***NON-POLITICAL COVID-19 Discussion Thread***

[JakeF]

A couple of reminders...

Originally Posted by Bwana

Once again, don't come in this thread with some kind of political agenda, or you will be shown the door. If you want to go that route, there is a thread about this in DC.

Originally Posted by Dartgod

People, there is a lot of good information in this thread, let's try to keep the petty bickering to a minimum.

We all have varying opinions about the impact of this, the numbers, etc. We will all never agree with each other. But we can all keep it civil.

Thanks!

Click here for the original OP:

Spoiler!

Apparently the CoronaVirus can survive on a inanimate objects, such as door knobs, for 9 days.

California coronavirus case could be first spread within U.S. community, CDC says
By SOUMYA KARLAMANGLA, JACLYN COSGROVE
FEB. 26, 2020 8:04 PM

The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention is investigating what could be the first case of novel coronavirus in the United States involving a patient in California who neither recently traveled out of the country nor was in contact with someone who did.

“At this time, the patient’s exposure is unknown. It’s possible this could be an instance of community spread of COVID-19, which would be the first time this has happened in the United States,” the CDC said in a statement. “Community spread means spread of an illness for which the source of infection is unknown. It’s also possible, however, that the patient may have been exposed to a returned traveler who was infected.”

The individual is a resident of Solano County and is receiving medical care in Sacramento County, according to the state Department of Public Health.

The CDC said the “case was detected through the U.S. public health system — picked up by astute clinicians.”

Officials at UC Davis Medical Center expanded on what the federal agency might have meant by that in an email sent Wednesday, as reported by the Davis Enterprise newspaper.

The patient arrived at UC Davis Medical Center from another hospital Feb. 19 and “had already been intubated, was on a ventilator, and given droplet protection orders because of an undiagnosed and suspected viral condition,” according to an email sent by UC Davis officials that was obtained by the Davis Enterprise.

The staff at UC Davis requested COVID-19 testing by the CDC, but because the patient didn’t fit the CDC’s existing criteria for the virus, a test wasn’t immediately administered, according to the email. The CDC then ordered the test Sunday, and results were announced Wednesday. Hospital administrators reportedly said in the email that despite these issues, there has been minimal exposure at the hospital because of safety protocols they have in place.

A UC Davis Health spokesperson declined Wednesday evening to share the email with The Times.

Since Feb. 2, more than 8,400 returning travelers from China have entered California, according to the state health department. They have been advised to self-quarantine for 14 days and limit interactions with others as much as possible, officials said.

“This is a new virus, and while we are still learning about it, there is a lot we already know,” Dr. Sonia Angell, director of the California Department of Public Health, said in a statement. “We have been anticipating the potential for such a case in the U.S., and given our close familial, social and business relationships with China, it is not unexpected that the first case in the U.S. would be in California.”

It is not clear how the person became infected, but public health workers could not identify any contacts with people who had traveled to China or other areas where the virus is widespread. That raises concern that the virus is spreading in the United States, creating a challenge for public health officials, experts say.

“It’s the first signal that we could be having silent transmission in the community,” said Lawrence Gostin, director of the World Health Organization Collaborating Center on National and Global Health Law. “It probably means there are many more cases out there, and it probably means this individual has infected others, and now it’s a race to try to find out who that person has infected.”

On Tuesday, the CDC offered its most serious warning to date that the United States should expect and prepare for the coronavirus to become a more widespread health issue.

“Ultimately, we expect we will see coronavirus spread in this country,” said Nancy Messonnier, director of the CDC’s National Center for Immunization and Respiratory Diseases. “It’s not so much a question of if, but a question of when.”

According to the CDC’s latest count Wednesday morning, 59 U.S. residents have tested positive for the new strain of coronavirus — 42 of whom are repatriated citizens from a Diamond Princess cruise. That number has grown by two since Messonnier’s last count Tuesday, although the CDC was not immediately available to offer details on the additional cases.

More than 82,000 cases of coronavirus have been reported globally, and more than 2,700 people have died, with the majority in mainland China, the epicenter of the outbreak.

But public health leaders have repeatedly reminded residents that the health risk from the novel coronavirus to the general public remains low.

“While COVID-19 has a high transmission rate, it has a low mortality rate,” the state Department of Public Health said in a statement Wednesday. “From the international data we have, of those who have tested positive for COVID-19, approximately 80% do not exhibit symptoms that would require hospitalization. There have been no confirmed deaths related to COVID-19 in the United States to date.”

CDC officials have also warned that although the virus is likely to spread in U.S. communities, the flu still poses a greater risk.

Gostin said the news of potential silent transmission does not eliminate the possibility of containing the virus in the U.S. and preventing an outbreak.

“There are few enough cases that we should at least try,” he said. “Most of us are not optimistic that that will be successful, but we’re still in the position to try.”

[Marcellus]

Originally Posted by DaFace

2977/285 million = 0.00001%

I suppose by that logic we should be sending missiles into China right about now.

I mean since you are hell bent on making a dumb comparison.


Let me know when the explosion in Lebanon causes the entire US economy to crash and results in 30MM people unemployed with no change in near sight and keeps schools closed when the average age of death is 78.

[Marcellus]

Originally Posted by DaFace

Guess I've missed that argument. What's the point they're trying to make?

The argument is the same one as pointing out 50K people a month in the US die from heart disease the response is "its not contagious!".

Neither are explosions in Beirut but here you were making the comparison.

[DaFace]

Originally Posted by Marcellus

I suppose by that logic we should be sending missiles into China right about now.

I mean since you are hell bent on making a dumb comparison.


Let me know when the explosion in Lebanon causes the entire US economy to crash and results in 30MM people unemployed with no change in near sight.

You're the one who keeps throwing out death percentages. They're not meaningful - I agree.

(And you don't think that Lebanon's economy is going to take a hit?)

[Marcellus]

Originally Posted by DaFace

You're the one who keeps throwing out death percentages. They're not meaningful - I agree.

(And you don't think that Lebanon's economy is going to take a hit?)

Is the whole world economy going to be impacted by this explosion? Are kids not in school in the US over it?

I mean you started this dumb conversation. I'll just bow out of it.

[DaFace]

Originally Posted by Marcellus

The argument is the same one as pointing out 50K people a month in the US die from heart disease the response is "its not contagious!".

Neither are explosions in Beirut but here you were making the comparison.

That doesn't explain what the argument is.

[Marcellus]

Originally Posted by DaFace

That doesn't explain what the argument is.

Dude you are smarter than this.

[Donger]

[DaFace]

Originally Posted by Marcellus

Dude you are smarter than this.

Apparently I'm not. I get that "it's contagious" is the thing that people say. I don't understand why that's an "argument" for anything.

[Perineum Ripper]

Originally Posted by DaFace

Guess I've missed that argument. What's the point they're trying to make?

You have missed that argument? How?



Every single time death numbers were brought up from some disease, people would bring up it wasn’t contagious like COVID. Those same people would then compare death totals of COVID to wars, even though war deaths aren’t contagious. Just like the explosion in Lebanon, just like 9/11 weren’t contagious, so I was curious if all those people would jump in to say that.

[loochy]

Originally Posted by DaFace

Apparently I'm not. I get that "it's contagious" is the thing that people say. I don't understand why that's an "argument" for anything.

Because its not contagious.

[DaFace]

Originally Posted by mac459

You have missed that argument? How?



Every single time death numbers were brought up from some disease, people would bring up it wasn’t contagious like COVID. Those same people would then compare death totals of COVID to wars, even though war deaths aren’t contagious. Just like the explosion in Lebanon, just like 9/11 weren’t contagious, so I was curious if all those people would jump in to say that.

If I'm understanding the argument correctly, that seems to be more about being "preventable" than about being "contagious" per se. It's not a black and white thing, but I'd put them on a spectrum something like this.

-Not a lot we can do about heart disease, though research continues.
-Relatively little we could have done about 9/11 given the information known at the time.
-Some things we could have done about COVID.
-A lot they could have done in Beirut.

Regardless, my only point is that looking at situations based on the percentage of people who are killed is silly. There is almost no situation, illness or otherwise, that would kill a significant percentage of the population, so using that as a means of examining a situation's severity is almost entirely meaningless.

[petegz28]

Originally Posted by DaFace

That doesn't explain what the argument is.

[Donger]

Originally Posted by mac459

You have missed that argument? How?



Every single time death numbers were brought up from some disease, people would bring up it wasn’t contagious like COVID. Those same people would then compare death totals of COVID to wars, even though war deaths aren’t contagious. Just like the explosion in Lebanon, just like 9/11 weren’t contagious, so I was curious if all those people would jump in to say that.

The argument was (and I guess is) that we lose more people from car accidents (e.g.) than we had from COVID-19, but we don't tell people to stop driving, in comparison to the mitigation efforts.

That's separate from saying, "Holy crap. This thing has killed more Americans in two months than Vietnam did in 10 years."

[Marcellus]

Originally Posted by DaFace

If I'm understanding the argument correctly, that seems to be more about being "preventable" than about being "contagious" per se. It's not a black and white thing, but I'd put them on a spectrum something like this.

-Not a lot we can do about heart disease, though research continues.
-Relatively little we could have done about 9/11 given the information known at the time.
-Some things we could have done about COVID.
-A lot they could have done in Beirut.

Regardless, my only point is that looking at situations based on the percentage of people who are killed is silly. There is almost no situation, illness or otherwise, that would kill a significant percentage of the population, so using that as a means of examining a situation's severity is almost entirely meaningless.

This sounds like complete nonsense. Every single decision made by people and especially government is based on risk vs reward.

Again we are harming out kids and young adults to avoid a disease that kills people on average the same age as the average life expectancy. Its stupid.

[sedated]

And here we are back to the "what is more important, the economy or hundreds of thousands of (old) people's lives?"