Jets this year

They beat the Texans already this year

and they had the Bills, in Buffalo mind you on a short week after monday night game and drilled them and had them at 21-3 at the half

So the Raider can compete, even with Campbell

Now they got Palmer, a big upgrade to Campbell

You do the math

The bills are the only team i could see the raiders beating out of any of those teams i listed.

You can yell and kick and scream all you want about the texans game but you were 1 shaub pass away from losing that game without their 2 best players. I wonder who they throw to on the goalline in that situation?

Your teams good. Ill give you that, but you arent elite like you think you are.

[Chronic]

Your running game and defense might be enough to beat us but to pretend the Palmer move was a good move is laughable.

lol

Raiders been kicking yer ass for 3 years

[milkman]

How could that possibly be the criteria by which one should judge value of this trade? Two first round picks = 2 SBs or it's a waste? You way overvalue first round picks. Heck, some teams haven't been to a SB in 40 years!

Success or failure is the criteria of any move you make in the NFL.

You don't make this trade simply to win some games.

It's all about Championships.

[DBOSHO]

Carson Palmer starting this week shows a BIG lack of respect that the Raiders have for the Chiefs football team.

I guarantee you Hue Jackson would not be starting Palmer if we were playing, say the Chargers, or Bears, or Lions or something like that.

LOL yall should be ashamed.

Hue Jackson knows all the Raiders have to do is run the ball, and target #24 on defense. Brandon Flowers is a pillow biting piece of burnt toast.

I hope to see you back here sunday night to eat crow.

[milkman]

Trent Green one of them??

lololololololol

Look it up.

I'm record for hating both the trade that brought Green to the Chiefs, and the trade for Montana.

You build a team around a young QB and open a window for a decade or more.

[IPwnFools]

I hope to see you back here sunday night to eat crow.

I hope to see you back here too.

But I don't expect to see you.

I know Sunday Night is usually the night you inbreds in KC take your sisters out on dates.

[Bacillus Anthracis]

No, you're 2-2 after playing those teams and then another 2-0 against a couple of scrubs.

Someone jumped my ass a couple of pages ago for pointing out the thick-headedness of remarks like this.

1. You play who's put in front of you.

2. The teams that have been put in front of us are Denver, Buffalo, Jets, Pats, Texans, and Browns. Of those teams, Denver is the only one that can be said is completely awful. The Browns are now 1 game under .500 and the others are all over .500.

3. We're 4-2 against good competition

4. You guys are 2-3 and your only wins have come against teams with a combined record of 1-11. Competition doesn't get much worse than that.

Please, think before you type.

[DBOSHO]

lol

Raiders been kicking yer ass for 3 years

Your team is cute. Theyre like the little brother whos been practicing their jumpshot for years in an effort to compete with big brother.

[PunkinDrublic]

lol

Raiders been kicking yer ass for 3 years

Yeah and you've been a laughing stock for over a decade. But enjoy the small victories.

[DBOSHO]

I hope to see you back here too.

But I don't expect to see you.

I know Sunday Night is usually the night you inbreds in KC take your sisters out on dates.

LMFAOROFLHAHAHA HOWD U KNO?

[BigMeatballDave]

How could that possibly be the criteria by which one should judge value of this trade? Two first round picks = 2 SBs or it's a waste? You way overvalue first round picks. Heck, some teams haven't been to a SB in 40 years!

Dumbass. If Palmer does not lead the Raiders to a SB win, this trade is a failure.

[Chiefspants]

I would tend to agree with you however I have to put an asterisk next to that as we stink at selecting in the first round anyway.

2001 #28 Derrick Gibson DB
2002 #23 Napoleon Harris LB
2002 #17 Phillip Buchanon DB
2003 #32 Tyler Brayton DE
2003 #31 Nnamdi Asomugha DB
2004 #2 Robert Gallery OT
005 #23 Fabian Washington CB
2006 #7 Michael Huff S
2007 #1 JaMarcus Russell QB
2008 #4 Darren McFadden RB
2009 #7 Darrius Heyward-Bey

Not exactly a stellar history there. Like Hue put it, at least he knows what he's getting with Palmer, good and bad.

Not a stellar history? Lol, right. Mcfadden is the lynchpin to the Raiders success this season, while Gallery, Huff, and Asomugha are/were major contributors, and, everyone bolded will also contribute much longer than your present QB.

Your team bet the farm on a QB on the wrong side of thirty, we'll see if it pays off.

[The Franchise]

Someone jumped my ass a couple of pages ago for pointing out the thick-headedness of remarks like this.

1. You play who's put in front of you.

2. The teams that have been put in front of us are Denver, Buffalo, Jets, Pats, Texans, and Browns. Of those teams, Denver is the only one that can be said is completely awful. The Browns are now 1 game under .500 and the others are all over .500.

3. We're 4-2 against good competition

4. You guys are 2-3 and your only wins have come against teams with a combined record of 1-11. Competition doesn't get much worse than that.

Please, think before you type.

SHOW ME WHERE THE FUCK ANYONE OF US HAS STATED THAT THE CHIEFS SHOULD HAVE A BETTER RECORD THAN THEY DO.

[Bacillus Anthracis]

Success or failure is the criteria of any move you make in the NFL.

You don't make this trade simply to win some games.

It's all about Championships.

True enough.

But there are only so many championships to go around. If we're in the playoffs for the next 3-4 years because of it, then it was a good move with or without a Superbowl win.

I don't think anyone would say the Chargers have been a waste of time over the last 5 years ago. They haven't made it to the Superbowl but their fans have been happy most of the time for quite awhile. They have hope. And that's a damn nice thing to have as a sports fan.

After the last 9 years of watching my team, I'd forgotten what it was like to actually look forward to watching games instead of preparing myself to view the sports equivalent of a weekly airline disaster.

[Chronic]

Your team bet the farm on a QB on the wrong side of thirty, we'll see if it pays off.

A pick between 22-28 in the 1st rd is "betting the farm?"

[Chronic]

Dumbass. If Palmer does not lead the Raiders to a SB win, this trade is a failure.

You're whole franchise has been a failure.. you have yet to win a Super Bowl since the merger

So all those 35+ or so 1st rd picks the Chiefs took were failures

[RaiderJave]

Not a stellar history? Lol, right. Mcfadden is the lynchpin to the Raiders success this season, while Gallery and Huff are major contributors, and, everyone bolded will also contribute much longer than your present QB.

Your team bet the farm on a QB on the wrong side of thirty, we'll see if it pays off.

Gallery's in Seattle, however if you remember he was supposed to be a franchise LT, you plug in and forget about for the next decade. He turned out to be far less, and after 3 years, under Cable I might add, finally became a serviceable G.
Huff as well was terrible until early last season when he "clicked" and became a good, not great S. While not total misses, where we selected them was way to high for what they turned out. Looking bad, Huff is a second round pick and Gallery, a late first, early second. We took them at #2 overall and #7 overall.

[Chiefspants]

A pick between 22-28 in the 1st rd is "betting the farm?"

Potentially two first round picks for a 32 year old quarterback whose peak was in 2006? Maybe it's not the farm, but your team certainly put a lot of the future at stake to attain him.

[Montane]

Success or failure is the criteria of any move you make in the NFL.

You don't make this trade simply to win some games.

It's all about Championships.

Then KC's first round draft picks have been failures for the last 40 years! The criteria for any move is does it make your team better? Would the Raiders have won more games keeping those picks than with Palmer.

We'll see how Carson and the Raiders perform. If they suck, then bad trade. If they compete with the best teams, then good trade. Simple.

[Bacillus Anthracis]

SHOW ME WHERE THE **** ANYONE OF US HAS STATED THAT THE CHIEFS SHOULD HAVE A BETTER RECORD THAN THEY DO.

Are you f'ing retarded? Seriously. Did you take a blow to the head as child or was it you getting your head bashed in at a bar in Canada recently and not Shia Lebouf?

Idiotic statements about how the Raiders have only beaten crappy teams are just that: idiotic. So why do I expect someone who makes idiotic statements to hold their own team to the same standard? I don't know.

Numbnut.