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Old 06-13-2014, 01:01 PM  
OldSchool OldSchool is offline
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Brandon Flowers done















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Chiefs released CB Brandon Flowers.
Flowers' performance and usefulness in Kansas City slipped dramatically under new DC Bob Sutton last season, as a press-man scheme was installed in the secondary and Flowers failed to find a fit. He wound up mostly at slot corner, and was beaten relentlessly. The Chiefs were trying to trade Flowers, but found no takers for his contract. Flowers had some of the best years of his career under now-Texans DC Romeo Crennel, and cornerback depth is needed in Houston. We wouldn't be surprised to see them reunite. Flowers turned 28 in February.
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Jun 13 - 3:04 PM
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Chargers agreed to terms with CB Brandon Flowers on a one-year contract.
The deal is worth "up to" $5 million and contains $3 million in total guarantees. Despite an anemic 2013 season as a misfit in Bob Sutton's press-man scheme, Flowers found a full bushel of suitors after the Chiefs released him 11 days ago. He lands in a spot where he can immediately rehab his value as a starting corner and then hit the open market again at age 29. Flowers put plenty of really good tape together from 2008-12, and will add borderline Pro Bowl shadow ability to a pass defense that ranked 29th in the league last year. With first-round corner Jason Verrett also added to incumbents Shareece Wright and Richard Marshall, this won't be quite the unit to pick on that it was last season.
He's a Charger now.
Last edited by OldSchool; 06-24-2014 at 09:35 PM..
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Old 06-15-2014, 11:17 AM   #601
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Old 06-15-2014, 11:23 AM   #602
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Originally Posted by milkman View Post
Years ago, I would have been right there with you.

I did, in fact, argue that pass rushers, and the front 7 in general, was far more valuable than the secondary.

However, as the league has evolved into a passing league, what it has also evolved into is a yac lead.

2700 of Peyton Manning's 5500 passing yards came on yac.
Only 3 teams gained fewer than 1500 yards of yac.

That means that teams are getting the ball out quicker.

If your secondary doesn't makes stops after the catch, then you can kiss any chance of getting to the QB goodbye.

Seattle's defensive domination of the Donkeys illustrated that.

Seattle's pass rush came into play only after the Seahawks secondary shut down yac and forced Manning to start looking for bigger plays through the air, thus holding the ball for that second longer.
Good Point.
I still value pass rushers more.
With good reason.

Defenses have won rings with shit secondaries.
Tell me the last time a D with a shit front 7 was part of the reason a team won a ring.
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Old 06-15-2014, 11:24 AM   #603
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Originally Posted by OnTheWarpath58 View Post
Rep.
I would bet that if it was Hali that was cut, you'd be making the exact opposite argument.
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Old 06-15-2014, 11:25 AM   #604
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Originally Posted by ThaVirus View Post
This is my issue. If we don't extend Houston or Smith with these savings this season, we just cut a good CB for absolutely no reason.
That's what I've been thinking.
If nothing is done with the $$, then WTF was the point?
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Old 06-15-2014, 11:32 AM   #605
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Would Flowers make Seattles roster if they could have him for cheap? No becuase they'd take a 6'2 UDFA who can run over him
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Originally Posted by xztop123 View Post
But yes installing a cover 3 press won't make your defense = to Seattles. Or else the Jags would be the second best D in the league.

The point is that you need the players, and that's how my comments relate to this thread, the players Seattle is choosing in the secondary are large UDFA type CB's
Your road to success is UDFA corner backs?
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Old 06-15-2014, 11:32 AM   #606
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Originally Posted by beach tribe View Post
Good Point.
I still value pass rushers more.
With good reason.

Defenses have won rings with shit secondaries.
Tell me the last time a D with a shit front 7 was part of the reason a team won a ring.
What I am saying is that the value of the secondary has increased substantially with the evolution of the passig/yac league.

Neither are going to win you anything without the other in today's NFL.

If your secondary doesn't force QBs to start looking for bigger plays, thne your pass rush is going to have any chance to do squat, and they then have to cover when the QB starts looking for those bigger plays.

When that happens, your pass rush has to produce.

You can no longer expect one unit to control the game.

It has to be a total effort.
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Old 06-15-2014, 11:48 AM   #607
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Quote:
Originally Posted by milkman View Post
What I am saying is that the value of the secondary has increased substantially with the evolution of the passig/yac league.

Neither are going to win you anything without the other in today's NFL.

If your secondary doesn't force QBs to start looking for bigger plays, thne your pass rush is going to have any chance to do squat, and they then have to cover when the QB starts looking for those bigger plays.

When that happens, your pass rush has to produce.

You can no longer expect one unit to control the game.

It has to be a total effort.
Best post in this thread.

This is exactly why Dorsey prefers bigger CBs. In press man, bigger CBs are able to disrupt the timing between the QB and WR and hopefully give the pass rushers more time to get to the QB. It's a team effort.
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Old 06-15-2014, 11:50 AM   #608
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Originally Posted by OnTheWarpath58 View Post
All of his sacks (but two) came in the first 7 games against mostly inferior talent.



When the games mattered most, he disappeared. I wouldn't call that impactful.

I absolutely see your point. I'd still say that Hali with a lost step is going to be better than Ford in his rookie year
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Old 06-15-2014, 11:53 AM   #609
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Originally Posted by milkman View Post
What I am saying is that the value of the secondary has increased substantially with the evolution of the passig/yac league.

Neither are going to win you anything without the other in today's NFL.

If your secondary doesn't force QBs to start looking for bigger plays, thne your pass rush is going to have any chance to do squat, and they then have to cover when the QB starts looking for those bigger plays.

When that happens, your pass rush has to produce.

You can no longer expect one unit to control the game.

It has to be a total effort.
Can't argue with you there.

Solid as always...
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Old 06-15-2014, 12:08 PM   #610
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I absolutely see your point. I'd still say that Hali with a lost step is going to be better than Ford in his rookie year
And Flowers wouldn't have been better than Owens or Gaines?

I just find it odd that when Flowers has a bad year, he deserves to be cut - but when other players making more money than their production dictates - and are older - the same folks change their opinion.
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Old 06-15-2014, 12:12 PM   #611
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the money vs production argument fails because that would mean Dwayne Bowe on paper statistically should be gone yesterday. Absolutely horrible stats for 11 million per.
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Old 06-15-2014, 12:15 PM   #612
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the money vs production argument fails because that would mean Dwayne Bowe on paper statistically should be gone yesterday. Absolutely horrible stats for 11 million per.
In fairness, WR's depend on a QB to get them the ball. They can do everything right, be wide open, and the QB goes elsewhere with the ball.

While it's nice to have Houston opposite him, Hali doesn't require anything from him to sack the QB.
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Old 06-15-2014, 12:27 PM   #613
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And considering the shit-show of QBs that Bowe has played with, his production has been pretty remarkable over his career.
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Old 06-15-2014, 12:35 PM   #614
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Flowers was a great open field tackler for a CB. We'll miss that.
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Old 06-15-2014, 12:38 PM   #615
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Bowe's contract. I always forget about that.

In fairness, Alex likes to distribute the ball around so his receivers have never had gaudy stats... But ****ing a, dude. He's getting top 5 WR money when he deserved top 15 at best.

Shit. Remembering that deal really makes me cringe at the idea of Dorsey in negotiations with Houston and Smith. We're going to get taken to the woodshed.
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