*** Official Youth, High School, College and International Wrestling Thread ***

[rico]

I can't be the only wrestling fan on this site. In fact, I know I that's not the case. The almighty king of n00bs, Sorter, is a wrestling fan. I figure there could be more.....????

Discuss anything wrestling related:

Youth wrestling: Heck, wrestling in Iowa has a rabid Youth wrestling scene...I lived through it, my younger brother lived through it and my brothers who are 15 and 13 are living through it, well the 13 year old is anyway...he's in high school. The 13 year old is a 7th grader who has been wrestling since he was 5 years old and has accumulated 4 state championships since his second grade year...a total badass. Believe it or not, Iowa has a youth wrestling forum that is hopping...even during the summer. Iowans take this stuff seriously. I'm assuming other states have rabid youth followings, for when I watch my bros at National tourneys, we are constantly running into kids and super clubs from other states that are amazing. Ironically, one of the biggest youth tourneys our club hits annually is the Park Hill Individual and Dual tournament...which to my knowledge is in Kansas City (I've never attended that one). Do any of you have kids who are wrestling? If so, how are they doing?

High School Wrestling: High school and college wrestling in Iowa is big... we are known for it, ask AC Slater. State tournament is a big, televised event at the Wells Fargo dome...you will see probably 10 times more spectators at state wrestling in Iowa then any other high school sporting event in Iowa. With some of the crazy talent I have seen/wrestled against at Fargo Nationals, I am assuming that it's either on the rise or just as big in other states as well... What are your thoughts on some of the high school wrestlers and/or teams out there?

College Wrestling: Hell, you Missourians semi-recently had those Askren brothers. I've never met Max, but have met Ben. He was the celebrity guest at Iowa Grade School State one year...he signed autographs and handed the medals and wall charts to all of the kids on the podium that year, which was cool because my youngest brother won it that year and was able to get his championship singlet signed by him. I was with my brother when he approached him....Askren struck me as a funny, goofy type of dude. I don't know Max, but someone posted his blog on an Iowa wrestling message board and the dude seems like a character. I know there are some Oklahomans' who post on this board. Anyone see Okie State defeat Iowa this past weekend? Iowa's first dual loss of the year. Anyone have any thoughts on college wrestling?

International Wrestling: Any of you have any thoughts on the international wrestling scene? Future Olympians, future Olympic champs, future World champs, Greco, Freestyle, etc.?

Wrestling Memories/General Discussion: Any of you have any memories you'd like to share from your personal experience(s) of wrestling when you were in youth, high school or college? Any opinions on females wrestling with males. Last year, a girl named Megan Black made history in Iowa by placing at state. Do you believe females should be able to wrestle with males at that age? Any thoughts on weight cutting? What are some of the most memorable matches to you? Who are your favorite wrestlers? One match that always sticks out to me is this:



Crazy match.

My favorite wrestler (besides my bros and former teammates) of all time is ironically not an Iowan. I don't really have a favorite team in wrestling...I root for individuals. It's a dude from Ohio that I initially hated because I didn't like the way he conducted himself after a match vs. my brother in the national duals when he and my brother were Seniors in High School, in which he defeated my brother. Kid was cocky. He and my brother both went on to wrestle D1, so I followed him since I knew who he was. I ended up becoming a huge fan of the kid's style...the kid could hit cradles from ANY position. He went on to win 2 National titles for Ohio State...and did so both years as an underdog, for he'd lose quite a few silly matches during the season, presumably due to his risky, but dangerous style that worked well for him at NCAA Nationals. It's a dude named Jeff Jaggers. First vid is what really put his name on the map as a high school wrestler. 2nd vid is his 1st NCAA championship as a Junior, in a match where he was a huge underdog, broke his ankle during the match and gutted it out and won. My favorite wrestlers tend to be the ones who are risk takers or brawlers...not afraid to be aggressive or take chances. I can't stand stallish wrestlers who are successful as hell simply because they don't open up and therefore don't give up points and score their own points by capitalizing on the other wrestler's aggression. Boring.






So what ya got?

Note: I have been posting on wrestling message boards for 12 years and I (and I'm sure everyone else involved with the sport) have heard every wrestling joke (rolling around with men, etc.) imaginable, but if ya want to clown on the sport, shoot... it was inevitable to happen anyways on CP, so have at it!

[rico]

Originally Posted by 'Hamas' Jenkins

He actually wants to be a creative writing teacher for deaf students. He lost all of the hearing in his left ear this year.

Nice! That's pretty admirable. Sounds like a great kid!

[Rudy tossed tigger's salad]

Ok, So after some research it appears that Cox weighed in at 95.8 KG in a FS tournament last spring (about 211 pounds). Weight limit was 97kg so he made it comfortably.

Some notable weights of National qualifier Heavies in various tournaments last spring

Marsden (OSU)- 262
Coon (Mich)- 261
Jensen (Nebraska)- 250
Cabell (UNI)- 222
Dejournette (App st)- 252
Medberry (Wisc)- 253
Mellon (Mizzou) -250
Stolfi (Bucknell)- 244
Tavanello (tOSU)- 250
Vollaro (Lehigh)- 269
Walz (VTech)- 250
Kettler (George Mason)- cut to 275
Deul (Binghamton)- 258
Gwiazdowski (NCState)- 260
Kroells (Minn)- 248
Black (ILL)- 263
Ryan (Colombia)- 254

Id say of all the Heavies, Kroells has the biggest problem with being oversized. He still placed 8th though. Seems like the magic number for Cox would be to get to 245. Not sure if he could get there or maintain it, but I like his chances even if a bit undersized. He could be like Kerry McCoy (yeah yeah comparison because he's black)

[Rudy tossed tigger's salad]

Originally Posted by rico

On the podcasts/radio stuff I did to cover our wrestling, I coined him "Hercules Holloway." Built like a Greek God. Google him.

MU needs to use the Miklus bros as sources to land some of these Southeast Polk kids...my God that team has some studs.

It appears that they are with Andersen. I'm not too familiar with him though.

[rico]

Originally Posted by Rudy lost the toss

It appears that they are with Andersen. I'm not too familiar with him though.

Anderson and Marnin were freaking studs this year. Andersen really stood out. Nice dude, too...almost too nice. Type of dude who would offer a hand to lift his guy up and pay him on the back after wrassle-raping him.

[rico]

Originally Posted by Rudy lost the toss

Ok, So after some research it appears that Cox weighed in at 95.8 KG in a FS tournament last spring (about 211 pounds). Weight limit was 97kg so he made it comfortably.

Some notable weights of National qualifier Heavies in various tournaments last spring

Marsden (OSU)- 262
Coon (Mich)- 261
Jensen (Nebraska)- 250
Cabell (UNI)- 222
Dejournette (App st)- 252
Medberry (Wisc)- 253
Mellon (Mizzou) -250
Stolfi (Bucknell)- 244
Tavanello (tOSU)- 250
Vollaro (Lehigh)- 269
Walz (VTech)- 250
Kettler (George Mason)- cut to 275
Deul (Binghamton)- 258
Gwiazdowski (NCState)- 260
Kroells (Minn)- 248
Black (ILL)- 263
Ryan (Colombia)- 254

Id say of all the Heavies, Kroells has the biggest problem with being oversized. He still placed 8th though. Seems like the magic number for Cox would be to get to 245. Not sure if he could get there or maintain it, but I like his chances even if a bit undersized. He could be like Kerry McCoy (yeah yeah comparison because he's black)

I stand corrected on my thinking earlier... That is some interesting stuff. I think J'Den would do just fine at HWT.

[Rudy tossed tigger's salad]

Originally Posted by rico

I stand corrected on my thinking earlier... That is some interesting stuff. I think J'Den would do just fine at HWT.

Well it wasn't too long ago we had immovable fatties like Cole Konrad and Dustin Fox winning championships. I think Sam Stoll is going to try and bring back the fat for Iowa next year.
I think some of it has to do with the popularity of football. If you're the type to have to lose weight to make 285, you're likely a football player and not a wrestler.


As far as adding a weight, id rather see one added in the middle weights since participation numbers support that thinking. But if we could bump 197 up to 210, id be ok with that. Someone 225-230 could reasonably get there. Something like:

127
135
144
152
160
169
180
192
210
285

[rico]

Originally Posted by Rudy lost the toss

Well it wasn't too long ago we had immovable fatties like Cole Konrad and Dustin Fox winning championships. I think Sam Stoll is going to try and bring back the fat for Iowa next year.
I think some of it has to do with the popularity of football. If you're the type to have to lose weight to make 285, you're likely a football player and not a wrestler.


As far as adding a weight, id rather see one added in the middle weights since participation numbers support that thinking. But if we could bump 197 up to 210, id be ok with that. Someone 225-230 could reasonably get there. Something like:

127
135
144
152
160
169
180
192
210
285

I like that idea a lot.

What about the tiny dudes who have a difficult time gaining enough weight to wrestle 125? They are out there. Do you think a 118 lb class would work? I wrestled in college with a guy who was a complete badass and no matter what he did, he couldn't outgrow 115 lbs. He hit the weights religiously, went on weight gaining diets, etc....he could just not overcome the fact that he was 4'10 and never going to reach 126. And he was GOOD. One of the hardest workers in the room, for...sure. One of the best, most physical wrestlers. He was just too small. If there was a weight suitable for him, he would be 3rd tier D1 material... A guy who would probably make some noise and maybe win some matches at nationals. Instead, he was 2nd string D3 at 125 his entire career, weighing 116 on full feed and won 65% or so of his matches. Sad stuff...he had so much heart.

[rico]

Btw, Hamas... Do you think wrestling is something you could become a fan of of you learned the ins and outs of it? It'd be cool as hell having your smarts (when you accumulate it wrestling-wise) in this thread for sure!

[rico]

Btw, fun little random fact. When my youngest brother was a 3rd grader, he wrestled this stud from Fort Dodge in the semis at AAU state in the 3rd and 4th grade division. A couple matches later in that same round, on that same mat....one of the most highly anticipated match ups in recent AAU memory took place. It was the semis match between Cory Clark and Thomas Gilman as 8th graders. These two butted heads a few times in youth. Gilman won...stalled his butt off. For those of you who don't know, the significance of this match was that these two are Iowa's current 125 (Gilman) and 133 (Clark) tandem. They fought all year last year for the 125 spot, which ultimately went to Clark.

Thought that was a fun fact because Gilman wrestled HS in Nebraska. Many people don't realize that he was an Iowa boy from Council Bluffs who went to a Catholic school/wrestling powerhouse (Omaha Skutt) in high school. He was expected by most to wrestle for Council Bluffs Lewis Central...which is 3A just like the school Clark went to (Southeast Polk). Lewis Central was a powerhouse in my day...kicked out studs like the Paulson twins (ISU), Brandon Mason (OK State), BLake Anderson (Iowa), David Kjeldgaard (Okie State), etc. Clark won 4 titles in Iowa...I THINK Gilman did the same in Nebraska. Wonder how things would have gone if Gilman stayed in Iowa... Crazy to think about.

[Rudy tossed tigger's salad]

Originally Posted by rico

I like that idea a lot.

What about the tiny dudes who have a difficult time gaining enough weight to wrestle 125? They are out there. Do you think a 118 lb class would work? I wrestled in college with a guy who was a complete badass and no matter what he did, he couldn't outgrow 115 lbs. He hit the weights religiously, went on weight gaining diets, etc....he could just not overcome the fact that he was 4'10 and never going to reach 126. And he was GOOD. One of the hardest workers in the room, for...sure. One of the best, most physical wrestlers. He was just too small. If there was a weight suitable for him, he would be 3rd tier D1 material... A guy who would probably make some noise and maybe win some matches at nationals. Instead, he was 2nd string D3 at 125 his entire career, weighing 116 on full feed and won 65% or so of his matches. Sad stuff...he had so much heart.

I think a watered down weight like 118 would be bad for the sport. I know wrestling wants to be the sport that includes everybody, but i don't share that line of thinking. I can't imagine how hard it would be to recruit a 118 pounder that wasn't killing himself to make weight. I know there are a few good 113 pound seniors this year, but some of them actually do fill out eventually. Matt Kyler and Jordan Conaway come to mind. I felt the same way when people complained about moving 103 to 106. God forbid your 95 pound freshman wrestler has to wrestle JV for a year. If it means less forfeits, it's good for the sport. Another example is having an 88 pound weight class for 14/15 year olds at the Cadet level. When there are as many 106 pounders as there are 88 94/100 combined, why do we still have 88?

[rico]

Originally Posted by Rudy lost the toss

I think a watered down weight like 118 would be bad for the sport. I know wrestling wants to be the sport that includes everybody, but i don't share that line of thinking. I can't imagine how hard it would be to recruit a 118 pounder that wasn't killing himself to make weight. I know there are a few good 113 pound seniors this year, but some of them actually do fill out eventually. Matt Kyler and Jordan Conaway come to mind. I felt the same way when people complained about moving 103 to 106. God forbid your 95 pound freshman wrestler has to wrestle JV for a year. If it means less forfeits, it's good for the sport. Another example is having an 88 pound weight class for 14/15 year olds at the Cadet level. When there are as many 106 pounders as there are 88 94/100 combined, why do we still have 88?

The high school weight classes at the lower weights has always baffled me. Back in the day, 98 lbs was the lightest weight in Iowa. And I meet former 98 lbers all the time. I don't hear very many stories of teams having difficulty filling that slot back in the 70's/80's. However, the minimum weight increased to 103 and now to 106...and many schools have a hell of a time occupying the 106 lb weight class... Have people gotten smaller or were the scales different back then? Not likely, but I can't help, but wonder if the coaches were a bit sketchier back then when it came to weigh ins. When I was a Freshman and Sophomore in high school, we weighed in, first thing in the morning. The only thing necessary that had to be present for a successful weigh in was a certified coach had to be present and witness the kids weighing in. Our own coach weighed us in...and he was honest about it. I've always wondered how many coaches around the state cheated a bit on it...and I wonder if you saw more 98 lbers back in the day because of it. We didn't move to the "weigh in an hour prior to competition in front of both team's coaches" system until I was a Junior...crazy to think about.

[GloryDayz]

Originally Posted by rico

The high school weight classes at the lower weights has always baffled me. Back in the day, 98 lbs was the lightest weight in Iowa. And I meet former 98 lbers all the time. I don't hear very many stories of teams having difficulty filling that slot back in the 70's/80's. However, the minimum weight increased to 103 and now to 106...and many schools have a hell of a time occupying the 106 lb weight class... Have people gotten smaller or were the scales different back then? Not likely, but I can't help, but wonder if the coaches were a bit sketchier back then when it came to weigh ins. When I was a Freshman and Sophomore in high school, we weighed in, first thing in the morning. The only thing necessary that had to be present for a successful weigh in was a certified coach had to be present and witness the kids weighing in. Our own coach weighed us in...and he was honest about it. I've always wondered how many coaches around the state cheated a bit on it...and I wonder if you saw more 98 lbers back in the day because of it. We didn't move to the "weigh in an hour prior to competition in front of both team's coaches" system until I was a Junior...crazy to think about.

I tend to agree. Unlike myself, my sons wrestle/wrestle were always in the "25th percentile" of size and weight, so wrestling really helped them not get crushed by every fat and overweight kid in many other sports. Yeah, AND I EVEN HELPED start the local youth football league, AND coach them both in baseball too. So I know and love all the sports, so I think I know where I'm being fair, but wrestling is the one sport where size and weight are taken out of the mix for the most part.

[rico]

Originally Posted by GloryDayz

I tend to agree. Unlike myself, my sons wrestle/wrestle were always in the "25th percentile" of size and weight, so wrestling really helped them not get crushed by every fat and overweight kid in many other sports. Yeah, AND I EVEN HELPED start the local youth football league, AND coach them both in baseball too. So I know and love all the sports, so I think I know where I'm being fair, but wrestling is the one sport where size and weight are taken out of the mix for the most part.

Yep... one of the cool things about wrestling is that it appeals to some of the kids who firmly believe that they have been overlooked for whatever reason in other sports, and wrestling works for them for they have more control over their destiny.

[Rudy tossed tigger's salad]

Originally Posted by rico

The high school weight classes at the lower weights has always baffled me. Back in the day, 98 lbs was the lightest weight in Iowa. And I meet former 98 lbers all the time. I don't hear very many stories of teams having difficulty filling that slot back in the 70's/80's. However, the minimum weight increased to 103 and now to 106...and many schools have a hell of a time occupying the 106 lb weight class... Have people gotten smaller or were the scales different back then? Not likely, but I can't help, but wonder if the coaches were a bit sketchier back then when it came to weigh ins. When I was a Freshman and Sophomore in high school, we weighed in, first thing in the morning. The only thing necessary that had to be present for a successful weigh in was a certified coach had to be present and witness the kids weighing in. Our own coach weighed us in...and he was honest about it. I've always wondered how many coaches around the state cheated a bit on it...and I wonder if you saw more 98 lbers back in the day because of it. We didn't move to the "weigh in an hour prior to competition in front of both team's coaches" system until I was a Junior...crazy to think about.

Yeah, it seems weird to me too. Not sure why it's different. I do like going back and watching old Olympic matches at 48kg and 52kg. It's hilarious watching two lightning quick jockeys going at it.

[Rudy tossed tigger's salad]

Originally Posted by rico

Yep... one of the cool things about wrestling is that it appeals to some of the kids who firmly believe that they have been overlooked for whatever reason in other sports, and wrestling works for them for they have more control over their destiny.

It was true for me. I was a basketball kid and I just never hit a growth spurt. Wish I would have wrestled earlier in life.