***Official Defense thread***

[BigRedChief]

Discuss all things defense

When you're so bad at run defense you make it a legitimately good choice to run the ball at you consistently, that's pretty impressive(ly bad). https://t.co/hFnQIuLKqe

— Seth Keysor (@RealMNchiefsfan) September 21, 2021

[RunKC]

Originally Posted by -King-

Not really it's just mental gymnastics to credit Veach and discredit Dorsey.

John Dorsey has been fired by multiple teams. He also had ideal situations in both jobs and ****ed them both up

[-King-]

Originally Posted by RunKC

John Dorsey has been fired by multiple teams. He also had ideal situations in both jobs and ****ed them both up

He's been fired because he's a power hungry egomaniac. Nothing to do with his actual job performance. The Chiefs and Browns are both winning because of his picks. Both of their cores are built 100% by Dorsey.

[Ming the Merciless]

Baker either had a horrible game or just plain sucks.

[Hammock Parties]

Originally Posted by Pawnmower

Baker either had a horrible game or just plain sucks.

He's fine as your 4th corner.

The Chiefs biggest issue is pass rush.

And significant talent is unlikely to arrive there.

They have a huge problem on defense I don't see getting solved until the offseason.

[RunKC]

“Why do people pump Veach so much?!”

Uh because he was awesome in 2019. We completely revamped a shit defense in one offseason and won the goddamn SB.

Frank Clark- he was really good in 2019
Tyrann Matheiu
Damien Wilson
Bashaud Breeland
Alex Okafor

That also doesn’t count Juan Thornhill who was excellent as a rookie.

What we are seeing now is no different than what other teams go through. When you have the highest paid player on your team and pick late it is really hard to win.

Herbert and the Chargers will be tough bc they are talented and are still paying Herbert nothing, so they can load up the next 2 years like we did

[Sassy Squatch]

Originally Posted by RunKC

John Dorsey has been fired by multiple teams. He also had ideal situations in both jobs and ****ed them both up

It's not a coincidence that both teams had to completely overhaul the entire defense after he'd left, but that's besides the point right now.

To say that Veach isn't looking too good right now is a massive understatement. We all know the 2018 class was an absolute disaster, but the 2019 class is looking worse and worse as time goes on. We got 1 decent situational player from each class (Nnadi and Hardman) and the rest re a bunch of guys that can't get playing time on some pretty bad units.

[RunKC]

Originally Posted by -King-

He's been fired because he's a power hungry egomaniac. Nothing to do with his actual job performance. The Chiefs and Browns are both winning because of his picks. Both of their cores are built 100% by Dorsey.

Dorsey was handed 2 top 5 draft picks and he didn’t even pick the best QB. Take those top 5 picks out and it’s Nick Chubb and a bunch of JAG’s through his 2 drafts.

Shit Myles Garrett and Larry Ogunjobi are some of their best defensive players and they were drafted the year before Dorsey got there.

Veach didn’t get the luxury of high draft picks so this is a bad comparison

[-King-]

Originally Posted by RunKC

Dorsey was handed 2 top 5 draft picks and he didn’t even pick the best QB. Take those top 5 picks out and it’s Nick Chubb and a bunch of JAG’s through his 2 drafts.

Shit Myles Garrett and Larry Ogunjobi are some of their best defensive players and they were drafted the year before Dorsey got there.

Veach didn’t get the luxury of high draft picks so this is a bad comparison

Veach still had a bunch a picks. High pick or not, there's still value to be had all over the draft. It's not like top 5 picks are the only good players in the whole draft. The fact that none of his picks so far look to be worth a second contract is not good. Seriously, which of his 2018 or 2019 picks are players you feel we MUST re-sign?

[Hammock Parties]

Originally Posted by -King-

The fact that none of his picks so far look to be worth a second contract is not good. Seriously, which of his 2018 or 2019 picks are players you feel we MUST re-sign?

This isn't true.

Nnadi, Fenton, Saunders, Thornhill, Hardman, Danna, Sneed, Niang are all going to be worth a second contract.

Gay and CEH remain to be seen, and we already see huge value in Creed and Trey. Bolton is flashing.

[-King-]

Originally Posted by Hammock Parties

This isn't true.

Nnadi, Fenton, Saunders, Thornhill, Hardman, Danna, Sneed, Niang are all going to be worth a second contract.

Gay and CEH remain to be seen, and we already see huge value in Creed and Trey. Bolton is flashing.

C'mon now, we all know what I mean by that. Of course they'll get a second contract somewhere. But they're not guys you're saying you must resign or can't easily replace with some other below average FA signing.

When people talk about second contracts we're not talking about DeMarcus Robinson, Pringle second contracts where we just offer them some barely marker value contracts and they sign it because they barely have any other options.

And the fact that Hardman is the best player on that list is sad.

[Ming the Merciless]

Originally Posted by Hammock Parties

He's fine as your 4th corner.

It seemed like every time he was in, he got torched or was out of position.



He was the opposite of "fine". He didnt seem worthy to be on the field.

[Ming the Merciless]

Originally Posted by Hammock Parties

The Chiefs biggest issue is pass rush.

The other biggest issue is our best / only linebacker is a rookie named Nick Bolton
We need mor linebackers badly

[RunKC]

Originally Posted by -King-

C'mon now, we all know what I mean by that. Of course they'll get a second contract somewhere. But they're not guys you're saying you must resign or can't easily replace with some other below average FA signing.

When people talk about second contracts we're not talking about DeMarcus Robinson, Pringle second contracts where we just offer them some barely marker value contracts and they sign it because they barely have any other options.

And the fact that Hardman is the best player on that list is sad.

Put it on a level playing field: take out their top 5 draft picks Baker and Ward and who is worthy of an extension from Dorsey’s 2 draft classes?

Nick Chubb. That’s it. A RB

[BigRedChief]

Originally Posted by Hammock Parties

This isn't true.

Nnadi, Fenton, Saunders, Thornhill, Hardman, Danna, Sneed, Niang are all going to be worth a second contract.

Gay and CEH remain to be seen, and we already see huge value in Creed and Trey. Bolton is flashing.

Sneed was a late round pick. A redraft I saw this off season had him going at #7. That's a helluva jump.

[lcarus]

Originally Posted by Superturtle

Nnadi has never been known for his pass rushing prowess so I'll give him a bit of a pass at least on that front (what he's "supposedly" good at, not so much) but Jarran Reed is an abortion. Completely ****ing worthless as an every down pass rusher and run stopper and I think this defense takes a massive step forward if you manage to land an actual NFL caliber DE and let Jones move back inside, with Nnadi and Reed rotating in and out based on situation. As for Clark, all we can do is pray to the football god's that he either returns to his usual JAG form instead of the literal worst DE in the NFL or the arraignment in October gives us an excuse to void the guarantees and cut his ass.

I saw Jarran Reed make that tackle yesterday and it confirmed that he does in fact play football for the Kansas City Chiefs. Because before I saw that tackle, I was starting to doubt that.