For all of you that don't think Autism is related to Vaccines

[BIG_DADDY]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yxIVHtbGiUw

Everyone I know with a child who has autism with the exception of one is the same way. Now go ahead and quote the AMA and the CDC now, they are looking out for you and your child. Ignore the tons of people right in front of you that are telling exactly what happened to their kid. For the billionth time I don't know what it is about the vaccines that is doing this for sure but it is what it is doing, period. There is no debate here just bunch of people working for big pharm out there putting out disinformation for the masses so they can continue making their BIG $$$$$.

[Iowanian]

Do you know how many parts per million of RAT SHIT are acceptable in organic corn flakes? Rats were the the catalyst of the spread of more than 1 plague that killed millions of people. Do you know how many microorganisms, capable of causing huge health issues are in a piece of sushi?

I don't want to know how Most of the things I eat are made.

[BIG_DADDY]

Originally Posted by Iowanian

Your position appears to be that anyone who has their children vaccinated is begging for a case of autism for their child, and is a moron for not listening to your logical arguements, complete with overwhelming proof of the causation of the disease, and that the Govt, medical industry, research industry are allied in a huge conspiracy to pollute the children of the world with toxic materials for monetary gain....and that they have so much control that everyone is keeping their mouth shut "for the corporations" and "the government".


The Executives might have those motivations....to make profit. Its their job. the reasearchers and the gears that make the wheels turn however, I don't believe would ever stand for such an attoricity.

First of all after discovering the contaminated polio vaccines they refused to recall them letting every contaminated vaccine out there be administered to people. Don't tell me about what's possible with these people.

My position is simply this. My experience with dealing with parents of autistic kids has been consistant. The majority of them say their kids were perfectly fine until after receiving a vaccine at which time everything immediately changed.

Facts are:
1. The huge increase in autism parallels the increase in vaccines. I am not drawing a conclusion from this but I think there may be reason for concern.

2. The AMA and CDC have proven throughout history that they cannot be trusted. Having Big Pharm regulate Big Pharm is ridiculous. I have also advocated taking responsibility for your own health across the board on all subjects, not just this. In that area I am very consistant.

3. The long term effects of such massive vaccination is unknown. All anyone has to do is take a look at what they are injectiong into your baby to know massive doses of all that shit may not be a good thing.

4. Being this is the case people should have choices with their children. I don't want to tell people what to do with their children anymore than I want somebody telling me what I must do with mine.

What I am trying to do is tell people I think they should take a good look at this subject themself instead of blindly accepting the path the AMA has laid out for them and their children. That considering the potential consiquences, both short term and long term, this is a subject I could be very is important. They can take and do with it what they please.

What does amazes me is that there are people out there that have tens of thousands of hours of scientific research on this subject that they would like to share. When I offer to send the video's they made to people at my own cost they refuse.

What I am saying is not that far out in left field. To reiterate what I said before. I had doctors that told me when I was at Stanford ICU that off the record that they understood why I was doing what I was doing. Stanford ICU is one of the top ranked in the country, these are not quacks no matter how badly you want to call them that. Anyway, for what it is worth, that is my position.

[HonestChieffan]

Fact is those who want to believe all the anti vaccine stuff will never accept facts and will find a reason to say its all lies. Thats pretty clear from all that been referenced in the threads on this subject. If someone....anyone...says there is nothing to the vaccine issue, they are branded part of big pharma and shouted down regardless of who they are.

[BucEyedPea]

Originally Posted by HonestChieffan

Fact is those who want to believe all the anti vaccine stuff will never accept facts and will find a reason to say its all lies.

Quite talking about yourself. I'm talking about mercury, not vaccination per se.
Some people react more severly to mercury poisoning.

[NewChief]

Originally Posted by HonestChieffan

Fact is those who want to believe all the anti vaccine stuff will never accept facts and will find a reason to say its all lies. Thats pretty clear from all that been referenced in the threads on this subject. If someone....anyone...says there is nothing to the vaccine issue, they are branded part of big pharma and shouted down regardless of who they are.

It's pretty much like any other debate on here: global warming, intelligent design vs. evolution, Huard vs. Croyle, etc...

[Iowanian]

I understand your arguement.

You're convinced that the vaccines are harmful. I need more proof before I'll risk exposing my child to those diseases by not vaccinating.

My position is that while some portions or combinations possibly could be.....I'm fairly convinced by something else.

The essential erradication in the US since vaccination of: Polio, small pox, pertusis, dyptheria, measels, mumps, ruebella and a laundry list of other deadly and debilitating diseases, that are still prevalent in countries in which children are not vaccinated.

That, is the nexus of my position and we're obviously in a positive of respectfully agreeing to disagree.

[HonestChieffan]

aint that the truth. Get yourself a cause, google some links, post it and away ya go.

[BIG_DADDY]

Originally Posted by Iowanian

I understand your arguement.

You're convinced that the vaccines are harmful. I need more proof before I'll risk exposing my child to those diseases by not vaccinating.

My position is that while some portions or combinations possibly could be.....I'm fairly convinced by something else.

The essential erradication in the US since vaccination of: Polio, small pox, pertusis, dyptheria, measels, mumps, ruebella and a laundry list of other deadly and debilitating diseases, that are still prevalent in countries in which children are not vaccinated.

That, is the nexus of my position and we're obviously in a positive of respectfully agreeing to disagree.

Yes I believe putting toxic metals straight into your blood stream at high doses many times combined with viruses grown off of a variety of horrific substances also injected straight into your blood as opposed to being subject to stomach acid COULD be harmful and probably at the very least isn't good especially when adding all the other crap that is in vaccines that I listed.

I also understand why you would want to protect your child from these horrible diseases and respect your choice in going through with the full vaccine schedule.

[veist]

Originally Posted by BIG_DADDY

First of all after discovering the contaminated polio vaccines they refused to recall them letting every contaminated vaccine out there be administered to people. Don't tell me about what's possible with these people.

My position is simply this. My experience with dealing with parents of autistic kids has been consistant. The majority of them say their kids were perfectly fine until after receiving a vaccine at which time everything immediately changed.

My understanding is that a reliable diagnosis for autism isn't likely until age 2 and that the average age of diagnosis is age 5. This is where people start trying to draw a causality from a correlation, an autistic child would be vaccinated while being "normal" before the signs and necessary development take place for a reliable diagnosis of ASD and then later develops into an autistic child. People look at that and draw the conclusion "they happened at the same time, one HAS to do with the other." When researchers investigated it they found that there is no causation. Thimerosal was removed from vaccines as a precautionary measure and follow up research in fact has shown that it had no significant reduction in the incidence of ASD diagnosis. The reality is the only causation there is age, the child is vaccinated at an age that happens to be around the same period when ASD diagnosis is most likely.

[Iowanian]

Lurker.

I am interested in what you've posted, and in seeing some of the studies and comparable treatments...partly so I can understand what those treatment options are.

as to the rise, I don't think anyone is argueing the increased diagonosis.

My question, relating to you increase in numbers from the 1970s to now, is how that compares to overall population growth.

If you have 300 in 10,000, and that turns into 1000 in 10,000, that is more alarming than if it becomes 3600 cases, but the population is now 3million.

[Bill Lundberg]

Originally Posted by Iowanian

Lurker.

I am interested in what you've posted, and in seeing some of the studies and comparable treatments...partly so I can understand what those treatment options are.

as to the rise, I don't think anyone is argueing the increased diagonosis.

My question, relating to you increase in numbers from the 1970s to now, is how that compares to overall population growth.

If you have 300 in 10,000, and that turns into 1000 in 10,000, that is more alarming than if it becomes 3600 cases, but the population is now 3million.

Another point to mention in the increase in the number of Autistic children is that 20 -30 years ago many of these children were just considered "slow" the parents didn't look for a reason behind it or a diagnosis.

I have a late uncle who I believe was autistic. Everyone just assumed he was socially inept because he lived with his parents until he was 40. Grandma coddled him because he was "Special", but no one ever considered looking for medical reasons for the way he was.

[NewChief]

Originally Posted by Bill Lundberg

Another point to mention in the increase in the number of Autistic children is that 20 -30 years ago many of these children were just considered "slow" the parents didn't look for a reason behind it or a diagnosis.

I have a late uncle who I believe was autistic. Everyone just assumed he was socially inept because he lived with his parents until he was 40. Grandma coddled him because he was "Special", but no one ever considered looking for medical reasons for the way he was.

Lurker 2 actually addressed that in another post in the other autism thread:

An interesting study presented to the California legislature looked at whether the increase was “real” or whether it was the result of changes in the autism criteria over the years, people moving into California for services for their kids, or vaccinations, or other possible “explanations”. The study found the increase real. If you want to see it, it’s downloadable (70+ pages). GO to autisminfo.com (a good web page, by the way), click on the MIND link on the left side of the page, and on that page click on the left side where it says: “Report to the California Legislature”. There's a lot of good info on that site.

However, I do think that we're seeing an increase in diagnosis along with an increase in occurrence. Now there's a whole new diagnosis called sensory sensitivity which is like a lesser, lesser degree of autism. It's actually usually considered a symptom of Asperger's, but it's also being treated as an entirely separate (but related) issue. So, your child could have sensory sensitivity, but not have ASD.

[Calcountry]

Meh, I'm more worried about Big FARM right now. When in the heck are you sunsabiotches gonna grow some more corn and get the freaking prices down!!! :

[Skip Towne]

Originally Posted by bunnytrdr

Meh, I'm more worried about Big FARM right now. When in the heck are you sunsabiotches gonna grow some more corn and get the freaking prices down!!! :

Do you make your own feed?

[BIG_DADDY]

Originally Posted by Skip Towne

Do you make your own feed?

No, he just needs a lot of fiber.