Gas on the Fire: Shutdown Corner Gives Chiefs "F" in FA.

['Hamas' Jenkins]

[BossChief]

Just wait till next offseason.

2 OL starters (Allen and Hudson) are FAs as well as Houston and Alex Smith.

That has the potential to get really nasty.

[keg in kc]

Originally Posted by milkman

You have this backwards.

This team has 2 major holes.
Ignoring free agency means you have to go into this draft targeting those holes.

Unless they believe they've already addressed those holes internally.

That didn't sound so perverted in my head.

[chiefzilla1501]

Originally Posted by milkman

You have this backwards.

This team has 2 major holes.
Ignoring free agency means you have to go into this draft targeting those holes.

If you are in "win now" mode, then you have to get immediate contributors. And you tend to use your draft to upgrade your weak starters and rule out positions where we are already strong.

If you aren't in a rush, you draft BPA. Period. In every single round. You draft QBs even if Alex Smith isn't going anywhere for a while. You draft pass rushers even if you probably have a 3 year window on your stud OLBs.

If you draft a guard in the first, well… **** me sideways.

[chiefzilla1501]

Originally Posted by BossChief

Bingo.

If we had signed TJ Ward/Clemons, Evan-Deitrich Smith and Emmanuel Sanders, the draft would be like a bonus.

Those 3 signings would have been easy to make happen, too.

Convert Hali and Bowes base salaries to bonuses and lets roll.

But, no.

We sat on our hands and waited for other tams we are "competing with" to bolster their already superior rosters while we play the "next year" game AGAIN.

Very aggravating.

You keep bringing up the point about converting Hali and Bowes contract to bonuses. But ignore the fact that with signing bonus money, you are guaranteeing more money for them in their declining years.

If you want to win now at all costs today, fine. But let's not pretend there aren't consequences.

[Easy 6]

Originally Posted by chiefzilla1501

What gives you the most leeway is walking into the draft believing you can take anybody, even if you have a starter already at that position. If you sign TJ Ward and send the message that you're trying to "win now" then you just took Safety off your draft board and are now forced to target a draft pick who is ready to start right away. That means drafting a safe pick and pigeonholing yourself to filling a few positions of need, versus walking into the draft with an open mind.

Taking Ward doesn't mean you cant draft his competition/depth... but it also means you don't have to worry to death about that one position if you don't want to and maybe focus on a scary young talent to groom behind Hali, or take a second WR behind your #1 receiver pick for insurance, or take a TE where you couldn't before because of the pressing safety need, or take WHOEVER you want at a given spot, even if they might need a little polishing.

Like I said, its a domino effect... you eliminate one need and it becomes like tetris blocks falling into place with the draft, you can take what you NEED or take what you WANT.

ONE GUY...one semi-stud at one of two positions... its not like most fans were asking for the moon, but please just make a difference.

[milkman]

Originally Posted by chiefzilla1501

If you are in "win now" mode, then you have to get immediate contributors. And you tend to use your draft to upgrade your weak starters and rule out positions where we are already strong.

If you aren't in a rush, you draft BPA. Period. In every single round. You draft QBs even if Alex Smith isn't going anywhere for a while. You draft pass rushers even if you probably have a 3 year window on your stud OLBs.

If you draft a guard in the first, well… **** me sideways.

Don't care if you are win now or drafting for the future,

You have 2 gaping chasms on your team, you can not ignore them.

[BossChief]

Originally Posted by chiefzilla1501

You keep bringing up the point about converting Hali and Bowes contract to bonuses. But ignore the fact that with signing bonus money, you are guaranteeing more money for them in their declining years.

If you want to win now at all costs today, fine. But let's not pretend there aren't consequences.

You don't seem to understand facts. No matter how many times I present them, you argue the same fruitless points. I don't understand it.

In 3 years, the salary cap is gonna be 150-155 million (maybe more, but at least that much) and players like Bowe, Hali, Flowers and Charles are gonna be gone, as will their contracts.

You think converting 8 million of Bowes base salary and spreading it between te next 4 years would hurt this teams cap situation? That's laughable. How about converting 5 million of Hali's base to a bonus over the next 3 years...that's 13 million that won't hurt this tam AT ALL over the next 2-3 years ...BUT THE TEAM COULD ADD SANDERS, WARD/CLEMONS AND DEITRICH SMITH WITH THAT MONEY.

add to that, the draft picks we have coming in as well as the players from last years draft that didnt contribute due to various reasons and EVERYONE HERE would be excited about next year.

Instead, you choose to tow the company line, as usual.

[chiefzilla1501]

Originally Posted by scott free

Taking Ward doesn't mean you cant draft his competition/depth... but it also means you don't have to worry to death about that one position if you don't want to and maybe focus on a scary young talent to groom behind Hali, or take a second WR behind your #1 receiver pick for insurance, or take a TE where you couldn't before because of the pressing safety need, or take WHOEVER you want at a given spot, even if they might need a little polishing.

Like I said, its a domino effect... you eliminate one need and it becomes like tetris blocks falling into place with the draft, you can take what you NEED or take what you WANT.

ONE GUY...one semi-stud at one of two positions... its not like most fans were asking for the moon, but please just make a difference.

If you bring in Desean Jackson and Jairus Byrd or even Ward, you have to win now. The type of gymnastics you have to do around the cap makes it hard to build for the future given the number of needs we'll have in 3 years. If you have to win now, you can't afford to draft for the future. What good is the future when your window is 3 years, and then everything tanks? When you draft for immediate need, you start drafting to fill holes instead of BPA. That's just my opinion.

[chiefzilla1501]

Originally Posted by BossChief

You don't seem to understand facts. No matter how many times I present them, you argue the same fruitless points. I don't understand it.

In 3 years, the salary cap is gonna be 150-155 million (maybe more, but at least that much) and players like Bowe, Hali, Flowers and Charles are gonna be gone, as will their contracts.

You think converting 8 million of Bowes base salary and spreading it between te next 4 years would hurt this teams cap situation? That's laughable. How about converting 5 million of Hali's base to a bonus over the next 3 years...that's 13 million that won't hurt this tam AT ALL over the next 2-3 years ...BUT THE TEAM COULD ADD SANDERS, WARD/CLEMONS AND DEITRICH SMITH WITH THAT MONEY.

add to that, the draft picks we have coming in as well as the players from last years draft that didnt contribute due to various reasons and EVERYONE HERE would be excited about next year.

Instead, you choose to tow the company line, as usual.

What's laughable is you think that Bowe and Hali would agree to restructure guaranteed money into a small signing bonus like that. If you wait one year, THEN you can start talking about the Chiefs restructuring with a reasonable signing bonus.

If I'm Hali's agent and I know Hali is basically guaranteed $11M this year (he knows he won't get cut), then why in the world would I settle for only an $11M signing bonus?

[chiefzilla1501]

Originally Posted by milkman

Don't care if you are win now or drafting for the future,

You have 2 gaping chasms on your team, you can not ignore them.

If you feel like this team has to win now. I understand why you think they should focus on that. I just don't agree.

[BossChief]

FTR, I don't even care that we didnt go after Desean Jackson...even though 8/yr for him was a good value. I'd rather have spend a little more than Denver to get Emmanuel Sanders.

Wards signed for less than 6
Sanders signed for 5
Deitrich Smith signed for 3.5
Clemons signed for around 4 iirc

Those were the values they should have pursued if they were serious about trying to contend next year without screwing the cap.

[chiefzilla1501]

Originally Posted by BossChief

FTR, I don't even care that we didnt go after Desean Jackson...even though 8/yr for him was a good value. I'd rather have spend a little more than Denver to get Emmanuel Sanders.

Wards signed for less than 6
Sanders signed for 5
Deitrich Smith signed for 3.5
Clemons signed for around 4 iirc

Those were the values they should have pursued if they were serious about trying to contend next year without screwing the cap.

Another Strong Safety when we need a Center Fielder. A WR with screws in his feet. A mother****ing Guard. And a Safety nobody seemed to have wanted.

No, they don't screw the cap. But we still have to shuffle our existing contracts around to free up space. It's basically taking out a loan with interest on the back. It may seem like a small deal to you. But because we wasted several years in the Pioli years, if we want to keep the window open past 3 years, every single dollar matters.

And we still wouldn't have solved how we extend Alex Smith, Justin Houston, and Eric Berry (Berry less so because he saves money through a restructure). Three guys who are more important than any free agent on your list if we're talking short-term window.

[BossChief]

Originally Posted by chiefzilla1501

What's laughable is you think that Bowe and Hali would agree to restructure guaranteed money into a small signing bonus like that. If you wait one year, THEN you can start talking about the Chiefs restructuring with a reasonable signing bonus.

If I'm Hali's agent and I know Hali is basically guaranteed $11M this year (he knows he won't get cut), then why in the world would I settle for only an $11M signing bonus?

You obviously don't even understand how restructures work.

Bowe has a base salary of 8.75 million this year that he will get in 16 installments as game checks. The veteran minimum for a 7 year veteran is 720,000.

Restructuring his deal means instead of paying him game checks, we give him one check for 8 million and drop his base salary to the vet minimum. That 8 million then gets spread over the course of the remaining years of his contract, in this case 4 years.

The player has no reason to say no and it clears that 8 million off the current years salary cap.

With the facts being that the salary cap is increasing at a crazy amount and the advanced age of a large part of our core group of layers is getting to the prime years and even exiting those prime years, wouldn't you have to agree that NOW would be a great time to not nessesarily go "all in" but AT LEAST RAISE THE POT?

FFS

[BossChief]

Originally Posted by chiefzilla1501

If you feel like this team has to win now. I understand why you think they should focus on that. I just don't agree.

What the **** are you talking about?

FFS read the shit you are typing and stop being a brainwashed ....well, nevermind.

You can't be unbrainwashed.

What's the point of trying to talk sense into people that don't want to see the light.

You will always think its ok to wait till next year...even though next year never happens.

[chiefzilla1501]

Originally Posted by BossChief

You obviously don't even understand how restructures work.

Bowe has a base salary of 8.75 million this year that he will get in 16 installments as game checks. The veteran minimum for a 7 year veteran is 720,000.

Restructuring his deal means instead of paying him game checks, we give him one check for 8 million and drop his base salary to the vet minimum. That 8 million then gets spread over the course of the remaining years of his contract, in this case 4 years.

The player has no reason to say no and it clears that 8 million off the current years salary cap.

With the facts being that the salary cap is increasing at a crazy amount and the advanced age of a large part of our core group of layers is getting to the prime years and even exiting those prime years, wouldn't you have to agree that NOW would be a great time to not nessesarily go "all in" but AT LEAST RAISE THE POT?

FFS

So Bowe turns into a $16M cap hit next year, a $15M cap hit the next year. And you've further guaranteed every dollar of those contracts because it's even MORE expensive to cut him. Why do you think we're overpaying Flowers right now? Hali… even worse idea. His agent isn't going to agree to some measly restructure for a player negotiating a final contract. So it's not even in the conversation.

What you're suggesting are good ideas for a team that goes all in on winning now. That's fine. But there are long-term consequences. I would rather use our existing cap to keep Houston, Berry, and Smith before their contracts balloon due to the new caps.