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Old 10-31-2022, 12:56 PM   #1
FRCDFED FRCDFED is offline
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Now Toub is the best ST coach ever, so maybe it's just a question of coaching him up properly. No question the Chiefs coaching staff is the best he's ever been around, so there's plenty to be optimistic about, but Toney may not be our answer this season as a returner. Just saying.

But it also means Toney may not be returning kicks/punts right now.
You think Toub is the beat ST coach ever? Even after watching KC trot Moore out there and muffing kicks?
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Old 10-31-2022, 12:57 PM   #2
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You think Toub is the beat ST coach ever? Even after watching KC trot Moore out there and muffing kicks?
If you look at the advanced analytics, he's one of the best ever, yes.
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Old 10-31-2022, 01:31 PM   #3
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You think Toub is the beat ST coach ever? Even after watching KC trot Moore out there and muffing kicks?
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If you look at the advanced analytics, he's one of the best ever, yes.
What he said.

Helps things if you do your homework.
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Old 10-31-2022, 02:48 PM   #4
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What he said.

Helps things if you do your homework.
How reliable are these so-called advanced analytics for ST coaches, though? Are they baseball WAR reliable or like, PFF QB rankings reliable? I'm not familiar with them at all, but based on how often Toub's teams seem to **** up, I'm deeply skeptical.

Homework doesn't help much if the teacher is drunk all the time...
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Old 10-31-2022, 02:49 PM   #5
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How reliable are these so-called advanced analytics for ST coaches, though? Are they baseball WAR reliable or like, PFF QB rankings reliable? I'm not familiar with them at all, but based on how often Toub's teams seem to **** up, I'm deeply skeptical.

Homework doesn't help much if the teacher is drunk all the time...
They're more like PFF QB rankings. But all that means is that individually, you have to take them with a grain of salt. It's when ALL of them agree on something that really means something.
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Old 10-31-2022, 05:16 PM   #6
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Originally Posted by carcosa View Post
How reliable are these so-called advanced analytics for ST coaches, though? Are they baseball WAR reliable or like, PFF QB rankings reliable? I'm not familiar with them at all, but based on how often Toub's teams seem to **** up, I'm deeply skeptical.

Homework doesn't help much if the teacher is drunk all the time...
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Originally Posted by htismaqe View Post
They're more like PFF QB rankings. But all that means is that individually, you have to take them with a grain of salt. It's when ALL of them agree on something that really means something.
This is the key. Dave Toub's reputation as a ST coach is unanimous among all analysts, and among all NFL coaches. And has been for more than a decade.

The only people that question Toub's excellence as a ST coach is the occasional ignorant fan.
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Old 10-31-2022, 05:34 PM   #7
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Originally Posted by carcosa View Post
How reliable are these so-called advanced analytics for ST coaches, though? Are they baseball WAR reliable or like, PFF QB rankings reliable? I'm not familiar with them at all, but based on how often Toub's teams seem to **** up, I'm deeply skeptical.

Homework doesn't help much if the teacher is drunk all the time...
I dont really know if its possible to assign certain NFL positions for players a WAR like they do for baseball. Just so many variables and not every play is of equal value. Great QBs are great because they move the sticks on 3rd down. And can make crazy plays when their team is losing and they have to.
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Old 10-31-2022, 05:40 PM   #8
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I'd give him KR & PR duties immediately, and develop a sweep and pass play for him his first week. Let him know he's got a place on this team and we've got him in mind.
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Old 10-31-2022, 09:15 PM   #9
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I'd give him KR & PR duties immediately, and develop a sweep and pass play for him his first week. Let him know he's got a place on this team and we've got him in mind.
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Old 10-31-2022, 09:53 PM   #10
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I'd give him KR & PR duties immediately, and develop a sweep and pass play for him his first week. Let him know he's got a place on this team and we've got him in mind.
Yes. One or two well timed offensive plays that maximize his skills set and KR/PR
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Old 10-31-2022, 05:57 PM   #11
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How reliable are these so-called advanced analytics for ST coaches, though? Are they baseball WAR reliable or like, PFF QB rankings reliable? I'm not familiar with them at all, but based on how often Toub's teams seem to **** up, I'm deeply skeptical.

Homework doesn't help much if the teacher is drunk all the time...
Be skeptical all you want.

Even better, watch just about any other team's ST play for 4 weeks. It's mostly a shitshow out there in the NFL. And nearly every team in the league would love to have Toub on their staff.
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Old 10-31-2022, 06:25 PM   #12
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Be skeptical all you want.

Even better, watch just about any other team's ST play for 4 weeks. It's mostly a shitshow out there in the NFL. And nearly every team in the league would love to have Toub on their staff.
Yeah, kinda weird for someone to bitch about the ST Coordinator because of a couple muffed punts.

All I know is absolutely nothing about analyzing specials teams, so I'll defer to the vast vast vast majority of people that say he's the best special teams coach in the league.
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Old 10-31-2022, 06:38 PM   #13
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Yeah, kinda weird for someone to bitch about the ST Coordinator because of a couple muffed punts.

All I know is absolutely nothing about analyzing specials teams, so I'll defer to the vast vast vast majority of people that say he's the best special teams coach in the league.
CP needs something to bitch about. Probably nothing more complicated than that.

Heck, just the few pieces of primetime games I've seen this season tells you that we're pretty buttoned up on ST vs. the rest of the league. The only team with a better kicker situation than KC is BAL, and that's only because they have Tucker. Outside of Tucker, they don't do anything better than KC does ST-wise.

And every other special-teams unit in the league is far below KC's, year in and year out. Basically, our ST unit is boring. They do their jobs every game. We've had a couple miscues this season and a bit last season, but we've also had a little merry-go-round with our returners during the same period. We got spoiled because for awhile there Tyreek was our returner and the whole time he was doing it he only made like two mistakes, and otherwise he did something special every other time he caught it. After that it was a carousel of rookies, including Hardman, so of course CP went nuclear every time Hardman didn't run one back for a TD (as if Hill did, but rose-colored glasses). Heck, one game I remember a couple years back people were upset with Hardman because he waved for a fair catch maybe a smidge early.

Mostly CP is populated with some good to great football minds, but sometimes CP gets pretty stupid about dumb shit as well.
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