Chiefs To those who wanted to rebuild - Page 6

dallaschiefsfan · 10-21-2008, 08:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brock

It shouldn't have "snuck up" on anyone. It should have been pretty obvious that Green, Holmes, Roaf, Kennison, etc. were going to need to be replaced and the team slept on it.

No. It shouldn't have been. These guys were playing fine...and you expect one or two players to drop off...but everyone?!? No. Roaf ditching made it even worse. Half-assed rear-view punditry is easy. Nobody was sounding this alarm that was actually taken seriously. Everything was hindsight.

Edit: Oh...and the stupid change in offensive system only made the problem worse...that probably wouldn't have been as devastating otherwise.

**Rausch** · 10-21-2008, 08:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brock

It shouldn't have "snuck up" on anyone. It should have been pretty obvious that Green, Holmes, Roaf, Kennison, etc. were going to need to be replaced and the team slept on it.

Before the talent retired you still had to be able to spot it, sign/trade/draft it, and play it.

This team has gone from the stupid of all FA/Trade to all Draft/Youth.

Suck and failure is the result of both. A healthy balance is what builds a franchise and winner.

Balance, balance, balance. On offense, defense, and hopefully one day in general management...

patteeu · 10-21-2008, 08:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dallaschiefsfan

Forgive me...but this makes no sense to me. You wanted the rebuild to start a year earlier...presumably because it was obvious it was going to be needed. Yet...you don't see that by waiting another year that we are simply delaying the inevitable firing and re-tooling of our "rebuild"? Surely you can see that the coaching-issues we currently have are more obviously flawed than the age-issues we had two years ago? Even sports pundits admit that the Chiefs' age-issues snuck up on everyone.

I'm just trying to figure out why in the hell you're patient with the incompetence, but you were disappointed with a lack of action on this supposed "rebuild". Makes no sense to me.

No, I wasn't clear. I see now, through hindsight, that the rebuild should have started a year earlier. I think it's fair for those who were calling for a rebuild earlier to criticize Carl for hanging on to the veteran team for that last year, but I wasn't one of them so I'm not going to criticize on that count.

Food for thought: Firing Carl and/or Herm after one real rebuilding year will be a discouragement to future Chiefs GMs and coaches to pull that rebuilding trigger. I think it makes sense to give them a second year.

dallaschiefsfan · 10-21-2008, 08:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by patteeu

No, I wasn't clear. I see now, through hindsight, that the rebuild should have started a year earlier. I think it's fair for those who were calling for a rebuild earlier to criticize Carl for hanging on to the veteran team for that last year, but I wasn't one of them so I'm not going to criticize on that count.

Food for thought: Firing Carl and/or Herm after one real rebuilding year will be a discouragement to future Chiefs GMs and coaches to pull that rebuilding trigger. I think it makes sense to give them a second year.

No way. A legit GM ain't gonna' be running scared from day one. A legit GM will be arrogant enough to believe he's better than Carl (and 90% of the possible GM's would be correct in this belief). These guys don't get to where they are in the NFL world by being timid about their abilities to do more than their predecessor. I don't buy this argument. Carl/Herm are horrible and most new GM's/Coaches will believe they are better.

**Rausch** · 10-21-2008, 08:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chiefnj2

What changed? This question isn't intended for those who wanted Herm gone for years. It is for those that embraced the rebuild when you first heard about it this offseason.

There has to be some building going on.

The idea is that you take a step back but see baby-steps forward.

There are no baby-steps. There is no raw talent producing on an irregular basis due to youth alone. It's suck. Its poor coaching, poor execution, poor scheme, and poor performance.

Not even poor. It's ****ing embarrasing. It's a joke and a full steam kick in the nuts weekly...

Brock · 10-21-2008, 08:28 AM

I'm still fine with rebuilding. I just think we're rebuilding a team for a different coach. Herm appears to be in over his head on gameday.

Demonpenz · 10-21-2008, 08:36 AM

There is no reason in the nfl you should ever get blown out this bad 2 or 3 times. Rebuilding or not, you should have hit or coached up some of your draft talent to atleast show some fight. You sure as hell shouldn't give up 300 yards rushing if your a ****ing defensive coach. Carl, Herm, Clark seem to be opposite pages on what the hell to do. That is not rebuilding. That is one big circle jerk. Fans would be alittle more understanding if they just come out and say they are playing the youngest possible QB's and such to see what they have and evaluate. Instead they feed us this bullshit like the atlanta game that Thigpen gives you the best chance to win. This franchise sucks at everything, They can't draft, can coach, can't game plan, can't game manage, You would think they would be able to motivate, but this team quits on a any time they are down. They suck at signing free agents, they resign ****ing thugs who spit in womans faces, the training staff can't keep anyone healthy, and when they get hurt it takes longer and they aren't strong when they come back, they can't pull the trigger on the trades that should be made, hell they can't even get people in and out of the damn staduim in a decent manor without being assholes. So save your I THOUGHT YOU WERE READY FOR REBUILD?!?!?! Happy horseshit

Reerun_KC · 10-21-2008, 08:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Demonpenz

There is no reason in the nfl you should ever get blown out this bad 2 or 3 times. Rebuilding or not, you should have hit or coached up some of your draft talent to atleast show some fight. You sure as hell shouldn't give up 300 yards rushing if your a ****ing defensive coach. Carl, Herm, Clark seem to be opposite pages on what the hell to do. That is not rebuilding. That is one big circle jerk. Fans would be alittle more understanding if they just come out and say they are playing the youngest possible QB's and such to see what they have and evaluate. Instead they feed us this bullshit like the atlanta game that Thigpen gives you the best chance to win. This franchise sucks at everything, They can't draft, can coach, can't game plan, can't game manage, You would think they would be able to motivate, but this team quits on a any time they are down. They suck at signing free agents, they resign ****ing thugs who spit in womans faces, the training staff can't keep anyone healthy, and when they get hurt it takes longer and they aren't strong when they come back, they can't pull the trigger on the trades that should be made, hell they can't even get people in and out of the damn staduim in a decent manor without being assholes. So save your I THOUGHT YOU WERE READY FOR REBUILD?!?!?! Happy horseshit

Solid rant, you must not be stoned this early in the am...

dallaschiefsfan · 10-21-2008, 08:39 AM

While Carl has sucked in the draft almost 90% of the time, we actually have one example of a responsible rebuild within the history of the 90's Chiefs. In '97, we turned over the offense and defense and the team sucked at first...but improved throughout the year and eventually went to the playoffs off a 13-3 record. They didn't ditch all the vets...but kept winning vets to compliment the younger talent and it worked out.

Of course, they followed up that season with the melt-down the next year which ended in Marty's departure...but I remember at the time, this is the way a rebuild should be handled.

beach tribe · 10-21-2008, 10:17 AM

I'm really tired of all the rebuild completely through the draft crap too. You still have to pursue young FAs to fill holes in this league.
A team should be damn near a complete rebuild in three seasons in today's NFL.
Good drafting paired with good FA signings is how it is done.
I'm not sayin we should go out, and sign a bunch of over the hill FAs, but you must have depth, and you must pursue quality players any way you can.

ChiefsCountry · 10-21-2008, 10:32 AM

Herm is rebuilding this sucker for somebody else. Its plain and simple. Somebody is going to walk into a gold mine of talent.

Chiefnj2 · 10-21-2008, 11:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChiefsCountry

Herm is rebuilding this sucker for somebody else. Its plain and simple. Somebody is going to walk into a gold mine of talent.

The "talent" remains to be seen.

10-21-2008, 08:28 AM	#6
Brock Say hello to my little friend Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Larryville Casino cash: $9598422	I'm still fine with rebuilding. I just think we're rebuilding a team for a different coach. Herm appears to be in over his head on gameday.
Posts: 47,314

10-21-2008, 08:36 AM	#7
Demonpenz Woman should only make babies Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Apartment "G UNIT!" Casino cash: $-493864	There is no reason in the nfl you should ever get blown out this bad 2 or 3 times. Rebuilding or not, you should have hit or coached up some of your draft talent to atleast show some fight. You sure as hell shouldn't give up 300 yards rushing if your a **ing defensive coach. Carl, Herm, Clark seem to be opposite pages on what the hell to do. That is not rebuilding. That is one big circle jerk. Fans would be alittle more understanding if they just come out and say they are playing the youngest possible QB's and such to see what they have and evaluate. Instead they feed us this bullshit like the atlanta game that Thigpen gives you the best chance to win. This franchise sucks at everything, They can't draft, can coach, can't game plan, can't game manage, You would think they would be able to motivate, but this team quits on a any time they are down. They suck at signing free agents, they resign **ing thugs who spit in womans faces, the training staff can't keep anyone healthy, and when they get hurt it takes longer and they aren't strong when they come back, they can't pull the trigger on the trades that should be made, hell they can't even get people in and out of the damn staduim in a decent manor without being assholes. So save your I THOUGHT YOU WERE READY FOR REBUILD?!?!?! Happy horseshit __________________
Posts: 54,962

10-21-2008, 08:39 AM	#9
dallaschiefsfan Herm is the worst...horrible Join Date: Sep 2000 Casino cash: $3028850	While Carl has sucked in the draft almost 90% of the time, we actually have one example of a responsible rebuild within the history of the 90's Chiefs. In '97, we turned over the offense and defense and the team sucked at first...but improved throughout the year and eventually went to the playoffs off a 13-3 record. They didn't ditch all the vets...but kept winning vets to compliment the younger talent and it worked out. Of course, they followed up that season with the melt-down the next year which ended in Marty's departure...but I remember at the time, this is the way a rebuild should be handled.
Posts: 2,033

10-21-2008, 10:17 AM	#10
beach tribe Keep doubting J MFing Houston Join Date: May 2007 Location: ft.lauderdale Casino cash: $3868036	I'm really tired of all the rebuild completely through the draft crap too. You still have to pursue young FAs to fill holes in this league. A team should be damn near a complete rebuild in three seasons in today's NFL. Good drafting paired with good FA signings is how it is done. I'm not sayin we should go out, and sign a bunch of over the hill FAs, but you must have depth, and you must pursue quality players any way you can.
Posts: 21,429

10-21-2008, 10:32 AM	#11
ChiefsCountry The Insider Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Lake of the Ozarks Casino cash: $-1701248	Herm is rebuilding this sucker for somebody else. Its plain and simple. Somebody is going to walk into a gold mine of talent.
Posts: 52,232

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