2014 Semifinalists for the Hall of Fame

[DaneMcCloud]

Originally Posted by ThaVirus

I can't say I agree here, as I admittedly wasn't a football guru at the age of 8 when Barry was in his prime, but you've brought up a point I'd like to delve into that's pertinent to this argument.

(To Dane)

When considering HOF enshrinement, what's the argument against LT? That he's not "transcendent"? That he didn't carry his team to a Super Bowl? DJ just noted that LT did a hell of a lot more to carry his team to a championship than a guy like Sanders or many others did.

Well, for one, when his team needed him most, he was out, injured.

Secondly, the Chargers WERE a loaded team with a Super Bowl winning coach (albeit as an OC but nonetheless). Vincent Jackson, Tomlinson, Gates, Rivers (or Brees), etc. Yet, they could never get over the hump and he never carried them over the hump.

Again, he was a great running back but I wouldn't vote for him as a Hall of Famer, any more than I'd vote Davis, George, Holmes, etc.

He failed to elevate the Chargers or Jets when it mattered most.

[DJ's left nut]

Originally Posted by DaneMcCloud

Well, for one, when his team needed him most, he was out, injured.

Secondly, the Chargers WERE a loaded team with a Super Bowl winning coach (albeit as an OC but nonetheless). Vincent Jackson, Tomlinson, Gates, Rivers (or Brees), etc. Yet, they could never get over the hump and he never carried them over the hump.

Again, he was a great running back but I wouldn't vote for him as a Hall of Famer, any more than I'd vote Davis, George, Holmes, etc.

He failed to elevate the Chargers or Jets when it mattered most.

When you're trumpeting Norv Turner in an attempt to run down LaDanian Tomlinson, your argument is really starting to run out of steam.

[DaneMcCloud]

Originally Posted by DJ's left nut

When you're trumpeting Norv Turner in an attempt to run down LaDanian Tomlinson, your argument is really starting to run out of steam.

So, tell us why Tomlinson should be in the Hall of Fame? What makes him worthy, other than some gaudy stats, which other players outside the Hall have as well?

What made him unique? Why should he be revered 100 years from now?

[DJ's left nut]

Originally Posted by DaneMcCloud

So, tell us why Tomlinson should be in the Hall of Fame? What makes him worthy, other than some gaudy stats, which other players outside the Hall have as well?

What made him unique? Why should he be revered 100 years from now?

He's the 2nd best combination of pass-catcher and rusher in league history (behind only Faulk) while simultaneously being responsible in every facet of the game.

His numbers, even era adjusted, stack up to anyone's. And as I've pointed out several times, there's not a good reason to apply a significant era adjustment to RB as they've been remarkably static in their performance throughout history. His regular season record is sterling as well; the Chargers really began their turnaround with him taking the reigns. Despite different coaches, QBs and skill position players, they just kept winning - LDT was the constant.

The only argument you have against him appears to be that he never won a SB. Well I guess Shields and Gonzalez are ****ed. DT shouldn't have been in there. And why are we still discussing Sanders?

You just move the goalposts every time I address an issue. You've now settle on a nebulous definition of 'transcendent'. And for the record, no, there's not a single player outside the hall that has stats on par with Tomlinsons. Not one. In fact, his are better than most of the guys that are already in it.

You're just seeing what you want to see.

[DaneMcCloud]

Originally Posted by DJ's left nut

You just move the goalposts every time I address an issue. You've now settle on a nebulous definition of 'transcendent'.

Bullshit.

First off, Will Shields was a Pro Bowler 12 of his 14 seasons, an 8 time All Pro and an NFL Man of the Year. His level of play was unique and unquestioned.

Tony Gonzalez has more catches than anyone in NFL history other than Jerry Rice. He was the first of new breed of tight ends and is a 13 time Pro Bowler that's still an effective player 17 years into his playing career. His level of play is unique and unquestioned.

LaDanian Tomlinson was a very good running back on a team with many offensive weapons and an "Elite" QB (two, if you count Brees). His teams never won an AFC Championship and by the time he actually played in two AFC Championships, his skills had begun to erode.

While I think he was an excellent player in his era, I do not believe that he is a Hall of Famer.

Nothing that you say can change my mind.

[DJ's left nut]

Originally Posted by DaneMcCloud

Bullshit.

First off, Will Shields was a Pro Bowler 12 of his 14 seasons, an 8 time All Pro and an NFL Man of the Year. His level of play is unique and unquestioned.

Tony Gonzalez has more catches than anyone in NFL history other than Jerry Rice. He was the first of new breed of tight ends and is a 13 time Pro Bowler that's still an effective player 17 years into his playing career.

LaDanian Tomlinson was a very good running back on a team with many offensive weapons and an "Elite" QB (two, if you count Brees). His teams never won an AFC Championship and by the time he actually played in two AFC Championships, his skills had begun to erode.

While I think he was an excellent player in his era, I do not believe that he is a Hall of Famer.

Nothing that you say can change my mind.

Clearly.

But as I've said 1000 times over - I'm not in it to change the minds of the militantly entrenched. All I can do is speak to those that will listen.

[DaneMcCloud]

Originally Posted by DJ's left nut

Clearly.

But as I've said 1000 times over - I'm not in it to change the minds of the militantly entrenched. All I can do is speak to those that will listen.

Gee, I'm sorry I based my opinion on dozens of San Diego games I watched over the years, some of which were actually in San Diego, in their stadium.

[GoChargers]

Originally Posted by DaneMcCloud

Tony Gonzalez has more catches than anyone in NFL history other than Jerry Rice.

And LT holds the record for most single-season rushing touchdowns and is second only to Emmitt Smith for most career rushing touchdowns. Neither has a ring. Hell, Gonzalez didn't even win a playoff game until he was 36 years old.

How is one any more "transcendent" than the other? Let me guess the real reason: Gonzalez was a Chief for most of his career, LT was on a division rival.

[DaneMcCloud]

Originally Posted by GoChargers

And LT holds the record for most single-season rushing touchdowns and is second only to Emmitt Smith for most career rushing touchdowns. Neither has a ring. Hell, Gonzalez didn't even win a playoff game until he was 36 years old.

How is one any more "transcendent" than the other? Let me guess the real reason: Gonzalez was a Chief for most of his career, LT was on a division rival.

Whatever, Dude. I never said he wouldn't get into the Hall of Fame; I said I wouldn't vote for him.

And, I've given several reasons why I wouldn't vote for him, regardless of your stats.

[DaneMcCloud]

Originally Posted by DJ's left nut

You're just seeing what you want to see.

And I can absolutely guarantee you that as a SoCal resident since 1993, I saw LaDanian Tomlinson in more games, likely at least tenfold, than you.

And I can say, without a shred of a doubt, that I was not as impressed by his play on the field as his stats indicate. He doesn't pass the eye test, IMO, like a Barry Sanders, Emmit Smith or even Priest Holmes.