Pats Cheating Comfirmed

[PizzaDoughz]

According to the report, the league sources say the NFL determined 11 of the 12 footballs used by the Patriots were under-inflated by two pounds per square inch each. Per NFL rules, footballs are required to be inflated between 12.5 and 13.5 PSI and weigh between 14 and 15 ounces.

http://www.sbnation.com/nfl/2015/1/2...bill-belichick

Discuss.

[Amnorix]

Originally Posted by Tombstone RJ

They could have pulled the relevant texts and given his phone back probably within a day. Who destroys their cell phone unless hiding something? He's probably gonna vote for Clinton too, 'cause birds of a feather...

Originally Posted by Garcia Bronco

And that's his choice, but he was told it was needed for the investigation and he destroyed the around or about the day the showed up to get the information. Fine, but he decided not to comply with the investigation. So he get's suspended for it per the contract (CBA).

Ugh.

First, he told them before destroying it that he was not going to produce the phone. Ever. On the advice of his agent and attorneys.

Second, the NFL already had the phones from all non-players that could possibly matter in terms of who a text would be sent to/from. From Belichick to the equipment guys. Would he text his wife instructions to deflate the balls?

Third, Gostkowski also did not produce his phone, in connection with the related kicking-ball issue (which turned out to be an NFL employee that was violating the rules) but he wasn't punished at all.

Fourth, most importantly, the science pretty clearly established no deflation. "Did you send texts about murdering someone, even though he we have no dead body that shows murder"? How is it relevant? Yeah, it isn't.

The phone was a red herring, designed primarily to distract from how completely flawed the process the NFL ran was. "We have no evidence, we're ignoring the testimony of the referee as to which gauge was used, we never knew what the Ideal Gas Law was, our paid experts are shills who defended the tobacco industry, and who have been destroyed by many other scientists, our "independent" investigators are league attorneys representing the "prosecution", and our Commission is judge, jury and executioner, BUT HE DESTROYED THE PHONE THAT HE WASN'T REALLY OBLIGATED TO GIVE US!!"


So, hey, four games. Cuz the Commish says so.

So there you go.

P.S. Just to be clear, there is no "he got suspended for it [destroying the cell phone] per the CBA." To my knowledge, the CBA does not require turning over cell phones. It was simply a factor in Goodell ruling.

[Spott]

Originally Posted by Tombstone RJ

They could have pulled the relevant texts and given his phone back probably within a day. Who destroys their cell phone unless hiding something? He's probably gonna vote for Clinton too, 'cause birds of a feather...

I don't follow politics so I don't even know what that reference means. And the things that he could have been hiding may have had nothing to do with the NFL (private pics, credit card info, etc.). If it's a company phone, then he's obligated to turn it over to Goodell, but no one in their right mind would turn over their personal phone to their employer when there is no legal obligation to.

[Red Dawg]

Originally Posted by Amnorix

Ugh.

First, he told them before destroying it that he was not going to produce the phone. Ever. On the advice of his agent and attorneys.

Second, the NFL already had the phones from all non-players that could possibly matter in terms of who a text would be sent to/from. From Belichick to the equipment guys. Would he text his wife instructions to deflate the balls?

Third, Gostkowski also did not produce his phone, in connection with the related kicking-ball issue (which turned out to be an NFL employee that was violating the rules) but he wasn't punished at all.

Fourth, most importantly, the science pretty clearly established no deflation. "Did you send texts about murdering someone, even though he we have no dead body that shows murder"? How is it relevant? Yeah, it isn't.

The phone was a red herring, designed primarily to distract from how completely flawed the process the NFL ran was. "We have no evidence, we're ignoring the testimony of the referee as to which gauge was used, we never knew what the Ideal Gas Law was, our paid experts are shills who defended the tobacco industry, and who have been destroyed by many other scientists, our "independent" investigators are league attorneys representing the "prosecution", and our Commission is judge, jury and executioner, BUT HE DESTROYED THE PHONE THAT HE WASN'T REALLY OBLIGATED TO GIVE US!!"


So, hey, four games. Cuz the Commish says so.

So there you go.

P.S. Just to be clear, there is no "he got suspended for it [destroying the cell phone] per the CBA." To my knowledge, the CBA does not require turning over cell phones. It was simply a factor in Goodell ruling.

More of this crap from you, really? The text messages implicate Brady. The video implicates they did it. His interviews implicate he is hiding something. The destroyed cell phone confirms it. After the text messages are discovered the NFL is denied another interview with the two goons that wrote them.

The best way to punish a team is for them not to have their QB. They deserve it, end of story if it sticks but of course his effing lawyers are trying to make the court believe this is a labor issue for the little guy. As if Brady gives two damns about labor laws for the little guy. I didn't hear him take a side in any other player suspensions. He's a whiner who can't face the fact that he plays under a CBA that gives Goodell all the power needed to do what he's done and he has not violated the CBA at all.

He agreed to play under it, his owner wanted it and signed off on it like all the other owners except for the Steelers and now they don't like it because it's not going their way.

Cry babies to the max.

[vailpass]

99% of the NFL player and fanbase do not curr. Whether he did or didn't mess with the inflation has zero to do with game outcomes. The handful of conspricay theorists here who act like this has any impact on Brady i.e. * his records herpy derpy are comical in your delusion.

[Amnorix]

Originally Posted by Tuckdaddy

More of this crap from you, really? The text messages implicate Brady. The video implicates they did it. His interviews implicate he is hiding something. The destroyed cell phone confirms it. After the text messages are discovered the NFL is denied another interview with the two goons that wrote them.

More of this crap from you, really?

Science proves there was no deflation beyond what the Ideal Gas Law would account for.

http://sports.yahoo.com/news/1-year-...073316233.html

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kp4u9vkNxhg

http://www.breitbart.com/sports/2016...ief-tom-brady/

The best way to punish a team is for them not to have their QB. They deserve it, end of story if it sticks but of course his effing lawyers are trying to make the court believe this is a labor issue for the little guy. As if Brady gives two damns about labor laws for the little guy. I didn't hear him take a side in any other player suspensions. He's a whiner who can't face the fact that he plays under a CBA that gives Goodell all the power needed to do what he's done and he has not violated the CBA at all.

It's bizarre that a player would "take a side" in another player's suspension. Has Alex Smith voiced an opinion in Brady's suspension? Can he never argue being suspended by the Commish if he doesn't?

He agreed to play under it, his owner wanted it and signed off on it like all the other owners except for the Steelers and now they don't like it because it's not going their way.

Cry babies to the max.

Yes, the union really screwed up by agreeing to the CBA's Article 46. I expect they will strike over it come 2020 or whenever it expires.

For now, despite how overwhelmingly pro-Commish the CBA is, and the law in favor of upholding arbitrator's rulings, 2 of 4 judges have found in favor of Brady. That alone tells you how terrible a job Goodell did. If the process was anywhere near reasonable, it'd be a slam dunk for the NFL.

[Red Dawg]

Originally Posted by Amnorix

More of this crap from you, really?

Science proves there was no deflation beyond what the Ideal Gas Law would account for.

http://sports.yahoo.com/news/1-year-...073316233.html

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kp4u9vkNxhg

http://www.breitbart.com/sports/2016...ief-tom-brady/





It's bizarre that a player would "take a side" in another player's suspension. Has Alex Smith voiced an opinion in Brady's suspension? Can he never argue being suspended by the Commish if he doesn't?



Yes, the union really screwed up by agreeing to the CBA's Article 46. I expect they will strike over it come 2020 or whenever it expires.

For now, despite how overwhelmingly pro-Commish the CBA is, and the law in favor of upholding arbitrator's rulings, 2 of 4 judges have found in favor of Brady. That alone tells you how terrible a job Goodell did. If the process was anywhere near reasonable, it'd be a slam dunk for the NFL.

Berman, the idiot, didn't like his power. Had nothing to do with the job he did. The second judge only ruled for Brady because he thought the punishment was excessive. Not because Goodell did a bad job. The two that ruled for the NFL actually did the right thing and upheld the CBA like all of them should. One of them even pointed out how overwhelming the evidence against Brady was. The CBA clearly gives the commish the power to do what he did.

Until there is a new agreement Brady should stop crying like a little girl and wasting millions of the players money pool just for himself. This is all for him and nobody else and he knows it. It won't change anything.

[Wildcat2005]

Originally Posted by Amnorix

More of this crap from you, really?

Science proves there was no deflation beyond what the Ideal Gas Law would account for.

http://sports.yahoo.com/news/1-year-...073316233.html

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kp4u9vkNxhg

http://www.breitbart.com/sports/2016...ief-tom-brady/




It's bizarre that a player would "take a side" in another player's suspension. Has Alex Smith voiced an opinion in Brady's suspension? Can he never argue being suspended by the Commish if he doesn't?



Yes, the union really screwed up by agreeing to the CBA's Article 46. I expect they will strike over it come 2020 or whenever it expires.

For now, despite how overwhelmingly pro-Commish the CBA is, and the law in favor of upholding arbitrator's rulings, 2 of 4 judges have found in favor of Brady. That alone tells you how terrible a job Goodell did. If the process was anywhere near reasonable, it'd be a slam dunk for the NFL.

You keep saying this, and it is hard to take anyone who repeats this seriously on anything

You can't prove a negative

What you should have said was that "there exists a set of circumstances that could potentially explain the drop in air pressure"

It is very possible for people to manipulate variables while keeping the results within the laws of physics

For all this science talk you Boston fans bring up there seems to be a fundamental understanding of the processes that are used

[Amnorix]

Originally Posted by Tuckdaddy

Berman, the idiot, didn't like his power. Had nothing to do with the job he did. The second judge only ruled for Brady because he thought the punishment was excessive. Not because Goodell did a bad job. The two that ruled for the NFL actually did the right thing and upheld the CBA like all of them should. One of them even pointed out how overwhelming the evidence against Brady was. The CBA clearly gives the commish the power to do what he did.

Until there is a new agreement Brady should stop crying like a little girl and wasting millions of the players money pool just for himself. This is all for him and nobody else and he knows it. It won't change anything.

So 2 out of 4 ruled in favor of Brady, right? Right. Thanks for playing.

[MagicHef]

Originally Posted by Amnorix

More of this crap from you, really?

Science proves there was no deflation beyond what the Ideal Gas Law would account for.

http://sports.yahoo.com/news/1-year-...073316233.html

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kp4u9vkNxhg

http://www.breitbart.com/sports/2016...ief-tom-brady/




It's bizarre that a player would "take a side" in another player's suspension. Has Alex Smith voiced an opinion in Brady's suspension? Can he never argue being suspended by the Commish if he doesn't?



Yes, the union really screwed up by agreeing to the CBA's Article 46. I expect they will strike over it come 2020 or whenever it expires.

For now, despite how overwhelmingly pro-Commish the CBA is, and the law in favor of upholding arbitrator's rulings, 2 of 4 judges have found in favor of Brady. That alone tells you how terrible a job Goodell did. If the process was anywhere near reasonable, it'd be a slam dunk for the NFL.

Ugh, I've already talked to you about that exact video you posted. Nice to see you ignored me.

Also, they had Belechick's phone? That's news to me.

[Amnorix]

Originally Posted by Wildcat2005

You keep saying this, and it is hard to take anyone who repeats this seriously on anything

You can't prove a negative

The allegation is intentional ball deflation. When science establishes that the deflation which occurred is within the range expected by the laws of science, then you've pretty much disproven the allegation. Not much else matters.

What you should have said was that "there exists a set of circumstances that could potentially explain the drop in air pressure"

It is very possible for people to manipulate variables while keeping the results within the laws of physics

For all this science talk you Boston fans bring up there seems to be a fundamental understanding of the processes that are used

Let me flip it around. To punish the Patriots the NFL should need to PROVE deflation. The first and most fundamental step is to establish that deflation of the balls actually occurred. They utterly failed to do that, except by imposing a bunch of assumptions that the league pulled out of its ass, as 20 science professors stated in their amicus brief.

“As professors, we cannot fathom how it is permissible to impose punishment for the possibility of a negligible increment of pressure loss, when underinflated footballs are common to NFL games, when laws of physics cause much larger pressure drops, and when the very possibility of an additional increment of pressure loss was generated from assumptions of the league’s choosing rather than data,” the brief states. “In the name of science, we support the petition for rehearing.”

http://www.bostonherald.com/news/loc...in_deflategate

[New World Order]

After careful consideration and reading all of Amnorix's posts I have come to the conclusion that Brady did indeed cheat.

I'm glad we can move on now.

[Fire Me Boy!]

Originally Posted by Amnorix

So 2 out of 4 ruled in favor of Brady, right? Right. Thanks for playing.

So 2 out of 4 ruled in favor of Goodell and the NFL, right? Right. Thanks for playing. (Those were in a higher court, too. I assume as a lawyer you understand what that means.)

[Amnorix]

Originally Posted by Fire Me Boy!

So 2 out of 4 ruled in favor of Goodell and the NFL, right? Right. Thanks for playing. (Those were in a higher court, too. I assume as a lawyer you understand what that means.)

Yes, that is what I said. 2 of 4 federal judges have voted for each side. Because one of them voting for BRady was at the lower court level, he won there, but then 2 of 3 went for the NFL's side at the appeals court, so the NFL has won for now. The chances of rehearing en banc and/or at the SCOTUS are fantastically slim.

[Amnorix]

Originally Posted by MagicHef

Ugh, I've already talked to you about that exact video you posted. Nice to see you ignored me.

Also, they had Belechick's phone? That's news to me.

This thread is 60 pages long. Feel free to repeat, summarize, or link me to whatever you said.

Many things are news to you, apparently, including the spelling of Belichick's name.

[BucEyedPea]

I'm beginning to think Tuckdaddy and Pestilence are probably the biggest cheats in real life—on taxes, in card games, on tests and in their relationships. They have to be to be this obsessed and concerned with this matter.